Spoilers Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread

[3ku11]

And some wonder why I don't care for Sheldon that much.  This is the reason I don't buy into the 'Sheldon don't know any better' crap he selfish, condescending, he's a think he knows it all, and more.

 

Leonard wasn't trying to be condescending, he thought he was helping Penny feel better about what upset her.  If anything Penny overreacted and didn't try to understand why Leonard brought her the information.  Makes you wonder if Penny would have acted in the same matter if Sheldon gave her the same information.

 

eta:  Leonard only understood that he was wrong after Penny was over the top. 

I think it was more that Penny got the impression that Leonard could only date her if Penny was cleared smart enough or Penny asatained a certain level of degree or qualification lol. That wasen't Leonard's intentions but he should of been more clear about his intentions, Penny only reacted the way she did based on the information she was given, different information like Penny I think your really really smart and amazing, and as a fall back to the amazing acting career your sure to have, heres some waitress courses I think you could do... *door slammed* haha so same result really. And in regards to Sheldon I don't think he intentionally means to be condecending and patronising, it's just the way he is built, he is logical and analytical, he speaks his mind. Like in 3x02 Sheldon blurted that Penny may feel agrieved because of Leonard's dissapointing performance, Penny was so embarrased. Sheldon diddn't even realize what he did wrong, he is not as socially equip as the rest of the group. Like in 2x01 when Sheldon told Penny you may not be compatible in his Sheldonesque way, he diddn't mean to imply Leonard is too good for her, just Penny gave him the information, he processed and Sheldon delievared thats the way he is.

Edited September 3, 2013 by 3ku11

[eirwinrommel]

And some wonder why I don't care for Sheldon that much.  This is the reason I don't buy into the 'Sheldon don't know any better' crap he selfish, condescending, he's a think he knows it all, and more.

 

Leonard wasn't trying to be condescending, he thought he was helping Penny feel better about what upset her.  If anything Penny overreacted and didn't try to understand why Leonard brought her the information.  Makes you wonder if Penny would have acted in the same matter if Sheldon gave her the same information.

 

eta:  Leonard only understood what he did was wrong after Penny was over the top. 

Leonard probably should have talked to her, and tried to understand exactly what her Insecurity was, instead if just trying to 'fix her problem'.

[Zhalen565]

I was just was watching 'The Bad Fish Paradigm' and Sheldon is a real ass, what he told Penny was so wrong, about Leonard only being compatible with smart women. Sheldon is really just an evil leprechaun trying to keep Leonard and Penny apart.

So true, follow that with The jiminy Conjecture with the disappointing sex reveal, The Guitarist Amplification where he reveals Pennys faults that irritate Leonard. Follow that with the times he throws the others under the bus, The Apology Insufficency, The Egg Salad Equivalency and The Spoiler Segmenttion.

He does have a well used technique for supporting his own agenda, though let's not forget he did block Stuart in The Hofstadter Isotope.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Zhalen565

[ArmyGirl]

Leonard probably should have talked to her, and tried to understand exactly what her Insecurity was, instead if just trying to 'fix her problem'.

 

Leonard didn't even know Penny had the problem until Sheldon told him and you have to admit Penny wouldn't talk to him about it even if he tried talking to her.  And as I said he only got what he did wrong when Penny was over the top in her reaction to the information.

 

eta: Remember Leonard thought Penny had a problem with him 'aka the bad fish'.

Edited September 3, 2013 by ArmyGirl

[3ku11]

So true, follow that with The jiminy Conjecture with the disappointing sex reveal, The Guitarist Amplification where he reveals Pennys faults that irritate Leonard. Follow that with the times he throws the others under the bus, The Apology Insufficency, The Egg Salad Equivalency and The Spoiler Segmenttion.

He does have a well used technique for supporting his own agenda, though let's not forget he did block Stuart in The Hofstadter Isotope.

Yeah Stuart's an idiot lol, I don't think Penny was seriousley considering doing anything that night as it was a first date, but still even just for coffee. Remember he had an argument with Sheldon over Superman was it, Penny ended up falling asleep on the couch lol. It diddn't last though as Penny said Leonard's name while making out with Stuart haha poor Stuart, at least he still has his comic book store.

[ArmyGirl]

So true, follow that with The jiminy Conjecture with the disappointing sex reveal, The Guitarist Amplification where he reveals Pennys faults that irritate Leonard. Follow that with the times he throws the others under the bus, The Apology Insufficency, The Egg Salad Equivalency and The Spoiler Segmenttion.

He does have a well used technique for supporting his own agenda, though let's not forget he did block Stuart in The Hofstadter Isotope.

 

You have Sheldon's number too. 

Edited September 3, 2013 by ArmyGirl

[5Mississippis]

Off topic wonderings:

 

Was just perusing the taping dates for Season Seven and I see we have one coming up this Wednesday, September 4. Were there any 'sides' put out there from which we can extrapolate the potential story idea? 

 

Another question that has been bugging me -- has the show been renewed past Season Seven? Have we heard anything about that yet? 

 

Just want to add that as I read through these topics and everyones responses, I am truly humbled by the level of intelligence and critical thinking displayed by members of our little group. It truly is stunning the way a topic is dissected, thought out, and presented in such a logical persuasive way that I feel like a drooling banana slug in comparison. Just wanted to take a moment to let you all know how truly amazing you are.  

[Zhalen565]

Yeah Stuart's an idiot lol, I don't think Penny was seriousley considering doing anything that night as it was a first date, but still even just for coffee. Remember he had an argument with Sheldon over Superman was it, Penny ended up falling asleep on the couch lol. It diddn't last though as Penny said Leonard's name while making out with Stuart haha poor Stuart, at least he still has his comic book store.

To quote Phil the minion, Whatttt! Penny "you think coffee, really means coffee"

[3ku11]

Off topic wonderings:

 

Was just perusing the taping dates for Season Seven and I see we have one coming up this Wednesday, September 4. Were there any 'sides' put out there from which we can extrapolate the potential story idea? 

 

Another question that has been bugging me -- has the show been renewed past Season Seven? Have we heard anything about that yet? 

 

Just want to add that as I read through these topics and everyones responses, I am truly humbled by the level of intelligence and critical thinking displayed by members of our little group. It truly is stunning the way a topic is dissected, thought out, and presented in such a logical persuasive way that I feel like a drooling banana slug in comparison. Just wanted to take a moment to let you all know how truly amazing you are.  

I get most of my matarial from how smart the show is The show makes us look good lol. And in regards to renewal haven't heard anything, but I see no reason why their woulden't be a renewal for Season 8, it is the most watched comedy on the planet presently, and if BBT wins the Emmy which would be long over due, then it is pretty much guarrented. It makes alot of ad revenue too, and it dominated the key 18-49 demographic demo, beat out MF and HIMYM this season.

Edited September 3, 2013 by 3ku11

[eirwinrommel]

Off topic wonderings:

 

Was just perusing the taping dates for Season Seven and I see we have one coming up this Wednesday, September 4. Were there any 'sides' put out there from which we can extrapolate the potential story idea? 

 

Another question that has been bugging me -- has the show been renewed past Season Seven? Have we heard anything about that yet? 

 

Just want to add that as I read through these topics and everyones responses, I am truly humbled by the level of intelligence and critical thinking displayed by members of our little group. It truly is stunning the way a topic is dissected, thought out, and presented in such a logical persuasive way that I feel like a drooling banana slug in comparison. Just wanted to take a moment to let you all know how truly amazing you are.  

No sides or hints for this week. I understand that they will be taping on two days, tomorrow and Wednesday, with audience at the Wednesday taping. As for being renewed I haven't heard.

[ArmyGirl]

To quote Phil the minion, Whatttt! Penny "you think coffee, really means coffee"

 

Here is the clip of the scene...

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_1zoX5Ax9U

Edited September 3, 2013 by ArmyGirl

[Nogravitasatall]

Just want to add that as I read through these topics and everyones responses, I am truly humbled by the level of intelligence and critical thinking displayed by members of our little group. It truly is stunning the way a topic is dissected, thought out, and presented in such a logical persuasive way that I feel like a drooling banana slug in comparison. Just wanted to take a moment to let you all know how truly amazing you are.

Challenge accepted!

I truly thought banana slug was a euphemism, and I had to look it up. You are much better off being one of those than one of that which I imagined. So not so smart now a group now, huh. Only so far today.

and exits....

forgot ... yes they are a clever bunch. I feel (and look) much smarter when I hang out here and say nothing. LOL.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Nogravitasatall

[Tensor]

It makes alot of ad revenue too, and it dominated the key 18-49 demographic demo, beat out MF and HIMYM this season.

It beat out everything(everything,including all hour dramas also) except Sunday night football (and The walking Dead, in the Live + 7). It's ad rate last year was $276,000 for a 30 second spot. There were six shows that had a higher ad rate. Speaking of entertainment only shows (meaning no Sunday night football) it was the only show to have over a 6.0 demo rating. It was over a full point higher than any other show. It was the only show in the top five( and it was in the top 2) of both viewers and demo (2 viewers, 1 demo). It is probably looking at from 350,000 to 400.000 per 30 second spot this year, meaning it will bring in between 238 and 300 million for 31 broadcasts (24 new, 7 repeats in the time slot, and 7-10 outside of time slot repeats). For a more thorough discussion, see

[Chiara]

"Let's face it : Leonard and Penny are equally messed up, just in different ways. That is why they fit; they are both adorably deranged and dysfunctional."  I would like to point out that they have both improved and grown since meeting each other.  All you need to do is watch a rerun of the first season and compare them then to the way they are now.  They are good for each other.

Oh, there is no doubt that they have greatly improved while remaining faithful to their core characters. Leonard will always be on the mushy side and Penny will forever display signs of her "eww, get those feelings off me!" tendency. A good thing it is too : were they both as sentimental as Leonard, they would waste their lives gazing in each other's eyes and if they both adopted Penny's attitude, they would communicate through the medium of grunts. 

 

No, I think the problem is we don't have any new episodes to re-hash, and no spoilers for this weeks taping. Once we have actual episodes we'll be able to obsess over them instead.

That is definitely a factor too. However, it is interesting to see that the minute we no longer have anything new to contemplate, we immediately go "Hey guys, remember that time we were really miserable ? What if we reenacted it ?".

Let us be honest, eirwinrommel, our happy muscles are so out of use they might as well be vestigial. 

 

I was just was watching 'The Bad Fish Paradigm' and Sheldon is a real ass, what he told Penny was so wrong, about Leonard only being compatible with smart women. Sheldon is really just an evil leprechaun trying to keep Leonard and Penny apart.

An "evil leprechaun" ? First things first, that made me laugh. 

 

Secondly, I agree with you on the leprechaun front. Sheldon does have a "pot of gold" guarded by snakes. So he clearly qualifies. Nevertheless, "evil" might be a bit tough. Sheldon is a purely utilitarian creature in that what comes naturally to him is to do whatever is needed to maximise his own comfort (and conversely, minimise his discomfort). Therefore, when his own interests clash with those of his friends, he can be ruthless. But he can also show tremendous generosity/kindness every time helping his entourage out does not involve sacrificing himself. 

 

The only thing he values more than himself is logic and that is his weakness : people can make him do stuff he has no pleasure/interest in doing if they can prove it is the sensible course of action. Like when Penny "forced" him to sing Soft Kitty to her because injured and drugged is "a kind of sick".

Logic > Sheldon Cooper > his friends > the rest of humankind. That is Sheldon's worldview and he sticks to it.  

 

Leonard wasn't trying to be condescending, he thought he was helping Penny feel better about what upset her.  If anything Penny overreacted and didn't try to understand why Leonard brought her the information.  Makes you wonder if Penny would have acted in the same matter if Sheldon gave her the same information.

It is clear that he was not trying to be condescending. Nonetheless, it is also clear that this is how Penny understood it. While Leonard meant to help her overcome her inferiority complex by suggesting a solution, what she got from his little presentation was "Yes Penny, you are right to feel dumb. But do not fear for the solution to your stupidity problem exists. Rejoice ! After a couple of courses from the local community college, you shall be able to date me without feeling like a complete nincompoop !". 

 

Leonard's intentions were very good but we all know that little saying about Hell... He tried his best but failed to communicate his meaning in a clear enough way. Penny felt insulted and reacted accordingly. 

As for her hypothetical reaction to Sheldon advising her in the same fashion as Leonard, I believe your implication is correct : she would not have been as hurt by it. However, I doubt one should read too much into that. Sheldon thinks everybody is stupid; he hardly singles out Penny in that regard. So she probably would have welcomed his plan with a philosophical shrug. 

 

It truly is stunning the way a topic is dissected, thought out, and presented in such a logical persuasive way that I feel like a drooling banana slug in comparison. 

Go UCSC !

Edited September 3, 2013 by Chiara

[3ku11]

Oh, there is no doubt that they have greatly improved while remaining faithful to their core characters. Leonard will always be on the mushy side and Penny will forever display signs of her "eww, get those feelings off me!" tendency. A good thing it is too : were they both as sentimental as Leonard, they would waste their lives gazing in each other's eyes and if they both adopted Penny's attitude, they would communicate through the medium of grunts. 

 

That is definitely a factor too. However, it is interesting to see that the minute we no longer have anything new to contemplate, we immediately go "Hey guys, remember that time we were really miserable ? What if we reenacted it ?".

Let us be honest, eirwinrommel, our happy muscles are so out of use they might as well be vestigial. 

 

An "evil leprechaun" ? First things first, that made me laugh. 

 

Secondly, I agree with you on the leprechaun front. Sheldon does have a "pot of gold" guarded by snakes. So he clearly qualifies. Nevertheless, "evil" might be a bit tough. Sheldon is a purely utilitarian creature in that what comes naturally to him is to do whatever is needed to maximise his own comfort (and conversely, minimise his discomfort). Therefore, when his own interests clash with those of his friends, he can be ruthless. But he can also show tremendous generosity/kindness every time helping his entourage out does not involve sacrificing himself. 

 

The only thing he values more than himself is logic and that is his weakness : people can make him do stuff he has no pleasure/interest in doing if they can prove it is the sensible course of action. Like when Penny "forced" him to sing Soft Kitty to her because injured and drugged in "a kind of sick".

Logic > Sheldon Cooper > his friends > the rest of humankind. That is Sheldon's worldview and he sticks to it.  

 

It is clear that he was not trying to be condescending. Nonetheless, it is also clear that this is how Penny understood it. While Leonard meant to help her overcome her inferiority complex by suggesting a solution, what she got from his little presentation was "Yes Penny, you are right to feel dumb. But do not fear for the solution to your stupidity problem exists. Rejoice ! After a couple of courses from the local community college, you shall be able to date me without feeling like a complete nincompoop !". 

 

Leonard's intentions were very good but we all know that little saying about Hell... He tried his best but failed to communicate his meaning in a clear enough way. Penny felt insulted and reacted accordingly. 

As for her hypothetical reaction to Sheldon adivising her in the same fashion as Leonard, I believe your implication is correct : she would not have been as hurt by it. However, I doubt one should read too much into that. Sheldon thinks everybody is stupid; he hardly singles out Penny in that regard. So she probably would have welcomed his plan with a philosophical shrug. 

 

Go UCSC !

Penny values Leonard's opinion, where as Sheldon is like her big eccentric brother, Sheldon has never valued anything Penny does as important. He has always devalued her education, knowledge, her acting career e.t.c. So she may go Okay I well keep it under consideration, throws it in the bin lol, besides why would Sheldon care enough to get Penny into college, it doesen't affect him in anyway but it does affect Leonard deeply.

[fixitmr]

Sheldon's statement is only important in this discussion insomuch as it is based on concrete observations he has made while Penny has been living across the hall. While Sheldon may not know much about romance or relationships he does know about observing things. As for Penny's romantic history, no it doesn't really matter all that much.

He may know about observing things , BUT he made a MISTAKE in his assumption about her ... she was living with a man for 4 years, and her high school relations ships  would only be 4 or 5, and the few men that Sheldon saw  NO were near 30 maybe 15 ..... NO way is this a BELL CURVE .....

[terriblewaitress]

Anyone watched the Johnny & Kaley interview about Leonard & Penny (it's on YouTube now, yay!) - I think they're the biggest Lenny lovers out there... we're not alone in wanting to give them an amazing Season 7!  

[Chiara]

Anyone watched the Johnny & Kaley interview about Leonard & Penny (it's on YouTube now, yay!) - I think they're the biggest Lenny lovers out there... we're not alone in wanting to give them an amazing Season 7!

Refering to this ? Yep, it is pretty awesome ! These two know their characters and want what is best for them.

[Nogravitasatall]

Squee. I think is the technical term. I have to go check my mascara now. So adorable.

[eirwinrommel]

That was good. It looks appears that the two actors really like each other.

Squee. I think is the technical term. I have to go check my mascara now. So adorable.

Something you want to reveal about yourself?

Edited September 3, 2013 by eirwinrommel

[Nogravitasatall]

That was good. It looks appears that the two actors really like each other.

Something you want to reveal about yourself?

I'm being affirming and positive. And yes, thanks for asking, I now have a dirt bike in my garage. Yay, me! LOL. Edited September 3, 2013 by Nogravitasatall

[rickfromillinois]

He may know about observing things , BUT he made a MISTAKE in his assumption about her ... she was living with a man for 4 years, and her high school relations ships  would only be 4 or 5, and the few men that Sheldon saw  NO were near 30 maybe 15 ..... NO way is this a BELL CURVE .....

Once again, watch the expressions on her face when he says how many guys he believed she slept with.  HE WAS RIGHT.   You can argue about his math, his methods, or anthing else.  Her facial expressions clearly indicate that no matter how he came up with the number, it was correct.

[terriblewaitress]

Once again, watch the expressions on her face when he says how many guys he believed she slept with.  HE WAS RIGHT.   You can argue about his math, his methods, or anthing else.  Her facial expressions clearly indicate that no matter how he came up with the number, it was correct.

 

Why are we back to this? You don't know the number is right. Her facial expression could 'clearly indicate' a number of things. If you want Sheldon's calculation to be correct, go for it. But that doesn't mean it's the only correct interpretation. You aren't Penny's vagina so how do you know what number is correct? 

 

Anyway... 

 

I cried a bit at that interview. Yeah. I don't care. It was just adorable and cute and sfjgeritu I love them! Plus Johnny's shirt a bit unbuttoned at the top there, hoo! (And his eyebrows.)

[rickfromillinois]

Why are we back to this? You don't know the number is right. Her facial expression could 'clearly indicate' a number of things. If you want Sheldon's calculation to be correct, go for it. But that doesn't mean it's the only correct interpretation. You aren't Penny's vagina so how do you know what number is correct? 

 

Anyway... 

 

I cried a bit at that interview. Yeah. I don't care. It was just adorable and cute and sfjgeritu I love them! Plus Johnny's shirt a bit unbuttoned at the top there, hoo! (And his eyebrows.)

If you don't like the conversation don't participate in it and start your own.   If people are interested they will respond.....  This is a fictional show.   Penny is a fictional character portrayed by an actress who is trained to give information by words, movements, and FACIAL EXPRESSIONS.  She does a very good job clearly showing that SHELDON WAS RIGHT about the number of men.  In another episode Penny told Berny and Amy that they would have to go a long way to find a bar without a man in it who had seen her naked.  That would seem to reinforce Sheldon's claim.

Edited September 3, 2013 by rickfromillinois

[Nogravitasatall]

If you don't like the conversation don't participate in it and start your own. If people are interested they will respond..... This is a fictional show. Penny is a fictional character portrayed by an actress who is trained to give information by words, movements, and FACIAL EXPRESSIONS. She does a very good job clearly showing that SHELDON WAS RIGHT about the number of men.

For the sake of argument, say that she was as enthusiastic as you would like to think. What does that signify? Nothing, now. At a physical level, nothing, at an emotional level, nothing. They are both aware of their natures and they carry little baggage about this part of their history. I'm at a loss to see how it impinges on their motivations and actions going forwards. I'm not starry-eyed about this either. If they disregard it, why should it come up, particularly as going down a path where this could have consequences would not be in keeping with the tone of the relationship we have seen now established.

I really think this is a dead end.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Nogravitasatall