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Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread

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I'm wondering when they will put Leonard in a situation where he has to defend his choice and stick up for Penny. Apparently his mum approved of her but Proton made him squirm a bit. They picked this unlikely thing and now they have to live with it. It's entirely valid for them but their two worlds are different, outside the hermetic bubble of 4A/4B. Could be funny.

 

 

If he is honest I think he can easily defend his choice.  She is all the love that was denied him in life by his family, she is a little wild which he likes in his life, she makes him comfortable and he can easily talk to her, sex is important in a marriage and she definitely does it for him, she is actually smart in her own way and she is fun to be around, she makes him laugh. There are probably more reasons but those seem like more than some people get married with.

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@sram. I agree. I just want to see more of the real world in this hermetic show.

They are adorable for making the attempt, regardless of the politics of class and gender.

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If he is honest I think he can easily defend his choice.  She is all the love that was denied him in life by his family, she is a little wild which he likes in his life, she makes him comfortable and he can easily talk to her, sex is important in a marriage and she definitely does it for him, she is actually smart in her own way and she is fun to be around, she makes him laugh. There are probably more reasons but those seem like more than some people get married with.

This is really to the point. Leonard hasn't had love in his life that one would expect from being raised in a nuclear family. Beverly's experiments and apparent inability to love denied him that. Penny is all the things missing from his life, and he will defend her easily. He's smart enough to understand why he loves her. While her looks certainly played a role initially, it was her open and physical affection for him. Hugs and kisses from early in the first season sealed that. She just likes and loves him for himself with no strings or agendas.

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Agree with both @SRAM and @hamerman55 about Leonard's love for Penny being an outcome of the affection she gave so readily even before they got together officially and how different it was to his family life. I also think it is important Leonard expresses his reasons for loving Penny. He may have said ILY more often than Penny but in seasons 4 and 6 we hear Penny's reasons for loving him a lot as we see and hear her go though the torment of her feelings but I don't really recall Leonard ever explaining his love, just that he does. Due to the cliched sitcom trope of nerd gets the hot chick, he is written talking about how lucky he is to have a beautiful woman and throughout the whole series he is always showing through his actions HOW MUCH he loves her ( Kurt, Car, multiple ILYs, career support) but it would be nice to hear him say WHY. And probably awkwardly funny as well.

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It's been a long time, but I remember he said why to Sheldon after the first time they broke up. He says something along the lines of finding a girl who was beautiful and sweet and funny and perfect, and everything you'd ever want in a woman, and then she'd come along and stomp on your heart with a pair of cleats. I do wish that Leonard would comment more on Penny's other attributes than being pretty, but I feel as if it's more the writers/show which has an overwhelming compulsion to point that out every chance they get.

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It's been a long time, but I remember he said why to Sheldon after the first time they broke up. He says something along the lines of finding a girl who was beautiful and sweet and funny and perfect, and everything you'd ever want in a woman, and then she'd come along and stomp on your heart with a pair of cleats. I do wish that Leonard would comment more on Penny's other attributes than being pretty, but I feel as if it's more the writers/show which has an overwhelming compulsion to point that out every chance they get.

Well, maybe now the elephant is out of the bag and the mouse is away, and they have some room to swing the lead around, instead of colouring with fat crayons with ham-fists, they can try depth. For at least an larger fraction of the 19 minutes. The conversation at, and after, Proton's decay was an indication that they can do more than just pratfalls and stick figures. But again, so many characters, so little time. We know Penny finally remembered how smart Leonard was, so perhaps sometime Leonard can be reminded of why he wants her, and not just make a list to prop her up spirits when she is low, as he had often before. Apropos of nothing would be nice.

But I'm inclined to think something East Texan will intrude.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
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I wouldn't mind the East Texan being out of the Lenny picture for awhile either.

 

The thing is, I think that Leonard feels all of these things for Penny - it's just not said. But come on, if Leonard was only interested in her for her looks, and not her heart and her personality, he would have been out the door a long time ago. It's clear how much he loves her.

 

The issue stems back to her, because she's always the one with the issues. It's something I see now in the Shamy relationship too and I realize why it's not the greatest way to write relationships. Leonard has always seemed 100% set on Penny, with no big issues about her, while she's always the one who throws up the complications. The same can be said where Amy adores Sheldon and so he's the one who always has to throw up the complications. It just makes it look like Sheldon and Penny are the ones who always are kicking and screaming to move forward, and it ends off playing as wondering what any of them see in each other. 

 

But they did a lot better fixing that with Leonard and Penny. Personally, I loved it when they had their "friend" date, or Sheldon let Penny know Leonard had his own issues with her, Bernadette and Amy calling Penny on never visiting Leonard at work and how it was not just Leonard's job to make her happy, or Leonard served up Penny his list of things for her to work on in the beta test. Penny being insulted was funny, but clearly she ended up getting the message that she was taking Leonard for granted and was not without fault. Those things were a massive step forward for the both of them, and good for the audience to see to get behind the relationship again. I only hope they see the need to do the same with Shamy as well, and to keep it up on the Lenny front.

 

But basically it's a dynamic that doesn't work. Obviously you can't have two people who meet, fall in love, and everything is perfect because...well...you have one episode of your show and then you're done, I guess. But I think you have to give issues in the relationship to each person in it equally, and have both working on them and working on the relationship issues together. Otherwise, it becomes lopsided and one person looks like they are settling when they are won over (finally) and the other looks like they are blind and perhaps deluded to continue to pursue.

Edited by Lionne
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One step in the right direction with Penny and Leonard is that twice she proposed, and he didn't say yes immediately. In the finally successful proposal, Penny had to work to convince him, and he would not be the guy she proposed to simply because he was a smart decision. She had to get worked up and make it clear he was what made her happy. Penny has been clear for a long time that Leonard makes her happy, and has told him so more than once. She loves him, and is happy in spite of the rest of her life not going to plan simply because he is her boyfriend, now fiancé.

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One step in the right direction with Penny and Leonard is that twice she proposed, and he didn't say yes immediately. In the finally successful proposal, Penny had to work to convince him, and he would not be the guy she proposed to simply because he was a smart decision. She had to get worked up and make it clear he was what made her happy. Penny has been clear for a long time that Leonard makes her happy, and has told him so more than once. She loves him, and is happy in spite of the rest of her life not going to plan simply because he is her boyfriend, now fiancé.

And as we saw in the episode, her greatest source of support!

Sent from my iPhone using

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This is really to the point. Leonard hasn't had love in his life that one would expect from being raised in a nuclear family. Beverly's experiments and apparent inability to love denied him that. Penny is all the things missing from his life, and he will defend her easily. He's smart enough to understand why he loves her. While her looks certainly played a role initially, it was her open and physical affection for him. Hugs and kisses from early in the first season sealed that. She just likes and loves him for himself with no strings or agendas.

 

Penny offers Leonard the love he did not have growing up, that much has always been clear. Hence why he's been so assiduous in how he's gone about things with Penny. He's learned and grown from the experience, which

we saw in the proposal. He will face other challenges with being engaged and married life (same for Penny). As for Penny ? Leonard offers her the stability she probably did not have growing up and he believes in her, which her family might not do i.e.

Penny saying she wasn't marrying Leonard because she was pregnant. In the end with all great loves, they have both bared their souls to each other and are deeply in love. But like most relationships it's had to

navigate it's way through various minefields to get to the point where they could get engaged. And the other side of Lenny ? They are best friends to boot. Even with the breakups they were always in and around each other amongst the group. Pining for each other in one way or another.

 

Thinking about it Sheldon will likely go to Leonard and Penny first, as they are his surrogate parents (looking at how they handle him) and he is the child genius that needs to grow up. You can't have Lenny without

Sheldon or Sheldon without Lenny. Those are the core characters in the show, which means Amy will at times be sidelined. I would hope that Lenny will get Sheldon to the point where he can

further progress his relationship with Amy and fly the nest so to speak. Penny is probably the biggest Shamy fan there is, and not because she wants to get rid of Sheldon. I genuinely think she wants Sheldon to be happy with himself and show his gentle side more often (Penny has managed to crack Sheldon's tough exterior a few times).

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I have been listening to Andrea Bocelli these past two weeks while in Italy and one song in particular "Vivo Per Lei:  " I Live For Her " it sums up Penny and Leonard, from their first meeting on ...

 

I live for her since you know when

The first time I met her

I don't know how but

She came into me and stayed

I live for her because

 She makes my soul quiver

I live for her without a thought 

 

I live for her too, you know

And do not be jealous

She belongs to all those

Who are in need

As a stereo in a room

Who is alone and now knows that 

This person is unique, and for this

I live for her

 

.....

There is more but you get the intent  .... I own none of the above  and a quick translation ....

 

you should listen to the Italian version ... it will make you cry ....

Edited by fixitmr
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I have been listening to Andrea Bocelli these past two weeks while in Italy and one song in particular "Vivo Per Lei:  " I Live For Her " it sums up Penny and Leonard, from their first meeting on ...

 

I live for her since you know when

The first time I met her

I don't know how but

She came into me and stayed

I live for her because

 She makes my soul quiver

I live for her without a thought 

 

I live for her too, you know

And do not be jealous

She belongs to all those

Who are in need

As a stereo in a room

Who is alone and now knows that 

This person is unique, and for this

I live for her

 

.....

There is more but you get the intent  .... I own none of the above  and a quick translation ....

 

you should listen to the Italian version ... it will make you cry ....

 

 

That does sound like Leonard and Penny.

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I agree DaisyJane, Lenny plays a bigger role in Sheldon's life than Amy, so he will come running to them.  Taperoo, definitely John Goodman would be perfect as Leonard's dad.  In real life, he and Johnny worked for a long time together in " Rosanne ".  I think it will be lots of funny seeing Penny preparing things for their wedding, involving Bernie and Amy, and possibly Emily if she is accepted by the girls.  The amazing thing now with Lenny engagement, is that now Lenny more than ever are the center of the gang; which is wonderful. I suspect that season 8 will show Lenny planning their life together.  For example things like finances, Penny's continuing going to school, family. I think Stuart could be a possibility for Amy if Sheldon does not grow up.  Sheldon will need to make some quick decisions, will he become an adult and accepts Amy romantically and emotionally, or will he be a become a lonely guy with just memories, too sad to even envision that.

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I agree DaisyJane, Lenny plays a bigger role in Sheldon's life than Amy, so he will come running to them. Taperoo, definitely John Goodman would be perfect as Leonard's dad. In real life, he and Johnny worked for a long time together in " Rosanne ". I think it will be lots of funny seeing Penny preparing things for their wedding, involving Bernie and Amy, and possibly Emily if she is accepted by the girls. The amazing thing now with Lenny engagement, is that now Lenny more than ever are the center of the gang; which is wonderful. I suspect that season 8 will show Lenny planning their life together. For example things like finances, Penny's continuing going to school, family. I think Stuart could be a possibility for Amy if Sheldon does not grow up. Sheldon will need to make some quick decisions, will he become an adult and accepts Amy romantically and emotionally, or will he be a become a lonely guy with just memories, too sad to even envision that.

I believe L/P have the potential to take up more of the screen time, as they used to do, with the others circulating around more, but Shamy is not going away as its either wildly or intensely popular. It might have to get some time in the wilderness but I'm sure they will be back. Its a cliff hanging episode coming, not an actual hanging.

I look forward to L/P sitting down to do their domestic budget at Leonard's insistence and Penny going through Leonard's bid with a red pen. "That much for collectible comic books a week? That's six pairs of shoes!".

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I was going to move the discussion of football to the thread in the Show forum, but I'm having trouble with that. Can we please discuss the football move in that thread in the show forum? As I said, I was going to move them (my post included) but for now, lets keep the football discussion in that thread, not this one).

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I agree DaisyJane, Lenny plays a bigger role in Sheldon's life than Amy, so he will come running to them.  [snip]

 

...except Leonard talking about living arrangements was part of what set him off and we know that he phones Amy.

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...except Leonard talking about living arrangements was part of what set him off and we know that he phones Amy.

Well, who else is he going to talk to? Howdette and Raj probably won't care, or will side with Lenny. Amy's the only one of the group who might have some sympathy for him, but not much. She wants to move in with Sheldon or Sheldon to move in with her. I think he went to Texas to see his mother (or his mee-ma) to find someone who'd take his side in this.

Edited by eirwinrommel
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...except Leonard talking about living arrangements was part of what set him off and we know that he phones Amy.

 

That's significant how? Mom and Dad are introducing changes so he phones the nanny, no surprise there. The fact that this would upset him so greatly is indicative of their profound importance to him, a significance Amy does not seem to share. 

Edited by DaisyJane
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Well, who else is he going to talk to? Howdette and Raj probably won't care, or will side with Lenny. Amy's the only one of the group who might have some sympathy for him, but not much. She wants to move in with Sheldon or Sheldon to move in with her. I think he went to Texas to see his mother (or his mee-ma) to find someone who'd take his side in this.

Why does no one believe me when I say he's gone to the Himalayas? *sigh*.

(meanwhile L/P are frolicking like spring lambs ...or something)

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Why does no one believe me when I say he's gone to the Himalayas? *sigh*.

(meanwhile L/P are frolicking like spring lambs ...or something)

 

because he is going to ride trains with Eric.

(well thats what i'd vote for)

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Well, who else is he going to talk to? Howdette and Raj probably won't care, or will side with Lenny. Amy's the only one of the group who might have some sympathy for him, but not much. She wants to move in with Sheldon or Sheldon to move in with her. I think he went to Texas to see his mother (or his mee-ma) to find someone who'd take his side in this.

The last thing Sheldon needs is having someone take his side in this. Not that his mother has ever taken his side in any battles anyways ( Piñata, Can Opener, Luminous Fish - she tends to be on Lenny's side).

He needs to be told he is wrong or he'll come back and try to upset Ma and Pa Lenny's wedding plans or give Amy the same grief as before.

Of course Ra's al Ghul in the Himalayas? That's a different story. Probably don't want that influence either. Things may not end well

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That's significant how? Mom and Dad are introducing changes so he phones the nanny, no surprise there. The fact that this would upset him so greatly is indicative of their profound importance to him, a significance Amy does not seem to share. 

 

If the writers are willing to let Leonard and Penny finally be engaged perhaps Sheldon can grow up. After all the engagement is a big break from TBBT homeostasis. Change is afoot (well we can hope).

The last thing Sheldon needs is having someone take his side in this. Not that his mother has ever taken his side in any battles anyways ( Piñata, Can Opener, Luminous Fish - she tends to be on Lenny's side).

He needs to be told he is wrong or he'll come back and try to upset Ma and Pa Lenny's wedding plans or give Amy the same grief as before.

Of course Ra's al Ghul in the Himalayas? That's a different story. Probably don't want that influence either. Things may not end well

Maybe good for comedy - not so good for life changing advice. Unless he drops a box on Sheldon's head at UPS and gives Sheldon minor brain damage, completing altering his personality.

 

If Sheldon were to ride the rails for the summer break I figure he could tire of it by the time s8e1 comes around. He would have a chance to miss Amy and do some growing up off camera. Eric would eventually tire out even Sheldon with repetition. Eric could be a metaphorical mirror that could lead Sheldon to desire changing himself (and through in some night time prodding by Prof Proton).

Edited by djsurrey
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(meanwhile L/P are frolicking like spring lambs ...or something)

Spring Rabbits?

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That's significant how? Mom and Dad are introducing changes so he phones the nanny, no surprise there. The fact that this would upset him so greatly is indicative of their profound importance to him, a significance Amy does not seem to share. 

 

Sheldon's been on the edge for a while now, Leonard was merely the twig that tripped him over the train shaped cliff edge.

As for Amy ? Penny asking him about him and Amy getting physical is all you need to know about Sheldon's feelings for Amy

i.e. Getting Physical with Amy = A possibility. Something he'd not have admitted seasons earlier. Moving in with Amy always

freaks him out, because he cares a lot more about her then he lets on. In fact he treats Amy in a similar way he treats Leonard or how he

did a few seasons ago. However the main focus will be on Penny and Leonard taking their relationship to the next step and

Sheldon not being ready for it. May take him a while to get his head wrapped around the idea. Amy will be on the back burner until the Lenny

change is dealt with by Sheldon. Which means a lot of kicking and screaming before he ultimately accepts it and gains a bit of maturity.

 

Spring Rabbits?

 

Swans ?

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Swans ?

The joke is that rabbits are portrayed as having a very active sex life.

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