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6.10 The Fish Guts Displacement (Dec. 6)

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106 members have voted

  1. 1. How do you rate this episode?

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So kind of a mediocre episode in my personal opinion. It was cute and had some funny bits but a lot of it seemed almost forced... it was nice seeing Sheldon actually want to help Amy get better and Howards interaction with mike was nice but all in all not one of my favorites this season... 6/10 from me

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Just an F.YI. There is a NFL game on nationally each and every Thursday. Why should that have anything to do with comparing ratings from 1 week to other weeks?
It depends which advertising market is pre-empted week to week. If the Giants are playing and NYC is pre-empted that can have a big effect on final ratings because its the largest media market in the country, I don't know where Denver falls in this list. This is just an example to answer why this might affect things weekly. 

 

 

@annie  Extrapolating about the popularity of certain relationships from a 0.2 drop is just fishing. The bottom line is that a drop of 0.2 isn't really a drop at all. It's just noise. A fall of 0.5 might suggest something, but it would have far more to do with better competition programming than whether people liked a promo or not. The night BBT got 5.7, I think the NFL game was between two poorly performing teams. 

 

 

Nearly every program got a bump after daylight savings finished, presumably because people finish outdoor activities an hour earlier. At that time, the show started hitting 5s. The ratings will probably drop back to high 4s in the spring when daylight time is back after sweeps. The ratings would have to fall immediately down to low 3's (while other programs retained theirs) for there to be any evidence that current story lines aren't working. For perspective, a 3 is still better than the performance of all the comedies on NBC, ABC and FOX ( save for Modern Family). I'm not sure that people appreciate just how wildly popular this show is. The Walking Dead is the only other (non-sportsball) show that has cracked 5.0 this season. Nothing else even comes close. 

 

 

 

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Man, I am so back and forth on this subject.  Is sheldon turned on or is he not?  The more I read the different viewpoints, the more I am confused!

 

Unfortunately, I always see the both sides of arguments.  It's kind of torturous!  I have been enjoying reading this thread though!

 

One thing is for sure, this episode does make good topic for conversation!  :icon_wink:

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Man, I am so back and forth on this subject.  Is sheldon turned on or is he not?  The more I read the different viewpoints, the more I am confused!   Unfortunately, I always see the both sides of arguments.  It's kind of torturous!  I have been enjoying reading this thread though!   One thing is for sure, this episode does make good topic for conversation!  :icon_wink:
Personally I feel it is little of both. At first he was simply helping AFF because he saw it as his obligation and she was his girlfriend, however, as the days went on he began to enjoy it more than just a duty he had to perform. By the time he spanked her although it began as a punishment you could see in his facial expression and tone of his voice that at least subconsciously he was enjoying it. Now the question will be does he begin to understand that he was enjoying it because he is beginning to think of AFF in a different light? I think slowly he will. But AFF is pushing the envelope more than ever this season so the writers may want all the relationships on a new level quicker than most followers thought at the beginning of the season.
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i think he liked it honestly i think he has thought about it before  

 

haha, well she did deserve it. :icon_lol:

 

I find it amusing how everyone is focused on sex, sex, sex and missing all the little nuggets. Like Sheldon saying "I thought our relationship was built on trust" and "you're my girlfriend and I care about your wellbeing" this is Sheldon Cooper saying these things! .... but oh no.... it's all about the spanking :icon_rolleyes:

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haha, well she did deserve it. :icon_lol:

 

I find it amusing how everyone is focused on sex, sex, sex and missing all the little nuggets. Like Sheldon saying "I thought our relationship was built on trust" and "you're my girlfriend and I care about your wellbeing" this is Sheldon Cooper saying these things! .... but oh no.... it's all about the spanking :icon_rolleyes:

 

And don't forget "It hurts that you would lie to me". Sheldon admitting that he not only has feelings, but that they can be hurt. 

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I know, it's all there. Things I never thought he'd say. I'm one of the people who gets complained about, for not wanting too much change in Sheldon but even I'm surprised I'm not flipping out. All we ever got from him over 5 seasons is his usual "oh I don't care!". This is massive growth but no one is noticing because everyone is just waiting for them to s***w. Thats the truth of it.
 

Edited by Moonbase

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And don't forget "It hurts that you would lie to me". Sheldon admitting that he not only has feelings, but that they can be hurt. 

 

Oh... I loved it!! Each time Sheldon shows less boundaries, when he is around Amy. They are totally comfortable with each other, even trying new things. What a fantastic relationship! :wub:

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I know, it's all there. Things I never thought he'd say. I'm one of the people who gets complained about, for not wanting too much change in Sheldon but even I'm surprised I'm not flipping out. All we ever got from him over 5 seasons is his usual "oh I don't care!". This is massive growth but no one is noticing because everyone is just waiting for them to s***w. Thats the truth of it.

 

 

To be fair to people though, I don't think it's not being noticed, I think there's just a tendency to worry and panic around here, so people tend to focus on the ambiguous rather than what's established (i.e. that he has feelings for her and he is showing them more and more). I don't know why that is, but I also pointed that out back when the report came out that people were focusing so much on the spanking when there were some really subtle but pretty massive signs of growth. I actually wonder whether the writers purposefully wrote the ep this way because most people would focus on the overt physical stuff but it was really just an excuse to make an episode which is essentially about Sheldon showing more emotional maturity than ever before to be funny at the same time. We had talked about his emotional maturity in the 43 Peculiarity, this is such an enormous step forward even from that. 

 

I personally keep rewatching the very first scene over and over again, I hardly watch the "physical" ones, because I'm just floored every time. Best moment of the episode (if not the show), for me, is when he stops in the hallway. That right there is the moment that changed everything for me. 

Edited by spook
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To be fair to people though, I don't think it's not being noticed, I think there's just a tendency to worry and panic around here, so people tend to focus on the ambiguous rather than what's established (i.e. that he has feelings for her and he is showing them more and more). I don't know why that is, but I also pointed that out back when the report came out that people were focusing so much on the spanking when there were some really subtle but pretty massive signs of growth. I actually wonder whether the writers purposefully wrote the ep this way because most people would focus on the overt physical stuff but it was really just an excuse to make an episode which is essentially about Sheldon showing more emotional maturity than ever before to be funny at the same time. We had talked about his emotional maturity in the 43 Peculiarity, this is such an enormous step forward even from that. 

 

I personally keep rewatching the very first scene over and over again, I hardly watch the "physical" ones, because I'm just floored every time. Best moment of the episode (if not the show), for me, is when he stops in the hallway. That right there is the moment that changed everything for me. 

 

Good point. I don't read taping reports, so I missed all that.

 

@bigbangsheldon

you missed a * (got it yet?)

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My belated take on it, as usual, including my starry-eyed rave about Sheldon/Amy (please ignore if it doesn't make sense to you). Sorry for copy-pasting, I just wrote it elsewhere and am too tired to write it up again. :)

 

 

I loved this episode, even apart from the obvious reason. I thought the Howard storyline had just the right mix of touching and funny, and Simon played it remarkably well as always. The place where Bernie's dad offers to teach Howard the card game almost made me tear up a little.

Penny/Kaley was brilliant in this episode. After a very long time, I LOVED Penny. It was a sweet throwback to the caring mentor role to the guys which we've seen her in, years back. And really, my favorite Penny look might be sweats, with her hair tousled and pizza all over her face. smile.gif

I also liked the little nod to Amy and Bernie's new-found camaraderie, when she dropped in with the experimental drugs with bizarre side-effects.

 

Regarding Sheldon/Amy.. let me just say what I have to, from a place of breathless fangirl wonder.. there were just so many dreams fulfilled, some of which I didn't even know I had, like the sickbed reading.

Sheldon Cooper came back. He thought of getting away from a sick Amy (after a highly engaging, flirtatious smile that almost made me forgive him).. but he couldn't. 'You're my girlfriend and I care about your well-being'.. he said that from his heart.

The way he said 'I just want you to get better as soon as possible'.

The way he said 'I need to get you down for a nap'.

The way he said 'Amy, would you be strong enough to bathe yourself, or do you need my help?'

..the familiarity and concern in his voice.

Sitting beside her reading the genetics experiment to her like a bedtime story, in a voice all velvet, while she looked up adoringly at him.. a picture of bliss likely to come back in my dreams for a long time.

'It hurts that you would lie to me, Amy. I thought our relationship was based on trust and mutual admiration'. He said that in so many words to her.. Sheldon Cooper did. He admitted - to her - that she could hurt him.
 

:wub: :wub:

 

I'm sorry to be just quoting all this like people do below youtube videos. I can't even get into analyzing.. there's no way I can explain just why or how much all of this affected me.

An offshoot of floating in this pink cloud of bliss is that I found I couldn't even think much about the other aspects of the story; by the time I reached the tag, I was too emotionally spent for it to really register, let alone shock. For me, everything else - the faux kinkiness, Amy's harmless little lie, her having a bit of fun around Sheldon's naivete - was played for laughs, and I did laugh, and I didn't really care. Well, I took those as additional hints of Sheldon being increasingly more physically comfortable around Amy; but this factor paled to insignificance beside the huge emotional impact of Sheldon in this episode, his growth, his tenderness, his sudden realization of willingness to be there in her bad times, the honesty and emotional frankness of his statement to her about their relationship.

I do think that no arousal, even unconscious, was implied on the side of Sheldon here; and that makes sense to me, because in a caregiver role with a sick person, I myself in his place would probably not have thought in the direction of sexuality. And this was Sheldon, who is remarkably naive and repressed in these matters anyway. On the other hand, Amy getting her little bit of wish-fulfillment out of it was quite in character too; and in no way did it come across to me as desperation or frustration from her side. After all, she wasn't even the one suggesting the actions, she just played along and made the best of what was happening!

I could have done without the tag scene (in fact I skipped it in all my rewatches), but I didn't mind it either. I did wonder how Jim and Mayim did that with straight faces. smile.gif

Oh, and someone pointed out that Jim's hands were even redder than usual, in that scene. I do believe his hands were blushing. :p

Edited by Pomita
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I think you are directing the criticisms that a lot of people have about the lack of potential for Sheldon in a sexual relationship towards me (e.g. he's asexual, not interested in Amy, a germophobe, frightened of sex, knows nothing about sex, would run screaming from Amy's vagina etc) when I haven't professed to having any of those opinions. The only argument I have now made repeatedly is that I believe Sheldon gets sexual innuendo when the context of the conversation or the interaction is clearly labelled as sexual. (His own recent comments and Alien parasite fall into this). When the context isn't clear, he just doesn't get it. This has happened several times before last night's show. The best example I can think that displays his sexual naivety is Sheldon believing the dead hooker actress was bouncing on the bed upstairs.

You have the theory that Sheldon wasn't oblivious and got some kind of sexual gratification from spanking Amy, but chose to hide it because he is a "kinky sob" but yet apparently in denial because of some religious-based sexual repression from his childhood. My theory is a lot simpler. I see him acting oblivious, I assume he is oblivious to the sexual component that Amy got out of it. My simple explanation of context explains Sheldon's behavior to my mind perfectly well. I have my opinion, you are welcome to yours, just don't expect everyone to agree with what is (in my opinion) a pretty far fetched idea. I don't think this discussion can go much further and it's probably boring everyone else. I'm out. :)

 

 

 I'm sorry, but my original and continued intention wasn't to single you out at all or to direct criticism about Sheldon towards you, I'm just been responding to your comments to ME. I left my original comment just to voice my own opinion and then you responded in disagreement with it so I wanted to try and explain my views more clearly.  I leave a comment expressing my opinion then if and when someone responds to it whether they agree or disagreeing with it I try to explain my thoughts further. I never said you professed to having any of those opinions you just described above I was simpling explaining my own and you chose to disagree which is fine by me.  But, please don't tell me not to discuss them or make this about me attacking you or your ideas because if anything all I was trying to do was defend/explain my own view point.

 

 So if my opinions and comments about Sheldon bores you or any one else here well thats fine ya'll have the right to ignore me.  But, you chose to reply to my comment first, so I chose to respond to you and explain my views.  In my opinon that is what discussion boards are for discussing different aspects of show and characters.   I do think I have the right to state my views and explain my opinions too. So that is all I've been doing.  Not trying to put a guilt trip on you or anyone by telling you that your ideas are wrong or far fetched or anything like that.  I was simply telling you and anyone else here who chooses to read my comments what I see in the characters.  If you disagree thats okay, but my comments aren't meant to be directed at you at all until you chose to respond to me first.  Then I began replying back to you in order to answer your questions that were directed at me. 

 

 Like you said Sheldon does understand sexual comments whenever the context is clear and when its more vague he doesn't always understand them as well and I agree with that. 

 

So when i broke down all the different comments as Exhibits in my original comment I was trying to create a pattern that shows how he over time has developed better understanding of human behavior but still struggles with it.   In this particular case with the spanking and taking care of Amy while she sick the gratification doesn't have to be just sexual.  That wasn't my point to make it just about Sheldon being kinky sob, my point was to show that there is more to Sheldon Cooper than what is on the surface and just obvious.  Same goes with all characters and well people in general.  Its just Like  what Jim Parsons said on Craig Ferguson  show "there's nothing wrong with sex, but human beings are more complicated than that." 

 

 

  Thats all I'm saying is that yes people can choose to look at this situation as very simple and that he didn't get her sexual remarks and is just oblivious to them all.  But I agree with Jim that human beings and characters are much more COMPLICATED then people want to believe they are on the surface.  As for my "KINKY SOB" comment that was said partially in jest, but partially to drive home the idea that Sheldon may have hidden desires that he don't always express in the most usual manner.  Most people don't spank their girlfriends when they lie to them, that is something that a lot of "normal" people would consider pretty kinky thing to do and involves physical contact that someone like Sheldon usually doesn't display on the show, but is willing to NOW with her.  

 

Sheldon may not even realize or want to admit consciously that he has desire to be more physically intimate with Amy yet, but his choice to stay and take care of her and to ignore his own germophobic tendencies by touching her with his bare hands instead of using gloves, to bath her and spank her are all indications of growing willingness to be physical with Amy even if the context is not always sexual to him it was to Amy which is pretty obvious by her responses to him. 

 

 

I've taken many psych classes in college and psychological behaviors interest me a great deal so that is why i like discussing them its not about just trying to prove I'm right and your wrong or anything like that.  Its about expressing a different view point than just what is simply obvious that Sheldon doesn't understand Amy's sex remarks.  He doesn't have to understand what she means to enjoy touching her he simply has to choose to touch her regardless of what he says and enjoy it.   But, anyway my point is I choose to believe there is a lot  more going on with Sheldon than just oh he is really kinky or he is a germophobe or asexual or genius etc...

 

I choose to believe he can be all of those things and more and that people are more than just one thing at one time, we evolve, change, learn, grow over time, but certain human needs or desires stem from very basic instincts and urges that are genetically coded into our DNA and many studies have been done and are still being done on human sexuality and social behaviors so its not all just Black and White or in this case its not all Sheldon is just Oblivious and doesn't understand sexual inneundos in unclear contexts vs. Sheldon having Secret Hidden Sexual desires masked by cluelessness that is also too simplistic way of looking at things in my opinion.  However, people want to look at Sheldon's current or past behaviors we will each find different ways to look at it based on our own knowledge, backgrounds, desires and opinions. 

 

 

But really I don't see that its a problem for me to bring up a different or perhaps if people want to interpret it as "complicated" view point when that is what discussion boards are for bring up different view points and discussing them.  IF that just bores people then they simply wouldn't bother to post at all or read my comments or any comments at all.  i like reading comments and I like posting my ideas and opinions so that is what I did.  Sheldon loves to bring up complicated ideas that don't meet the norm all the time and people constantly disagree with him on it, but that doesn't stop him from bringing them up and I not trying to stop anyone else from bring up there.  Just let record show that though my ideas about Sheldon's behavior may seem far fetched to some it doesn't make them WRONG! and it doesn't make yours RIGHT because to your mind its more "simple" explanation. 

 

My point is sometimes life isn't always so simple, characters aren't always very simple and Sheldon is not just a simpleton who doesn't understand his own urges or desires in my opinion at least he is quite complex, interesting and unique character and all the different ways of interpreting his behavior can bring something interesting to the discussions here even if I personally don't agree with all of them.  Truth is I don't disagree with you at all that Sheldon doesn't always understand sexual things happening around him like with the dead hooker, but I do disagree that just because he doesn't understand other people's behavior that it means he doesn't have his own unique behaviors and sexual desires.  Those desires do not only stem from the strict religious southern upbringing or his mother's nurturing, but also they stem from his own personal growing desire for Amy which have slowly been developed over time from just a "relationship of the mind" as he put it to a "relationship based on mutual admiration and trust."  Sheldon knows his relationships can grow and change over time.  Like he told Penny when he said "Leonard made me like you and that was a hard road to hoe." He realizes you can learn to like someone more and feel more comfortable around them as difficult as it may be for him he is capable of change even if he doesn't LIKE change.  He will likely continue to change and develop socially as long as Sheldon has these relationships and Amy is making him grow and change that much faster that is my point.

 

 

Anyway, thats all i really have to say on the matter.  So i'll stop boring you now since you seem to want out of the discussion, but I just wanted to let everyone know my opinion and thoughts not just you thats all.  Take care. :)

Edited by Superlovelexi

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Sorry, Sheldon may have read "the book" but he is clueless putting what he read together with actual human actions/reactions.

He truly wanted to rub Vapor Rub on her chest because that's what he know is done in that situation.

He helped her bathe, because .... oh, I hope Mary doesn't help him...

and he spanked her (her choice) because it's what his father did to (him and) his brother (when he stole his driving whiskey).

 

Nothing more than that. Sheldon is Sheldon.

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Yep Sheldon is Sheldon.  His mother use to bath him and rub his chest with vapor rub and his father use to spank him and his brother so he chose to do these things to Amy because that is what he has experienced before.  I totally agree with that.  Thats why I said this all ties into his childhood and upbringing growing up.   But he also Enjoyed having his mother sing to him when he's sick so he can sleep better, and bath him which he even asked Penny to do for him once because his mother use to do it and Mary rubbed his chest which he also liked her to do because it helps get rid of congestion and he made her do all those things for him again when he got sick during her visit.  

 

 So Sheldon enjoys those things whenever he is sick because he believes it helps make you well and he was willing to do them all for Amy so she would get better as soon as possible.  :) I think thats really very sweet of him and shows some nice growth in his character that he is willing to do these type of things for her when at first he was just going to walk away.  He said he cares about her well being so that means a lot.   And he enjoys punishing those who do him wrong, he got great pleasure out of getting revenge on Wil Wheaton and on Howard when he stole his parking space, so I still stand by my position that means he was also enjoying spanking Amy because she lied to him.   Enjoyment whether its sexual in nature or not is still ENJOYMENT.  Its as simple as that.  But, if and when he chooses to express his sexual urges for her through physical contact like how he admitted to fantasing about fondling her slightly hunched shoulder then I think there will be no denying what he feels then.

Edited by Superlovelexi
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haha, well she did deserve it. :icon_lol: I find it amusing how everyone is focused on sex, sex, sex and missing all the little nuggets. Like Sheldon saying "I thought our relationship was built on trust" and "you're my girlfriend and I care about your wellbeing" this is Sheldon Cooper saying these things! .... but oh no.... it's all about the spanking :icon_rolleyes:
It's pretty amazing that Sheldon has moved from "I would not object to us no longer categorizing you as not my girlfriend" in 5.10 and could barely stand saying it, to "you're my girlfriend and I care about your well being" and freely admitting they have a relationship based on trust and admiration in 6.10. Where is he going to be by 7.10?

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I hope by 7.10 he is at least willing to kiss her on the lips that would be so sweet to see him go from just accepting a kiss from someone else to actually intiating it himself and kissing Amy first. :) 

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Yeah, I'd be really surprised if he isn't, he has been moving at light speed recently. I'm not as patient as Amy, so I will be well fed up if he hasn't at least showed that he is interested in kissing her by 7.10. I'm a big fan of the almost-kiss, so I would love it if he shows some intent to kiss her and it goes awkwardly and hilariously awry. Sheldon still owes Amy some romantic physical affection that he was supposed to give her on the anniversary date. Penny completed her ILY challenge, Sheldon's turn to step up.

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Yeah, I'd be really surprised if he isn't, he has been moving at light speed recently. I'm not as patient as Amy, so I will be well fed up if he hasn't at least showed that he is interested in kissing her by 7.10. I'm a big fan of the almost-kiss, so I would love it if he shows some intent to kiss her and it goes awkwardly and hilariously awry. Sheldon still owes Amy some romantic physical affection that he was supposed to give her on the anniversary date. Penny completed her ILY challenge, Sheldon's turn to step up.

 

I like this idea. I want an absolute foul-up on his first kiss attempt....with some sort of hilarious but nice resolution. 

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Yeah, I'd be really surprised if he isn't, he has been moving at light speed recently. I'm not as patient as Amy, so I will be well fed up if he hasn't at least showed that he is interested in kissing her by 7.10. I'm a big fan of the almost-kiss, so I would love it if he shows some intent to kiss her and it goes awkwardly and hilariously awry. Sheldon still owes Amy some romantic physical affection that he was supposed to give her on the anniversary date. Penny completed her ILY challenge, Sheldon's turn to step up.

Like... get stung by a bee? :p LOL. Sorry bostrich, I'm hijacking all your posts with XF references tonight. hehe.

 

I actually think, later on in the series, it'd be hilarious to have an almost-coitus too. Oh, the implications. It'd actually be very ironic if Sheldon did a "Raj". ;) I think I want to use that in the ff I'm trying to write... lol.

Edited by spook

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have to love pennys nebraska charm in

her sweapants, grey sweater with pizza on

her face, helping howard with fishing,guting.

 

howard/bernie having dinner with the

parents is what just married people do,

it was great to see bond-mike/howard.

 

shamy fans all i can say is amy fowler

is a vixen. very good episode, good laughs.

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