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walnutcowboy

Bible On The History Channel.

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 Jesus  tells us to do only ONE thing !

 In JOHN 13:34-35 JESUS says

34, " A new commandment I give to you: Love one another, As I have loved you, so must you love one another.

35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."

 If you follow that 1 rule EVERYTHING else falls into place.

You will WANT to feed the poor, give drink to the thirsty, take care of the sick, visit prisoners ! 

 

 As for being BORN AGAIN, JESUS doesn't demand that we be BORN AGAIN, HE ASKS us to make a choice because we have" ALL fallen short of the GLORY of GOD"..

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@Europa:  Of course we must admit that we have all sinned and come short of the glory of God.  But the gift of salvation is a free gift and it is not something that we can acquire by DOING anything but accepting  Jesus Christ, His work on the Cross, His resurrection and His being the Lord of our lives.  Anything else we do - the feeding of the poor, the helping the needy, etc. stems from obedience to Jesus.  It's not a requirement of salvation though.  Otherwise we would boast about how great we are and how much we love mankind and forget that Jesus died so that we may have life.

 

I purposely didn't specifically add the quotations to the Bible verses I paraphrased but will do so if needed...

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 the gift of salvation is a free gift and it is not something that we can acquire by DOING anything but accepting  Jesus Christ, His work on the Cross, His resurrection and His being the Lord of our lives.  

 

Okay - so by "accepting" Jesus Christ, what do you mean? Saying "Yep, he did all those things for me," even believing that with all your heart, is pretty meaningless if you don't also do as he commanded - love one another. Love requires action. If I say "I love my neighbor," but I do nothing to help him when he is hungry, sick, cold, thirsty - that's not love. Platitudes and beliefs are meaningless without action. 

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Okay - so by "accepting" Jesus Christ, what do you mean? Saying "Yep, he did all those things for me," even believing that with all your heart, is pretty meaningless if you don't also do as he commanded - love one another. Love requires action. If I say "I love my neighbor," but I do nothing to help him when he is hungry, sick, cold, thirsty - that's not love. Platitudes and beliefs are meaningless without action. 

 

Yes believing you're a sinner, believing that Jesus died for our sins and was resurrected is the way to salvation.  You accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior and as such you "obey" Him.  That is where your abide by His commandments which the chief one being to love the Lord with all your heart, soul, body and spirit and to love your neighbor as yourself.  To obey Jesus is a product of your salvation, not a condition.  There is a distinction...

Edited by Kasey

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 @ EUROPA,

 KASEY speaks much more eloquently then me, and makes her points much better than I can.

But I'd like to add one thing

Once you accept JESUS as your PERSONAL SAVIOR, you WANT to please GOD.

Pleasing GOD is WANT to thing, NOT a HAVE to thing !

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Huh?

 

I'll put it another way. Going to heaven is not the reward of the saved.

 

The meek (Christians) will inherit the earth.... not heaven!!

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I totally got what you were saying and it is very true that every person seems to want their two minutes of "fame" in telling people how to get saved and get to Heaven.  My point was simply "what does God say?" 

 

Here is what God says....

 

John 3:13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven - the Son of Man.

 

If dead Christians were now in heaven they would see God, right?

 

John 1:18 No one has seen God at anytime. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.

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 Platitudes and beliefs are meaningless without action. 

 

Very true....

 

James 2:17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does no have works, is dead.

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Here is what God says....

 

John 3:13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven - the Son of Man.

 

If dead Christians were now in heaven they would see God, right?

 

John 1:18 No one has seen God at anytime. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.

 

 

This is exactly the point that Sherminator was trying to make about a dozen or so posts ago - Christians haggling over words and phrases and "how to's".  

 

The KJV of John 3:13 (and I believe we covered this already) says that no man hath ascended up into Heaven.  What is the tense of the word "hath"?  Does it imply past, present and future?  And when it says "man" is that a human in their physical form or someone in their spiritual form?  Because what of the angels - are they not no one?

 

Jesus did say that the meek shall inherit the earth (Matthew 5:5).  He also said that the pure in heart would see God and that those who were persecuted for righteousness' sake would have the Kingdom of Heaven.  I have never heard or read that the "meek" refer to Christians specifically.  Are Christians suppose to be meek?  Yes and humble and maintain an attitude of servitude to all.

 

The point I was trying to make to Europa was that, as is said in Ephesian 2 that it is by grace are we saved and not by works "lest anyone should boast".  Naturally doing what is right in the eyes of God is a by product of one's faith in God's saving grace.  But for me to think that I can do anything to attain eternal life on my own is to negate the whole entire meaning of the Cross.

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The KJV of John 3:13 (and I believe we covered this already) says that no man hath ascended up into Heaven.  What is the tense of the word "hath"? 

Jesus did say that the meek shall inherit the earth (Matthew 5:5).  He also said that the pure in heart would see God and that those who were persecuted for righteousness' sake would have the Kingdom of Heaven.  I have never heard or read that the "meek" refer to Christians specifically.  Are Christians suppose to be meek?  Yes and humble and maintain an attitude of servitude to all.

 

 

When scripture talks of God's Kingdom you will noctice that is always states "The Kingdom of Heaven" it never states "The Kingdom in Heaven".

 

One does not need to be in heaven to be in God's Kingdom.

 

At the return of Christ, God will set up his kingdom on earth. No one is going to heaven.... Neither is anyone there now.

 

Right now the dead are awaiting the resurrection.

 

John 3:13 is very clear in it's claim that no one has ever gone into heaven.

 

Both 1 Timothy 6:14-16 and John 1:18 makes is very clear that no one has ever seen the father... Who is in heaven.

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Right John 3:13 says that no man has ever gone into Heaven.  What it doesn't say is that no man will ever go into Heaven.  And that is pretty clear to me.

 

Yes the Bible says the Kingdom OF Heaven and doesn't qualify where exactly it is.   Scripture tells us that God is IN Heaven.  Jesus said that in His Father's house are many mansions and that He went to prepare a place for us.  Revelation 21 states that there will be a new Heaven and a new earth. 

 

As a believer who wants everyone to have a mansion with God and have a wonderful eternal life, I'm really not feeling the need to know the geographical details of where the streets of gold are.  I think that matters like these are what trip people up from understanding the "simplicity in Christ Jesus".

 

God bless...

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Right John 3:13 says that no man has ever gone into Heaven.  What it doesn't say is that no man will ever go into Heaven.  And that is pretty clear to me.

 

Yes the Bible says the Kingdom OF Heaven and doesn't qualify where exactly it is.   Scripture tells us that God is IN Heaven.  Jesus said that in His Father's house are many mansions and that He went to prepare a place for us.  Revelation 21 states that there will be a new Heaven and a new earth. 

 

As a believer who wants everyone to have a mansion with God and have a wonderful eternal life, I'm really not feeling the need to know the geographical details of where the streets of gold are.  I think that matters like these are what trip people up from understanding the "simplicity in Christ Jesus".

 

God bless...

 

When Jesus said “in my Father’s house there are many mansions” (mansions meaning rooms in correct translation) He was talking about position of office. In the temple in Jerusalem there were many rooms where the religious leaders lived. Jesus was telling his apostles that He was going to prepare a future position of rule for them.

 

Even the Lord’s Prayer tells us that it is the earth and not heaven that is the reward of the saved....

 

Matthew 6:9-10

In this manner, therefore pray: Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come. You will be done ON EARTH as it is in heaven.

 

Proverbs 2:22 tells us that the wicked will be cut off from the EARTH.... Not cut off from heaven.

Revelation 5:9-10 (New King James Version)

Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 And have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on the earth.”

 

Proverbs 10:30 (King James Version)

The righteous shall never be removed: but the wicked shall not inhabit the earth.

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Continued from above...

 

Priest x: now, you have to pay 10% of your income to church to be saved.

priest y: NO, you have to sell all your belongings, give all your money to the poor, and only then are you saved!

priest z: SEriously people, you have to believe all the words in the Bible to be saved.

priest g: oh no, you  have to obey all the laws in the bible to be saved!

priest t: Hey, in fact you have to eat the body of Christ to be saved!

priest u: in fact, the only way to salvation is by preaching the word of God openly!

priest r: good one! In fact, you have to say this magic prayer aloud, that saves you!

 

I could go on and on for days, you know!!!

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Oh Catweazle, God bless you...

 

That's very kind of you, but it doesn't answer questions.

 

Please explain Proverbs 10:30 in your understanding.... What does it mean that the righteous shall never be removed but the wicked shall not inhabit the earth?

 

Please explain what Jesus meant when He told us to pray, "Your will be done on EARTH as it is in heaven"

 

Please explain Revelation 5:9-10 Where we're told that those made kings and priests by God shall reign on the earth.

 

I'm assuming that you don't know much about the hierachy and lifestyles of the religious leaders like the Pharasees and Sadducees to be able to draw the parallel Jesus was making in John 14:2-4.

 

Please explain how long forever is. Because, Psalm 37:22 tells us this.... the righteous will inherit the land (Earth) and dwell in it forever.

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I'm so sorry.  I wasn't aware that I had questions to answer...

 

When Jesus taught us to pray, He said to ask the Father for His will to be done on earth as it is done in Heaven.  Since I am here on earth, I want God's will to happen here.  I see no other meaning beyond that.

 

Nope, don't know about Jewish hierarchy back in the day and never heard any parallelism about "mansions" being 'stations or positions" but that's cool if that is your interpretation of it.

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Noteworthy to think:

 

Many serial killers based their work on the Bible.

 

Spanish Inquisition was founded on Bible

 

KKK was founded on the Biblical teachings

 

Anti-jew credo of the Nazis was founded on the Bible.

 

Point here is this:

 

Just because your opinion is based on Bible, does not mean it's good opinion, or righteous opinion.

 

Also:

 

If you found your life on the Bible, it does not mean your life will be good, righteous or just.

-Remember, those serial killers founded their life on the bible, and were they good?

 

Also:

 

MAny think that reading Bible will transform them to better persons. Not so!

-again, look at those serial killers: they read the bible with obsession, and yet, it did not change them to better person. On the contrary, Bible seemed to enhance their evil side!

 

So, Bible does not do any good on itself. Only Christ can transform you, and that transformation has nothing to do with Bible studies.

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I'm so sorry.  I wasn't aware that I had questions to answer...

 

When Jesus taught us to pray, He said to ask the Father for His will to be done on earth as it is done in Heaven.  Since I am here on earth, I want God's will to happen here.  I see no other meaning beyond that.

 

Nope, don't know about Jewish hierarchy back in the day and never heard any parallelism about "mansions" being 'stations or positions" but that's cool if that is your interpretation of it.

It is quite clear that right now on earth God's will is not yet come. There will not be murder, rape, war, hate and every other kind of sin happening in heaven, but clearly on the earth it is happening. On a vast and increasing scale! So, the question remains. When will the earth be as it is in heaven? The answer is, at Christ's second coming when the saints who are made kings and preists will reign with Him ON Earth. Rev 5:9-10

 

The belief that the saved go to heaven is a false belief held by the majorty of professing Christians. The minority of Christians who believe in what is commonly known as "soul sleep" leading to the future "resurrection" have the truth.

 

Nowhere in the Bible does God state that heaven is the reward of the saved. Because it isn't. Any belief that it does is based on ignorance and wrong understanding.

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It is quite clear that right now on earth God's will is not yet come. There will not be murder, rape, war, hate and every other kind of sin happening in heaven, but clearly on the earth it is happening. On a vast and increasing scale! So, the question remains. When will the earth be as it is in heaven? The answer is, at Christ's second coming when the saints who are made kings and preists will reign with Him ON Earth. Rev 5:9-10

 

The belief that the saved go to heaven is a false belief held by the majorty of professing Christians. The minority of Christians who believe in what is commonly known as "soul sleep" leading to the future "resurrection" have the truth.

 

Nowhere in the Bible does God state that heaven is the reward of the saved. Because it isn't. Any belief that it does is based on ignorance and wrong understanding.

 

 

I am not convinced and so therefore I guess I am ignorant and wrong.  Like I said before Catweazle, God bless you.  There is no need to further this along.

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So, Bible does not do any good on itself. Only Christ can transform you, and that transformation has nothing to do with Bible studies.

 

I agree.  I do not study the Bible as a textbook.  I study the Bible because it is the way I learn about my Heavenly Father and my Savior Jesus Christ.  How I learn Their ways and Their heart and Their will..

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I am not convinced and so therefore I guess I am ignorant and wrong.  Like I said before Catweazle, God bless you.  There is no need to further this along.

 

Ignorance is only being without the facts. The Bible has the facts so ignorance can be removed. If you are not convinced study is the answer.

 

Most people never really test their longheld beliefs to see if they are correct. They blindly go through life accepting they must be right because the majority agrees with them. However, the majority are wrong and live with false belief.

 

Do not be surprised that a minority can be right and the majority wrong. If you alone were to stand in front of a billion Muslims and proclaim that salvation can only be achieved throught Jesus you would be right. The billion Muslims would not accept that and be wrong.

 

Acts 4:12 confirms Jesus is the only name under the sun that can save.

 

No one likes to be proved wrong, it's human nature due to pride. But there is no profit in being in error.

 

Try not to take things personally. Proverbs states a wise man loves correction.

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@Catweazle

 

Where am I wrong in my beliefs?  Because you didn't convince me that the saved are not going to Heaven?  Am I somehow not saved then?

 

I took nothing personally.  I was merely pointing out that if YOU think that I am ignorant and wrong because I don't agree with your interpretation, then to YOU I am. 

 

I never said I thought I was...

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@Catweazle

 

Where am I wrong in my beliefs?  Because you didn't convince me that the saved are not going to Heaven?  Am I somehow not saved then?

 

I took nothing personally.  I was merely pointing out that if YOU think that I am ignorant and wrong because I don't agree with your interpretation, then to YOU I am. 

 

I never said I thought I was...

The good news is that the vast majority of humankind will be saved, even though only the minority believe that right now.

 

I don't just think you are wrong... I know you're wrong.... but that will only turn into a circular argument, because you think that I'm wrong.... The billion Muslims think they know I'm wrong, but they're wrong.... It' going in a circle!

 

One day the wrong will be right.... It's in God's plan.

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