Spoilers Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread

[SRAM]

Speculation is May 1 for Proton(since they mention May fourth).   That would leave the 8th and 15th as the last two shows of the year.

 

The amount of talk in The Proton Transmogrification about proposals, seems to be an indication that there is more to come before the season is over.  Two more episodes is still enough time to shake things up.

[mjc45]

yes, you could say that stuart save the day

l/p were going back and forth and penny was a little mad

then stuart tell penny that they are the best couple that

he knows, and order was restored.

[Chrismo]

Could The Proton Transmogrification be near or the season finale.  The date of May fourth is mentioned and we have an open proposal from Penny as a

They already seemed to have the cliffhanger proposal during Penny's NCIS fiasco. I think the next will be real and one of them is going to say yes. If there is going to be any cliff hanger IMO it will be with Shamy

[3ku11]

Re Pennys susposed drinking problem, its pretty much circumstancial. Other then the raj thing, i cant remember a time on tbbt that shes blacked out, not on screen anyway. Go back to s4 the girls and Sheldon went out, Amy and Bernie did most of the drinking, Penny hardly drank at all. Amy is actually the one who got really drunk, and made a fool of herself and kissed Sheldon. Just saying i understand frustration with the way the writers deal with Pennys drinking, but i dont think the actual consumption is a big deal, its more an extension to her personality, i feel the writers over exagerrate for effect, more just throw away jokes. I agree theirs more to pennys character, but i think the writers have showed depth to her character imo. Besides since s5 her drinking has become more refined, other then the DL ep last season, although she wasent drunk. The drunk slut has been a ploy used by writers in many sitcoms, no different with tbbt, but hey Penny aint no Charlie .

Edited March 9, 2014 by 3ku11

[DaisyJane]

Yeah, Rick was resorting to false arguments to prove his point. Surprise, surprise.

Most of the things he described either never happened with her or happened once, a long time ago.

Edited March 9, 2014 by DaisyJane

[Tensor]

Yeah, Rick was resorting to false arguments to prove his point. Surprise, surprise.

Most of the thongs he described either never happened with her or happened once, a long time ago.

People that dislike Penny keep pointing out she's an alcoholic, using that time with Raj, as a major example. However, they conveniently forget both Amy and Sheldon haven been black out drunk as many times as Penny ( and both came closeer to a second time than Penny has.). And if that bottle started full that Leonard finished in "Lunar Excitation" he was right on the edge also. Except for the understandable night in "Hesitation", she doesn't drink alone or that heavily anymore.

[Chrismo]

Yeah, Rick was resorting to false arguments to prove his point. Surprise, surprise.

Most of the thongs he described either never happened with her or happened once, a long time ago.

But her history has come Back to haunt her. This season the previous marriage to Zack. the drinking marriage proposal to Leonard. Leonard jokingly mentioning how Napa Valley wouldn't be a good place to go. In the Disney episode Penny mentioning hooking up with some guy at a hotel and getting drunk at Disney. Some of these as you suggested were long ago but have been brought more recently. Rick may have been a bit over the top but there is some truth in what he said. A lot of times the problem is brought up by Penny mentioning things she has done in the past. Edited March 9, 2014 by Chrismo

[DaisyJane]

But her history has come Back to haunt her. This season the previous marriage to Zack. the drinking marriage proposal to Leonard. Leonard jokingly mentioning how Napa Valley wouldn't be a good place to go. In the Disney episode Penny mentioning hooking up with some guy at a hotel and getting drunk at Disney. Some of these as you suggested were long ago but have been brought more recently. Rick may have been a bit over the top but there is some truth in what he said. A lot of times the problem is brought up by Penny mentioning things she has done in the past.

 

No, it really hasn't. Zack was resolved in the span of a few hours (who doesn't drink in Vegas?), Penny's proposal was just as bad as both of Leonard's, she remembered it clearly the next day. Leonard's thoughtless joke fell flat with everyone listening. The hotel was an example of casual sex, something all the guys (minus Sheldon) are quite familiar with. Most of these were one-time instances that happened several years ago, not indicative of an alcoholic in the least. A lapse in judgement, certainly, but nothing more. 

[I.H.S.F.C.]

Penny really is an angel when you excuse away every single poor decision she has made. Penny and Leonard are both flawed characters. It doesn't make them any less lovable or deserving of each other. Most people can see that. There are a few who insist on holding one of them up on a pedestal and running down the other every chance they get. Quite sad really.

[DaisyJane]

Penny really is an angel when you excuse away every single poor decision she has made. Penny and Leonard are both flawed characters. It doesn't make them any less lovable or deserving of each other. Most people can see that. There are a few who insist on holding one of them up on a pedestal and running down the other every chance they get. Quite sad really.

 

Wasn't saying that she was an angel, I was refuting the idea that she was an alcoholic. The subject should have been put to rest ages ago, but ignoramuses keep popping up.  

[SodidIwin?]

Since certain posters seem to not want to let the theory that Penny is an alcoholic go. Tensor’s statement about Sheldon being drunk once got me to thinking. I tend to believe that the evidence shows that there is a bias against the female Penny that is not shown against the male Sheldon. I thought about just how many times has Sheldon actually been drunk on the show? Let’s count the times shall we?

 

1)      1.08 The Grasshopper Experiment – Sheldon is so drunk that he is at The Cheese Cake Factory playing the piano and singing “To Life” from Fiddler on the Roof.

2)      3.18 The Pants Alternative – Sheldon became so drunk that he had to watch his speech the next morning on YouTube because he blacked out.

3)      5.22 The Stag Convergence – Sheldon got so drunk at Howard’s stag party that he had to vomit when he made it home.

4)      6.07 The Habitation Configuration – Sheldon becomes so drunk he wanted to fight Wil Wheaton and ends up once again vomiting. This time on Wil’s bushes.

5)      7.09 The Thanksgiving Decoupling – Sheldon got so drunk with Howard’s father-in-law that he (you guessed it) once again vomited, this time in Howard’s mom’s bathroom.

 

Except for seasons two and four it has been once per season. Now I don’t believe Sheldon’s an alcoholic just like I don’t believe Penny is. I think people should stop bring up something that just isn’t there. Also, if Penny is an alcoholic then why didn’t she go right to her alcohol when she came out so angry after Leonard’s first proposal? No she went right to the refrigerator for a water. Or how about when she came home from the awful Valentine’s Day date and she and Leonard were having that serious discussion. Why didn’t she go directly to her alcohol then?  No, she went and got a water. The writers may use her drinking as humor, just like they use Sheldon’s times he drank for humor, but whenever she needed to have a serious discussion she was shown with a water not alcohol. Enough already!

Edited March 9, 2014 by SodidIwin?

[Tensor]

Since certain posters seem to not want to let the theory that Penny is an alcoholic go. Tensor’s statement about Sheldon being drunk once got me to thinking. 

 

 

One small correction, my statement was  Sheldon was black out drunk once, not just drunk.  As was Amy and Penny.  Leonard was close, depending on if the bottle he emptied, was full when he started.   

[djsurrey]

Since certain posters seem to not want to let the theory that Penny is an alcoholic go. Tensor’s statement about Sheldon being drunk once got me to thinking. I tend to believe that the evidence shows that there is a bias against the female Penny that is not shown against the male Sheldon. I thought about just how many times has Sheldon actually been drunk on the show? Let’s count the times shall we?

 

1)      1.08 The Grasshopper Experiment – Sheldon is so drunk that he is at The Cheese Cake Factory playing the piano and singing “To Life” from Fiddler on the Roof.

2)      3.18 The Pants Alternative – Sheldon became so drunk that he had to watch his speech the next morning on YouTube because he blacked out.

3)      5.22 The Stag Convergence – Sheldon got so drunk at Howard’s stag party that he had to vomit when he made it home.

4)      6.07 The Habitation Configuration – Sheldon becomes so drunk he wanted to fight Wil Wheaton and ends up once again vomiting. This time on Wil’s bushes.

5)      7.09 The Thanksgiving Decoupling – Sheldon got so drunk with Howard’s father-in-law that he (you guessed it) once again vomited, this time in Howard’s mom’s bathroom.

 

Except for seasons two and four it has been once per season. Now I don’t believe Sheldon’s an alcoholic just like I don’t believe Penny is. I think people should stop bring up something that just isn’t there. Also, if Penny is an alcoholic then why didn’t she go right to her alcohol when she came out so angry after Leonard’s first proposal? No she went right to the refrigerator for a water. Or how about when she came home from the awful Valentine’s Day date and she and Leonard were having that serious discussion. Why didn’t she go directly to her alcohol then?  No, she went and got a water. The writers may use her drinking as humor, just like they use Sheldon’s times he drank for humor, but whenever she needed to have a serious discussion she was shown with a water not alcohol. Enough already!

 

You have somehow missed the essential point.

In 1.08 The Grasshopper Experiment it was penny that slipped Sheldon the alcohol when he ordered virgin drinks.

In 3.18 The Pants Alternative Sheldon did not want to drink. It was Penny that convinced him to have the first drink, then the second drink.

In other episodes Sheldon gets drunk because of lack experience. The point here is Penny is the one with a long history of drinking and she is the one that brings it to the group. It is also Penny that turns to drinking as a way to cope.

Edited March 9, 2014 by djsurrey

[SodidIwin?]

You have somehow missed the essential point.

In 1.08 The Grasshopper Experiment it was penny that slipped Sheldon the alcohol when he ordered virgin drinks.

In 3.18 The Pants Alternative Sheldon did not want to drink. It was Penny that convinced him to have the first drink, then the second drink.

In other episodes Sheldon gets drunk because of lack experience. The point here is Penny is the one with a long history of drinking and she is the one that brings it to the group. It is also Penny that turns to drinking as a way to cope.

Sounds to me like you are an enabler for Sheldon. Its always someone else's fault. Just my opinion.

Edited March 9, 2014 by SodidIwin?

[ajond]

Wasn't saying that she was an angel, I was refuting the idea that she was an alcoholic. The subject should have been put to rest ages ago, but ignoramuses keep popping up. 

 

do you have to use derogatory words for people you disagree with.Reasoned arguments would be preferable.

[djsurrey]

Sounds to me like you are an enabler for Sheldon. Its always someone else's fault. Just my opinion.

 

You think I am an enabler but he is fictional and I am not. Does that make sense even just as an opinion?

[DaisyJane]

do you have to use derogatory words for people you disagree with.Reasoned arguments would be preferable.

 

I have, yet they keep beating the dead horse. Saying that the people who think she's an alcoholic are ignorant isn't derogatory, as those people are clearly very uninformed about the disease. I envy that naivete. 

[SodidIwin?]

You think I am an enabler but he is fictional and I am not. Does that make sense even just as an opinion?

I don't think it makes much sense at all, but then I'm not the one making excuses for a fictional character's drunkenness either. You would have to answer why you feel compelled to do so not me.

 

The two excuses you stated by the way are ones a person with a problem use. Namely, blame it on anyone but themselves.

 

Penny slipped him alcohol in his diet coke? Excuse me but Sheldon has an eidetic  memory. He knows what diet coke taste like and everything he ever tasted his entire life. He could and would have sent it back when it tasted funny. But the eccentric Sheldon didn't do that. Oh but that's Penny's fault.

 

Sheldon is what 8 or 10 years older than Penny? But she "talked" him into drinking before his speech. Always an excuse, never the person drinking's fault.

[Tensor]

You have somehow missed the essential point.

In 1.08 The Grasshopper Experiment it was penny that slipped Sheldon the alcohol when he ordered virgin drinks.

Yep, this one was Penny's fault.

In 3.18 The Pants Alternative Sheldon did not want to drink. It was Penny that convinced him to have the first drink, then the second drink.

I don't get how this is Penny's fault. I'll give you Grasshopper Experiment, she snuck it in (Much as in The Habitation Configuration), but here, she didn't sneak it in, she didn't force him to drink it and she sure didn't put the bottle into his hand after that.

 

In other episodes Sheldon gets drunk because of lack experience.

And how is this Penny's fault?

 

The point here is Penny is the one with a long history of drinking and she is the one that brings it to the group.

What, her history of drinking or drinking itself? And I hardly think she brings it to the group.  Sheldon was quite aware of his father's drinking.  Not to mention Bernadette was shown drinking, on hers and Howard's first date, before she was part of the group. Hardly Penny's fault unless you're saying she was introduced to it by Penny.

 

It is also Penny that turns to drinking as a way to cope.

 

How does any of that equate to saying she's an alcoholic because she is shown blacking out once? Just pointing out she has shown to be black out drunk as many times as Sheldon and Amy.

[Nogravitasatall]

Penny really is an angel when you excuse away every single poor decision she has made. Penny and Leonard are both flawed characters. It doesn't make them any less lovable or deserving of each other. Most people can see that. There are a few who insist on holding one of them up on a pedestal and running down the other every chance they get. Quite sad really.

Yup, its not a show for pre-teens to live by. There are other shows for that. Try Nickelodeon. LOL. Edited March 9, 2014 by Nogravitasatall

[Chrismo]

No, it really hasn't. Zack was resolved in the span of a few hours (who doesn't drink in Vegas?), Penny's proposal was just as bad as both of Leonard's, she remembered it clearly the next day. Leonard's thoughtless joke fell flat with everyone listening. The hotel was an example of casual sex, something all the guys (minus Sheldon) are quite familiar with. Most of these were one-time instances that happened several years ago, not indicative of an alcoholic in the least. A lapse in judgement, certainly, but nothing more.

Zack's wasn't resolved in a few hours. it happened three years earlier. Most people do drink in Vegas and some do get married but most people don't believe their weddings are fake. Especially three years later. In regards to casual sex at hotels you must hang with a different crowd than me.Don't think the guys on TBBT have done that besides Howard. You can call her events in the past lapses of judgment. But it also seems quitting her job without a back up plan and maintaining her car are lapses in judgment but that is recent. I think at a certain point these lapses of judgment are just a lot of stupid things she has done in her past. Hopefully they won't happen in the future.. In regards to her drinking IMO 99 percent of people on here don't think she is an alcoholic. However her drinking has caused a lot of trouble for herself compared to the others.

[djsurrey]

I have never said she is an alcoholic. If she uses alcohol to cope she could be headed in that direction.

And how is this Penny's fault?

 

Certainly Penny did not put the bottle in his hand. My point was he was reluctant to drink and she talked him into it on this ocasion.

Edited March 9, 2014 by djsurrey

[djsurrey]

What, her history of drinking or drinking itself? And I hardly think she brings it to the group.  Sheldon was quite aware of his father's drinking.  Not to mention Bernadette was shown drinking, on hers and Howard's first date, before she was part of the group. Hardly Penny's fault unless you're saying she was introduced to it by Penny.

 

Penny definitely brought drinking into the group.

1. It was Penny practicing making drinks that was the first occasion that Raj found he could talk to women if he had a drink.
2. Amy referred to an offer of a drink from Penny as the "peer pressure" her mother had warned her about.
3. In  The Lunar Excitation Penny provides the example copied by Leonard in getting very drunk.
4. It was Penny that took Leonard's mother drinking. I believe Beverly had said she was not a drinker.
5. As was already pointed out it was Penny who introduced drinking to Sheldon.

Bernadette and Howard probably were occasional drinkers already.

Edited March 9, 2014 by djsurrey

[DaisyJane]

Penny definitely brought drinking into the group.

 

To a group of people well over the age of 21? Big deal. Raj would still be whispering into Howard's ear in order to communicate. The others made the decision to drink on their own free will, way too old to claim peer pressure. 

Zack's wasn't resolved in a few hours. it happened three years earlier. Most people do drink in Vegas and some do get married but most people don't believe their weddings are fake. Especially three years later. In regards to casual sex at hotels you must hang with a different crowd than me.Don't think the guys on TBBT have done that besides Howard. You can call her events in the past lapses of judgment. But it also seems quitting her job without a back up plan and maintaining her car are lapses in judgment but that is recent. I think at a certain point these lapses of judgment are just a lot of stupid things she has done in her past. Hopefully they won't happen in the future.. In regards to her drinking IMO 99 percent of people on here don't think she is an alcoholic. However her drinking has caused a lot of trouble for herself compared to the others.

 

I sure as hell don't hang out with people who engage in casual sex (thanks for the assumption), but Penny does. Howard had more stories than Penny ever will, Raj had a few (Sailor Moon anyone?) and Leonard has had Leslie, Joyce, Priya (initially, Stephanie arguably began the same way), almost Alice, you get the point. They formed into relationships, but began with casual sex. I get that you hold them to a different standard because they're guys, but she's really no worse than them in that regard. 

[Chrismo]

To a group of people well over the age of 21? Big deal. Raj would still be whispering into Howard's ear in order to communicate. The others made the decision to drink on their own free will, way too old to claim peer pressure. 

 

I sure as hell don't hang out with people who engage in casual sex (thanks for the assumption), but Penny does. Howard had more stories than Penny ever will, Raj had a few (Sailor Moon anyone?) and Leonard has had Leslie, Joyce, Priya (initially, Stephanie arguably began the same way), almost Alice, you get the point. They formed into relationships, but began with casual sex. I get that you hold them to a different standard because they're guys, but she's really no worse than them in that regard.

I was commenting about the hotel part. sorry if I offended you.