Spoilers Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread

[Lionne]

I believe part of the reason us Lennys are so excitable is that the writers screw with Leonard and Penny too much, and act like messing with the Shamy is a third rail. Lenny is the only couple that broke up for an extended period of time. Bernie and Howard never really got started before heir breakup, and Shamy broke up for about a week (25 cats!). I prefer to see more episodes such as where Leonard and Penny are sitting on the couch offering comments while the Shamy takes an extended turn in bad relationship land.

 

My fellow shippers are going to shoot me for this, but I don't disagree with it - when Sheldon and Amy are a little stronger as people. Or both are, in their self-esteem. (Not the self-esteem that they fake externally, the one which is real on the inside, and is still iffy for both.) Otherwise, I think both characters would just about crumble if they broke up, and then the question becomes...do you want to watch 6 - 7 episodes of Sheldon and Amy moping over each other before they get back together? Would THAT be fun to watch? (Because I don't think Leonard's going to let Sheldon get 25 cats this time.)

 

Sheldon and Amy have a lot of hurdles to overcome - they started as a pair of babies playing at a relationship, went through potty training, and finally hit their teenage hormonal stage at the end of last season. It's possible to have a type of fight or break up typical to teenagehood, or about something trivial in this point of their relationship, but I don't see either of them being able to handle or partake in drama as most people would know it. Theoretically, the whole thing in Raiders over that movie, and Sheldon seeking revenge on Amy, was "drama" as far as Shamy would do it, for them it was pretty emotional. But "normal" type of bickering in a relationship, as most people would know it? No.

[3ku11]

I am actually quite happy with this season. I really didn't expect an obvious escalation of Leonard and Penny this soon. The Las Vegas weding is Penny's gaffe for the fall, as Leonard not immediately picking her for the scavenger hunt and playing with her regarding his Mom's book were his. So they will be mostly even in the mistake game.

I do think Leonard is overly vilified for manipulating Penny over his Mom's book. I think the fact that he told Penny to a. pick another book, please, or barring that, b. don't talk to him about it. She refused to do neither, and sort of picked on him a little. Personally, she was due for some payback. Her response really was out of line, but maybe she is worried that Leonard will outsmart her. She probably was glad Howard was such a sleeze and a wuss.

I believe part of the reason us Lennys are so excitable is that the writers screw with Leonard and Penny too much, and act like messing with the Shamy is a third rail. Lenny is the only couple that broke up for an extended period of time. Bernie and Howard never really got started before heir breakup, and Shamy broke up for about a week (25 cats!). I prefer to see more episodes such as where Leonard and Penny are sitting on the couch offering comments while the Shamy takes an extended turn in bad relationship land.

Muhahaha the demise of the Shamy lol I agree though, I am enjoying this season diddnt expect that much progression within Lenny so soon, its only 7 episodes in. It is sort of even Leonard manipulating Penny, and Penny's "marrage", its funny every time you watch Season 4-6 now, you well think ha your married! But then again, if Lenny was just in the front seat, in smooth transition people would be complaining its too predictable, although compared to the drama in previous seasons, ill take predictabilty over drama any day. But the writers are in the buisness of ratings, the drama is good to put in a promo, "Penny married?" That catches your attention, wow maybe their is a reason to keep watching Lenny. Season 7 is definately better then last season already, I am not sure why some people are saying they are dumbing down Sheldon, to me he is no different to Season One, maybe in this episode they prefered to show Sheldons human side, their is nothing wrong with that. Character development is a fundamental part of a sitcom as much as the laughing track, I sometimes think peoples perception of the show is distorted and vague, surley when someone watches Season 2 and sees a scene with Penny and her boys, oh this well still be happening seven years later, because I have Goldfish eyes lol.

 

The characters havent changed all that much, their lifes have, their relationships have, the whole landscape of the show has been de constructed into a more refined and bolder show now. Problem is TBBT in the first two seasons espeically was known for its Science and Geekiness with a side of Lenny , I think some people just need to get over this idea TBBT has grown up, some people cannot and thats great stick the dvd in and get lost in a time warp. Theirs also some people who prefer Leonard and Penny as friends, as they were in Season 2 seeing the show was at its peak then, ironically though not in terms of ratings Season One debuted with 8 million, Season 7 debuted over 20 million, so the shows been at its best since Season 4 possibly. I think Penny when it came to guys and relationships were all based on her ideals, being in Hollywood looks are everything, so she scaled her perfect guy based on looks and money, and then when the perfect guy Leonard comes along who is smarter then her, and contrasts everything that she hasent got, up to that point she has been burnt so many times, she finds it hard to trust people. She even said that she has said ILY so many times too soon, and it hasent ended well. So I think every time Penny has rejected Leonard, it has come from her serious intimacy issues and insecurites, a defense mechanism she is trying to protect her self, and also the fact deep down she knew Leonard was one of the good guys. She is now embracing the reality and not waiting for her life to start, she has found it in Leonard. So I guess their are frustrations with the writers, but I think they are on the right track. 

[Nogravitasatall]

I'm very happy with the show this season too, overall. I think Sheldon has enough going on not to be overwhelming and I don't have the faculties to be cranky for too long about anything. But I will react when what they do works, because I'm going "whoo!" on the rollercoaster. I have had big laughs from every episode and the Unofficial Extras provided by the forum membership are extremely diverting. If I wasn't engaged I wouldn't be here.

(I would say maybe some topics deserve get their own threads. Especially if the deep past ever comes up again.)

[hamerman55]

My fellow shippers are going to shoot me for this, but I don't disagree with it - when Sheldon and Amy are a little stronger as people. Or both are, in their self-esteem. (Not the self-esteem that they fake externally, the one which is real on the inside, and is still iffy for both.) Otherwise, I think both characters would just about crumble if they broke up, and then the question becomes...do you want to watch 6 - 7 episodes of Sheldon and Amy moping over each other before they get back together? Would THAT be fun to watch? (Because I don't think Leonard's going to let Sheldon get 25 cats this time.)

 

Sheldon and Amy have a lot of hurdles to overcome - they started as a pair of babies playing at a relationship, went through potty training, and finally hit their teenage hormonal stage at the end of last season. It's possible to have a type of fight or break up typical to teenagehood, or about something trivial in this point of their relationship, but I don't see either of them being able to handle or partake in drama as most people would know it. Theoretically, the whole thing in Raiders over that movie, and Sheldon seeking revenge on Amy, was "drama" as far as Shamy would do it, for them it was pretty emotional. But "normal" type of bickering in a relationship, as most people would know it? No.

I think you put it well comparing Sheldon and Amy to a pre-adolescent to teenage couple. Sheldon is still in the stage of thinking that girls have cooties, yet his world would collapse if Amy broke up with him. Amy developed faster, as girls do at that age, and would like to take the edge off some hormones. What I don't like right now is the whole revering Sheldon thing she has going on, and Sheldon's total unwillingness to even realize she has a point of view, much less that it could possibly be valid. What I do like is that they have been at the center of two episodes highlighting just these issues, which suggests that they may be working on things. And leaving Penny and Leonard alone to just watch the play unfold, just like they have so often done with Sheldon and Amy. The main problem with Penny and Leonard right now is that they are having big problems to sort out, that in the past could have broken them up. That I think is the root of the fear Lenny's express here. Sheldon and Amy have little problems that seem big because Sheldon makes so much noise about them (which is quite funny BTW). It would be good to she a bit more respect for Amy's intellect too. These guys are so smart, yet she pointed out the flaw in Raiders (which I hadn't noticed either, and could also apply to third one as well. The Nazis would have never made it to the Grail, much less have picked the right one, and the mountain would have still collapsed on them if they had tried to take it to Hitler). The funny thing is that Amy was quite reluctant to mention this except that Sheldon kept pushing for her to join him in love for the movies. The plot flaw she saw immediately kept her from doing so, but she wouldn't have mentioned it if Sheldon hadn't kept pushing. The episode where she started working at CalTech was another example. He could have just let it go,, or enjoyed lunch with her, but it looked so much like a high school lunch room scene I almost fell out of my chair. The boys were at the "cool" table, and it was jnacceptable for Amy to actually sit with someone else, not pining to be with him. Sheldon is certainly having the experiences. The question is will he figure out how to handle them before Amy dumps him. Bernie brought this up, Amy beat her down, but for how long. Another date with Stewart may be in order.

It would not bother me in the least if Shamy is the center of most episodes at this point, with the real drama being saved for Bernie and Howard. They actually have the most potential for a real breakup level problem, or at least some serious couples counseling. Penny and Leonard, sitting on the couch under a blanket (with Penny's hand underneath!) watching the other's dramedy play out would be just fine. Shamy working their way up to holding hands without a stream of complaints from Sheldon (girl cooties, eek!) and the Wolowitzs figuring out how to be married.

[Carlos]

He would have pretty much had to have know his wife was smoking pot while pregnant, (Hmmmmmm, he's a farmer, right? ). Maybe Penny started when she found her parents stash.

 

But didn't he tell Penny about the bag that she said was poutpourri? I don't remember if in the episode it is implied he knew it wasn't, but it appeared to me as he didn't.

[Tensor]

But didn't he tell Penny about the bag that she said was poutpourri? I don't remember if in the episode it is implied he knew it wasn't, but it appeared to me as he didn't.

No, he knew. When he said potpourri, the sarcasm was very obvious in his voice. It was said in much the same tone as "diabetes" in the sentence before that.

[hamerman55]

I remember the episode well. Wyatt knew his little darling was smoking weed and having unprotected sex.

[Disgusted]

I remember the episode well. Wyatt knew his little darling was smoking weed and having unprotected sex.

 

They have mentioned the pregnancy tests quite a few times. She seems to have dodged the bullet so far. What if she can't have children? Comedic gold!!!  

[SRAM]

They have mentioned the pregnancy tests quite a few times. She seems to have dodged the bullet so far. What if she can't have children? Comedic gold!!!

That would be a lot of drama and would really ruin 'Our babies will be smart and beautiful' for sure.

[Disgusted]

That would be a lot of drama and would really ruin 'Our babies will be smart and beautiful' for sure.

 

 

....as well as imaginary...

[ArmyGirl]

They have mentioned the pregnancy tests quite a few times. She seems to have dodged the bullet so far. What if she can't have children? Comedic gold!!!  

 

I had this thought before and since it's Leonard who can't catch a break, anything can happen.

That would be a lot of drama and would really ruin 'Our babies will be smart and beautiful' for sure.

 

When has the writers every shied away from drama where Leonard and Lenny is concern? 

[hamerman55]

The only thing that would save us from this it that the same thing was used in HIMYM with Robin.

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[Nogravitasatall]

Besides Wyatt may have a say when it comes to an engagement.

I can't see how, really. He's onboard, but she has been going her own way for a long time. That's one of the things about the character I had enjoyed. A determined, strong female making her own way in the world and doing her thing, regardless of what anyone else thought. With a crippling fear of making a choice that takes that all away. I don't know if her dad has that much influence. He's just being supportive and standing well back, hoping it works out.

(Still smarting from the Mrs Johnson slap *sigh*)

 

ETA: taping report preliminary says little L/P. Why has my paranoia kicked in. I'm thinking Newton's Third Law

Edited November 13, 2013 by Nogravitasatall

[carl1970]

According to the info we have for last night's episode not much Penny in this one. Moyra did say that L/P seemed fine so no fallout from last week's taping. I'm hoping that Penny gets a storyline (involving Leonard of course) in episode 7.11 which should either be a Christmas or New Year's one. I have a feeling this next episode will be couple oriented since last year's wasn't.

[Carlos]

Speaking of Leonard, i would love to get a leonard centric episode, but now where he's reacting to others, or how what he does affect others, but the other way around, like some important development for himself. Sorry if I don't make too much sense.

[Chrismo]

According to the info we have for last night's episode not much Penny in this one. Moyra did say that L/P seemed fine so no fallout from last week's taping. I'm hoping that Penny gets a storyline (involving Leonard of course) in episode 7.11 which should either be a Christmas or New Year's one. I have a feeling this next episode will be couple oriented since last year's wasn't.

You would think so. She seemed to be involved in 7.8 and heavily involved in 7.9. It looks like there trying to tie up some loose ends with Sheldon and the element. Probably going to even more talk about Penny after the Thanksgiving episode so a lull involving Penny(and Leonard) is probably a good thing. Since I'm guessing December 12th is the last new episode of the year a couple's episode is a good bet. Although I'm guessing they will push off Penny's "annulment" to next year.

[SRAM]

Okay I copied the following from the taping report:

"Sheldon says that when he thought the element existed, he didn’t want it but now that it is gone, he wants it more than ever. Leonard tells Penny, “Tell him his gone mad” but Penny says she gets what Sheldon is saying. Sheldon says “Welcome back, friend”. Penny says it is kind of like when you’re going out with someone and they’re not really into you but you stay with them because you want them to like you more than anything. Sheldon says he doesn’t know what she’s talking about but they’re ganging up on Leonard so they’re good. Leonard asks Sheldon what he want Leonard to do. If he doesn’t publish the results, it is only a matter of time until somebody else find out. Sheldon tells Leonard he must publish the results. Leonard says “Ok” and Sheldon tells Penny, “Can you believe this guy?!”"

Please someone explain to me Penny's comment about liking someone who doesn't like you and why is she ganging up on Leonard when he did nothing wrong. I sure hope I'm reading this wrong but this does not sound like two people in a good place. She should be standing up for her man.

[I.Am.Molly]

Okay I copied the following from the taping report:

"Sheldon says that when he thought the element existed, he didn’t want it but now that it is gone, he wants it more than ever. Leonard tells Penny, “Tell him his gone mad” but Penny says she gets what Sheldon is saying. Sheldon says “Welcome back, friend”. Penny says it is kind of like when you’re going out with someone and they’re not really into you but you stay with them because you want them to like you more than anything. Sheldon says he doesn’t know what she’s talking about but they’re ganging up on Leonard so they’re good. Leonard asks Sheldon what he want Leonard to do. If he doesn’t publish the results, it is only a matter of time until somebody else find out. Sheldon tells Leonard he must publish the results. Leonard says “Ok” and Sheldon tells Penny, “Can you believe this guy?!”"

Please someone explain to me Penny's comment about liking someone who doesn't like you and why is she ganging up on Leonard when he did nothing wrong. I sure hope I'm reading this wrong but this does not sound like two people in a good place. She should be standing up for her man.

 

The way i read this was that Penny was saying she knew how it felt to miss something more when she didn't have it than when she did have it. Sheldon lost the element like Penny lost Leonard and it wasnt until those things were gone that they realised how much they wanted them Pure cuteness in my eyes!

[terriblewaitress]

Please someone explain to me Penny's comment about liking someone who doesn't like you and why is she ganging up on Leonard when he did nothing wrong. I sure hope I'm reading this wrong but this does not sound like two people in a good place. She should be standing up for her man.

 

What's wrong with her comment? She's just reflecting on wanting to be liked. I don't think she's ganging up on Leonard she just related something back to Sheldon's side. Leonard and Penny seem to be back in their good place this episode, spending time around each other, just enjoying life. 

[SRAM]

The way i read this was that Penny was saying she knew how it felt to miss something more when she didn't have it than when she did have it. Sheldon lost the element like Penny lost Leonard and it wasnt until those things were gone that they realised how much they wanted them Pure cuteness in my eyes!

What's wrong with her comment? She's just reflecting on wanting to be liked. I don't think she's ganging up on Leonard she just related something back to Sheldon's side. Leonard and Penny seem to be back in their good place this episode, spending time around each other, just enjoying life.

Okay, I must be reading it wrong, my bad. Thanks for setting me straight. Edited November 13, 2013 by SRAM

[I.Am.Molly]

Okay, I must be reading it wrong, my bad. Thanks for setting me straight.

 

That what we do Think like a proton dude, stay positive haha

[Disgusted]

 Penny says it is kind of like when you’re going out with someone and they’re not really into you but you stay with them because you want them to like you more than anything.

 

That sounds like she is describing every guy she ever went out with before Leonard.

 

......or she is describing Leonard [edit: Vis a Vis Penny]  I prefer the first.

Edited November 13, 2013 by Disgusted

[Nogravitasatall]

@sram. They had vacuum cleaner on the show, man. It's a sign. Everything will be cleaned up. Once that thing gets run over Penny's floor then its "job done".

... and, they put more energy into the commitment issue for Thanksgiving so I wonder if that thing is going to hit the ground for the new year or for ep 24. Feb 14 is getting closer. Do they ever get that predictable?

[ajond]

Speaking of Leonard, i would love to get a leonard centric episode, but now where he's reacting to others, or how what he does affect others, but the other way around, like some important development for himself. Sorry if I don't make too much sense.

 

Couldn't agree more, We need to grt L back to being a pivotal character, At present he appears to be merely  half {lesser half} of Lenny

 

 

9

[I.H.S.F.C.]

Penny's comment had nothing to do with Leonard.  For it to be about Leonard, he would have to not be that into her, which everyone knows is false.  I agree that it probably describes a lot of her previous relationships.  She was really into a guy, and he was not as into her, so that makes her even more into him because she wants to convince him to like her more.  It goes to the whole culture of girls liking guys who are assholes to them or not into them.

 

Sheldon just didn't understand it and assumed she was making fun of Leonard somehow.  Just like the "I'm the guy - You're so not the guy" scene with the two of them last season.  All of her analogies are relationship related and Sheldon doesn't understand relationships, so they are completely lost on him.