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ShellyBean

What happened to Halo night? Paintball ? Chinese restaurant?

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EVERY show that goes at or over 100 episodes has had major character development. Every last one of them. Look at the beginning of Seinfeld, and look at the last season. Ditto with the Simpsons, Ditto with Family Guy, ditto with South Park, ditto with Cosby show, ditto with Married With Children. I could keep going on and on but the ultimate goal of a show is to be the highest rated show and keep execs happy to make as much money as possible. Right now this show is beating Idol in ratings and is the most popular sitcom on TV.

The show isn't far from the beginning, it just changed some characters so it can stay fresh. How many more episodes can they do the "Howard says something lewd to Penny while Lennard acts like a complete lap dog". And its 5 seasons, Raj should be able to say hello to a female without the need of a beer.

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I agree, you can't have of both ways. A show can not run on and on without some degree of change. It's what those changes are going to mean that's worrying some fans. Baby steps or big leaps. The bottom line is, Chuck and Bill know the score, it their business to know. They could have kept TBBT unchanged, wound it up after about 4 seasons and made it a cult classic. A lot of new fans might never have know it existed. I would have loved this approach but it would have ended by now. Anything without change is much more finite.

I'm kind of resigned to the fact TBBT is changing. It's out of my hands, so I can only sit back and watch it unfold. But if a time comes when it goes seriously downhill, I just hope they have the sense to wind it up.

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Well, I would have preferred it to end earlier than morph into an "all crowd-pleasing" show that drifted away from its unique comedic formula.

If they found their story-lines getting tired and the ratings starting to drop, I would have preferred that they end it on a high note - rather than changing the show into something that had become more and more difficult to stomach.

Long live Seasons 1-3.

:-)

PS - I still love the show - (mostly for the 4 main characters) - but that love is slowly dissolving...

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PS - I still love the show - (mostly for the 4 main characters) - but that love is slowly dissolving...

Who got left out? Penny, or the 'treasured acquaintance'?

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PS - I still love the show - (mostly for the 4 main characters) - but that love is slowly dissolving...

Who got left out? Penny, or the 'treasured acquaintance'?

To me, I like the show as a "guy" thing.

A story about guys, for guys.

I find the other supporting characters to be just that - supporting side stories - no more.

I'd rather have most of the focus of the show be on the 4 guys.

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl

Maybe I still love the show because I started watching it from the begginning? I don't know, maybe it has to do with the fact that the show changed with me during all this time? maybe the time has softened the change for me? I don't know, probably.

But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

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Sorry to reference Seinfeld again, but there is one pertinent analogy.

When George was going to get married to Susan, they ended up killing her character off.

Prior to that, it was foreshadowed - if you remember - George was trying to underline that the George you know and love (independent George) is a different entity than "relationship George".

The quote was "If relationship George walks through this door, he will kill independent George".

The Seinfeld folks "got" it.

Introducing a permanent "relationship" with the main characters would change the original chemistry too much - and the winning formula would be upset.

I wish TBBT folks would take a step back and look at what they are doing.

(perhaps it is all now only about ratings and dollars - which is more motivation than most would need these days. This explains the pandering being done to appease a broader female demographic - evident in the season 5 relationshippy "storylines".)

I feel this is what is happening to the show.

The "relationship" slant is killing the personas of the characters we grew to love - as now they are a different "entity" with the girlfriends at their sides, and in their own girls-clique.

Remember the recent episode, where Raj had to point out - how much he was looking forward to just spending time with the "guys" again - just like old times.

He nailed that one on the head.

The addition of permanent female relationships has been a soaking wet blanket on the charisma of the show.

Look at the Amy character for example.

When she was first introduced, she was a robotic, logic-centric, female-Sheldon.

That was actually funny - to see her interact just like Sheldon does.

Then....(why oh why did they have to do it), they changed her into a woman who stopped being like Sheldon, and more like a woman who "needs a man" - then gets hell-bent on seducing him.

The whole hand-holding scene at the end really paints a clear picture of the direction the writers/producers are going to take the show.

I'm afraid we're in store for more cookie-cutter relationship stories for season 6.

I vote to bring back the nerdy, scientific, logic-based, gaming, comic-book loving, awkward, funny, UNIQUE, guys of seasons 1-3.

That was entertaining, and definitely different enough than anything else on the tube, keeping you wanting more.

I love the fact that everyone on this forum is so passionate about the show.

I can appreciate the differences of opinion of those who prefer relationship-comedies, and of those (like me), who would like this show to get back to its roots.

I simply feel that the show is turning into what can be seen "on every other sitcom out there".

If this show turns into that, then there will be a point where it has diminished its unique value enough to turn away even its truest fans.

I hope that day does not come - I love the show.

Standing ovation from me for this post! I agree completely and have been pummeled with scorn in other topics for daring to suggest that I don't like the changes. You nailed the Amy changes perfectly. They've changed her into a manipulative love-starved shrew who I see as very creepy and unlikable. I fear they're changing TBBT from a wonderfully unique show into a dime-a-dozen romantic relationship show that's been done thousands of times before. I'm sure the ratings will stay high since there's a large audience for that type of show but it's disappointing to those of us who appreciated it's refreshing uniqueness.

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Sorry to reference Seinfeld again, but there is one pertinent analogy.

When George was going to get married to Susan, they ended up killing her character off.

Prior to that, it was foreshadowed - if you remember - George was trying to underline that the George you know and love (independent George) is a different entity than "relationship George".

The quote was "If relationship George walks through this door, he will kill independent George".

The Seinfeld folks "got" it.

Introducing a permanent "relationship" with the main characters would change the original chemistry too much - and the winning formula would be upset.

I wish TBBT folks would take a step back and look at what they are doing.

(perhaps it is all now only about ratings and dollars - which is more motivation than most would need these days. This explains the pandering being done to appease a broader female demographic - evident in the season 5 relationshippy "storylines".)

I feel this is what is happening to the show.

The "relationship" slant is killing the personas of the characters we grew to love - as now they are a different "entity" with the girlfriends at their sides, and in their own girls-clique.

Remember the recent episode, where Raj had to point out - how much he was looking forward to just spending time with the "guys" again - just like old times.

He nailed that one on the head.

The addition of permanent female relationships has been a soaking wet blanket on the charisma of the show.

Look at the Amy character for example.

When she was first introduced, she was a robotic, logic-centric, female-Sheldon.

That was actually funny - to see her interact just like Sheldon does.

Then....(why oh why did they have to do it), they changed her into a woman who stopped being like Sheldon, and more like a woman who "needs a man" - then gets hell-bent on seducing him.

The whole hand-holding scene at the end really paints a clear picture of the direction the writers/producers are going to take the show.

I'm afraid we're in store for more cookie-cutter relationship stories for season 6.

I vote to bring back the nerdy, scientific, logic-based, gaming, comic-book loving, awkward, funny, UNIQUE, guys of seasons 1-3.

That was entertaining, and definitely different enough than anything else on the tube, keeping you wanting more.

I love the fact that everyone on this forum is so passionate about the show.

I can appreciate the differences of opinion of those who prefer relationship-comedies, and of those (like me), who would like this show to get back to its roots.

I simply feel that the show is turning into what can be seen "on every other sitcom out there".

If this show turns into that, then there will be a point where it has diminished its unique value enough to turn away even its truest fans.

I hope that day does not come - I love the show.

Standing ovation from me for this post! I agree completely and have been pummeled with scorn in other topics for daring to suggest that I don't like the changes. You nailed the Amy changes perfectly. They've changed her into a manipulative love-starved shrew who I see as very creepy and unlikable. I fear they're changing TBBT from a wonderfully unique show into a dime-a-dozen romantic relationship show that's been done thousands of times before. I'm sure the ratings will stay high since there's a large audience for that type of show but it's disappointing to those of us who appreciated it's refreshing uniqueness.

Standing ovation from me as well.

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I'll third the standing ovation!

Me Too!

I'm happy to see that now that the season is over people are coming out of the woodwork to express their displeasure on various threads.

A little validation is good for the soul.:)

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Well, I would have preferred it to end earlier than morph into an "all crowd-pleasing" show that drifted away from its unique comedic formula.

If they found their story-lines getting tired and the ratings starting to drop, I would have preferred that they end it on a high note - rather than changing the show into something that had become more and more difficult to stomach.

Long live Seasons 1-3.

:-)

PS - I still love the show - (mostly for the 4 main characters) - but that love is slowly dissolving...

I agree. The truly great shows knew when to end. "The Bob Newhart Show, "The Mary Tyler Moore Show", "Cheers", "Seinfeld", "Everybody Loved Raymond" all pulled the plug before their quality started declining and they still had good ratings. You could argue that "Seinfeld" should have ended a season earlier when Larry David left. And all of them are remembered as classics. Others like "Happy Days" and "MASH" became embarassing shells of their glory years even though their rating were still good. People continued to watch out of habit, not because of the quality of the show. It's painful to watch "Two and a Half Men" and "The Office" now that they're past their primes. It's like watching Muhammad Ali in his last few fights.

Jerry Seinfeld said that it's better to leave the audience wanting more than to go on too long.

But it seems that more often than not, ratings and money trump quality.

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But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl

But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

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But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

Good for you. :)

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But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

There's just as much name-calling from those who attack people who don't like the changes this season. I guess it depends on whose ox is being gored.

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But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

There's just as much name-calling from those who attack people who don't like the changes this season. I guess it depends on whose ox is being gored.

I don't recall a single name you people have been called. No, but I get your point. :)

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But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

There's just as much name-calling from those who attack people who don't like the changes this season. I guess it depends on whose ox is being gored.

I don't recall a single name you people have been called. No, but I get your point. :)

But I do love the show as it is now. I love it more than ever. If it wasn't for Amy & Bernadette I wouldn't be probably watching. Heck, sometimes, I rewatch seasons 1-3 and I kinda miss them, Amy most specially. I kinda keep waiting for her to show up.. crazy.

Same here.

I know the general attitude here is that if we dare to make this confession, then we're mindless morons (or desperate housewives, or one of the dumb general public), but it still has to be said.

yeah, that is usually the name-calling for the people who also like the latest seasons but, whateaver, I know for a fact that I am smart, so whateaver "Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them." LOL

There's just as much name-calling from those who attack people who don't like the changes this season. I guess it depends on whose ox is being gored.

I don't recall a single name you people have been called. No, but I get your point. :)

I've been called stupid and ignorant.

I've been told I don't "care" about the happiness of the characters, even though THEY"RE NOT REAL PEOPLE.

I've been told repeatedly to shut up and stop watching the show because I've dared to be critical of the changes this year and don't love the show enough.

And best of all - I've been told that I must be unhappy and lonely in my personal life so I'm threatened by fictional nerds getting girlfriends. My wife of 22 years loved that one.

But as you say ""Yes, well, I'm polymerized tree sap and they're an inorganic adhesive, so whatever verbal projectile they launch in our direction is reflected off of us, returns on its original trajectory and adheres to them.". Now THAT was when Sheldon was still funny,

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I've been called stupid and ignorant.

I didn't see that, and I have no idea why someone would say that. Stupidity has nothing to do with it.

I've been told I don't "care" about the happiness of the characters, even though THEY"RE NOT REAL PEOPLE.

This was me. For many of us, watching a sitcom (and loving it) over many years means developing an attachment with the characters and wishing them well. You obviously don't look at it that way; for you it's only the comedic aspect that matters. So saying that you don't care about the characters is not an accusation, it's a fact you admit yourself.

I've been told repeatedly to shut up and stop watching the show because I've dared to be critical of the changes this year and don't love the show enough.

Not in those words; but it's true that if anyone complains vociferously about a show over several months, and seems to hate most things about it (in its present form),then I do wonder why they're still watching. I wouldn't. I've said this before, and I mean it sincerely.

And best of all - I've been told that I must be unhappy and lonely in my personal life so I'm threatened by fictional nerds getting girlfriends. My wife of 22 years loved that one.

On the contrary, I expressed surprise that you are happily married yourself but feel such shock and anger if it happens to these TV characters.

But I do believe this conversation is going too much into personal territory again, and we might be told off by the mod. So let's get back to talking of the show, after this.

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I've been called stupid and ignorant.

I didn't see that, and I have no idea why someone would say that. Stupidity has nothing to do with it.

I've been told I don't "care" about the happiness of the characters, even though THEY"RE NOT REAL PEOPLE.

This was me. For many of us, watching a sitcom (and loving it) over many years means developing an attachment with the characters and wishing them well. You obviously don't look at it that way; for you it's only the comedic aspect that matters. So saying that you don't care about the characters is not an accusation, it's a fact you admit yourself.

I've been told repeatedly to shut up and stop watching the show because I've dared to be critical of the changes this year and don't love the show enough.

Not in those words; but it's true that if anyone complains vociferously about a show over several months, and seems to hate most things about it (in its present form),then I do wonder why they're still watching. I wouldn't. I've said this before, and I mean it sincerely.

And best of all - I've been told that I must be unhappy and lonely in my personal life so I'm threatened by fictional nerds getting girlfriends. My wife of 22 years loved that one.

On the contrary, I expressed surprise that you are happily married yourself but feel such shock and anger if it happens to these TV characters.

But I do believe this conversation is going too much into personal territory again, and we might be told off by the mod. So let's get back to talking of the show, after this.

I don't "hate" most things about the show. I've repeatedly said that it's still better than most shows on today. I do hate what they've done to Sheldon and I really hate what they've done to Amy.

If the characters were real people, I would want them to be happy, but they're not. I just want them to be funny and I think the changes are threatening that.

Thanks for discussing it maturely.

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I don't "hate" most things about the show. I've repeatedly said that it's still better than most shows on today. I do hate what they've done to Sheldon and I really hate what they've done to Amy.

If the characters were real people, I would want them to be happy, but they're not. I just want them to be funny and I think the changes are threatening that.

Thanks for discussing it maturely.

Fair enough.

I do think unhappy people aren't that funny - which is why I'm not finding Raj funny, nowadays. And Leonard and Howard clearly were unhappy when they were single and kept failing with women. I believe that joke works only for so long before the audience would also start feeling the pressure of their frustration.

Sheldon's is an interesting case. He certainly was happy alone, in his own way. So it may be legitimately argued 'why give him a girlfriend at all'.

I like the possible evolution in Sheldon's character that this involves. I find it fascinating. But it's a valid point to say that he didn't, on the face of it, need that development. He could have done without it. It's just another 'wonderful way to play with him', as Jim said.

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I don't "hate" most things about the show. I've repeatedly said that it's still better than most shows on today. I do hate what they've done to Sheldon and I really hate what they've done to Amy.

If the characters were real people, I would want them to be happy, but they're not. I just want them to be funny and I think the changes are threatening that.

Thanks for discussing it maturely.

Fair enough.

I do think unhappy people aren't that funny - which is why I'm not finding Raj funny, nowadays. And Leonard and Howard clearly were unhappy when they were single and kept failing with women. I believe that joke works only for so long before the audience would also start feeling the pressure of their frustration.

Sheldon's is an interesting case. He certainly was happy alone, in his own way. So it may be legitimately argued 'why give him a girlfriend at all'.

I like the possible evolution in Sheldon's character that this involves. I find it fascinating. But it's a valid point to say that he didn't, on the face of it, need that development. He could have done without it. It's just another 'wonderful way to play with him', as Jim said.

Was sheldon happy? I guess that could be a whole other thread to discuss.

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I hated Friends with all my soul. I absolutely love TBBT. I don't see it, but, whateaver.

btw, regarding Seinfeld... even George Constanza was engaged to be married. Food for thought.

I grw up in the 90's with Friends and Seinfeld being staples. Maybe even Home Improvement. For me the show I couldn't stand was Will & Grace. That show just seemed difficult to understand, there was no point. I know many people say seinfeld didn't have a point but I think it did. Four friends going through the trials and tribulations of everyday normal life and how to cope. Granted almost none of the episodes were based off the previous episode, but it didn't have to be. Life, events and people all move on with time.

What was wrong with George??? Now if Kramer got engaged i'd be scared for humanity.


"Oh and yes, I am tired of this Leonard and Penny crap, they break up, get back together, break up again..and it looks like they are going to break up again."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Me too! I know the Leonard character is supposed to be the show's straight man,,,not quite as nerdy as the others. But at least in the first two or three years he had his funny moments. But now, for me, he's become intolerable. When he isn't with Penny, he becomes a whiney, pouting, insufferable brat, and it drags the entire episode down.

And in almost all the episode descriptions now, it's "Leonard and Penny" or "Howard and Bernadette." You don't see "The Guys." And because it's becoming a more relationship oriented show, other hilarious characters are seen less and less, like the comic book store owner and Kripke.

Sorry, I never found Krpike funny. Infact i find him more disgusting than Wolowitz.

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Sorry, I never found Krpike funny. Infact i find him more disgusting than Wolowitz.

Disagree. Well, let's talk about Howard first. He was a funny disgusting pervert when he was single. My favorite Howard moment is when he goes to Vegas with the guys and his reaction when he finds out from Leonard that the girl he was talking to was a hooker.

H- "She's a hooker, did you already give her the money"?

L -"Yes.."

(inhales deeply)

H - "Thank you!"

Look at Howard now, yes this season showed more than enough about his space trip so next season I hope we see the old nerdy personality of him.(robots, magic tricks, talking in other languages, etc)

Kripke and Stuart needs to make more appearances, I find them funny and just refreshing.

EDIT-

I don't think theres any point talking about why guys are not geeky anymore, it's all because of the relationship problems. The last time they TRIED to have a Halo night was in season 3 in the episode where Dr.Pimpton was in Raj's apartment, they never had a Halo night ever since because Howard and Bernadette got back together and Sheldon met Amy in the season finale. It all changed when those 2 joined the show.

I love playing video games, and I don't think that part of me would ever change if I am in a relationship. :) I hope Sheldon breaks up with Amy, she was perfectly right for Sheldon at first when they met but then she became horny and different as the seasons progressed.

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Sorry, I never found Krpike funny. Infact i find him more disgusting than Wolowitz.

Disagree. Well, let's talk about Howard first. He was a funny disgusting pervert when he was single. My favorite Howard moment is when he goes to Vegas with the guys and his reaction when he finds out from Leonard that the girl he was talking to was a hooker.

H- "She's a hooker, did you already give her the money"?

L -"Yes.."

(inhales deeply)

H - "Thank you!"

Look at Howard now, yes this season showed more than enough about his space trip so next season I hope we see the old nerdy personality of him.(robots, magic tricks, talking in other languages, etc)

Kripke and Stuart needs to make more appearances, I find them funny and just refreshing.

EDIT-

I don't think theres any point talking about why guys are not geeky anymore, it's all because of the relationship problems. The last time they TRIED to have a Halo night was in season 3 in the episode where Dr.Pimpton was in Raj's apartment, they never had a Halo night ever since because Howard and Bernadette got back together and Sheldon met Amy in the season finale. It all changed when those 2 joined the show.

I love playing video games, and I don't think that part of me would ever change if I am in a relationship. :) I hope Sheldon breaks up with Amy, she was perfectly right for Sheldon at first when they met but then she became horny and different as the seasons progressed.

Need more Wil Wheaton and Stuart. Kripke just never did anything for me. He was hard to understand when he talked. That scene where he was in Sheldon and Leonard's apartment and he was flossing and during the middle of the process he notices Penny and tries to hit on her, Howard then says to Penny something about looking like a better option now and she laughed.

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