I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 I love how some go on and on about how much Penny have to put with when it comes to Leonard. So the man proposal and he apologize for it --- I mean some acted like he tried to kill Penny or something. Yes, Leonard can put the cart before the horse sometimes but we all know he loves Penny and wants a life with her. I think you are trivialising a pretty huge thing. Leonard knew that Penny wasn't ready for such a commitment. Before they had went to the bedroom she stated that she didn't want to do anything to mess up what they had gained over the few months they had began dating again. She wanted to take things slow, so she could have time to figure out what her feelings for him were, and then he proposed! It wasn't even like he just told her he loved her again, he asked the woman to marry him, when they had only been back together four months. Honestly, I think she handled the whole thing pretty well. I think you are letting Leonard off the hook too easy on this one! haha He shouldn't of put that kind of pressure on her. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyGirl Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) I think you are trivialising a pretty huge thing. Leonard knew that Penny wasn't ready for such a commitment. Before they had went to the bedroom she stated that she didn't want to do anything to mess up what they had gained over the few months they had began dating again. She wanted to take things slow, so she could have time to figure out what her feelings for him were, and then he proposed! It wasn't even like he just told her he loved her again, he asked the woman to marry him, when they had only been back together four months. Honestly, I think she handled the whole thing pretty well. I think you are letting Leonard off the hook too easy on this one! haha He shouldn't of put that kind of pressure on her. I'm not trivializing anything about the proposal. What I have seem on the show that anything and everything Leonard does is wrong and he gets beat down by everyone to include Penny. Penny was never ready for anything and it's sad that Leonard had to walk on egg shell all the time around her. You act like Penny and Leonard had only known each other for a short amount of time. How do you know he didn't tell Penny he loved her again? Of course, you think Penny let Leonard off the hook too easy. Yet, no matter how badly Penny treated Leonard it was always his fault. Penny calling their love boring was explain away by some. Penny wanting to dump Leonard was explain away by some. Penny not being able to tell Leonard she loves him for the longest was explained away. Leonard never had the right to ask questions about their relationship or voice how he felt or what he wanted. Leonard is called whiney, needy, ball-less, and many other things because he let Penny basically walk all over him. Then the minute he says 'I love You' or 'Marry Me' he is pressuring Penny. The dude can't win for losing, imo. My one wish has always been that Leonard had given Penny a little of what she dished out to him. I know it won't happen because that isn't Leonard and it will never happen. Edited June 17, 2013 by ArmyGirl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Those things are explained away because there is a reason behind them. I'm not saying Penny doesn't have her faults, I am simply saying that all their problems, aren't all Penny's fault, like is sometimes suggested. They both have their issues, Leonard can be needy at times, and Penny can be thoughtless. Also I am not saying everything Leonard has done is wrong, but he has made bad decisions, like the proposal. And yes, Leonard does have every right to voice his opinions, but it was up to him to actually do it, which he is now. Honestly he was a little wimpish and did need to grow some balls, although I will admit that that he had trouble with that because of how he had been treated in the past. The important thing is now he is changing that. I feel like you are only really seeing Leonard's side of things here, that is why I felt I had to speak up for Penny. The thing is, they both have their faults and are to blame for went wrong in their relationship, it's not fair to put it all on just Penny, or just Leonard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyGirl Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) I feel like you are only really seeing Leonard's side of things here, that is why I felt I had to speak up for Penny. The thing is, they both have their faults and are to blame for went wrong in their relationship, it's not fair to put it all on just Penny, or just Leonard. No, I don't only see Leonard side of things. I defend Leonard due to most always taking Penny's side of things and it bothers me that in some eyes Penny could do no wrong. I have stated over ad over that both needed to grow up. When Leonard messed up I say so and keep rolling. As Leonard is the least favorite of all the characters (on the forums) someone has to stand up for him. Edited June 17, 2013 by ArmyGirl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Fair enough, although it did seen like you were being quite one sided. but, as I have said before, we all have our own opinions on things. And I have to disagree about Leonard being the least favourite, I think Penny gets more stick than Leonard on here, that's why I began posting, and most of what I have been posting has been in defence of her. I should say that just because of this, it doesn't mean I dislike Leonard in any sort of way, just in case that's how this comes across. I adore Leonard as much as I do Penny, but I think most people here, the ones that read my fanfiction anyway, already know that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tensor Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 It's obvious I hate both of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 It's obvious I hate both of them. Haha! I always thought that Rick.. > Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 It's obvious I hate both of them. Haha! I always thought that Rick.. > Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyGirl Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Fair enough, although it did seen like you were being quite one sided. but, as I have said before, we all have our own opinions on things. And I have to disagree about Leonard being the least favourite, I think Penny gets more stick than Leonard on here, that's why I began posting, and most of what I have been posting has been in defence of her. I should say that just because of this, it doesn't mean I dislike Leonard in any sort of way, just in case that's how this comes across. I adore Leonard as much as I do Penny, but I think most people here, the ones that read my fanfiction anyway, already know that I Am Molly, it's all good. I enjoy posting with you and please don't take any offense to my posting. As someone that was bullied most of my life, I tend to stick up for those that I see as underdogs. As for thinking you dislike Leonard --- I didn't, just wanted to present Leonard's side too. btw what are you fanfics? Love to read them. Thanks for posting with me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyGirl Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 It's obvious I hate both of them. Rick you are so bad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 I Am Molly, it's all good. I enjoy posting with you and please don't take any offense to my posting. As someone that was bullied most of my life, I tend to stick up for those that I see as underdogs. As for thinking you dislike Leonard --- I didn't, just wanted to present Leonard's side too. btw what are you fanfics? Love to read them. Thanks for posting with me. It was fun! I got into my first proper debate on this site haha and I understand your reasoning behind being in Leonard's corner, because I tend to be behind Penny because I can relate more to her in the sense that I am the kind of person who finds it hard to let go of my emotions. I have a thread in the fanfiction part of the site that has my recent fic on it, but if you go on the the fanfiction site and click on my name you will see the rest of them there. There are a few haha Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tensor Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Molly's fanfics are also really good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Molly's fanfics are also really good. Aww shucks Rick, your gonna make me blush! Haha but thank you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tensor Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Aww shucks Rick, your gonna make me blush! Haha but thank you Simple truth. Forever Yours was one of the stories that started me on Fanfic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) Simple truth. Forever Yours was one of the stories that started me on Fanfic. God Forever Yours.... That feels like so long ago now and it was only the beginning of the year when I started writing that... Wow. Edited June 17, 2013 by I.Am.Molly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyGirl Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) It was fun! I got into my first proper debate on this site haha and I understand your reasoning behind being in Leonard's corner, because I tend to be behind Penny because I can relate more to her in the sense that I am the kind of person who finds it hard to let go of my emotions. I have a thread in the fanfiction part of the site that has my recent fic on it, but if you go on the the fanfiction site and click on my name you will see the rest of them there. There are a few haha I understand where you are coming from about your emotions and relating to Penny (my ex was like that and it drove me crazy), now me on the other hand I am an Aries and a temper to match so even though I was bullied, I gave as good as I got, that's the one thing I wish Leonard had in him. Can't tell you how many fights I got into when I was younger. lol I Am Molly, I located the thread and will start reading it later tonight. Thanks ArmyGirl Edited June 17, 2013 by ArmyGirl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) I am an Aries too hehe possible explanation for why we got so heated earlier haha Edited June 17, 2013 by I.Am.Molly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRAM Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Molly's fanfics are also really good.The "IF' bothers me because we all know how lazy Penny can be and very few things are important to her and I just don't see her proposing will be at the top of her list. I don't want Leonard sitting around forever waiting on Penny to finally get to the point that she wants to marry him, as we all know he wants children and I'm sure he wants to be still young enough to enjoy a little time with them. He deserves to have those 'smart and beautiful' babies. I'm sure the writers will try to stretch the proposal and wedding out to the very end, though I have to wonder how many Lenny fans will hang around forever to get some real payoff. What's if the show goes pass the ten year mark? Will we still be waiting on a proposal? How about marriage? At some point some people will give up and walk away from TBBT --- I know I have done this with a few shows that keep me hanging in limbo. As for the proposal, being that this is Penny I have no clue what she will do or come up with. I do want it to be special and well thought out as I only see her doing the proposal thing once in her lifetime ---- if at all. I agree with you about stalling forever on the marriage. If they sign for another 2 years, that will give us three seasons, and the writers should give us moving in together, a proposal and a wedding. If they lay out a plan, they could probably do something really nice with lots of comedy, instead of this lets see attitude they currently have. Plus if they have a plan we won't get some of those strange episodes like 6.02 where we have to guess what's happening. As for season 10+ they can wing it then with a married Leonard and Penny. They could work on getting Shamy married or Raj. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRAM Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Molly's fanfics are also really good. I concur. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhalen565 Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Molly's fanfics are also really good. They are all extremely good, but A Tragic Fairy tale gets me every time when I read the letter. It sums these two up perfectly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Am.Molly Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Thanks guys, you are all too sweet, making me blush big time over here haha I was actually so surprised over the reaction that little letter got. I hoped that people would like it but I certainly never expected to have people in tears! Haha crazy stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogravitasatall Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 (edited) 2c (and a hyperbole warning). This may go badly. Leonard has everything going for him pretty much. To a great extent, except for Penny and his other relationships with women, he has every aspect of his life under control. He is good at his job and can meet all his material needs. Penny has had almost no control over her life. She has had to manage a great deal of uncertainty about basics like paying rent and feeding herself. Poorly put, Leonard was in a powerful position and Penny was not. This was flipped for their relationship. Penny "allowed" Leonard to court her, he found it difficult to push his suit. Penny was the relationship expert, Leonard the idiot. Penny had that one aspect of her life that she could directly influence. I agree that Leonard had to grow a spine when dealing with her and VD shows that he has. I also believe that by handing the reins to Penny and ceding control of their future to her he has addressed that overall power imbalance. It was crucial that she have a choice other than "No" and not just have to fall to the inevitable. "Penny: As long as things keep going great between us, you’ll keep asking me to marry you, and eventually I’m gonna end up saying yes, and then we’re gonna be married forever, and the whole thing just freaks me out" Also I feel Penny gets judged here by the tribal elders and doesn't get a fair break. She's young and stupid, sometimes. That's what being young is for. And I'm an Aries too. But I agree with Sheldon about all that (lol). Eta. And Molly writes soooo well. But I blush on the train from some of her stories lol. And I think this is post 1001 for me. Damn. Edited June 17, 2013 by Nogravitasatall Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangerMain Posted June 17, 2013 Posted June 17, 2013 Since she and Leonard have essentially committed to each other, they've been writing her much more sympathetically. That she has commitment issues is fine, but let's lay off on her as a slut and a drunk. Having said that, I suspect Penny is really happy for the first time in her adult life. Sometimes that is a bit scary, since you have so much to lose. I believe that is the key to Penny's commitment issues. The writers are hinting that she is afraid that her happiness with Leonard could all disappear, if Leonard suddenly thinks that she is not worth the effort. That's been the pattern of her life with men. Fortunately, she is reassured constantly that Leonard will not hurt her. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitars1964 Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 At the end of the day, for lots of us, Leonard and Penny are a great couple and currently in a great place. But I'd guess that, even now, she is still worried that he'll get bored with her - I am not sure that they've ever resolved her concern in that regard. With Leonard's trip to the North Sea (it was nice to see that Penny knew who Hawking was and understood the importance of Leonard's being invited to join Hawking's team), I might argue that the power has clearly shifted to Leonard in the L&P relationship. With that back drop, a very interesting story line prospectively would be Penny's acting career taking off. And it would be about time. But if the writers take that road in Season 7, it could create some potential issues for Leonard. Let's face it, having a significant other or spouse that becomes a big-time entertainer/performer/celebrity has to create some issues. Tall, good-looking leading men in Penny's work is one that comes to mind immediately for Leonard to have to deal with. And celebrity status can be intoxicating to the actor or performer. So while we may have seen a power shift to Leonard (at long last), that could reverse in a New York minute if Penny's acting career kicks into high gear. I'd bet that the writers have been looking at some of these potential story lines and it will be interesting to see what Season 7 reveals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogravitasatall Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 (edited) I contend that the only space where Penny has any power in her life is in her relationships. Everywhere else she is relatively powerless. Actors spend most of their working lives being told no and being judged. As a waitress or student she is still in an inferior position. Materially she has literally lived hand to mouth and been dependent on the kindness of strangers. I read it not that Leonard has the power now (which he has had all the way through, except that she resisted him) but that he has equalised their relative positions by acknowledging that she needed to keep control of something and giving that control to her. If he holds to his commitment then I would like to believe that any future jealousies, like over Cole, will be figments of Leonard's imagination. Its not supposed to be a competition and if they are committed they should work through the challenges together. If tptb don't play it that way then we've all been had, because this is not a situation that calls for symmetry. They can't go back to being fragile because its implausible. They can only break or go on. Also, in my view Leonard has never been punished, he just has been a VERY poor communicator, AS HAS SHE and they have both suffered from their misunderstandings. S4 was mostly about suffering and everyone should be content with that. Look how it ended. Nobody came out smelling of roses. Now they are talking openly as in the valetimes day ep I will feel betrayed if tptb walk back from this. And i do hope they give her some success, be because being a faculty wife may not be that satisfying or funny. Edited June 18, 2013 by Nogravitasatall Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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