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The Shamy Thread! (Season 6 Edition-Spoilers)


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It is interesting to me that this season has featured more quotes from Sheldon's father than we've ever heard before, the story about Pop Pop, and now this episode with Bob Newhart. The single most important relationship for any child is with their same-sex parent, so no matter how important his Mee Maw and Mother were to Sheldon, you cannot discount the role of his father in this life. When quoting his father, it's always been interesting to me that I've never heard Sheldon reject or question anything his father has ever said. He edits the language, for instance, "Shelly, women are nothing but flippin' pains in the bottom," but he doesn't disagree with the sentiment behind it. He doesn't question or comment on such things as his father's "driving whiskey" either, and while we know his father had an affair with a barmaid, Sheldon never spoke any judgements about that state of affairs either.


But it seems clear that Sheldon and his father are as different as night and day. Nevertheless, his father made some sort of effort with Sheldon, trying to teach him football or how to "shoot so close to a raccoon it craps itself," and such backwoods skills as archery. It was the longest 7 years of Sheldon's life, but his father definitely made some impression, and Sheldon hasn't forgotten the lessons that his father taught him.


Pop Pop died when Sheldon was only 5, and his father died only a few months before the series starts, as we find out during Missy and Mary's visits in Season One. Whatever longing Sheldon has had for a patriarchal influence in this life - as the matriarchal influences were obviously the strongest in Mary and Mee Maw - we've only seen that explode out of Sheldon once, in the Christmas episode this year. But in particular, as Sheldon "grows up" and starts finding more to life outside of science, such as his friends and relationship with Amy, I can see Sheldon groping around for role models even more than usual (and I think he did this his entire life) to which he can relate and model his own behavior as a man on. I feel pretty sure that somewhere along the line Sheldon rejected the idea of growing up into a man like his father, with his football and driving whiskey and hunting and affairs and "manly man" way of operating in the world. And perhaps this is why Sheldon has never really fully grown up either - with no father figure in his life for Sheldon to try to model and pattern his behavior on (and Sheldon needs this more than most, with the natural lack of social skills he has) Sheldon simply didn't evolve into a full-grown man at all, there was no real role model for him to latch onto.


I know that it's been pointed out that the Professor Proton episode finishes up some things from 6.11, but I also think it continues on the Spiderman speech from 6.1 - the entire thing about Sheldon and the kind of man he wanted to be. As we saw in this past episode, Sheldon is still remarkably childish, and not really a full grown up. Professor Proton's request of Sheldon to fill in for him, which Sheldon rapidly associated with being "Junior" (and remember that in the Cooper family, it's Sheldon's older brother George who gets to be the "Junior") and latched onto the idea of Professor Proton being his father, to me it goes back to Sheldon finding a man and role-model to whom Sheldon can relate and who Sheldon would actually want to be like. Finding a male role model, finding some type of father figure at all, particularly to help Sheldon replace or grieve the one he lost in Pop Pop when he was only 5, in order to help him figure out that "man he wants to be" and still "working on" becoming seems to be part of the theme of the show this season (consciously or unconsciously on the part of the writers) for Sheldon's character.


In any case, it's hard for me to say much else. I have currently moved out of my old place and am living in between moving into the new one while I do a lot of things like have it painted and replace carpets and whatnot. It'll be awhile before I have an Internet connection again other than when I'm hanging out at Starbucks. So I'll be around when I can, which might not be much, and I won't be able to watch the episodes a few times to get my mind around all of the little things I normally like to analyze.


Don't forget about me while I am gone! I'll see you all on the flip side, when I start to settle in and get my new life going.

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I'm not a developmental psychologist, but since I was very interested in women in sports issues I had been reading a lot about that recently, so I'll have to go dig up some references, but, from what I've read in recent times, I disagree with the notion that the single most important relationship for a child is the same-sex parent. You'd be surprised how many notions we have about development that we take for granted are rooted in nothing more than gender stereotyping (nowadays coated in pop-neuroscience with no real basis just to make it sound more valid) nobody ever bothered to challenge until recently. But that will get us into a complicated, delicate discussion that's probably not suited to this thread. 


I think Sheldon's issues in navigating the world, the ones that aren't due to his "quirks", especially women and sex, are mostly to do with his unusual upbringing as a child prodigy, rather than lack of a male role model. Not being given the chance to live through developmental milestones by being thrown into an adult world as a child is what makes him so childlike in the first place: he never had the chance to grow up because by the time he was 11 he was already thrown into the grown-up world who had no interest in dealing with him as a person. We know he didn't have friends growing up, and that's not only because of his personality but also because he had nobody his age, let alone his IQ, around him, for his entire adolescence.


Furthermore, physics is an extremely male-dominated environment. If you take away the chance for a kid to interact with kids from the other gender during young age, it's inevitable that they will never learn how to do so as an adult, which is why Sheldon is only now learning how to approach the opposite sex (hell, he's only now learning how to have friends, regardless of gender!). And since he did not even care about the opposite sex in the first place, he will obviously resort to the only things he knows about women, which is what he heard from his father, and not bother challenging them precisely because he doesn't care, it's not of importance to him. But now with Amy in the picture things might have to change.


I think his adoration with PP has more to do with the fact that, to this day, he recognizes his grandfather as the one person that encouraged him to pursue science. I can see how, after his death, with Sheldon being in love with his show, he had already sort of replaced him with his grandfather, in a way. I think it was more to do with that, and the fact that the rest of his family doesn't seem all that "intellectual", that made him see PP as a role model. It's hard to find a role model in a family that is so completely different from the way you think, so one tends to seek it elsewhere. 

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Yes, I think the truth about Sheldon's growing up problems can be kind of a mixture of Lionne's and Spook's point of views, it includes these both sides.  These both facts (child-prodigy/upbringing + no real good father figure) have left its scars to Sheldon for sure. It is important to us to now see him growing up and dealing with his issues. And somehow they can relate to Amy too. Once Sheldon can perceive himself as a man he wants to be, he is on a road getting closer to Amy.
I'm not sure if Sheldon understands, that he doesn't have to be like "all the other men", when it comes to some areas of his personality. He can still be himself, a scientist while growing in his relationship with Amy. I mean, Professor Proton is a good example for him, he doesn't have to neutralize his passion for science to be a  grown up man. I hope by him he understands he can include both to his man-image.  He can be a "grown up man" with healthy relationships (and with a healthy intimate relationship with a female too!) and a scientist at the same time. It is important for him to understand these two things don't exclude each other away. I hope he begins to understand that his manhood or  intimate relationship with a woman don't take his intelligence or passion for science away or doesn't affect to the "science part" of him. Not in a bad way, although what Kripke suggested in 6x14 and Sheldon agreed. :) I think that must have been one of his major fears too when considering his relationship with Amy, at least in the beginning of their relationship.

Edited by Catlina
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The thing is, I always feel uncomfortable talking about "scars" and the like when it comes to the perception of the world and relationships some people have that don't fit in with what is normally expected of society. That's why I have an issue with developmental psychology in general. So much of it seems to be focused on finding the recipe to develop the perfectly adjusted child who functions in society the way society wants people to behave. But is it really that bad not to develop in a way that conforms to what's expected? Or to have a bit of "variety" in the world? One of my main pet-peeves in RL is actually the whole 6x17 play scenario: you have to do something because you want to do something but you have to lie about wanting to do it so that the person you do it for thinks you actually want to do it, but in reality you're just been taught you have to want to do it. It's like society trains you to lie about what you like or don't like or what you want or don't want in order to please people. 


I think a lot of the "issues" Sheldon has are due to the fact that society puts certain expectations on how people should behave or respond to certain situations and a lot of work is done to make sure that people like Sheldon learn to function within society rather than the other way around, to teach society to accept people that don't behave in a conventional way. That's what I like about Shamy, it's never just about Sheldon learning to function within the relationship but the fact that Amy gets where he comes from most of the time, and doesn't get upset if he makes her his EC contact on V-day, quite the opposite! Or when he tries to apologize by giving her Cooper coupons. Or initiates RP sex as a substitute for physical intimacy. Whereas a lot of other women would probably storm out of the room. And that's why I constantly freak whenever I'm afraid they're making Amy too normal, because I don't want them to lose this dynamic that really sets them apart from the others: they speak each other's language. 


I don't think Sheldon is necessarily holding back because he thinks he'll "lose himself", as much as he doesn't really know what he's doing most of the time because it's a totally new situation to him. That's why I wouldn't say he has issues, other than the phobia with physical contact (and he is very aware when he does have an issue), but that it's more a matter of being in a situation most people first experience much earlier in life. But you also have this mixed with the fact that for many other aspects he is an adult and has a very pragmatic mind: so every time he's been confronted with big issues this season he has acted like someone who has really worked on figuring it out (6x10, 6x14, 6x23). He might not be all the way there yet, and tries and avoid being put on the spot as much as humanly possible, but he knows what he's doing, IMO. He's this odd combination of man and child. 

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I'm not even going to try and get involved in this subject (as other's above me have done a amazing job, IMO) except to say.....for some reason when I picture Sheldon's dad when he brings him up I always see John Goodman, lol. 


Take that as you will.

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What a great insights Lio, koops and Catlina. Thank you. 

I agree with that Sheldon being raised in matriarchal influence never has good paternal role model. IMO he knows what he wants to get from his father, what he wanted to learn from his father. He must itself in some way, fill the gap, but he does not know whether he wants to do it,  and how. Too many scars could be open. And some of the issues and truths that a loving father would tell him, he won't be able to get to know himself or understand.

He himself does not even realize, that all the things that a good and exemplary father could teach him, could help him to avoid most of the problems that exist. Therefore, the latent longing for the father model, for something that was missing in his life is revealed in those moments as in ep. 22 with Professor Proton. 
Mother accept him as he is, she tells him that he is unique, because he is unique, he should walk with his head held proudly, because he is unique, but not because he's a genius, but for the fact that he is himself, true and real Sheldon, without any masks,  another because he is her son and she loves him no matter what. She knows how real Sheldon is, deep inside in his heart. And Amy knows it too, and that's why she treats him as an adult and not a child. He believes and trusts him, takes seriously all his quirks. They have so much in common, and they are so similar to one another,  but also so unique. They know that the public would like that they were like the rest of the people, but now they have each other, they can be against all those who want to change them because they are together. They can work on their issues, that their relationship will be better, but for each other, for their love, not for the public.
Edited by silverangelD
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I imagine that scene like that:
Amy waited in Sheldon's bedroom after Penny let her in. She is so excited and little scared, what Sheldon will say when he will see her wearing Cat woman costume, well after all this is anything can happen thursday. One thing she was sure, he will be surprised. She looked at herself in the mirror " yes I look sexy...oh wow did I really said it?" But she really looks sexy, and this was Sheldon's favorite cat woman costume, that one that Lee Meriwether wore. It emphasized her figure and her breasts in such a way as Penny has always did, wearing her sexy dresses.  She thought that her breasts are not as enticing and desirable as Penny breasts,  but what she saw in the mirror will cause her feel beautiful and confident. 
Suddenly she heard the key opened the door and she heard Sheldon walks in to the appartment. She closed her eyes and thought to herself... "calm down Fowler it will be wonderful, remember what Penny told you...
 Amy you look so sexy and, o wow girl why did you hide that hot figure under all those layers... Sheldon will be stunned... go get him girl"
She opened her eyes and slowly lay down on his bed, and she waited for him to enter his bedroom. 
The door knob jiggled and the door slowly opened. There he was, standing in his room looking at her..puzzled, and his face showed many emotions, not all were clear to Amy, one thing was certain... surprise was successful.


" Amy, what?..... oh wow ....!"


Sheldon looked at Amy lying on his bed, in his favorite catwoman costume, with those hair falling down on her shoulders like waterfall, she has no glasses, with that make up which caused her eyes were even more beautiful and shining like emeralds. Sheldon knew that she has sexy figure under all those sweaters and blouses, but in that costume she looks so hot... and her breasts were so.... o good Lord he just couldn't stop stare at her breasts... he wanted to using Kolinahr to stop this warm sensational feeling which he felt in his groin , but he just couldn't. All the forces that he always focused in himself to resist her, failed him.
Amy slimled at him and just said: How do you like anything can happen thursday...?
She knew that he likes it, and  given his facial expression and that  his eyes wandered inch by inch on her body and always stopped for a little longer on her breasts.
"Sheldon?... what do you say?"
" Amy... I'm just... I... you look so ..  your appearance  is a pleasure for my eyes.
" O I see that not only your eyes are pleased..." Amy smiled looking down on his pants...
Sheldon blushed red and smiled shyly...
O she noticed it ...darn it...that Kohlinar doesn't work any more.
" O Sheldon don't be shy... it's flattering, and now you're even more handsome..."
"You should have told me.... I could to prepare and put on my Batman costume..."


"Well we have time.... and I will wait, so go and do it. Put on, your Batman costume"
It was a moment when Amy was waiting  and suddenly, he came...and  stood in front of her ..
"I'm Batman"... he said and his eyes shone like stars, so blue...like deep blue ocean.
Amy looked at him and her heart was pounding like crazy... he was so handsome and so hot in that costume... 
Their eyes met, and there were everything in their eye coitus moment.
His lips were slightly open, and his lower lip that always drived her crazy... he was so close to her. 
Sheldon licked his lower lip and looked at her... she smells so intoxicating, and her lips were so delicate and so velvety red... he noticed it when she kissed him on that girls night in her apartment... and now he wants to do it again...
"... Now my cat woman .. let's start our game.... but we dont need DnD, we will need only dices from that game and ...I hope that I will get that 14 quickly" 


That was just my imagination... I can even think to compare with all those fantastic and perfect fanfic,  but I thought I should try to describe that scene.  Sorry about my English mistakes, and I hope you like it... but please be gentle...



Do you remember this post? Well maybe not but I have finished it,  I smoothed and polished it a little. And I thought maybe some of you will like to read it. I hope you will like it. Thank you.



Edited by silverangelD
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Clever, clever CBS! They edited the promo in a veeeeery sneaky way to make it sound like Sheldon was talking about being out of sex with Amy. haha! Good for them, they have often given away way too much in the promos in the past. 

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Misophonia Thank you for that chapter. It was so sweet and lovely. And Sheldon in that chapter just melted my heart. He was so adorable. And Amy... so happy...it really moved me.  I would like to see  Sheldon and Amy so happy in TBBT, like they were in your chapter, and the most of all I would like to see Sheldon confessing  his feelings to Amy just like in your chapter.
Have I told you that I love turtles?..
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We could quibble over if the same-sex parent is the most important or just extremely important, but I don't think you can argue that one's father is one of the strongest influences on your life. It's your parents - whether good or bad or absent, there's still an influence on a person's psyche.


So, no matter how you slice it, if you want to go with the word "most" or just "very," I think that the rest of my post still stands. Sheldon didn't have a male role model which suited him and who he was, and I think that's part of his evolution and the fact he's remained very childlike even though he's well into his 30's by now and frankly his childish behavior is not so cute (IMO) anymore. Sheldon can be all over the map sometimes - in this episode he was the most childish, although when Professor Proton began to have his meltdown over his life and it's disappointments, Sheldon did snap to and provide the proof to cheer the Professor up and try to make him understand how much he meant to him. In other recent situations, such as at the middle school with the classroom of girls, Sheldon was by far the most mature and wise throughout the episode.


I'm not always sure what we're going to get with Sheldon. He can be all over the place depending on the episode or the current plot. However, I'm a bigger fan of the dry, sarcastic, smart and mature Sheldon than I am of the hyperactive, childish one, especially the older the characters get.

Edited by Lionne
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Wow, look at the differences in facial expression between Sheldon and Amy, Amy looks surprised and offended where Sheldon looks very innocent and intrigued. I wonder if Amy had not ran away if he would have continued in front of everyone. :) love it, I can't wait for Thursday!!!

Misophonia Thank you for that chapter. It was so sweet and lovely. And Sheldon in that chapter just melted my heart. He was so adorable. And Amy... so happy...it really moved me. I would like to see Sheldon and Amy so happy in TBBT, like they were in your chapter, and the most of all I would like to see Sheldon confessing his feelings to Amy just like in your chapter.

Have I told you that I love turtles?..

Yes, great chapter ....I don't want there to be only one chapter left :'( Sheldon was so sweet and said everything i wanted him to say after his time in TX. i am excited for his response on his last slip....can't wait until the next chapter! Edited by delsino
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It is in the episode thread

ETA: here is the CBS one



THANK YOU FOR THE LINK. Oh wow I just can't wait OMG.....I'm so impatient ...I will see it on friday... well CBS clever maneuver, they give us only what Penny, said that to Amy and Sheldon, "maybe your characters do it in the game" and then  that thing with Howard and Bernadette... clever... 

Edited by silverangelD
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Oh BazingaFan....just want to remind you that many of us would love an update to Homeostatic Adjustment when you can get to it.   ;)



Edited by silverangelD
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