Spoilers Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread

[I.Am.Molly]

Science query: if the maglev coil in "The Holographic Excitation" would remove a pierced nipple, would it not tear off Penny's brassiere because of the ferrous underwires?

(I'm proud to say my wife posed this question, just now, as we watched the blu-ray. It's evening here).

 

Um... maybe she wasnt wearing one?  They were gonna do it in there, maybe she just came prepared. haha!

[Zhalen565]

Um... maybe she wasnt wearing one?  They were gonna do it in there, maybe she just came prepared. haha!

We know she is a fan of Victorias Secret, it could have been one of their wireless range. I used their favourite web site for that.

[Chrismo]

I don't want Leonard going there either, I was just making a point.  Penny knows how Beverly feels about Leonard and that is all I am saying and why go there having all the information about Leonard and Beverly's relationship. Beverly doesn't have Leonard's best interest at heart and Penny knows this.

 

So does that mean Leonard should call Wyatt since he and Leonard bonded during his visit and bring him in to help with Penny so called commitment issues?

 

I still say Penny overstepped in bringing in Beverly and it's sad that she went there.  Trust is very important in a relationship and once it's broken It is hard to get back and Penny should know this since so many guys broke trust with her.

But didn't Leonard break the trust by using his mother's book to get sex out of Penny? Also an ongoing problem with their relationship is Penny's lack of education. When Penny was feeling inadequate after their first date because she wasn't smart of emough for Leonard, he brought over junior college books and mentioned it's only a junior college. Same goes with not telling his mother about Penny being his girlfriend. He didn't refute Sheldon's claim of lack of education. Same goes with the scavenger hunt he appeared not wanting to pair with her because of her not being smart. Now this. Penny's  POV (and logically so) is that he's only interested in her looks and sex. His appearance of wanting her to have an education appears to come from Beverly. He needs to finds ways to convince her otherwise.

[JonRS92]

But didn't Leonard break the trust by using his mother's book to get sex out of Penny? Also an ongoing problem with their relationship is Penny's lack of education. When Penny was feeling inadequate after their first date because she wasn't smart of emough for Leonard, he brought over junior college books and mentioned it's only a junior college. Same goes with not telling his mother about Penny being his girlfriend. He didn't refute Sheldon's claim of lack of education. Same goes with the scavenger hunt he appeared not wanting to pair with her because of her not being smart. Now this. Penny's  POV (and logically so) is that he's only interested in her looks and sex. His appearance of wanting her to have an education appears to come from Beverly. He needs to finds ways to convince her otherwise.

  I think he has tried to convince her.  Yes, he handled it poorly when he found out that Penny stopped dating him because she thought that he was too smart for her, but I believe he really was trying to help her and not himself by his actions.  Also he realized his mistake in what he said immediately.  After that he never tried to get her to take any classes until she brought up the fact that she was taking one last season.  In addition, he's not been tempted (not yet anyway) by Alex who you could say is better than Penny in that she is both hot and educated.  Consider also all the stuff Leonard has done for her without sex being an option: food, rent, going to fight for her with Kurt, etc. It seems clear to me that Leonard wants Penny for something other than, or in addition to, looks and that education doesn't appear to be a factor.  As for the scavenger hunt, I really believe that was more about the writers creating odd combinations and forcing a Sheldon/Penny pairing for their back and forth.  Maybe a better way to approach that would have been to have Raj object to the traditional pairings.  Edited September 22, 2013 by JonRS92

[Chiara]

I think it might be interesting to try to separate what the writers intend to put into their stories and the way we interpret them. Not because our interpretations are worthless or uninteresting (if they are, what in the name of Cthulu have I been doing with my life ?!?), but because it may help us get a clearer view of where things are heading.

 

I believe it was Bill Prady who said, in an interview he gave at Comic Con 2013, that while TBBT writers do not prepare story archs too far ahead, they already had the first seven or eight episodes planned out by then (late August). I found the number interesting for it was roughly a third of a season. It got me thinking that perhaps this is how the writers organise their work year : they divide it into three thirds (give or take a couple of episodes) each representing one story arch, from the formulation of a "problem" to its resolution.  

 

The system appears to work, for the most part, for season six : 

- from The Date Night Variable to The 43 Peculiarity : from Penny refusing to say ILY to her letting it out inadvertently

- from The Fish Guts Displacement* to The Tangible Affection Proof : from Sheldon being tricked into giving Amy affection to him doing it willingly and fittingly (I know "something else" happened in The Tangible Affection Proof but be indulgent)

- from The Monster Isolation to The Bon Voyage Reaction : from Raj convincing Lucy to give their relationship a chance to her dumping him, seemingly for good. 

 

* I believe The Parking Spot Escalation was mostly filler, of the best kind. 

 

So we probably should not look at 7.04 as a standalone piece but as part of an arch (the first third of season 7)... within an arch (the whole of season 7) within an arch (the whole show). Like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel. Sorry, I am getting lyrical. 

 

The seventh season's first third opens on Penny missing Leonard while he is having fun on his trip and is showing his crewmates a video his girlfriend is ashamed of. Please, before any blunt ones and zeroes come flying my way, give me time to say that I know Leonard is innocent in that he is blissfully unaware of Penny's shame. However, allow me to point out that the audience is not. We are told, by the woman herself (i.e. the writers) that the tape is something she wishes to forget and for nobody to know about or watch, immediately after which we are shown Leonard proudly passing it around...

Then comes 7.03 and Leonard recoiling at the prospect of Penny being on his scavenger hunt team for fear of her being a hindrance to his victory. And now 7.04 in which he uses Penny's affection to get what he wants.

 

Again, I feel I have to point out I am not saying that Leonard is a villain or that the writers intend to portray him as such. To turn Dr Hofstadter into a bad guy, they would have to dismantle him and rebuild him from gene one, which I am sure they have no intention or desire to do (let us not forget that he is their guy, their homeboy, their and the show's hero).

Nevertheless, a pattern is definitely emerging from the first handful of spoilers we have at our disposal and its theme does not seem to be "Penny has to learn to respect Leonard and his boundaries". If anything, it appears to be the other way around. 

 

This season's first of three arches may very well be "Leonard has to remind himself (and Penny) that she is important to him as a whole person and not just as a remarkably well wrapped provider of satisfaction". It is certainly not a bad arch and it, to me at least, does not shine a bad light on Leonard at all. It carries the possibility of deepening the relationship to a hitherto uncharted extent by forcing Dr Hofstadter to investigate and analyse his feelings for his girlfriend. Basically, imagine The Recombination Hypothesis but with Leonard having to describe what is going on in his gigantic brain. That could be cool. 

(Sidenote : the October return of Pr "what do the two of you talk about ?" Proton may help catalyse the reaction.)

 

Given this context, Penny calling Beverly is probably not, in what I believe to be the writers' eyes, such a transgression; it is a (very) tough but fair retaliation for, to TPTB, Beverly is not abusive; she is emotionally retentive and comically clueless. Now, I will grant you that they certainly push the envelope as far as they can with references to the trauma she appears to have caused her son but at no point is she painted as vicious or mean-spirited. 

It is tempting to draw a parallel between her and the other mothers on the show, especially Mrs. Wolowitz. One could easily say that the latter has been as gormlessly detrimental to her son's emotional welfare as Dr. B. Hofstadter has been to her progeny's yet nobody, I believe, would think of calling the legendarily rotund yiddishe mame "abusive" or "destructive". 

If Bev is not meant to be a villain, then there is no real downside to Penny calling her to the rescue to punish Leonard for his accidentally (and somewhat unwillingly) manipulative ways.

[JonRS92]

I think it might be interesting to try to separate what the writers intend to put into their stories and the way we interpret them. Not because our interpretations are worthless or uninteresting (if they are, what in the name of Cthulu have I been doing with my life ?!?), but because it may help us get a clearer view of where things are heading.

 

I believe it was Bill Prady who said, in an interview he gave at Comic Con 2013, that while TBBT writers do not prepare story archs too far ahead, they already had the first seven or eight episodes planned out by then (late August). I found the number interesting for it was roughly a third of a season. It got me thinking that perhaps this is how the writers organise their work year : they divide it into three thirds (give or take a couple of episodes) each representing one story arch, from the formulation of a "problem" to its resolution.  

 

The system appears to work, for the most part, for season six : 

- from The Date Night Variable to The 43 Peculiarity : from Penny refusing to say ILY to her letting it out inadvertently

- from The Fish Guts Displacement* to The Tangible Affection Proof : from Sheldon being tricked into giving Amy affection to him doing it willingly and fittingly (I know "something else" happened in The Tangible Affection Proof but be indulgent)

- from The Monster Isolation to The Bon Voyage Reaction : from Raj convincing Lucy to give their relationship a chance to her dumping him, seemingly for good. 

 

* I believe The Parking Spot Escalation was mostly filler, of the best kind. 

 

So we probably should not look at 7.04 as a standalone piece but as part of an arch (the first third of season 7)... within an arch (the whole of season 7) within an arch (the whole show). Like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel. Sorry, I am getting lyrical. 

 

The seventh season's first third opens on Penny missing Leonard while he is having fun on his trip and is showing his crewmates a video his girlfriend is ashamed of. Please, before any blunt ones and zeroes come flying my way, give me time to say that I know Leonard is innocent in that he is blissfully unaware of Penny's shame. However, allow me to point out that the audience is not. We are told, by the woman herself (i.e. the writers) that the tape is something she wishes to forget and for nobody to know about or watch, immediately after which we are shown Leonard proudly passing it around...

Then comes 7.03 and Leonard recoiling at the prospect of Penny being on his scavenger hunt team for fear of her being a hindrance to his victory. And now 7.04 in which he uses Penny's affection to get what he wants.

 

Again, I feel I have to point out I am not saying that Leonard is a villain or that the writers intend to portray him as such. To turn Dr Hofstadter into a bad guy, they would have to dismantle him and rebuild him from gene one, which I am sure they have no intention or desire to do (let us not forget that he is their guy, their homeboy, their and the show's hero).

Nevertheless, a pattern is definitely emerging from the first handful of spoilers we have at our disposal and its theme does not seem to be "Penny has to learn to respect Leonard and his boundaries". If anything, it appears to be the other way around. 

 

This season's first of three arches may very well be "Leonard has to remind himself (and Penny) that she is important to him as a whole person and not just as a remarkably well wrapped provider of satisfaction". It is certainly not a bad arch and it, to me at least, does not shine a bad light on Leonard at all. It carries the possibility of deepening the relationship to a hitherto uncharted extent by forcing Dr Hofstadter to investigate and analyse his feelings for his girlfriend. Basically, imagine The Recombination Hypothesis but with Leonard having to describe what is going on in his gigantic brain. That could be cool. 

(Sidenote : the October return of Pr "what do the two of you talk about ?" Proton may help catalyse the reaction.)

 

Given this context, Penny calling Beverly is probably not, in what I believe to be the writers' eyes, such a transgression; it is a (very) tough but fair retaliation for, to TPTB, Beverly is not abusive; she is emotionally retentive and comically clueless. Now, I will grant you that they certainly push the envelope as far as they can with references to the trauma she appears to have caused her son but at no point is she painted as vicious or mean-spirited. 

It is tempting to draw a parallel between her and the other mothers on the show, especially Mrs. Wolowitz. One could easily say that the latter has been as gormlessly detrimental to her son's emotional welfare as Dr. B. Hofstadter has been to her progeny's yet nobody, I believe, would think of calling the legendarily rotund yiddishe mame "abusive" or "destructive". 

If Bev is not meant to be a villain, then there is no real downside to Penny calling her to the rescue to punish Leonard for his accidentally (and somewhat unwillingly) manipulative ways.

 

I think you probably have a point here, but I don't get it.  Didn't we already have several episodes (about 4 months in show time) where Penny and Leonard were proceeding in their relationship without sex?  Wouldn't he have learned to appreciate the whole person then? If not then what was going on with him all that time?  Was he just biding his time and learning nothing?  I would also argue that these two talk more now than they ever did.  Those quiet dinners they share now are not done in silence   She talks about her day and he talk about his.  As for episode 7.3, I think this is a perfect example of when you say that maybe we are seeing things the writers never intended.  All of that episode just seems to be about laughs and mixing things up.  After all, from what I read in the taping report, nearly everyone insults Penny in that episode.  Sheldon, Leonard, Amy, Bernadette, and Raj all insult her in some way.  The first three by not wanting to team up with her, Bernie lies about her in a bad way to Leonard and Raj admits to rigging the game to negate Penny's dragging her partner down.  Now I get why we would all be more upset with Leonard as her boyfriend for participating in this instead of having her back, but I don't think the writers intended it to be that way.  If they did I don't think they thought anyone would take it as such a betrayal.  Consider, all of her friends including her best girl friends bag  on her.  Now in 7.4, we see Leonard manipulating Penny to get sex and to get out of doing things he doesn't want to do.  Instead of this arch being about him learning to appreciate her as a whole, which I assert he has already done, but more about Leonard coming to grips with his new assertiveness and confidence and new position within their relationship.  He now knows that she worries just has much about losing him and he does about losing her so he took advantage.  As you said, I think this will be a learning experience for him and it will ultimately make them stronger as a couple.

Edited September 22, 2013 by JonRS92

[Chrismo]

I think you probably have a point here, but I don't get it.  Didn't we already have several episodes (about 4 months in show time) where Penny and Leonard were proceeding in their relationship without sex?  Wouldn't he have learned to appreciate the whole person then? If not then what was going on with him all that time?  Was he just biding his time and learning nothing?  I would also argue that these two talk more now than they ever did.  Those quiet dinners they share now are not done in silence   She talks about her day and he talk about his.  As for episode 7.3, I think this is a perfect example of when you say that maybe we are seeing things the writers never intended.  All of that episode just seems to be about laughs and mixing things up.  After all, from what I read in the taping report, nearly everyone insults Penny in that episode.  Sheldon, Leonard, Amy, Bernadette, and Raj all insult her in some way.  The first three by not wanting to team up with her, Bernie lies about her in a bad way to Leonard and Raj admits to rigging the game to negate Penny's dragging her partner down.  Now I get why we would all be more upset with Leonard as her boyfriend for participating in this instead of having her back, but I don't think the writers intended it to be that way.  If they did I don't think they thought anyone would take it as such a betrayal.  Consider, all of her friends including her best girl friends bag  on her.  Now in 7.4, we see Leonard manipulating Penny to get sex and to get out of doing things he doesn't want to do.  Instead of this arch being about him learning to appreciate her as a whole, which I assert he has already done, but more about Leonard coming to grips with his new assertiveness and confidence and new position within their relationship.  He now knows that she worries just has much about losing him and he does about losing her so he took advantage.  As you said, I think this will be a learning experience for him and it will ultimately make them stronger as a couple.

I think you are correct about in season 6 they talked more than ever before. But it seems IMO so far in season 7 Leonard's reverted to his old ways. 7.1 he was on the boat watching her topless video. 7.2 he returned and you can imagine all the make up sex. 7.3 though you are correct the others may have thought she dragged him down but I think you have to hold Leonard to a higher standard IMO than the rest. 7.4 manipilating Penny for sex. I do agree though they will get back on track.

[Chiara]

I think you probably have a point here, but I don't get it.  Didn't we already have several episodes (about 4 months in show time) where Penny and Leonard were proceeding in their relationship without sex?  Wouldn't he have learned to appreciate the whole person then? If not then what was going on with him all that time?  Was he just biding his time and learning nothing?

I do agree with you wholeheartedly about Leonard already having learnt to appreciate Penny as a whole person. I would even argue that he learnt that a very long time ago, basically since the first time when he noticed that, on top of being a "cheesecake-scented goddess", she was also something of a messy, contradictory, infuriating, maddening woman. 

This is why I wrote that he would have to "remind himself" that she is important to him as a whole person; not that he would have to "realise" it.

 

He knows, I am sure. Yet, the trend that appears to emerge from this first batch of spoilers is that he might have forgotten, or lost sight of, it. Perhaps he is too busy being dazzled by his own success, in which he never truly believed : he has Penny (in every way now that she has said she loves him), he has professional success, he has amazing friends (he has always had them but still, it is good to know), etc. He pretty much has it all, for now. And he cannot believe his luck. So it would not be inconceivable for him to get a bit too content with the big picture, to the point of forgetting the little (yet essential) things.

 

As for episode 7.3, I think this is a perfect example of when you say that maybe we are seeing things the writers never intended.  All of that episode just seems to be about laughs and mixing things up.

I could not agree with you more :  everything in TBBT is about laughs and mixing things up... Until it is not.

The whole ILY debacle in The Wheaton Recurrence was about laughs, until Penny broke down and broke up. Leonard's daydream in The Recombination Hypothesis was a long series of really joke-y scenes, until the experimental physicist put himself out there and asked Penny out. Penny' s reluctance to say ILY was played for laughs in The Date Night Variable and Leonard's jealousy (as well as his girlfriend's exasperation) in The 43 Peculiarity was very funny, until Penny finally said the words. Even Penny's half-baked intention to break up with Leonard in The Decoupling Fluctuation had lots of funny moments, until Sheldon broke into his neighbour's apartment to plead "Please don't hurt my friend". 

 

Laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, oh. Such is the rhythm of TBBT

 

So I have no doubt that Leonard's showing of the tape, refusing to have Penny on his team or cranking up the pathos to get extra sympathy will be funny as hell. Until something else happens... I am merely wondering what the "something else" might be this time.

Edited September 22, 2013 by Chiara

[Tensor]

I think you probably have a point here, but I don't get it.  Didn't we already have several episodes (about 4 months in show time) where Penny and Leonard were proceeding in their relationship without sex?  Wouldn't he have learned to appreciate the whole person then? If not then what was going on with him all that time?  Was he just biding his time and learning nothing?

Biding time was just about it. That stems, I think, that the writers wanted and had gotten L/P back together, but the main emphasis in the later half of season five was Howard and Bernadette's wedding. This way, they had them back together, but didn't have to do anything with them. Except for the "Initiation" episode(the first of that arc and the one that explained the beta test), there wasn't a lot of growth. When Leonard proposed, just before the end of the season, they basically clammed up and didn't talk about it at all, that continued through the season 5 finale and through half of season six. Hell, they didn't even talk about the ILY, they ran off from each other. It wasn't until "Egg Salad that things started getting better for them, when it came to talking.

The eight episode arcs(with a one episode on either side) make sense in that the resolution of an eight episode arc, falls within the "Sweeps Month". Last year, the ILY was in sweeps month (15 Nov), Tangible Affection was on 14 Feb, and of course Bon Voyage was on May 16.

[Nogravitasatall]

I think you probably have a point here, but I don't get it.  Didn't we already have several episodes (about 4 months in show time) where Penny and Leonard were proceeding in their relationship without sex?  Wouldn't he have learned to appreciate the whole person then? If not then what was going on with him all that time?  Was he just biding his time and learning nothing?  I would also argue that these two talk more now than they ever did.  Those quiet dinners they share now are not done in silence   She talks about her day and he talk about his.  As for episode 7.3, I think this is a perfect example of when you say that maybe we are seeing things the writers never intended.  All of that episode just seems to be about laughs and mixing things up.  After all, from what I read in the taping report, nearly everyone insults Penny in that episode.  Sheldon, Leonard, Amy, Bernadette, and Raj all insult her in some way.  The first three by not wanting to team up with her, Bernie lies about her in a bad way to Leonard and Raj admits to rigging the game to negate Penny's dragging her partner down.  Now I get why we would all be more upset with Leonard as her boyfriend for participating in this instead of having her back, but I don't think the writers intended it to be that way.  If they did I don't think they thought anyone would take it as such a betrayal.  Consider, all of her friends including her best girl friends bag  on her.  Now in 7.4, we see Leonard manipulating Penny to get sex and to get out of doing things he doesn't want to do.  Instead of this arch being about him learning to appreciate her as a whole, which I assert he has already done, but more about Leonard coming to grips with his new assertiveness and confidence and new position within their relationship.  He now knows that she worries just has much about losing him and he does about losing her so he took advantage.  As you said, I think this will be a learning experience for him and it will ultimately make them stronger as a couple.

I've distilled this in my head to "Leonard wanted to level up, found a cheat code, then got slapped hard for it." LOL.

[JonRS92]

I think you are correct about in season 6 they talked more than ever before. But it seems IMO so far in season 7 Leonard's reverted to his old ways. 7.1 he was on the boat watching her topless video. 7.2 he returned and you can imagine all the make up sex. 7.3 though you are correct the others may have thought she dragged him down but I think you have to hold Leonard to a higher standard IMO than the rest. 7.4 manipilating Penny for sex. I do agree though they will get back on track.

 

Here is where I do not agree that what we are seeing is "reverting".  Leonard's old problems tend to be him being too submissive or apologetic.  Can you point to a time in the past where Leonard manipulates Penny at all?  I'm not sure what to make of showing the topless scene on the boat except I think that was described as one of those tack on scenes that I do not believe have ever been used for anything important or something that carried over to another episode.  I could be forgetting something, but I don't remember Leonard ever doing anything like the thing on the boat.  Sure he took a picture of himself kissing Penny with a newspaper as proof she was his girlfriend, but nothing like what was described in 7.1.  As for manipulating her into sex...I don't remember him manipulating her at all for anything.  Again, if I am forgetting something please point it out.  Because of that I think we are seeing a brand new problem and not a reverting to an old one. 

 

I do agree with you wholeheartedly about Leonard already having learnt to appreciate Penny as a whole person. I would even argue that he learnt that a very long time ago, basically since the first time when he noticed that, on top of being a "cheesecake-scented goddess", she was also something of a messy, contradictory, infuriating, maddening woman. 

This is why I wrote that he would have to "remind himself" that she is important to him as a whole person; not that he would have to "realise" it.

 

He knows, I am sure. Yet, the trend that appears to emerge from this first batch of spoilers is that he might have forgotten, or lost sight of, it. Perhaps he is too busy being dazzled by his own success, in which he never truly believed : he has Penny (in every way now that she has said she loves him), he has professional success, he has amazing friends (he has always had them but still, it is good to know), etc. He pretty much has it all, for now. And he cannot believe his luck. So it would not be inconceivable for him to get a bit too content with the big picture, to the point of forgetting the little (yet essential) things.

 

I could not agree with you more :  everything in TBBT is about laughs and mixing things up... Until it is not.

The whole ILY debacle in The Wheaton Recurrence was about laughs, until Penny broke down and broke up. Leonard's daydream in The Recombination Hypothesis was a long series of really joke-y scenes, until the experimental physicist put himself out there and asked Penny out. Penny' s reluctance to say ILY was played for laughs in The Date Night Variable and Leonard's jealousy (as well as his girlfriend's exasperation) in The 43 Peculiarity was very funny, until Penny finally said the words. Even Penny's half-baked intention to break up with Leonard in The Decoupling Fluctuation had lots of funny moments, until Sheldon broke into his neighbour's apartment to plead "Please don't hurt my friend". 

 

Laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, laugh, oh. Such is the rhythm of TBBT

 

So I have no doubt that Leonard's showing of the tape, refusing to have Penny on his team or cranking up the pathos to get extra sympathy will be funny as hell. Until something else happens... I am merely wondering what the "something else" might be this time.

 

Point taken on this whole thing.  You've convinced me

 

Biding time was just about it. That stems, I think, that the writers wanted and had gotten L/P back together, but the main emphasis in the later half of season five was Howard and Bernadette's wedding. This way, they had them back together, but didn't have to do anything with them. Except for the "Initiation" episode(the first of that arc and the one that explained the beta test), there wasn't a lot of growth. When Leonard proposed, just before the end of the season, they basically clammed up and didn't talk about it at all, that continued through the season 5 finale and through half of season six. Hell, they didn't even talk about the ILY, they ran off from each other. It wasn't until "Egg Salad that things started getting better for them, when it came to talking.

The eight episode arcs(with a one episode on either side) make sense in that the resolution of an eight episode arc, falls within the "Sweeps Month". Last year, the ILY was in sweeps month (15 Nov), Tangible Affection was on 14 Feb, and of course Bon Voyage was on May 16.

 

I'm sure you've noticed this, but often we have to do all of the filling-in-the-blanks with these episodes.  They took a bunch of moments from 6.1 to the ILY and beyond and didn't overtly connect them.  We did that with our discussions.  Because of that, all of this discussion on what it means for Lenny that Leonard is doing these things so far in season 7 is really difficult to pin down. 

[Nogravitasatall]

@ArmyGirl.

On Beverly: She can't ever be completely horrible, because it's Charlie's mum in TAAHM who occupies that space in Mr Lorre's pantheon. It's more likely she will just be always as blind as Sheldon to human sensibility, and will have her own sad story (as came out with Penny in the car and "Yikes".) Penny will be the connector between Leonard and his mum, like Penny connects Leonard to the world that is off campus. And I think it bears repeating that its not worth reading too heavily into the back-stories, as there is some awful stuff there, potentially. The arguments about drinking and Leonard's disgraceful sluttiness have their roots there. This is advice to myself, too. On the upside, maybe Penny's connection to Beverly can be exploited to rope in Leonard's missing dad.

Also, more generally, there is a rule evident. As "Sheldon settles all ties", with the Roommate Agreement, so to "Penny wins all games", even power games. This could come back to bite her sometime, however I'm skeptical of that. But maybe they can make a joke of Leonard's incipient erectile dysfunction . And then bring back the "chew toy" again. LOL.

[SRAM]

Science query: if the maglev coil in "The Holographic Excitation" would remove a pierced nipple, would it not tear off Penny's brassiere because of the ferrous underwires?

(I'm proud to say my wife posed this question, just now, as we watched the blu-ray. It's evening here).

That would have made for an interesting episode, even them not showing anything it still would have been funny and would have made it easier to get to the sex part.

[Nogravitasatall]

That would have made for an interesting episode, even them not showing anything it still would have been funny and would have made it easier to get to the sex part.

It would be a hard one to pull off.

As a gag, it would need careful setting up to make it not look horrible, such as privacy, humour and lack of intent. It would be funny if carefully done and properly referenced, maybe. "Old" Howard would have been all over it. I also think he would be behind the wireless bra. Interestingly (to me) an Australian developed the algorithms used in all wi-fi gear, for an astrophysics problem. The patents are held by the CSIRO. Worth billions. From pure science. Yay!

[Tensor]

I'm sure you've noticed this, but often we have to do all of the filling-in-the-blanks with these episodes.  They took a bunch of moments from 6.1 to the ILY and beyond and didn't overtly connect them.  We did that with our discussions.  Because of that, all of this discussion on what it means for Lenny that Leonard is doing these things so far in season 7 is really difficult to pin down.

Nah, it doesn't make it difficult, it makes it impossible. The best any of us can do is to interpret it so our interpretation doesn't conflict with what is seen on screen. But, all of us are going to have different interpretations. After all, 24 out of 25 of us could agree with what happened in 6.01. Then 23 of those 24 agree with what happened in 6.02 but now you have three different interpretations. You run that out for 24 episodes and you have 25 different interpretations and that doesn't even include different possible interpretations within those that disagree. But, as long as it doesn't disagree with what is shown on screen, all of those are valid. The problem is that if all those interpretations are valid, then none of them are.

That's what fan fiction is for.

[Count Wally de Honk]

Nah, it doesn't make it difficult, it makes it impossible. The best any of us can do is to interpret it so our interpretation doesn't conflict with what is seen on screen. But, all of us are going to have different interpretations. After all, 24 out of 25 of us could agree with what happened in 6.01. Then 23 of those 24 agree with what happened in 6.02 but now you have three different interpretations. You run that out for 24 episodes and you have 25 different interpretations and that doesn't even include different possible interpretations within those that disagree. But, as long as it doesn't disagree with what is shown on screen, all of those are valid. The problem is that if all those interpretations are valid, then none of them are.

That's what fan fiction is for.

 

All I can think is that any Venn Diagram drawn to accompany this explanation would look borderline psychedelic. I tried to find a suitable image, but got distracted by a yellow submarine...

Anyroad, I wholeheartedly concur. I wish you'd pin this somewhere on the forum to remind people of the inherent subjectivity of their opinions.

[hamerman55]

I will wait and see on the Leonard manipulating Penny into sex. When has she ever said no, when they were in a having sex part of their relationships? Once she and Leonard enter a having sex period in either 1.0 or 2.0, she's good to go. I think Leonard has lacked the confidence to ask previously, so where he may be getting into trouble is not asking for sex straight up, which would be fine with Penny. It would be looking for a lever where none is needed.

The spoiler reports are fun, but in the end, the episodes as aired frequently look different. Four more days to go!

[3ku11]

I'm not sure the taping report suggests Leonard manipulated Penny into sex, more monopolized the situation to gain sex. Leonard has always been the awkward geeky nerd with submissive tendancies. Now he is gaining more confidence and for the first time in his life in a relationship with a women who loves him as much as he loves her, so in the past probabaly would think twice, but now probably trying too see how much he can get away with, searching the boundaries of this new relationship that it is almost now, same for Penny it well probably come across as funny. Penny may have been upset so in the spur of the moment she called Beverley, regretting it later, it is comedy after all.

[fixitmr]

Science query: if the maglev coil in "The Holographic Excitation" would remove a pierced nipple, would it not tear off Penny's brassiere because of the ferrous underwires?

(I'm proud to say my wife posed this question, just now, as we watched the blu-ray. It's evening here).

Who said she wears a BRA to the LAB !!!!!!!!

 

Just watched the ep . she is wearing what looks like a tube top under her blouse .....

Edited September 23, 2013 by fixitmr

[Tensor]

All I can think is that any Venn Diagram drawn to accompany this explanation would look borderline psychedelic. I tried to find a suitable image, but got distracted by a yellow submarine...

I prefer the math itself, but that can also get somewhat messy . Have fun.

 

Anyroad, I wholeheartedly concur. I wish you'd pin this somewhere on the forum to remind people of the inherent subjectivity of their opinions.

I would, but then I would have to issue a disclaimer, as my opinion isn't subjective and is always correct.

[Nogravitasatall]

Who said she wears a BRA to the LAB !!!!!!!!

It was my wife who asked the question. Maybe it was an expectation about comfort or style. I can assure you it was probably not about morality. We are Australian, after all.

[Tensor]

We are Australian, after all.

Sluts. GO.

[3ku11]

Sluts. GO.

Read a fact that Australian Women on average have sex on the first date then Americans and Canadians, I only bring this up because I am not sure if that is a genralization or an actual fact lol, nor do I think Penny slept with Leonard on their first date because we all know she diddn't

[Nogravitasatall]

I would, but then I would have to issue a disclaimer, as my opinion isn't subjective and is always correct.

 

I cite you. At least three time now I've plugged "Chew Toy".  (such a suck up, me)

 

Who said she wears a BRA to the LAB !!!!!!!!

Just watched the ep . she is wearing what looks like a tube top under her blouse .....

 

I appreciate your dedication to research. No stone unturned nor ep freeze-framed. LOL. But Im glad she was safe and the wardrobe crew are on top of the details. She is a generous actor and committed to the moment. I read somewhere the gear was the real deal, but it hums ltoo loudly to turned on for recording  (probably from the taping report).

[JonRS92]

I cite you. At least three time now I've plugged "Chew Toy".  (such a suck up, me)

 

 

I appreciate your dedication to research. No stone unturned nor ep freeze-framed. LOL. But Im glad she was safe and the wardrobe crew are on top of the details. She is a generous actor and committed to the moment. I read somewhere the gear was the real deal, but it hums ltoo loudly to turned on for recording  (probably from the taping report).

 

I always wondered if that stuff was real especially the hologram machine