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Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread


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Not only that, but watch Penny as she sits with Amy in the guys apartment during dinner that night.  She is visibly upset.   And while Amy mentions how she was sorry for her earlier cattiness towards Priya,  Amy knew Penny was upset and why.

I think she was more than upset  .... if looks could kill ... even though she kept her coooollll

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Regardless of other factors, people's opinions and influences e.t.c Amy, Pria, and Sheldon. At the end of the day they choose by themselfs to be together. Imo no one impacted Leonard and Penny's decision to get back together, Amy is the one who revealed that Penny broke up with Leonard, not because she didd'nt have deep feelings for Leonard, but at that point was not ready for a serious commitment. When they broke up at that time it was for the best, Penny had to do what was right for her, and Leonard had to grow a bit to get to the point where they are now in their relationship, both almost equals now. That was Amy's role in Lenny, my point was Leonard was still the one in the 100th ep to not awkwardly ask Penny out, or try to justify why he is asking Penny out, but actually be straight with Penny for once. And since then Leonard and Penny have worked this time because 1. Penny is not hulking out and pushing Leonard away when issues come around and 2. Leonard is not pushing or resisting, he is now challenging Penny alot more, and because of this Penny is compromising more, and learning to trust Leonard alot more and theirs alot more honesty between them now. It's alot more stable now, they are working on their relationship now. And ever since Leonard received the ILY, it has given him that sense of security with Penny that he has never had in the past with, and I think with Pryia and more recently Alex, Penny was revealed to have insecurities even she diddn't realize she had. So she basically pushed Leonard away in the past because she was scared of loosing him, and she had intimacy issues. The ep to me which showed that Penny is compromising alot more, and putting Leonard first is the spoiler alert ep, Leonard wanted to move in, even though she freaked out haha, she was willing to compromise her intimacy issues to make Leonard happy. And the car scene in S6 finalie I thought the ILY was more important, because this time it was delieberate, and it was more intimate.

I agree with almost everything you said. But I don't think it was by accident Leonard asked Penny out in the 100th episode in front of Amy and Bernadette. A/B's reaction to it was certainly favorable.

Edited by Chrismo
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It is interesting that the girls formed a separate group, as it satisfies the Bechdel test. Usually girl groups in an ensemble sitcom mainly reinforce the various relationships. Here, the girls have each other's back first.

I have to say the writers deserve some kuddos for that. They have managed to create, in a male-oriented show (initial ratio : four boys, one girl), a special space for the female characters to interact believably and independently from their male counterparts. 

While they do spend a lot of time talking about their men, though not more than said men spend talking about them, they have their own activities : going to clubs, dressing up as Disney princesses, painting portraits of one another, playing drunken Twister... They are busy ladies !

 

I agree with Bernie, I think Amy would be better off with someone else, but I'm not a writer for the show.

The heart wants what the heart wants... But I am not the right person to talk about stable, fulfilling relationships; I am the person who did not mind her neck turning green because of some dodgy jewelry. ;)

 

The writers are in a fix, I believe, with regard to the Shamy. They've amped up Amy's sexuality, and made her more like the girls than like Sheldon. She was quite the distaff counterpart early on. In many ways, she is like Leonard, who puts up with Sheldon for no obvious reason. Sheldon is clearly miserable without Amy, yet is so poorly suited to have a relationship with a girl.

It is a classic case of upstairs/downstairs in a way. Even in Shakespearean plays, especially his romantic comedies, there are often instances in which the same story, roughly speaking, is told twice simultaneously, with different pairs of characters : Hero/Claudio and Benedick/Beatrice in Much Ado About Nothing; Bianca/Lucentio and Katherina/Petrucchio in The Taming of The Shrew, etc. One version of the story is played kind of "seriously"; the other one is more "for laughs". 

Amy "is" Leonard : emotional, vulnerable, forgiving, devoted; Sheldon "is" Penny : aloof, immature, tough-talking, clueless in the ways of normal romance. The writers will see it through; it will just take a while.

 

On a side note, is it just me or is there some sort of trend in TBBT couples in re. eyesight ?  It seems there might be an unofficial rule of thumb on the show about this kind of things : characters without glasses can only be in relationships with their bespectacled couterparts. Leonard and Penny, Amy and Sheldon, Bernadette and Howard... 

Furthermore, it appears that the poorly sighted ones are always the "responsible" ones in their couples; they tend to lead the charge and cajole their S.O.s into deeper and more mature forms of commitment. It is almost comical in a way : a case of the literally (somewhat) "blind" leading the figuratively (romantically) "blind"

That makes me worried for Lucy's future on the show. Unless we find out she wears contact lenses, the girl has no chance in hell to come back as Raj's romantic interest. What he needs is a severely myopic woman and he will be good to go. . 

Edited by Chiara
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On a side note, is it just me or is there some sort of trend in TBBT couples in re. eyesight ?  It seems there might be an unofficial rule of thumb on the show about this kind of things : characters without glasses can only be in relationships with their bespectacled couterparts. Leonard and Penny, Amy and Sheldon, Bernadette and Howard... 

Furthermore, it appears that the poorly sighted ones are always the "responsible" ones in their couples; they tend to lead the charge and cajole their S.O.s into deeper and more mature forms of commitment. It is almost comical in a way : a case of the literally (somewhat) "blind" leading the figuratively (romantically) "blind"

That makes me worried for Lucy's future on the show. Unless we find out she wears contact lenses, the girl has no chance in hell to come back as Raj's romantic interest. What he needs is a severely myopic woman and he will be good to go. . 

Interesting observation. Perhaps it has to do with vision generally deteriorating with age. Older = (supposedly) wiser, theredore glasses imply greater wisdom or maturity.

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It is a classic case of upstairs/downstairs in a way. Even in Shakespearean plays, especially his romantic comedies, there are often instances in which the same story, roughly speaking, is told twice simultaneously, with different pairs of characters : Hero/Claudio and Benedick/Beatrice in Much Ado About Nothing; Bianca/Lucentio and Katherina/Petrucchio in The Taming of The Shrew, etc. One version of the story is played kind of "seriously"; the other one is more "for laughs". 

Amy "is" Leonard : emotional, vulnerable, forgiving, devoted; Sheldon "is" Penny : aloof, immature, tough-talking, clueless in the ways of normal romance. The writers will see it through; it will just take a while.

 

 

Chiara: have yu had some kind of literary training , or studied literature in depth? I as you because you always have insight as far as being able to analyze the show and who the hero , the villain, the hero's object of desire is, and what the "roles" of each are, not to mention that interesting Shakespeare comparison...

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Interesting observation. Perhaps it has to do with vision generally deteriorating with age. Older = (supposedly) wiser, theredore glasses imply greater wisdom or maturity.

Or perhaps the assumption is that those with glasses read more, and thus have gained wisdom. Bernie just earned her Phd. so she's probably in her mid 20's. In fact everyone except Bernie and Penny are in their 30's. There are a whole slew of tropes used by the show.

 

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheBigBangTheory

Edited by eirwinrommel
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Or perhaps the assumption is that those with glasses read more, and thus have gained wisdom. Bernie just earned her Phd. so she's probably in her mid 20's. In fact everyone except Bernie and Penny are in their 30's

Of course, I wasn't refering to the character's ages, but a specific logic chain: age=wisdom, glasses=age, wisdom=glasses

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I think she was more than upset  .... if looks could kill ... even though she kept her coooollll

I think she was more upset about a female being intergrated so soon into their social group. I mean she had been the Queen Bee for so long, then a another women comes along who posseses qualities she just doesen't have. And Priya was getting all the attention, kinda similar when that Alicia chick moved in, obviousley worser because Priya is now Leonard's GF. I think she felt excluded and left out. I mean she never broke up Leonard because she wasen't into him, more because she had alot of growing up to as Leonard did too, she had serious intimacy issues and insecurities, she had to work through. I never agree when people go on about how horrible Penny was when she broke up with Leonard, horrible? Did you not see her bursting into tears and running off, it is not something that was pre-meditated or pre-determined. Will kinda monopolized the situation just to win a bowling competition, since then I have hated him haha, but possibily just delayed the inevitable. Penny did the right thing at that place in their relationship, Penny was not ready for a serious commitment, and Leonard needed more self assurance and validation, which he got from his relationship with Priya. I also think thanks to his mother he is always seeking the approval of women, Leonard is learning just to let things be now, I remember in S3 everytime he had sex with Penny, he would thank Penny, in a weird way that correlates directly to his maternal issues with his mother. The same way Penny would date loser guys, because of the type of relationship she had with her father. So although Leonard and Penny on the surface are from two completely different worlds, and pretty much have nothing in common, that is what make's their relationship work, their differences compliment each other. And their relationship identities are very very similar and have alot in common in that. I don't think Leonard and Penny well ever finally realize what is staring in their face till maybe the end. Leonard the nerd who see's Penny as a Queen, and Penny the Queen who does not see herself as a Queen due to her insecurities. But yeah Penny was clearly upset about the breakup, Penny just have problems with articulating her emotions, although like I said she was clearly upset when they broke up, but at the end of the day it was for the best, she broke up with Leonard at that point, because she diddn't want the possibility of hurting Leonard even more along the way, and Leonard needed to grow a bit. 

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I  have been watching season 4 x 18 , this is were Priya asks Leonard to stop seeing Penny. I can see that Leonard STILL loves Penny even though he is dating Priya and says he LOVES Priya .... what a crock .... 

 

S4 x 19 .... Who does Leonard call for help when stranded with the guys on their quest to get Sheldon's stuff back .... PENNY ....

 

Penny has more courage than the boys ...  Amy's right I do wanna fling my poop at her ....

 

 

Just LOVE Penny  LOVE IT LOVE IT ...

Edited by fixitmr
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I  have been watching season 4 x 18 , this is were Priya asks Leonard to stop seeing Penny. I can see that Leonard STILL loves Penny even though he is dating Priya and says he LOVES Priya .... what a crock .... 

 

S4 x 19 .... Who does Leonard call for help when stranded with the guys on their quest to get Sheldon's stuff back .... PENNY ....

 

Penny has more courage than the boys ...  Amy's right I do wanna fling my poop at her ....

 

 

Just LOVE Penny  LOVE IT LOVE IT ...

Yeah I agree but I don't think Leonard ever professed his love for Priya in front of her, he may of dropped it in conversations just a part of his self validation in a way. That was the difference really Penny loves Leonard for who he is completley, the nerd guy, the socialy awkward guy e.t.c. Remember that ep 4x19 Priya said "Who woulden't want to date a boy trapped in a mans body". Where as Penny gets the nerd side of Leonard, and it is part of his charm and one of the reason's she fell for him in the first place. That is why Leonard called Penny, other then the fact his current GF just basically shunned him in front of his friends, but he knows Penny gets what they are doing, and is from nebraska and they don't take crap from nobody lol. As much as I despised Priya at times, she was nice to most of Leonard's friends, and in 4x23 her and Penny seemed to get on, with their mutual sharing of Leonard's shortcomings. But overall Priya just showed her true colors to many times, to really warm to her. But I do agree she was the catalyst for change in the show, and a big part of Leonard and Penny getting back together.

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Yeah I agree but I don't think Leonard ever professed his love for Priya in front of her, he may of dropped it in conversations just a part of his self validation in a way. That was the difference really Penny loves Leonard for who he is completley, the nerd guy, the socialy awkward guy e.t.c. Remember that ep 4x19 Priya said "Who woulden't want to date a boy trapped in a mans body". Where as Penny gets the nerd side of Leonard, and it is part of his charm and one of the reason's she fell for him in the first place. That is why Leonard called Penny, other then the fact his current GF just basically shunned him in front of his friends, but he knows Penny gets what they are doing, and is from nebraska and they don't take crap from nobody lol. As much as I despised Priya at times, she was nice to most of Leonard's friends, and in 4x23 her and Penny seemed to get on, with their mutual sharing of Leonard's shortcomings. But overall Priya just showed her true colors to many times, to really warm to her. But I do agree she was the catalyst for change in the show, and a big part of Leonard and Penny getting back together.

Leonard was never in love with Pryia.  I think that he was simply trying to convince himself of this because he did not want to be alone.  As for Pryia, by her actions and comments , like being afraid to tell her parents shows that she never really cared that deeply for Leonard or the relationship.  Leonard was simply a fun way to rebel against her parents while in the U.S.  but she would have never risked being disowned by her parents for Leonard. 

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Heads up.....

 

S06E08 The 43 Peculiarity is being repeated on Monday Night at 9:30 est/8:30 cst just before Under the Dome.

Just finished watching the episode (It ended up starting 9PM cst because of the tennis) Found it fascinating even not that long ago how insecure Leonard was in regards to Penny. Makes me believe even more that Alex had more of a benefit to his confidence than Priya ever did.

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I think she was more upset about a female being intergrated so soon into their social group. I mean she had been the Queen Bee for so long, then a another women comes along who posseses qualities she just doesen't have. And Priya was getting all the attention, kinda similar when that Alicia chick moved in, obviousley worser because Priya is now Leonard's GF. I think she felt excluded and left out. I mean she never broke up Leonard because she wasen't into him, more because she had alot of growing up to as Leonard did too, she had serious intimacy issues and insecurities, she had to work through. I never agree when people go on about how horrible Penny was when she broke up with Leonard, horrible? Did you not see her bursting into tears and running off, it is not something that was pre-meditated or pre-determined. Will kinda monopolized the situation just to win a bowling competition, since then I have hated him haha, but possibily just delayed the inevitable. Penny did the right thing at that place in their relationship, Penny was not ready for a serious commitment, and Leonard needed more self assurance and validation, which he got from his relationship with Priya. I also think thanks to his mother he is always seeking the approval of women, Leonard is learning just to let things be now, I remember in S3 everytime he had sex with Penny, he would thank Penny, in a weird way that correlates directly to his maternal issues with his mother. The same way Penny would date loser guys, because of the type of relationship she had with her father. So although Leonard and Penny on the surface are from two completely different worlds, and pretty much have nothing in common, that is what make's their relationship work, their differences compliment each other. And their relationship identities are very very similar and have alot in common in that. I don't think Leonard and Penny well ever finally realize what is staring in their face till maybe the end. Leonard the nerd who see's Penny as a Queen, and Penny the Queen who does not see herself as a Queen due to her insecurities. But yeah Penny was clearly upset about the breakup, Penny just have problems with articulating her emotions, although like I said she was clearly upset when they broke up, but at the end of the day it was for the best, she broke up with Leonard at that point, because she diddn't want the possibility of hurting Leonard even more along the way, and Leonard needed to grow a bit. 

Yes this is very true ..... and since then they have grown to the point where they can start to trust each other. Penny will always be Leonard's Queen ....

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Just finished watching the episode (It ended up starting 9PM cst because of the tennis) Found it fascinating even not that long ago how insecure Leonard was in regards to Penny. Makes me believe even more that Alex had more of a benefit to his confidence than Priya ever did.

 

And I believe that Alex gave Penny a much needed wakeup call that she needed to stop taking Leonard for grant and that there were women who would love to be with him (Leonard).

 

To be honest Alex was good for both Leonard and Penny!

Edited by ArmyGirl
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I wonder whether Penny's wakeup call was Alex's attraction to Leonard or Leonard's reaction to it.

 

Objectively, Penny is bound to know that her man is a sexy little devil the ladies find appealing; over the years, she has seen him become the object of Stephanie's obsession, have an on-and-off relationship with Leslie and date Pryia. Heavens, she even knows that a senior citizen paid for Leonard's services ! She cannot possibly believe that her man is so unpleasant no other woman could ever hit on him.  

 

In my opinion, what truly blew her mind and made her doubt was Sheldon's account of his roomate's reaction. The idea that Leonard might show such pleasure at being hit on by somebody else or be even remotely tempted to stray was an electroshock for her for, in Penny's mind, Leonard is so not "that kind of guy" (The Prestidigitation Approximation) or "one of those guys" (The Good Guy Fluctuation)

 

I think her actions and feelings in The Egg Salad Equivalency are a continuation of her frustration in The 43 Peculiarity.

Penny knows people get hit on all the time. She knows it better than most, in fact : Leonard pointed out it happens to her quite a lot (The 43 Peculiarity). But she also knows it is all irrelevant as long as the recipient of the attention does not react to it which is why she was so mad at her boyfriend's obsession with other guys' hypothetical attempts at seduction : since she has no intention to respond favourably to any of her suitors, she did not see why Leonard felt so strongly about it ("Leonard why do you always do this ? Listen, you're the one I'm with, you know I love you so will you please relax because you're driving me crazy !").

In The Egg Salad Equivalency, she was led to assume that Leonard was extremely happy with Alex's seduction and that was what made her doubt his feelings for her : "I don't care about Alex... Fine I care... OK I hate that bitch ! But what really hurt is that you liked it so much. Do I need to be worried ?" Now, we the audience knew she had no reason to worry. Leonard was merely (a bit too) flattered; at no point did he give even the slightest hint that he might engage with Alex in a romantic fashion. But Penny did not know that and reacted to the possibility of her man leaving her for another woman, or even cheating on her with said woman.

 

These two episodes combined were about the characters admitting there is nobody else for them but each other. They do not want anybody else, not even people who might, on paper, appear to be better matches for them. Penny wants Leonard, Leonard wants Penny, Ernie wants his rubber duckie, etc. Why ? Well, they all do make bathtime lots of fun but that cannot be the only reason. So why ? Do they even know ? Probably not. But they do not care too much.  

Coulden't of said it better myself, Season 6 was Lenny. The writers have done an amazing job in terms of Penny compromising a ton more in their relationship but still maintaining her independence, the reason for this is Penny's revealed insecurities, as Penny may see to be perfect on the outside, on the inside she has inadequacies like anyone else. The point is like you said, Penny could be with any other guy right now other then Leonard, and Leonard could be someone he on paper would have more in common with, but they choose each other and that what make's their relationship so appealing.

Edited by 3ku11
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Just finished watching the episode (It ended up starting 9PM cst because of the tennis) Found it fascinating even not that long ago how insecure Leonard was in regards to Penny. Makes me believe even more that Alex had more of a benefit to his confidence than Priya ever did.

Yes after watching it again, I really am surprised on much Alex is hitting on him and Leonard doesn't get it. It makes so much sense now, that she asked him on a date because she realized her hints were not getting through to him, so she had to take it a step farther.

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I also thought it was funny that Leonard was so worried about Cole in Penny's apartment  that he kept looking out his peep hole and tailed him down the stairs.Then in Egg Salad Alex asked Leonard out to dinner in his own apartment.


Coulden't of said it better myself, Season 6 was Lenny. The writers have done an amazing job in terms of Penny compromising a ton more in their relationship but still maintaining her independence, the reason for this is Penny's revealed insecurities, as Penny may see to be perfect on the outside, on the inside she has inadequacies like anyone else. The point is like you said, Penny could be with any other guy right now other then Leonard, and Leonard could be someone he on paper would have more in common with, but they choose each other and that what make's their relationship so appealing.

Amy and Bernadette knew Penny's insecurities but it was important that Leonard found out. He couldn't stop smiling when he found out that Penny was so insecure about Alex.

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I wonder whether Penny's wakeup call was Alex's attraction to Leonard or Leonard's reaction to it.

 

Objectively, Penny is bound to know that her man is a sexy little devil the ladies find appealing; over the years, she has seen him become the object of Stephanie's obsession, have an on-and-off relationship with Leslie and date Pryia. Heavens, she even knows that a senior citizen paid for Leonard's services ! She cannot possibly believe that her man is so unpleasant no other woman could ever hit on him.  

 

In my opinion, what truly blew her mind and made her doubt was Sheldon's account of his roomate's reaction. The idea that Leonard might show such pleasure at being hit on by somebody else or be even remotely tempted to stray was an electroshock for her for, in Penny's mind, Leonard is so not "that kind of guy" (The Prestidigitation Approximation) or "one of those guys" (The Good Guy Fluctuation)

 

I think her actions and feelings in The Egg Salad Equivalency are a continuation of her frustration in The 43 Peculiarity.

 

Penny knew of Alex in 6X3 tried to inquire about her(trying to ask how was his day) and got nothing out of Leonard. This was egged on by Amy's the skank is your problem. Penny made sure she introduced herself to Alex but didn't tell her that she was his girlfriend. You are correct Sheldon's account did put put Penny over the top. Him getting the other girls involved made it more dramatic but Sheldon making it a work problem really doesn't make sense. It wasn't a work problem. I think Sheldon actually just wanted to tell Penny about what Alex did and this was his way of doing it.

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tumblr_msxd3uXmkn1sp407ko1_500.jpg

 

The locket just makes me :wub: every single time! 

I'm guessing maybe they're looking at that monster that was going to pull Leonard overboard. Probably not Penny in the shower

Edited by Chrismo
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tumblr_msxd3uXmkn1sp407ko1_500.jpg

The locket just makes me :wub: every single time!

Still seeing "the apartment as wardrobe" thing going on. Oh well, nice halter top dress. (That was a filler comment-I don't really care about the dress or the tidiness. Lol). Happy for the photo! Edited by Nogravitasatall

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