Jump to content
The Big Bang Theory Forums
Sign in to follow this  
C-Trayne

Leonard And Penny Shippers Thread (Possible Spoilers)

Recommended Posts

@hammerman55 i dont know how not to include the source. It might be your browser/tech. You may need to find a teenager for tech support. Thats what i do. I use firefox and sometimes safari.

Pm tripper if necessary. S/he responds promptly.

Wrt the talking. They have far greater scope for d&m chats over dinner now. We might see that play into things.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the really big lesson Penny needs to learn (and will learn in an upcoming episode) is not to put her life on hold while waiting for her dream to come true. The dream, in and by itself, is fine but it should not maker her dismissive of what she already has. It should not be the gold standard to which her reality is compared (Is it just me or is this post starting to sound like some third-rate emo ballad ?). She has to stop thinking her real life is about to begin and realise that it started about six years ago.

 

I figured out how to quote part of a post. You quote the whole post, then delete what you don't want in the quote (let's me respond to specific statements). In this case, the post is starting to sound more like one of the classic albums of all times, "Dark Side of the Moon". The whole first theme is about the idea of not realizing that life is already happening.

 

"And all you touch and all you see

Is all your life will ever be" - R. Waters

 

Roger Waters expanded on this in the excellent "Classic Albums" video, where he expressed his realization that his life had already started.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

She was quite aware that they were compatible sexually. Their problem was (as Leonard had Penny verbalize in the 6.13 fantasy) "when we talk". For her to recognize that and hold off on sex while they see how the non-sexual part of the relationship works is rather perceptive. If the non-sexual part isn't worked out, or is thought of as boring, there isn't much reason to continue in the relationship. Hence, Penny's thinking she should break up with Leonard, since she thinks it's boring.

 

It wasn't that it was boring because of sexual reasons, the non-sexual reasons were boring to her. I said she was comparing the more sexual relationship of season three, with the non-sexual part of the season five (I'd say season six, but it's not far enough into the season) As far as being clear, in season three, almost all their one on one time was in a sexual context (think of all the bedroom scenes). This season, almost all their one on one time is in the more mundane tasks of living (think the kitchen and eating scenes).

 

Go back and watch the episode. She doesn't put the blame on Leonard. She says nothing but good things about Leoanrd, admits she loves him(by her definition of love, Bernie doesn't agree with her definition), but is confused about how she feels about the status of the relationship.

 

 

Solely was a bad choice of words, the main thrust of the relationship was sexual. They almost broke up after the first episode, because the sex wasn't great. The thing that saved it was the sexual attraction.

There are a couple of additional things. While all of us here are aware the previous break up, not all viewers were. This, as I said, gives newer viewers a place in the relationship to compare with the "fixes" of Penny's problems later in the season. And, of course, as I continue to say, there isn't really enough time provided (most of the time L/P is on for 6-8 minutes). Six to Eight minutes out of entire week is not a good representation of what is going on in the relationship. As a result, there is not enough unambiguous evidence to actually determine what is really going on. There is plenty of interpretation that can go various ways. Which is why we can keep going back and forth, debating our own interpretations and giving examples to support our contentions.

I also want to thank all the participants for the enjoyable and civil discussions that we've been having.

 

I don't think she was comparing her season 5-6 relationship with season 3 relationship because she says that her relationship with Leonard does not quite match up with her previous experience of Love ergo indirectly blaming Leonard.....

 

And all those nice things she said about Leonard in that episode had 0% conviction in them....it was quite clear from her tone......one can clearly see the difference between the scenes when she says nice things about him in 6.03 and 6.02.....

 

And one more thing I noticed in that episode .... I still don't understand why Leonard would make those puppy eyes ( he was supposed to not know that Penny was thinking of breaking up with......or if he knew and made those eyes then I don't think it can get more pathetic than that even for Leonard)

 

I don't think the writers would want to regress a character just for the sake of new viewers getting to know the character better...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wrt the talking. They have far greater scope for d&m chats over dinner now. We might see that play into things.

They do seem to spend a lot of time in the kitchen together these days. 

 

Thanks for getting back about the quotes. Your comment gave me the idea. I was over thinking it. Sometimes I'm as bad as Leonard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Anyway, I hope that the next step by her comes more organically, where she brings it up to the girls, talks about it with them, and then goes to Leonard. No shooting from the hip. An actual considered action moving the relationship forward. I'd rather see her decide to do something with good data, rather than react to external events. She's capable of it, as we saw in "The Decoupling Fluctuation". She decided to break up with Leonard, talked to the girls, and was ready to act on it. It was a bad decision, as she hadn't really worked at this or any other relationship before, but it was a considered, planned action with regard to her relationship. Now let's see her do the same thing, but moving the relationship forward.

I agree with you about Penny "shooting from the hip". It certainly has caused grief for both of them (season three break up). Although depending on what that next step is talking to the girls may not be necessarily it. The person who has given the best advice to  Leonard/Penny  has been Sheldon. His advice about the cat in "tangerine factor" to both of them was spot on. The North Pole advice to Leonard about leaving so Penny would miss you again was correct. I know you don't watch the ''Spaghetti Catalyst '' but he is the one that didn't follow Howard and Raj's "bro's before ho's" and ate dinner with Penny. This led ultimately to Leonard and Penny being able to hang out together. His decision in "The Decoupling Fluctuation" not to tell Leonard about Penny thinking of breaking up and asking Penny not to hurt his friend is another example. If he had told Leonard where would they be at now?

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think she was comparing her season 5-6 relationship with season 3 relationship because she says that her relationship with Leonard does not quite match up with her previous experience of Love ergo indirectly blaming Leonard.....

Or directly blaming herself, because it doesn't match her eperience.

 

And all those nice things she said about Leonard in that episode had 0% conviction in them....it was quite clear from her tone......one can clearly see the difference between the scenes when she says nice things about him in 6.03 and 6.02.....

I suggest you go back and listen to both episodes. Her statements in 6.02, after Amy asks her what does that mean( "It means he's special and smart and nice") are said in the same tone as her "Of course he's great. He's smart, he's sweet...)in 6.03.

 

And one more thing I noticed in that episode .... I still don't understand why Leonard would make those puppy eyes ( he was supposed to not know that Penny was thinking of breaking up with......or if he knew and made those eyes then I don't think it can get more pathetic than that even for Leonard)

We've discussed that before. take your pick of 1) he didn't know, but was worried about what she was going to say, 2) he knew from her tone what she was going to say, or 3) His eyes weren't really that sad, it was simply Penny thinking they were that sad.

 

I don't think the writers would want to regress a character just for the sake of new viewers getting to know the character better...

Who said regress? It was simply showing the low point. Let's face it, they weren't in the best of places in 6.01.

Again, it's all in the interpretation, and each of us has their own.

Edited by Tensor
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with you about Penny "shooting from the hip". It certainly has caused grief for both of them (season three break up). Although depending on what that next step is talking to the girls may not be necessarily it. The person who has given the best advice to  Leonard/Penny  has been Sheldon. His advice about the cat in "tangerine factor" to both of them was spot on. The North Pole advice to Leonard about leaving so Penny would miss you again was correct. I know you don't watch the ''Spaghetti Catalyst '' but he is the one that didn't follow Howard and Raj's "bro's before ho's" and ate dinner with Penny. This led ultimately to Leonard and Penny being able to hang out together. His decision in "The Decoupling Fluctuation" not to tell Leonard about Penny thinking of breaking up and asking Penny not to hurt his friend is another example. If he had told Leonard where would they be at now?

You are right that Leonard/Penny ultimately gets her best advice from Sheldon. I hadn't really thought about that. The girls provide a running soundboard for Penny, where she can talk things through. "The Decoupling Fluctuation" was the first time Sheldon knew a secret involving Penny, kept it from Leonard, and initiated a discussion with Penny. Could he be the ultimate Lenny shipper at this point? The girls are certainly on board. It is interesting that they didn't call Penny on her stupidity first after all her suffering with Priya, and Sheldon was the one to step up. Over a year of Priya bashing, yet they did nothing to point that she was being an idiot. However, once Penny slept with Leonard rather than dump him, they were instrumental later in getting her to start working on the relationship like a grownup.

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with you about Penny "shooting from the hip". It certainly has caused grief for both of them (season three break up). Although depending on what that next step is talking to the girls may not be necessarily it. The person who has given the best advice to  Leonard/Penny  has been Sheldon. His advice about the cat in "tangerine factor" to both of them was spot on. The North Pole advice to Leonard about leaving so Penny would miss you again was correct. I know you don't watch the ''Spaghetti Catalyst '' but he is the one that didn't follow Howard and Raj's "bro's before ho's" and ate dinner with Penny. This led ultimately to Leonard and Penny being able to hang out together. His decision in "The Decoupling Fluctuation" not to tell Leonard about Penny thinking of breaking up and asking Penny not to hurt his friend is another example. If he had told Leonard where would they be at now?

 

She shoots from the hip because it's easier for her to do that, rahter than face upto her insecurities. Amy and Bernie have given her a soundboard to ping off on and to think

more about her relationship with Leonard. And Sheldon hits things home with the things he says or the way he acts. He reinforces Penny's need to think more and

shoot less from the hip. If he had told Leonard, I guess lenny would have broken up.

Penny is growing emotionally thanks to the girls and Sheldon. The writers need to move that up a gear or two in season 7 to

start positioning Penny into a place where she can ask Leonard to Marry him because she wants, and not as a reaction in a crisis.

 

If Penny tells Leonard how she fells about him, rather than shutting the door on him and then whispering what she wants, then that will show

just how far she's come from the end of season 2. I think Penny not understanding her love for Leonard is basically her being in love

properly for the first time with a decent guy who would do anything for her. It seems as though Penny has had some bad experiences that are clouding

her judgement over Leonard. I would guess Sheldon might be the one to get her to open about that in a Sheldoesque kind of way.

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awful quiet on the forums. I guess we're all waiting for the taping report. Have they ever kept key plot points back in pretapings to avoid spoilers? It would seem like the season finale would be the place to do that as there is no need to show the completed episode until it airs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the inclusion of the girls was a good thing for the show, because like someone said, it allows us to now know what Penny thinks and the girls help Penny make important decisions.  I always thought that although Penny and Leonard are experienced in sexual relations (Penny more so), they are both virgins when it comes to being in true love with someone, and that has always been one of their problems, they don't know what exactly to do, so they both make mistakes.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awful quiet on the forums. I guess we're all waiting for the taping report. Have they ever kept key plot points back in pretapings to avoid spoilers? It would seem like the season finale would be the place to do that as there is no need to show the completed episode until it airs.

Seems kind of pointless to speculate now, with a taping report about eight hours away (depending on how late they go and travel time).

Edited by eirwinrommel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@sram, Also Sheldon had to always offer solutions, so problems always got defined down. No exposition, or not much. What would be helpful would be GOT style exposition, but the show would have to find a new slot.

And yes, i agree they are now well in the deep end and are just getting past the drowning stage. Hoping they get thrown lifesavers not rocks, for the finale.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seems kind of pointless to speculate now, with a taping report about eight hours away (depending on how late they go and travel time).

its legit. Remember the 'i wish you wer dead' hullabaloo. They could conceivably feint in the taping and dodge elsewhere in post production.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

its legit. Remember the 'i wish you wer dead' hullabaloo. They could conceivably feint in the taping and dodge elsewhere in post production.

Maybe, but I refuse to make myself even nuttier over this.  If I did, I'd be wearing my underwear as a hat, have two pencils up my nose and be saying nothing but "Wibble!".

Edited by eirwinrommel
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe, but I refuse to make myself even nuttier over this.  If I did, I'd be wearing my underwear as a hat, have two pencils up my nose an be saying nothing but "Wibble!".

Well then, I'm in good shape, I don't have any pencils.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great discussion of the Lenny!  I've enjoyed reading all of your insights. It has shed new light and perspective on this coupling...to me anyway.  I'm just as excited to learn what decision's L/P will make in this next taping report!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awful quiet on the forums. I guess we're all waiting for the taping report. Have they ever kept key plot points back in pretapings to avoid spoilers? It would seem like the season finale would be the place to do that as there is no need to show the completed episode until it airs.

 

I thought I read somewhere that when they taped Monopolar, they didn't tape the scene right after Penny closed the door and said "it means I wish you weren't going" with the audience present.  I didn't read spoilers back then, so I'm not positive though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought I read somewhere that when they taped Monopolar, they didn't tape the scene right after Penny closed the door and said "it means I wish you weren't going" with the audience present.  I didn't read spoilers back then, so I'm not positive though.

It was a prerecorded scene, such as they continue to do until now. The difference was that it was not shown to the audience to get their reactions recorded, as is normally done. It was edited in without any audience reaction.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At this point it appears to be a good episode for the Lenny fans. Apparently not for some of the Shamy fans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At this point it appears to be a good episode for the Lenny fans. Apparently not for some of the Shamy fans.

 

But its not dire like s3 and s4 was for L/P. The Shamy still have 6.23. So all up they are in good shape.

Nice to know that L/P stayed solid. Will look for the details later this afternoon my time.

 

The scribes deserve something btw. Anyone got ideas on how?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Evidently Leonard gave Penny a locket with his picture in it before leaving, to wear around her neck.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So are Leonard and Penny still together when Leonard leaves? Or is it left ambiguous?

 

They exchange mutual "ILY's" at the airport before he leaves so yes they are still together. It will interesting to see how the scene plays out because throughout the rest of the episode Penny appears to be very calm about everything. Hopefully TPTB allow Johnny and Kaley to bring some emotional juice to that scene.

 

It's great that Penny is being supportive about Leonard but at the same time it should also made clear that Penny is going to miss him. This scene is really the only place where this message has any chance of being made clear to the audience because it doesn't appear that it's going to happening anywhere else in the episode.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think I really like the tone of this episode : Penny and Leonard appear to behave very maturely about the separation.

Understandably Leonard seems a bit worried four months may be too long a time apart but I find it interesting (and a positive move forward) Penny is so accepting of it and, above all, happy for him and the opportunity he has been given. 

 

The writers made good use of the first onscreen mutual ILYS, I think : when the reality of the separation hits them, they use it to comfort themselves and each other. Nicely done ! Furthermore, Penny and Leonard do not overreact to it. They accept it as fact which is in keeping with the second half of the season during which they behaved as if they had already said ILY to each other.

 

Considering the episode looks like it is mostly about Raj (with a healthy dose of Leonard/Sheldon), the relative lack of Lenny drama/heavy action does not bother me. Plus, it gives us the chance to see Penny be the group's "momma", as she should be. 

Edited by Chiara
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.