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The Hate The Direction Of The Show Club


Ar Diem
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Dear Shippers and love TBBT the way it is nowers.  If anything you read here is factually wrong please jump in and correct.  If you can answer a question factually please do.  We would rather not debate opinions with you though.  Thanks.

 

Ok.  So we don't hate everything because we are still watching but I have seen enough posts that many people agree with me that the show is not the same quality as it was in the beginning.

 

To get things going...

 

Remember when Penny had an apartment full of friends to watch the football game?  What happened there?  Where did all of her friends go?  I hate that by adding 2 more female characters Penny has to limited to them now.  I don't care how you slice it, losing an apartment full of friends is not character growth.  While I would agree that you do lose friends to marriage and kids as you get older you don't lose them all.

 

I hate the boys in one apartment and the girls in the other routine.  Is that a Friends thing?  I never watched that show.  To me it is like an old fashioned gender separation where the men retire to the den after dinner to have a brandy and the ladies to the drawing room for tea.

 

 

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl
Dear Shippers and love TBBT the way it is nowers.  If anything you read here is factually wrong please jump in and correct.  If you can answer a question factually please do.  We would rather not debate opinions with you though.  Thanks.

 

Ok.  So we don't hate everything because we are still watching but I have seen enough posts that many people agree with me that the show is not the same quality as it was in the beginning.

 

To get things going...

 

Remember when Penny had an apartment full of friends to watch the football game?  What happened there?  Where did all of her friends go?  I hate that by adding 2 more female characters Penny has to limited to them now.  I don't care how you slice it, losing an apartment full of friends is not character growth.  While I would agree that you do lose friends to marriage and kids as you get older you don't lose them all.

 

I hate the boys in one apartment and the girls in the other routine.  Is that a Friends thing?  I never watched that show.  To me it is like an old fashioned gender separation where the men retire to the den after dinner to have a brandy and the ladies to the drawing room for tea.

 

So, what, 3 episodes where they showed people at her apartment make those guys the best friends she ever had? Did you see the friends she had at her apartment? the ones who looked at Leonard like he was inferior and the ones that kinda mocked the guys when they were in costume? How is she getting friends who love her for who she is a regression of her character?

 

If anything, the girls made her character develop. Before Amy and Bernadette showed up, we never had insights on Penny's feelings, on what she felt about Leonard and about herself. She was only Leonard's love interest and Sheldon's antagonist. She wasn't a character by herself. How many storylines did she have until Season 3? You know, Penny storylines, not Sheldon vs Penny storylines or Leonard storylines?. I'll tell you = 0. The inclusion of Penny & Bernadette made her gain more dimensions to her character. How would we have knowin she still had feelings for Leonard in Season 4? How would we know about her insecurities in Season 5? How would we know about her doubts in Season 6? Who would she tell? Sheldon? who doesn't care at all about her feelings?, Raj, who can't even talk to her if he's not drunk? Howard? that if Bernadette hadn't came along he would probably try to cop a feel? Leonard? the one who's feelings towards are one of the main causes of her doubts?

 

This argument is flawed no matter how you look at it.

 

And the boys and girls grouping separately, well, that happens in real life, just observe any party or reunion everywhere.

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Dear Shippers and love TBBT the way it is nowers.  If anything you read here is factually wrong please jump in and correct.  If you can answer a question factually please do.  We would rather not debate opinions with you though.  Thanks.

 

Ok.  So we don't hate everything because we are still watching but I have seen enough posts that many people agree with me that the show is not the same quality as it was in the beginning.

 

To get things going...

 

Remember when Penny had an apartment full of friends to watch the football game?  What happened there?  Where did all of her friends go?  I hate that by adding 2 more female characters Penny has to limited to them now.  I don't care how you slice it, losing an apartment full of friends is not character growth.  While I would agree that you do lose friends to marriage and kids as you get older you don't lose them all.

 

I hate the boys in one apartment and the girls in the other routine.  Is that a Friends thing?  I never watched that show.  To me it is like an old fashioned gender separation where the men retire to the den after dinner to have a brandy and the ladies to the drawing room for tea.

 

I have to say I enjoy your posts. They are always well thought out. 

 

I never totally understood why Penny was friends with Amy and Bernadette anyway. There is no reason she would be. She's so different to them and sometimes it seems weird that she's always hanging with them. It would make more sense for her to have her own friends. Some of the scenes with just Amy and Penny are very good though. This odd friendship has got a lot better than the early days.

 

I also agree about the old fashioned way they have the girls together. It reminds me of sitcoms from the 70s or something.

Edited by Moonbase

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So, what, 3 episodes where they showed people at her apartment make those guys the best friends she ever had? Did you see the friends she had at her apartment? the ones who looked at Leonard like he was inferior and the ones that kinda mocked the guys when they were in costume? How is she getting friends who love her for who she is a regression of her character?

 

If anything, the girls made her character develop. Before Amy and Bernadette showed up, we never had insights on Penny's feelings, on what she felt about Leonard and about herself. She was only Leonard's love interest and Sheldon's antagonist. She wasn't a character by herself. How many storylines did she have until Season 3? You know, Penny storylines, not Sheldon vs Penny storylines or Leonard storylines?. I'll tell you = 0. The inclusion of Penny & Bernadette made her gain more dimensions to her character. How would we have knowin she still had feelings for Leonard in Season 4? How would we know about her insecurities in Season 5? How would we know about her doubts in Season 6? Who would she tell? Sheldon? who doesn't care at all about her feelings?, Raj, who can't even talk to her if he's not drunk? Howard? that if Bernadette hadn't came along he would probably try to cop a feel? Leonard? the one who's feelings towards are one of the main causes of her doubts?

 

This argument is flawed no matter how you look at it.

 

And the boys and girls grouping separately, well, that happens in real life, just observe any party or reunion everywhere.

 

 

You know I am a big fan of yours but WTH?  I specifically asked not to debate opinions.  Besides she had to have best friends before the characters were added to the show.  Best friends she could confide in.  I would think as a female it would be a little offensive that all of her friends now revolve around her boyfriend and his friends.

Edited by Ar Diem

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How many storylines did she have until Season 3? You know, Penny storylines, not Sheldon vs Penny storylines or Leonard storylines?. I'll tell you = 0.

 

The Dead Hooker Juxtaposition was a Penny episode . So count = 1 :)

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl
You know I am a big fan of yours but WTH?  I specifically asked not to debate opinions.  Besides she had to have best friends before the characters were added to the show.  Best friends she could confide in.  I would think as a female it would be a little offensive that all of her friends now revolve around her boyfriend and his friends.

 

Yeah she had one, The Whore of Omaha, we had an episode with her. Barely what I would call a "good friend". Besides, Penny is not even from California, she had just moved in when the show started. Hardly time to develop true friendships. 

 

Besides, Bernadette was HER friend BEFORE Bernadette started dating Howard. She was the one who set them up.

 

And my poist above was not only an opinion, was a questioning of your argument, that, by the way it was worded, was also an opinion.Saying that you hate the direction of the show or that it doesn't make sense to you, it is an opinion,.

Edited by Sursonica

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Yeah she had one, The Whore of Omaha, we had an episode with her. Barely what I would call a "good friend". Besides, Penny is not even from California, she had just moved in when the show started. Hardly time to develop true friendships. 

 

Besides, Bernadette was HER friend BEFORE Bernadette started dating Howard. She was the one who set them up.

 

And my poist above was not only an opinion, was a questioning of your argument, that, by the way it was worded, was also an opinion.Saying that you hate the direction of the show or that it doesn't make sense to you, it is an opinion,.

 

What about the episode when she got addicted to gaming? It had some Sheldon some Leonard but it was mostly Penny turning into a nerd. And this was because she had no direction in her life so she got obsessed with something, who hasn't done that? :D

Edited by Moonbase

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Yeah she had one, The Whore of Omaha, we had an episode with her. Barely what I would call a "good friend". Besides, Penny is not even from California, she had just moved in when the show started. Hardly time to develop true friendships. 

 

Besides, Bernadette was HER friend BEFORE Bernadette started dating Howard. She was the one who set them up.

 

And my poist above was not an opinion, was a questioning of your argument, that, by the way it was worded, was also an opinion.

 

I thought she had been there for about 4 years with her ex.  It still doesn't make sense that all of those people are suddenly out of her life.  If she made that many friends in California and she is still at a very sociable age it makes no sense that she is trimmed down to two.

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl

also, another thing I forgot to add in my post. You mentioned that she should have had someone to confide to, other than Bernadette & Amy. If that was so on the show, what would be the difference and/or the way to handle it? You would have Penny's friend pop up every once in a while to hear her talking to Penny and then dissapear? It would only make that character a plot device, a character that nobody would get invested in since it wouldn't be a character on it's own right and also, it would be just weird.

 

If you would make such a character integrate into the group, then I don't see the difference with Bernadette, since that is what happenned. She was only Penny's friend until she started interacting with the group and married Howard.

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also, another thing I forgot to add in my post. You mentioned that she should have had someone to confide to, other than Bernadette & Amy. If that was so on the show, what would be the difference and/or the way to handle it? You would have Penny's friend pop up every once in a while to hear her talking to Penny and then dissapear? It would only make that character a plot device, a character that nobody would get invested in since it wouldn't be a character on it's own right and also, it would be just weird.

 

If you would make such a character integrate into the group, then I don't see the difference with Bernadette, since that is what happenned. She was only Penny's friend until she started interacting with the group and married Howard.

 

 

Lots of characters have had minimal roles but important to their lives.  Sheldon's mother and sister, Leonard's mother, Howard's mother,  Raj's mother and father, and even Stuart.  I am not invested in any of them.

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I thought she had been there for about 4 years with her ex.  It still doesn't make sense that all of those people are suddenly out of her life.  If she made that many friends in California and she is still at a very sociable age it makes no sense that she is trimmed down to two.

 

This is true and it's one of those things that doesn't make sense. There's a lot of them. :icon_biggrin: Obviously it's setup for the purpose of making the charcaters fit together but it's a bit like square pegs and round holes at times. Bernadette was someone Penny knew but not a close friend, but they have nothing in common at all. Penny confides more in Amy but that kind of works because Amy is so lenient with her.

 

Guys/girls - Ar Diem is not attacking anyone. Just raising some interesting questions about Penny's development and friendships.

Edited by Moonbase

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl
Lots of characters have had minimal roles but important to their lives.  Sheldon's mother and sister, Leonard's mother, Howard's mother,  Raj's mother and father, and even Stuart.  I am not invested in any of them.

 

yes, and yet, they all interacted with the group. Also, you couldn't develop a character throughout a catalyst that only shows up once or maybe two times a season.

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This is true and it's one of those things that doesn't make sense. There's a lot of them. :icon_biggrin: Obviously it's setup for the purpose of making the charcaters fit together but it's a bit like square pegs and round holes at times. Bernadette was someone Penny knew but not a close friend, but they have nothing in common at all. Penny confides more in Amy but that kind of works because Amy is so lenient with her.

 

I agree.  Penny and Bernadette may have been friends but not close friends.  It is a just a convenience that she holds the two so close now.

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yes, and yet, they all interacted with the group. Also, you couldn't develop a character throughout a catalyst that only shows up once or maybe two times a season.

 

 

At the slow pace they are developing Lenny I think they could have used additional characters.

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I agree.  Penny and Bernadette may have been friends but not close friends.  It is a just a convenience that she holds the two so close now.

Are you aware that TBBT is a sitcom? Sitcoms revolve around the same little group of characters  sharing the same common environment.(This is factual)

You should just change the channel and watch another type of comedy show because you really seem to dislike the very format of TBBT.

 

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Thing is...it's a TV situation comedy!

 

In 'real life' there is no way a girl like Penny would even tolerate guys and girls like Leonard / Amy and Co. She would probably acknowledge them in the hallway, but invite them into her aprtment and subsequently her life? Not a chance.

 

But the premise of the show is girl meets Nerds and the juxtaposition is the joke. (Remember Will & Grace? Gay guy / straight girl romance?)

 

As for Penny's friends at the football game episode disappearing - the producers probably don't like paying extras on the show budget! But I do take the point........IRL girls like Penny get a lot of attention wherever they go and are generally in a position to 'choose' their friends - whereas your average Nerd / unattractive girl, generally (not inevitably) spend time with a few friends or alone.

 

But apply that. and you have no show!

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Well, technically (factually!) the only time we have seen Penny with friends at all other than the guys are the football party and the Halloween party - both instances where people you don't normally hang out with much all come together for a party.  (I have to wonder how many Husker fans there are in Cali.) Penny has never been shown to have scads of friends. We never saw the three girls she went dancing with and came to the doorway tell the boys they'd have sex with them, ever again.  Plot devices all.  Bernadette on the other hand was a friend of hers from the Cheesecake Factory - quite realistic, that, a girl she knew and got along with at work, but probably wasn't really "friends" with until she started dating Howard and thus became part of the group that Penny hung out with.  

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Sometimes when you grow and mature, you lose friends.  I'm 40 years old, and it's just what happens in life.  Penny has grown past her old friends because she has changed and there's nothing wrong with that.  It's just the natural progression of life and maturity.

 

At this point, could you see penny enjoying hanging out with zack again?  No. 

 

I've always felt quality is better than quantity.  Even if you have a slew of superficial friends, if you don't have at least one good, true friend, then you have nothing.

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl
Why is disagreement about the direction of the show considered to be "hate"? Do you really hate people who disagree with you?

 in all honestly though, the title of the thread is "hate the direction of the show" so.....

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