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6.17 The Monster Isolation (Feb. 21)

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"shes the least likeable character" yeah i dont think so, she is most peoples favourite female in the ga

 

IMO = In MY OPINION.

 

And most ppl that like her are men, who like her for her looks. IMO.

 

I'm not gonna be hypocritical and be all like Yay Penny! 

Edited by Kiru Breezy

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No offense, but not everyone cares for Penny....

 

She's the least likable character on the show and does not deserve progress IMO. 

I still don't understand--are you trying to say that she should just stay the same objectionable character? How can a fictional character "deserve" or "not deserve" progress? A character cannot "earn" progress--since it's all up to what the writers decide they want to do, or not do, with the character.

If the writers are committed to moving a character forward, they're going to do it. And if she's such a terrible character, why shouldn't she then "improve"?

No one says she has to be anyone's favorite, but it seems to me that if she's really such a terrible character (which I don't agree with) then she would be the one most in need of "improvement."

And since she's obviously paired with Leonard for the long term, the writers are going to be having her make progress as a person.

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I still don't understand--are you trying to say that she should just stay the same objectionable character? How can a fictional character "deserve" or "not deserve" progress? A character cannot "earn" progress--since it's all up to what the writers decide they want to do, or not do, with the character.

If the writers are committed to moving a character forward, they're going to do it. And if she's such a terrible character, why shouldn't she then "improve"?

No one says she has to be anyone's favorite, but it seems to me that if she's really such a terrible character (which I don't agree with) then she would be the one most in need of "improvement."

And since she's obviously paired with Leonard for the long term, the writers are going to be having her make progress as a person.

 

Meh, I just care for her at all, so what she does or doesn't do is of little to no interest to me. The writers can do what they wanna, I'm sure some will love it..I won't. 

 

Its ironic, Leonard is my all time fave character and Penny my least fave...go figure. 

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Meh, I just care for her at all, so what she does or doesn't do is of little to no interest to me. The writers can do what they wanna, I'm sure some will love it..I won't.

 

You still haven't explained "doesn't deserve improvement." Please do so.

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You still haven't explained "doesn't deserve improvement." Please do so.

 

I don't have to. I don't like her....so she doesn't deserve to go anywhere. Simple.

 

I'm not saying its logical.....its just what it is. 

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I don't have to. I don't like her....so she doesn't deserve to go anywhere. Simple.

I'm not saying its logical.....its just what it is.

That's like the most self centered thought ever... O.o

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I don't have to. I don't like her....so she doesn't deserve to go anywhere. Simple.

 

I'm not saying its logical.....its just what it is. 

 

I figured as much. Thanks for confirming what I already suspected.

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Meh, I just care for her at all, so what she does or doesn't do is of little to no interest to me. The writers can do what they wanna, I'm sure some will love it..I won't. 

 

Its ironic, Leonard is my all time fave character and Penny my least fave...[...]

Actually, it is not.

While Sheldon may be a more singular, immediately recognisable character, there never has been any doubt that Leonard is the show's (sole ? main ?) protagonist, quite literally : he is the first one to struggle, the one who's destined to suffer the most to achieve his goal. It has been like that since the beginning of the show and will continue in this fashion until the very end.

Also, as the protagonist, he is the main recipient of the audience's compassion : people root for him, want him happy. So anything/anyone that/who satisfies him gets a hurrah from the crowd; anything/anybody that/who doesn't gets booed.

Unfortunately for her, Penny is what/who Leonard wants. She is the "object" of his "quest", has been since day one and will be be until the show's over. In and by itself, it is not a massive problem except that Penny is not a remarkably cooperative "object" : she has her own struggles, her own doubts, her own massive failings, etc... She doesn't fall for Leonard at the same time as he falls for her and she doesn't try to.

Her resistance is such that she can almost, at times, look like an antagonist : Penny actively stands in the way of Leonard's happiness with... Penny !

Now, if you consider Penny as character in her own right, her being emotionally retentive and shilly-shallying when it comes to her relationship with Leonard, while frustrating at times, is all part of her personality and her own "quest" : she wants to be happy... She is just not very good at it, due to lack of experience and know-how it would seem. And you can even like her very much for it. I, for one, do.

Conversely, if you think of Penny solely or even mainly as Leonard's goal, then whenever she does something that does not fit his schemes, dreams and aspirations (which tends to happen a lot), you can only regard her as a nuisance.

That is why, I believe, some viewers love Leonard and dislike Penny. Or want the two of them together (for Leonard's sake) but not care for the girly half of the duo.

 

It is particularly visible when you compare these reactions to the kind provoked by the tribulations in Sheldon and Amy's relationship. Amy is every bit as sweet, loving, forgiving and weirdly romantic as Leonard and should therefore attract the same level of empathy. Sheldon is as emotionally inadequate, closed-off, occasionally insensitive and self-centered as Penny and should be on the receiving end of the same amount of criticism for occasionally acting as a hurdle in the evolution of his own romance with the bespectacled biologist. Yet they don't.

She is not the protagonist (she's a great supporting character); nobody can think of him as "just" her love interest (he existed before her in the show universe) = she doesn't get as much sympathy as Leonard does; he gets a couple of get out of jail free cards Penny doesn't.

 

All of it, IMO of course ;)

 

ETA (more on topic) I look forward to any development on the Penny front. Just like I cannot wait to see Raj get some attention. These two have, at times, been a bit sidelined (Raj more so than Penny) and I am anxious to see them develop their own storylines and get recognition a bit outside of their more traditional roles (Leonard's girlfriend for Penny; Howard's sidekick for Raj).

Edited by Chiara
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I just consider myself lucky that (and pardon me for doing this again) "I like everyone!!!" :) Penny is my 3rd fave at the moment, so looking forward to some development with her. I think this ep tackles two characters that were in desperate need of some development: her and Raj. So it's all good :)

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Penny has way more development compared to Raj. Penny has at least had to confront a few things this season like her commitment issues and that Leonard has people attracted to him now. Raj has been in the same place character-wise for as long as I can remember. It'll be interesting what Lucy does to help him along to make him better. If this show can get better after Howard gets MARRIED, it can be nothing but great in the long run for Raj to be in a steady relationship.

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Penny has way more development compared to Raj. Penny has at least had to confront a few things this season like her commitment issues and that Leonard has people attracted to him now. Raj has been in the same place character-wise for as long as I can remember. It'll be interesting what Lucy does to help him along to make him better. If this show can get better after Howard gets MARRIED, it can be nothing but great in the long run for Raj to be in a steady relationship.

I'm also looking forward to Kunal maybe getting a chance to use his acting chops, flexing his acting muscles a little. I think that he hasn't really been able to put his skills to the test very much so far, so it will be good to hopefully see him get to do the kind of work that the others have had a chance to do. Just give him more to work with.

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This sudden appearence of Penny's acting ability bothers me a little too. Probably because if she actually is talented, then the last 6 years of her life are rendered a tragic mistake. Not her relationship with her friends, but the fact that she never took the risks to succeed. At what? 26, her time has probably passed.

 

That doesn't mean I want her to continue her sad road (seriously, she is way more tragic than Raj.). She should find her actual calling and make a splash there.

 

She needs to write a young adult novel. She can even base it on her genius friends and her roll as their life translator. Now I know, Penny can't write, maybe she just can't write academically. And if Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey have taught the world anyting, writing talent isn't necessary to have a runaway bestseller.

 

It would be great to give her something she could succeed at and be happy about.

 

Acting? I like my Penny as a bad actor.

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That's like the most self centered thought ever... O.o

 

It's just a SHOW, you know.  :)   It isn't self centered to dislike a character and not care about her development.

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Just because I think they are meant for each other doesn't mean I think she deserves to improve, she is too ungrateful and really hasn't done anything to deserve the improvement.

 

I am highly critical at times about Penny, but I want her to improve, I liked her character the first three seasons, but disliked many of her actions in season four.  So in a way, least in my opinion she became worse in season four and early season five.

But this season I think she is improving and is showing growth as a character, which I like.

Granted her being an actress is something I thought was dead, she has in six years had two parts. 

 

Plus I don’t see how she can impress Sheldon.

 

 

 

Edited by Dbear12

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It's just a SHOW, you know. :) It isn't self centered to dislike a character and not care about her development.

I completely agree... However saying she doesn't deserve improvement BECAUSE she doesn't like the character is extremely self centered... That's like saying no one else gets to eat because I'm hungry...

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I just consider myself lucky that (and pardon me for doing this again) "I like everyone!!!" :) Penny is my 3rd fave at the moment, so looking forward to some development with her. I think this ep tackles two characters that were in desperate need of some development: her and Raj. So it's all good :)

 

I too like them all, just think that some of the characters should only be in smaller doses than we currently see them.  

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To be honest I would have preferred this, but then again I am an advent slasher so it is not such a big deal for me.

 

What's an advent slasher?

 

I would like to see some diversity.  As much as I want to see Raj happy, it might seem a little too matchy-matchy to have four heterosexual couples.  Having said that, aside from the comments he makes, the writers have made it clear that Raj is heterosexual so unless they can figure out a way to change that, we won't see any diversity in terms of sexual orientation.  Actually, I would love to see Raj free of the mutism and have some time to play the field before settling down.

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I still don't understand--are you trying to say that she should just stay the same objectionable character? How can a fictional character "deserve" or "not deserve" progress? A character cannot "earn" progress--since it's all up to what the writers decide they want to do, or not do, with the character.

If the writers are committed to moving a character forward, they're going to do it. And if she's such a terrible character, why shouldn't she then "improve"?

No one says she has to be anyone's favorite, but it seems to me that if she's really such a terrible character (which I don't agree with) then she would be the one most in need of "improvement."

And since she's obviously paired with Leonard for the long term, the writers are going to be having her make progress as a person.

Interesting if you change she to he, and the subject of the statement from Penny to Sheldon, and Leonard to Amy, you'd pretty much sum up my feelings for Sheldon.

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Just looked at the promo pictures and I'm not looking forward to seeing Raj whining with self-pity about being single...again! Its too pathetic for words. Being single has a lot of advantages, he should enjoy it while he can.

 

I am looking forward to the Penny story though. Really want to see her act. :icon_cheesygrin: When she did the community college course I thought the acting dream was long gone. This is a surprise and I hope its not just a one off.

Edited by Moonbase
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Just looked at the promo pictures and I'm not looking forward to seeing Raj whining with self-pity about being single...again! Its too pathetic for words. Being single has a lot of advantages, he should enjoy it will he can.

 

 I think when all your friends are in happy relationships, it can make being single less fun. Although I think the fact that he seems to be down after a bad first date is understandable. Considering the fact that the past couple of women he dated weren't actually attracted him that much, I can see him being really upset that he thinks he made a bad first impression on her. Kinda interested to see what the note segment shown in the promo pics going to be about....

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I think this is going to be a turning point for Raj. He's going to hit rock bottom and from there it can only improve. It's not a bad thing, it might be the last we ever see of depressed Raj. I'm optimistic.

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I think this is going to be a turning point for Raj. He's going to hit rock bottom and from there it can only improve. It's not a bad thing, it might be the last we ever see of depressed Raj. I'm optimistic.

The last single nerd guy finally getting a GF, could be why they promoted Stuart to a regular, so they would still have a nerd to make fun of.....

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 I think when all your friends are in happy relationships, it can make being single less fun. Although I think the fact that he seems to be down after a bad first date is understandable. Considering the fact that the past couple of women he dated weren't actually attracted him that much, I can see him being really upset that he thinks he made a bad first impression on her. Kinda interested to see what the note segment shown in the promo pics going to be about....

 

Raj has always been a bit whiny and co-dependent. Soon we will have 4 couples and that to me is too many. They should have kept 2 guys single for balance. JMO.

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What's an advent slasher?

 

I would like to see some diversity.  As much as I want to see Raj happy, it might seem a little too matchy-matchy to have four heterosexual couples.  Having said that, aside from the comments he makes, the writers have made it clear that Raj is heterosexual so unless they can figure out a way to change that, we won't see any diversity in terms of sexual orientation.  Actually, I would love to see Raj free of the mutism and have some time to play the field before settling down.

 

Most of my Ships in the past were slash: Sylar/ Mohinder, 10/ Simm-Master, Sam/ Gene, Sherlock/ John etc. rarely, if ever did I ship Het. Honestly I found most Het. I found to be boring before Shamy. Personally I wish Raj were Bi. All of his comments would make much more sense, but then again they would no longer be for laughs and that is most likely the Main Reason the powers that be would Not make Raj anything other than 100% Straight.... Just my thoughts.

EDITED: Forgot my favourite Slash Pairing there for a moment.

Edited by The God Particle

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