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Posts posted by djvang

  1. 3 hours ago, vasu said:

    any reason to why Leonard and Howard changed their minds?? they were sure they got the girls to believe their lies... 

    atleast should have shown sometime which led them to changing their minds.....  but all we got was a dull apology...

    and for all the misogyny... comments in the forum.... how come no one comments when it is always the husbands doing mistakes and husbands apologizing while women forgive them....

    Sitcom 101. Women are wise and patient. Men are childish buffoons.

    • Like 1
  2. Seeing Penny as a suitor for Sheldon means somehow getting over that huge firewall that the writers have built between the characters; Penny does not see Sheldon as a desirable adult male. To her he's an unformed, pre-sexual child, a dependent creature who can not function on his own, an irritating voice anxious to tell her of her short comings. She cares deeply for him because she feels he can't help being that way and is vulnerable to the world he does not wish to understand. And he's Leonard's friend. None of those Sheldon characteristics make him attractive to any normal women.

    I think the original conception of Sheldon was brilliant and unique. He was conceived (mainly by Bill Prady, I believe) to be the opposing force to Penny in the tug of war for Leonard. He was the extraordinary male character on a TV sitcom who had no interest in cultivating a romantic relationship with any human. While the other males drooled over Penny, he went out of his way to insult her. He even touched her breast and saw her bottom and showed not that slightest arousal. Why? Because he was Sheldon, dammit, he didn't care in the least.

    Trying to make Sheldon into a romantic male means completely redoing the character and he becomes just like every other guy in sitcom land.

    But that's another story.

    Totally agree with that. That was Vintage Sheldon. Now he's become Sheldumb - just another clownish, befuddled sitcom boyfriend.  "Growth".

    • Like 5
  3. Amy wasn't interested in sex at first and if you go back and count thru the years how many times each has mentioned sex in some way around the other, it's actually Sheldon that brings it up more than Amy.  He just accuses her of it which is why everybody thinks it's her but it's really him.  I'm actually surprised that nobody really seemed to catch onto that.

    I'm not about to go back and count and provide "evidence" but there was a long stretch where just about every episode contained a ritual "Sheldon won't have sex with me" whine. 

    But just off the top of my head - dismantling a TARDIS and rebuilding it around your bedroom door is quite eager.  Faking illness to get Sheldon to touch her, Catholic school girl outfit, Star Trek nurse outfit, flashing her privates at him, scenting his possessions,  pressuring him to move in with her, etc. I'm sure others more  zealous than me could come up with many more. All betray a certain sense of "eagerness" that you say should  cause Sheldon to "lose all respect for her". 

    • Like 3
  4. It wouldn't work with Martha.  She's too eager for sex and he would loose all respect for her (if he even had any in the first place) just like he did with Dr. Slut Bunny.

    And as for the main question for me? 


    Theres a key for every lock and Amy is the key to Sheldon's lock.

    Hasn't Amy just spent the past 4 seasons letting everyone, including Sheldon, know how eager she is for sex with Sheldon?

    • Like 2
  5. I think the reason so many posters are upset about Shamy is that they've created heir own personal fantasy versions of the Shamy romance that aren't based on the reality of what has actually happened on the show.  They want a perfect fairy tale type of romance and the writers aren't giving it to them.  The fact that TPTB have as much as told everyone that Shamy will be together when the series ends apparently isn't enough.

    • Like 8
  6. But being aroused because she sees a good looking guy is a lot different than wanting intimacy..intimacy vs. sex is quite different.   She wanted intimacy with Sheldon...wanted his whole heart (which she has, but she just doesn't see it yet) and him to have her whole heart.   She never wanted intimacy with Zach.  Sure she might have entertained a dalliance with him but she immediately changed her mind on that...so quite a difference.

    For the past few seasons she obviously wants intimacy with Sheldon but I'd say she was interested in intimacy with Penny before Sheldon. What season was the lesbian innuendo version of Amy? S5? Remember the creepy painting of them that was originally in the nude? "There's not a hair on my body I wouldn't let this woman trim.".  That sounds pretty intimate. You can't  simply airbrush away the past to fit a fantasy.

    • Like 2
  7. Well..in all honesty, Amy never was interested in intimacy at all until she met Sheldon.  He awakened those feelings in her and he was the object of her desire.  

    While she may not owe him any reasoning, my problem isn't about what she owes him.  My problem is that her heart was always his and now suddenly she acts as if he really was never that important to her and that her feelings for him were more "on the surface" than deep in her heart.  Her actions in these episodes have not matched who she has been for five years and who Sheldon has been to her in the last five years.   

    He was her first love and only love and she saw him making strides, admitting his love for her, allowing her to have a sleepover, etc. and boom, she suddenly can drop him like a hot potato and date another guy within a month (if it is a date, which I am still on the fence about)?  It just isn't adding up to make sense when her heart should be broken as much as Sheldon's.

    Sure she should not have to stay at home and not socialize, etc. but we just haven't seen much concern or love or friendship left for him in all of this from her.   By not showing her POV, it hasn't helped things.   I just wish they had shown a much more broken up and truly confused and pained Amy than just an angry one and then a "moving on" one.

    The Alien Parasite Hypothesis episode disagrees with you.  From wiki:

    Amy is aroused by Penny's ex-boyfriend Zack Johnson and is unfamiliar with the feeling.

    "Zack meets them in the same bar and Amy approaches him saying, “I stand here before you, 130 pounds of raging estrogen, longing to grab your hold of your gluteus maximus and make Shakespeare's metaphorical Beast with Two Backs.” Zack is confused as usual. (My gluteus what?) Based upon his ape like expression, she decide to start using Vulcan disciplinary practice of Kolinahr for her urges, though there is one more “Hoo” before she leaves. Outside the bar, she does try holding Sheldon's hand though doesn’t feel anything, well at least in season 4."


    • Like 3
  8.  Given what we saw of Shamy this season would YOU HAVE GUESSED Amy would've broke up with Sheldon in the finale? 

    Absolutely. They have to stretch out the show for two more seasons and contrived drama helps them do it. The last 4 seasons have been the "Amy Pursues Sheldon Show". Now it'll be the "Sheldon Pursues Amy Show" for at least one season.

  9. I think that if there was an episode like you describe I would be wondering how the writers were going to work their way back to Sheldon/Amy getting back together because I know that would be their ultimate intention.  Just like I know that if Leonard and Penny have an argument, their wedding will not be called off--even if they were to temporarily call it off.  In the end it would all be okay.

    So in other words, since TPTB have made their "ultimate intention" clear and have thus already told everyone in advance how the story ends, all "drama" the rest of the way is essentially meaningless because as you say, in the end it will all be okay.

      So why is everyone constantly wailing and gnashing their teeth over the state of the ships when they already KNOW the ultimate outcome?  I fully expect that all the couples will break up at some point in the remaining 2+ years but TPTB have already slipped us the final chapter - all the current couples WILL live happily ever after. 

  10. This is true of the so-called "romantic Shenny" stuff--Shenny shippers will bend over backwards to try to make every little twitch or lifted eyebrow or random look have some deeper meaning. 

    I'm not a "romantic Shenny", but this statement coming from this site is simply...........stunning.  Do you not read the Shamy threads?

  11. Continue to be fascinated by the results of this. Scavenger is still the only post Season 3 episode through to round 2. Piñata already building a handy lead over 43 and Status quo is last chance next match. Not a Shamy (or a Lenny) to be seen. The purists must have mobilised their forces? Is the forum just a vocal minority? Or are the best laugh out loud episodes actually from the early years?

    "The purists must have mobilised their forces?" - somewhat, but not to the point of dressing alike. :icon_wink:


    "Is the forum just a vocal minority?" - I'd say yes. Most of the previous posters who disagreed with the direction the show has taken the past three seasons, (ie couples humor, emphasis on romantic relationships),  have either left and/or stopped posting. Unlike the posters who remain, I don't think most viewers really care whether Amy finally gets Sheldon to have sex with her or if everyone lives happily ever after in fictionland. They just want the show to be funny.


    "Or are the best laugh out loud episodes actually from the early years?" - Yes. And it was a different type of humor then. It was fresh and unique. Much more LOL-centric than awwwww-centric. But almost all sitcoms have problems remaining fresh AND funny. TBBT is no different. .

    • Like 1
  12. That is an exaggeration of the ratio of Leonard moping scenes to total scenes and saying there is only one good scene is stretching it a lot ( but all opinions allowed!).


    In the three scenes ( out of eight) that any Leonard disappointment is evident, one is right at the end of a scene that begins with Leonard actually happily bonding with Dave until he sees Penny, one is putting on a brave face at the uni ( but yes showing his disappointment) and the last actual whiny moping on the couch while getting stirred by the guys. I don't count his final confrontation with Penny as moping behaviour - that was one of those early classic Lenny moments where a fight ends up in adorable togetherness. Hardly the rest of the episode!


    Bath Item is my favourite all time episode for a number of reasons. I love episodes with extended scenes rather than chopping and changing from short skit to short skit. It allows for greater development of dialogue and comedic interaction between characters. The opening scene was one of those classic geek culture moments in the show with the boys having an hilarious, extensive argument about Superman sweat! Great dialogue. I found the follow up interaction revolving around Dave Underhill's arrival funny as well, both in physical comedy and the change in Leonard's attitude. But then I like Leonard!

    This is followed by more comedy gold that involved no Leonard moping - the Wii bowling, Sheldon's bagging out of Leonard for dumping the team for Dave, followed by his epic description of the problem of gift giving demands. Penny's reactions are priceless. I also found the shopping scene hilarious. As for what I assume you think is the one good scene, the Sheldon Penny hug- well yeah, one of the great moments of the show's seven years. The physical comedy of Jim in that scene is absolutely brilliant.


    SO yeah, everyone's entitled to their opinion but I definitely see why Bath Item got 71.5% of the vote. Every scene was funny. Having said that, bad draw for Love Spell copping Bath as its round one opponent. That's a great episode as well. I love episodes when the whole ensemble are together. Would have gone far if it didn't have to compete with Bath Item. 


    One thing I find interesting, and I said this earlier in this thread, is the large representation of Shenny centric episodes in this tournament. While like 99.95% of the members of this forum I find the romantic Shenny ship delusional and farcical, I must say I am very much a fan of the comedic Shenny coupling. And it would appear that many voters are of the same opinion. Bath and Adhesive are probably the two great Shenny moments but in the top 16 we also have Work Song ( Shenny teamwork), Piñata ( Shenny showdown), Scavenger ( Shenny team up), Pancake (Shenny bonding and caring). 6 out of 8 rounds have Shenny episodes competing. I just find it interesting that with such a focus on Shamy and Lenny in the Forum, its the Shenny dynamic that is so prevalent in this episode battle.

    I don't think the posters in the forums are representative of the fanbase as a whole. They represent the fevered fan as opposed to the casual viewer.


    Oh, hum. Hi all. Long time no see. I see things have been getting pretty heated on here. I wasn't aware this was organised for the finale night. Even though I did not watch the last 4 eps (and hence my disappearance from the boards), I did tweet Bill of my own accord because I had been holding it for a while. While I can understand that organised campaigns can backfire and be irritating when one is on the receiving end of one (although Bill himself started one the other day so he could get an honorary degree from his Alma Mater!!!), I think if people feel the need to express their negative opinion (in a civilised way, of course) they should be allowed to do so. I don't understand why we should shield the writers from negative criticism and only approve of positive tweets. To say "Don't complain or things might get even worse" is frankly kind of disturbing, in so many ways.


    Also, if writers changed their course of action on the show in a vengeful way out of annoyance because of a bunch of negative comments, then it would make me wonder whether they truly are grown professional men and women or just a bunch of middle-school kids with a very thin skin. That idea always kind of reminds me of fanfic writers who cross their arms and threaten not to update if the reviews are negative or if not enough people review. That shows an incredible lack of integrity with respect to your own story, and I would hope that professionals are a little better than that. There are tons of people out there who truly despise the show and probably send far harsher and more obnoxious messages than anyone on here ever will, and people who harass them on a daily basis. I'm sure they know that this comes with the territory when you're a writer on television's #1 comedy. Not to mention they can very well block people when they've had enough (Bill has been known to do so in the past), so I'm pretty sure they can manage their own life in the social media frenzy just fine. They don't need bodyguards.


    As for Amy being given the same amount of importance or consideration as other characters or not, I think that's an extremely subjective definition and it depends on what you mean by importance and consideration. Is she getting the amount of screentime she deserves? Yes. Is she getting even more plots than some of the lead characters? At times, yes. Leonard this year had pretty much nothing to do other than sit around waiting to get engaged whereas at least Amy had her plots with Howard, with Raj, with Howard and Raj, with the girls, with the gang and so on. 


    But it is also true that, compared to the Amy in S4 and 5, she's become extremely unidimensional and a lot less interesting than she used to be, and her importance and impact in Sheldon's life has declined significantly and steadily over the last two years. This episode was really the culmination of that decline. They might have an unconventional relationship, but in the past they used to be written like she mattered a lot to him and she filled the role a significant-other SHOULD fill in their partner's life, even if that role was to create internal turmoil and discomfort. She was not just a nuisance and a burden. Which is what was endearing about it: they were not physical and they were not conventional (hell, they were in denial about being a couple for over one year!) but they were still written like a couple. It was a wonderful message that it isn't sex or romance or labels that makes a relationship real. And I feel that has been solely lacking recently. I feel like they've traded that intellectual connection for some physical crumbs here and there and they call that "progress". When I personally couldn't care less that they're kissing if that intellectual connection is gone. I didn't get into this couple because I wanted to see Sheldon kiss a woman or get laid or married. I got into it because I was fascinated with Sheldon building a quirky, loving bond with his intellectual equal, and I've said many times I would have been happy with this being an asexual relationship so long as that mental connection was there. It's now gone, and I am trying really hard to stop from deluding myself into thinking it will ever come back, despite how badly I want to hope for it.


    So, to me, while she might be getting the right amount of screentime and plots (and more so this season than last), she isn't getting the right amount of consideration in terms of characterisation, consistency (the amount of blatant disregard and downright contradictions in her backstory is baffling: Friendship Turbulence being the most glaring example this year) and particularly with respect to the role she was invented to fill: Sheldon's significant other. Things have changed quite significantly in that arena in the last two years, and I am personally really struggling with it, because she is the reason I got into the show. To see my favourite character stripped of the characteristics that made her so precious in my eyes and go from being a special exception in Sheldon's life to a prop who is written like she's some random, pushy, whiny girl who has a massive crush on a guy she's not dating and she doesn't really have much of a chance with unless he gets up on the right side of the bed in the morning is frankly really hard to swallow. Raz put it best last night when we were chatting: it isn't Amy that ruined Sheldon, it is Sheldon that ruined Amy. That's really how I see it, in a nutshell. And the reason I've stopped watching. If the writers' intent was to make me stop rooting for this couple, well… they've achieved that. 


    I know that some here will disagree with this assessment and feel that Amy is being handled with the consideration and respect she deserves. But that doesn't mean those who feel differently shouldn't be allowed to express their opinion (even to the writers) or that we are wrong or are not paying attention. As long as it's done in a constructive, civilised manner and not with insults and swearwords, I don't see anything wrong with voicing a concern/complaint.


    I do agree though that, ultimately, I don't think this will have much of an impact simply because they probably just dismiss organized campaigns and I doubt that they will change a writing style they're so comfortable with just to please some disgruntled fans. If critics and award nominations aren't swaying them, I doubt a Twitter campaign will. Having said that, who knows. Maybe they haven't really noticed how things are coming across (like they didn't with the gay-for-Penny jokes until people started getting fed up with them), and giving them a hint here and there might have at least get them to think about it. People beyond this forum have noticed how Amy is being sidelined too, even reviewers. In any case, once again, if it's civilized and respectful, I see no problem with it. The issue is that you can't control the people who tweet, and you might start one off with the intent of it being civilized and then some hot-heads who are not even part of the forums take over the hashtag with insults and rudeness and that can become embarrassing for everyone. So, yeah, pros and cons. It's a slippery slope. 


    PS You missed my essays (not), didn't you? ;)


    I agree with a lot of what you say about what they've done to Amy. I liked her when she first came on the show. Since then they've made her very needy, desperate, manipulative and unlikeable. But Sheldon did not ruin her. I'd say that the writers ruined both of them in an attempt to force them into a conventional romantic relationship. They just don't seem to like each other much anymore.

  14. Excellent episode!!

    Also an excellent jumping-off point for those who can't bear to suffer thru the next three seasons that WILL culminate in the final deliverance of Vintage Sheldon into the clutches of the Undeserving One.

    The Howardette story was entertaining even though it was a bit "heavy" on the tired old "my mom is fat" jokes.

    Stuart was very good.

    I even liked Leonard in this one. He showed himself to be a real friend. And Penny was spectacular.


    The best part of the episode is the way Amy's attempt to exploit Sheldon at a vulnerable time in his life blew up in her face. Her four years of never-ending pressure, scheming and manipulation failed and she was left in a sputtering, selfish rage. She didn't get what she demanded. Not deserved. Demanded.

    Sheldon is FREE!!! That's the way I will remember him. Long live Vintage Sheldon!biggrin.gif

    End of series for me.heart.gif

    • Like 3
  15. We're not deliberately manipulating a social network. One of the great things about social media is that it gives the consumer the ability to communicate to the brand (in this case, a TV show). We are using Twitter for this purpose, the same way many people use it every day.


    Like SuchaHag says, it's not going to hurt. We want to get their attention, but in a positive way. The best thing that could happen is that TPTB think to themselves "wow this small number of people must really care about our show and its characters." The worst thing that can happen is that they either don't see it or they don't respond to it. It's going to be a fun experiment, so please do not fret! :)


    Also, I'm probably going to make a throwaway twitter account (not that I don't trust you guys, more just I'm embarrassed by the ridiculous tweets from my younger self  :laugh: ) Will post my handle asap!

    No, I think the worst that could happen for Shamys is that tptb get so annoyed by an orchestrated twitter flood from a very vocal minority of obsessed fans that they decide to fling Amy down the elevator shaft to be rid of them. :blackeye:


    Or, they might somehow find out about this topic and realize that the flood isn't a spontaneous uprising from outraged fans but rather a pre-planned and coordinated scheme to attempt to manipulate the future of the show.  =@


    Just saying.

    • Like 1
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