annieogly Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Gosh there's so much; it's funny how worked up people get about this topic..hmm interesting Let me just re-iterate. The show belongs to Chuck Lorre; he can do whatever he wishes & the writers obey. And I'm sure CL is attentive to the fans Also there has been no attempt to measure via ratings the fan popularity of Shenny vs. Shamy so there is no data to support either side. And yes if CL wanted there to be Shenny all the writers would have to do is have Penny say she said all those pro-Shamy things in order to support her friend as she felt so guilty having feelings for Sheldon. Easy-peasy. Not terribly hard. One of the problems with tv is as Doug said the joke comes first. At the end of season 3 when Sheldon is betrayed by the ruse of the electric can-opener. The writers meant it to be a funny prank. But really if you're looking at the psychology of the characters; Sheldon would probably have a breakdown, Leonard, Howard & Raj would be fired for creating fraudulent data and ruining Caltech's reputation. That can't happen so it becomes a 'joke' and glossed over. This is where the writers lost me in terms of investing in the characters. This is the problem of tv comedy, characters don't/can't have the consistant psychological background of a character in a novel Finally: literature, movies, tv are all subjective! That's why literature lasts as each new generation finds something in the text, perhaps something the author didn't even intend. Doesn't matter. So while the Shamy-ites never understand the Shenny-ites and visa-versa; It's not a problem because there is no objective answer. I did wonder how the writers would drive the Shamy & they keep re-using Amy threatening to dump Sheldon if he doesn't yield. Tiresome; how often can they do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubyanjel Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Tiresome. At least it's not as tiresome as LP (no offense) and not as terribly tiresome as the other minority's claim that every freaking scene of Sheldon and Penny together has some worked up hidden story of their love affair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerMain Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 (edited) Gosh there's so much; it's funny how worked up people get about this topic..hmm interesting Let me just re-iterate. The show belongs to Chuck Lorre; he can do whatever he wishes & the writers obey. And I'm sure CL is attentive to the fans Also there has been no attempt to measure via ratings the fan popularity of Shenny vs. Shamy so there is no data to support either side. And yes if CL wanted there to be Shenny all the writers would have to do is have Penny say she said all those pro-Shamy things in order to support her friend as she felt so guilty having feelings for Sheldon. Easy-peasy. Not terribly hard. One of the problems with tv is as Doug said the joke comes first. At the end of season 3 when Sheldon is betrayed by the ruse of the electric can-opener. The writers meant it to be a funny prank. But really if you're looking at the psychology of the characters; Sheldon would probably have a breakdown, Leonard, Howard & Raj would be fired for creating fraudulent data and ruining Caltech's reputation. That can't happen so it becomes a 'joke' and glossed over. This is where the writers lost me in terms of investing in the characters. This is the problem of tv comedy, characters don't/can't have the consistant psychological background of a character in a novel Finally: literature, movies, tv are all subjective! That's why literature lasts as each new generation finds something in the text, perhaps something the author didn't even intend. Doesn't matter. So while the Shamy-ites never understand the Shenny-ites and visa-versa; It's not a problem because there is no objective answer. I did wonder how the writers would drive the Shamy & they keep re-using Amy threatening to dump Sheldon if he doesn't yield. Tiresome; how often can they do that? OK. Still want to know why Lorre would bother to destroy the premise of the show as was explained in the early season: the tug of war over Leonard between Penny and Sheldon. Sheldon representing the Physics/Nerd world and Penny the carnal delights of the "normal" world. Hence the double meaning of the title "Big Bang Theory". Since the very first episode, Penny and Sheldon have been adversaries. This has been a very successful formula now that they have added Amy to the mix to gently push Sheldon in the direction Leonard is heading. Why would Lorre ever want to take the chance in killing the golden goose that is the Shamy? For what purpose? Is there some think tank study saying that the Shenny will make him more money? He has the only data he needs: 15 to 16 million fans an episode and the number one rated comedy. No business would dare change that model.. Another thing, what do you do with the other characters when the Shenny is formed? Will every other character be saying "oh, well that's life"? What happens with the fans of the Shamy and the Lenny? Do they except that the relationships they bought into for years just got blown to hell? Until there are answers to those questions, expect Lorre to not even think about this as even a topic worth considering. Edited October 15, 2012 by BangerMain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPK Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 (edited) Gosh there's so much; it's funny how worked up people get about this topic..hmm interesting Let me just re-iterate. The show belongs to Chuck Lorre; he can do whatever he wishes & the writers obey. And I'm sure CL is attentive to the fans Also there has been no attempt to measure via ratings the fan popularity of Shenny vs. Shamy so there is no data to support either side. And yes if CL wanted there to be Shenny all the writers would have to do is have Penny say she said all those pro-Shamy things in order to support her friend as she felt so guilty having feelings for Sheldon. Easy-peasy. Not terribly hard. No it isn't that simple. Because this scenario requires the viewing audience to simply forget five plus years of show continuity and just expect them to accept something that out of left field. Theoretically Chuck Lorre can do anything he wants with the characters of the show. Hell he could have Raj and Stewart come out of the closet.and start dating. He could have Penny and Amy experiment with Lesbianism. He could have Leonard become a monk and take a vow of celibacy. That doesn't mean it would work or even make sense with how the characters have been shown thus far. It also means that the probability that the audience would stick around and continue to watch it would be very low. . One of the problems with tv is as Doug said the joke comes first. At the end of season 3 when Sheldon is betrayed by the ruse of the electric can-opener. The writers meant it to be a funny prank. But really if you're looking at the psychology of the characters; Sheldon would probably have a breakdown, Leonard, Howard & Raj would be fired for creating fraudulent data and ruining Caltech's reputation. That can't happen so it becomes a 'joke' and glossed over. This is where the writers lost me in terms of investing in the characters. This is the problem of tv comedy, characters don't/can't have the consistant psychological background of a character in a novel Sheldon would also be fired because no credible scientist would ever publish results and declare any kind of discovery without peer testing and review of data first. He would have been held just as accountable for failing to do that. Finally: literature, movies, tv are all subjective! That's why literature lasts as each new generation finds something in the text, perhaps something the author didn't even intend. Doesn't matter. So while the Shamy-ites never understand the Shenny-ites and visa-versa; It's not a problem because there is no objective answer. I did wonder how the writers would drive the Shamy & they keep re-using Amy threatening to dump Sheldon if he doesn't yield. Tiresome; how often can they do that? Good literature follows proper structure when it comes to story and character. There are rules and guidlines that have been on the whole agreed apon by most scholars who study the storytelling form based on hundreds of years of research examining all the greatest tales form the classic greek myths and poems from Homer to the plays of the bard himself Shakespeare. This isn't subjective. Character's can develope and change and good storytellers make sure this happens but the changes have to be believable and not only fit within the established profile of a given character, but the good storytellers will also make sure the seeds of change are foreshadowed earlier in the narrative. People don't just disover things in a tale by random happenstance. At least not in the good ones. In the good stories nothing is accidental and the intent of the author is clear. The only people who are discovering "hidden things or meanings" are people who for whatever reason have a bias in wanting to see certain things a certain way but that in no way means that it's a legimate position because it has no basis on what the actual text reading is and on the intent of the author. There is nothing in this shows past or present that could substantiate Penny having any kind of romantic feelings for Sheldon nor Sheldon for her. It's not there. It isn't there in the writing. It hasn't been shown on screen. The people involved in the show from all levels have gone on record saying it isn't going to happen. Why do you think Shamy even exists in the first place? It exists partially because they wanted to make it clear that if Sheldon was ever going to be involved in any kind of romantic relationship that Penny was certainly not going to be the girl that he was going to be paired with in such a relationship. I'd say we have a pretty good indicator of Shamy vs Shenny when it comes to ratings. The show has higher ratings now with the romantic relationships it currently has then it did back pre-Amy and back when Shenny had any kind of steam at all. Shamy is discussed much more heavily now by the larger audience as a whole than Shenny ever was back in the day. Which isn't difficult to do when Shenny has never been anything but a vocal minority. I'm sorry Annieology, I know you want to believe you are part of some massive movement within the shows fan base but you aren't. You are simply part of a very small but vocal fanbase of a pairing that has no basis in the shows reality. No sane showrunner would ever cater a hit show like this to the tastes of a minority. Especially when the current formula...like it or not has proven to be a massive hit. Edited October 15, 2012 by DPK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbangsheldon Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 AMY DOES NOT LIKE LEONARD YES HALLELUJAH THAT IS SO RIGHT! and you know sheldon doesnt like penny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disgusted Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 One thing about the shennies, they are persistent...................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubyanjel Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Tell me about it. Since there "freedom of expression" no freaking shit could ever stop them from thinking so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbangsheldon Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 they just keep poking and poking and even when no one is listening they do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickfromillinois Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 (edited) The new arguement seems to be that Lorre can do whatever he wants and there has not been any scientific polls showing the percentage of fans who are pro or con on the idea of Penny and Sheldon getting together. Let me start witht the poll first. There has not been any poll that WE ARE AWARE OF. Want to bet that there has been focus groups on the subject? Once again, Lorre, the writers, and some of the actors have said "no" to the idea and some have even expressed their disgust at the thought. Sometimes you don't need a poll to tell you that something is a terrible idea. As for Lorre being able to do as he wants with the characters, true, but why would he? He could have Amy develope some drug that would make Sheldon amorous, give it to him, but something goes wrong and he ends up raping Penny. It would be disgusting, it would be out of character for Sheldon, it would be unethical of Amy, it would be a terrible experience for Penny, and it would ruin the show, but he could do it. But that raises the question again of "why"? If I so desired I could grab an ax and chop off my foot but I'm not ready to called "Peg Leg Rick". I could do it but it would be stupid. Edited October 17, 2012 by rickfromillinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantagrae Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The new arguement seems to be that Lorre can do whatever he wants and there has not been any scientific polls showing the percentage of fans who are pro or con on the idea of Penny and Sheldon getting together. Let me start witht the poll first. There has not been any poll that WE ARE AWARE OF. Want to bet that there has been focus groups on the subject? Once again, Lorre, the writers, and some of the actors have said "no" to the idea and some have even expressed their disgust at the thought. Sometimes you don't need a poll to tell you that something is a terrible idea. As for Lorre being able to do as he wants with the characters, true, but why would he? He could have Amy develope some drug that would make Sheldon amorous, give it to him, but something goes wrong and he ends up raping Penny. It would be disgusting, it would be out of character for Sheldon, it would be unethical of Amy, it would be a terrible experience for Penny, and it would ruin the show, but he could do it. But that raises the question again of "why"? If I so desired I could grab an ax and chop off my foot but I'm not ready to called "Peg Leg Rick". I could do it but it would be stupid. Thank you! I would also add that if Chuck Lorre and/or Bill Prady don't want to have Sheldon and Penny get together, then why would they even have to bother taking polls or using focus groups. They will tell the story they want to tell, and perhaps the buzz they hear at ComicCon may give them an idea they want to explore--like the idea of Sheldon finding a girlfriend--but just because they hear that some fans want this idea or that idea doesn't mean that they have to try it. If they have decided that they do not want a certain thing, then they're not going to do it. And it seems to me that they've made up their minds in this case. They don't need opinion polls, they don't need to try out ideas and see whether or not the ratings dip, etc. All they need to do is explore the ideas they want to explore and the Shenny ain't one of those ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annieogly Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Interesting; I suggested an innocent dream sequence and then a ratings comparison. I imagined the Shamy-ites & others would be happy to have me proved wrong. Seems it isn't so...hmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeWolf Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 I interrupt this rambling to inject a point of reality. Interesting: When engaged on substantive points based upon actual scenes and actions from the show Shenny's refuse to respond. When non-Shenny's act similarly to questions based upon fantasy, Shenny's are quick to point out said non-response. Sounds like a heads - I win, tails - you lose scenario. I now return you to your regularly scheduled delusional musing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantagrae Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Interesting; I suggested an innocent dream sequence and then a ratings comparison. I imagined the Shamy-ites & others would be happy to have me proved wrong. Seems it isn't so...hmmmm Sophistry--once again you've taken the information in front of you and come to the wrong conclusion. The real point is, why would Chuck Lorre and Bill Prady waste time on such a thing when they have no intention of going down that path? It's not what Shennys or Shamys want--it's what CL and BP want. And they obviously don't want the Shenny. And no matter what you think, the "Shenny" crowd is not some silent majority out there waiting to overturn the show with some kind of secret ratings coup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickfromillinois Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 It seems to me that like thier unrealistc fantasy concerning Sheldon and Penny, their "sugggestions" are likewise unrealistic. Have a episode basesed upon a dream sequence where Sheldon and Penny get together? To what end? Why would Lorre do it? To settle some silly argument as to who makes a better companion for Penny or for Sheldon regardless of how it would affect the storyline or the direction of the show? I think that that Sheldon and Raj have a wonderous chemistry and they would make the perfect couple although I am sure that there are some bigots would disagree. Therefore I DEMAND that they have a dream sequence with Raj and Sheldon getting together so that we can compare the ratings of that show with the rest of the episodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ðꧧï©å‡êÐ ©ø®þ§ê Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Woah, this is a bit too far--I don't even think they're capable of being a couple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubyanjel Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Since we've been in the "read this fanfic" topic, this one greatly demonstrates as to why they ARE NOT COMPATIBLE IN ANY WAY. http://www.fanfiction.net/s/8623377/1/No-Reason I'm not saying this is a proof, but I'm just sharing this because this story actually demonstrates the "what if" that we keep on pointing out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbase Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 My internet is down and i only have my phone to surf with. So have not seen 6.04 yet. I knew Sheldon got wrestled by Penny from seeing the promo. But now I see there's a gif of her kissing him all over his face. Hmmm! Why would she do that? And why wasn't that Amy? Not sure what to think now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ðꧧï©å‡êÐ ©ø®þ§ê Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Watch the episode, you'll find out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantagrae Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 My internet is down and i only have my phone to surf with. So have not seen 6.04 yet. I knew Sheldon got wrestled by Penny from seeing the promo. But now I see there's a gif of her kissing him all over his face. Hmmm! Why would she do that? And why wasn't that Amy? Not sure what to think now It's quite obvious in context and he's not enjoying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubyanjel Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 My internet is down and i only have my phone to surf with. So have not seen 6.04 yet. I knew Sheldon got wrestled by Penny from seeing the promo. But now I see there's a gif of her kissing him all over his face. Hmmm! Why would she do that? And why wasn't that Amy? Not sure what to think now please tell me you are serious, and please tell me the gifs you saw were not the altered ones where they made it look like Sheldon and Penny were making out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbase Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 As I wrote, all I have seen is the gif from the episode. It baffled me because throwing Sheldon on his back and kissing his face, even under protest, is very provocative. Well it certainly would be if someone did that to me. I knew they were going to wrestle... but the kissing? Not sure what to make of it. Of course seeing the episode might change that impression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pomita Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 I think it was quite clear from the scene that Penny was just having fun with teasing him after defeating him, and he was suitably horrified by her attack. Amy's tentative kisses on his forehead, on the other hand, had an undertone of affection (this second statement might just be my shipper glasses, but at least I have the advantage of knowing that the writers are on my side). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonbase Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 I think it was quite clear from the scene that Penny was just having fun with teasing him after defeating him, and he was suitably horrified by her attack. Amy's tentative kisses on his forehead, on the other hand, had an undertone of affection (this second statement might just be my shipper glasses, but at least I have the advantage of knowing that the writers are on my side). I did notice there were no shenny's signing up to post about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPK Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 It's all about torture. Penny is humilating him by kissing him like she does because she knows he can't stand it. It's actually very sibling like. I don't have a sister but a couple of my buddies growing up did and their older sisters would do something along those lines all the time to annoy them. The Shenny shippers will take this moment out of context and assign a completely different meaning behind it, but they do that for every scene. Just watch the episode, it's hardly provacative at all and there is no romantic/sexual subtext to the scene at all, this is doubly so because Amy joins in as well. You can't tell me Shenny people are looking for a threeway between Amy/Penny/Sheldon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ðꧧï©å‡êÐ ©ø®þ§ê Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) They'll probably make an excuse for Amy joining in and continue with their idiotic rants... Edited October 20, 2012 by Dessicated Corpse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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