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Leonard And Penny Season 7 *spoiler* Discussion Thread


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Obviously I like Penny just look at my avatar. This season so far Leonard IMO opinion has been screwing up. In past seasons Penny has screwed up. I don't necessarily agree with bringing Leonard's mother into this either but since Leonard committed "the crime" he really doesn't have much say into how Penny gets even.

 

Well my one hope is the next time Penny does something major is that Leonard not be so forgiving and really stick it to her.  Penny can dish it but rarely can she take it.

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So true Tensor.   The most consistent motif the writers have used with Penny is her insecurity about her intelligence and judgement. It pops up constantly in several episodes a season, starting with

Bullshit. My wife and I have OUR money. If money is budgeted for her to get clothes or for me to get clothes, neither one of us is giving the other money for clothes, we are using OUR money to get clo

OK, I went and re-watched the show tonight. I was looking at how Leonard and Penny reacted and it became obvious it was a no-win for Leonard. He was obviously sticking his foot in his mouth while tryi

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I thought the promo was pretty funny.  I am not so sure that all of this is going to be all that big  of a deal in the long run, but we will have to wait and see.  I could be wrong. 

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I still don't like bringing in his mother but I don't mind Penny getting back at Leonard just not through his mother.  As for Leonard I would think twice every time he saw Penny dressed in that manner, never know if he mother will be on Skype again.

If not through his mother, through what or whom ? There is a nice symmetry to the tactic : Leonard uses his mother to make Penny feel sorry for him; Penny uses Beverly to make him feel sorry for real... I doubt anyone is a huge fan of the "bringing mommy into the relationship" manoeuvre but this particular instance may be the one and only in which it is somewhat justified. 

 

The amount of preparation and thought Penny put into her revenge is definitely interesting; She went all out on this. The nightie, the makeup, the call to Beverly, etc. She ain't kidding; she is going straight for the kill.

 

PS I cannot wait to hear what the Wicked Witch of the East Coast has to say... Bev always has funny, if disturbing, observations to make. 

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If I were Leonard.. I'd never leave the house... Um I mean if I were Leonard I'd have been sure to have changed the locks before de-pantsing in case of Sheldon... Trying again... If I were Leonard I'd hope not to get in this pickle and treat my love with the respect she deserves.

But it does look funny. I'm not sure if its a post-feminist grrl power thing or the matriarchy asserting itself. It certainly nice to know that Penny can let him into the room to spring the trap, rather than letting him just bang his head against the door from the outside. She went to a fair amount of trouble with her hair and makeup, so she does care.

is this the whole tag?

Penny did do a fair amount of work to look good. She could of also gone a little longer letting Leonard disrobe further before showing Beverly on skype. Past Penny may have done that. I don't think the scene(tag) was much longer than that. The one I saw was a little different than @PuppyChow's clip.

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If not through his mother, through what or whom ? There is a nice symmetry to the tactic : Leonard uses his mother to make Penny feel sorry for him; Penny uses Beverly to make him feel sorry for real... I doubt anyone is a huge fan of the "bringing mommy into the relationship" manoeuvre but this particular instance may be the one and only in which it is somewhat justified. 

 

The amount of preparation and thought Penny put into her revenge is definitely interesting; She went all out on this. The nightie, the makeup, the call to Beverly, etc. She ain't kidding; she is going straight for the kill.

 

PS I cannot wait to hear what the Wicked Witch of the East Coast has to say... Bev always has funny, if disturbing, observations to make. 

 

 

Well you and some others love his mother and find her to be this great character so of course it doesn't bother you that Penny brings in his mother. 

 

As for the preparation and revenge Penny put into ---- I look forward to when Penny does something and Leonard be given the same opportunity to get revenge on her.  I know it won't happen but I can wish.

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Well you and some others love his mother and find her to be this great character so of course it doesn't bother you that Penny brings in his mother. 

 

 

I don't like Leonard's mother either. But it didn't seem to bother you when Leonard used his mother to get sex out of Penny.

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Penny did go to a lot of trouble to look good, she has never dressed up like that for him before, that we've seen.  She would never do that before, she would just go nuts on him and throw him out, but not now, she is training him.  She has picked him and he is end game, so now she has to train him, what she is showing him is what good guys get, that outfit says only one thing, and bad boys, like what he did, do not get.  Leonard will stay awake all night thinking about his beautiful girlfriend and the way she looked, while she will get washed up and put on her normal pajamas to go to bed, but he will never know and will get no sleep thinking about her in his own bed.  Smart girl, but she does love him, so next week, he is good and they cuddle.

 

His mother is just the second barrel in a double barrel attack.

 

I had no idea she was looking like that when I read the taping report, this does make it better, she is screwing with him, you can tell she loves him, but she is keeping him in line, just like last episode, when he screwed up and she wouldn't then be his partner and was competing against him. 

 

This looks like another funny episode.  The writers are really on fire and I hope they can keep it up all season.

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Well you and some others love his mother and find her to be this great character so of course it doesn't bother you that Penny brings in his mother. 

 

As for the preparation and revenge Penny put into ---- I look forward to when Penny does something and Leonard be given the same opportunity to get revenge on her.  I know it won't happen but I can wish.

I do apologise for being obtuse but I fail to see where the perception of Leonard as perpetually victimised is coming from. I understand and accept that he is a very forgiving and patient soul and, as such, does not get as frequently upset as Penny, who is of a more sanguine disposition. However, on several occasions already, he has put his foot down and taken his revenge from Penny when he felt she had gone too far : 

- in The Guitarist Amplification, he felt Penny's friend staying at her place was inappropriate and did not back down, no matter what she said;

- in The Boyfriend Complexity, he thought Penny's lie to her father was too much and did not miss an opportunity to embarrass and bother her over it;

- in The Ornithophobia Diffusion, he took great pleasure at making Penny "pay" for all the sacrifices he used to make when they were an item (even though she seemed entirely unaware of them) and, during an argument, called her stupid in front of a stranger (I know they were having a fight and Penny said some extremely unsavoury things about him too, but the allusion to stupidity was particularly harsh); 

- in The Tangible Affection Proof, he took offense at Penny's sabotage and demanded an explanation she provided. 

 

Time and time again, Leonard has been given the opportunity to express his discontent and he has done so with gusto whenever he felt he was in the right. 

 

So I do not understand why you appear to believe I would be shocked/surprised/bothered if he were to do it again in the future. I can assure you I would not. There would be nothing even remotely extraordinary about such a course of action. He has done it before; I do not see why he could not do it again, if given proper cause. He would have every right to. 

Edited by Chiara
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I'm talking about this episode on this Thursday.

 

And I said he was wrong for during that.  At least I admit Leonard does wrong.

Further to Armygirl's and Chrismo's comments about Beverly, I find her distant and clinical, but in no way the evil shrew some people paint her as. Just MHO.

 

I have no problem that you like her.  I can't get with a mother that treats her child that way be it a comedy or not. 

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I have no problem that you like her.  I can't get with a mother that treats her child that way be it a comedy or not. 

Wouldn't want her as a mother, but the character is funny. I just don't think she's intentionally mean

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Further to Armygirl's and Chrismo's comments about Beverly, I find her distant and clinical, but in no way the evil shrew some people paint her as. Just MHO.

 

I don't think she is an evil shrew but she hasn't ever shown love or pride towards Leonard that I can recall.  Now if the Skype has her saying something "nice" to Leonard then I might not feel as apprehensive as I do right now.  Otherwise I just can't wrap my head around the concept that Penny calling Leonard's mother is appropriate.  Sure he took things a bit too far supposedly but...I guess I have to wait to see the actual episode...

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Wouldn't want her as a mother, but the character is funny. I just don't think she's intentionally mean

 

 

You don't find it odd that the only child she writes about is Leonard?  I mean what kind of mother does everything in her power to make her son life miserable?  When has Beverly ever been a halfway decent mother to Leonard? 

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Wouldn't want her as a mother, but the character is funny. I just don't think she's intentionally mean

It's the same argument though like the one with Sheldon. He does things "unintentional" but to some people that doesn't excuse it.

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I don't think she is an evil shrew but she hasn't ever shown love or pride towards Leonard that I can recall.  Now if the Skype has her saying something "nice" to Leonard then I might not feel as apprehensive as I do right now.  Otherwise I just can't wrap my head around the concept that Penny calling Leonard's mother is appropriate.  Sure he took things a bit too far supposedly but...I guess I have to wait to see the actual episode...

IMO the show is probably going to look different than any taping report or clip.

 

Wow, you're reading more into my posts than I think I intended. I'm in no way excusing her.

Sorry my mistake. I just don't find her that funny though. More annoying than anything.Although I don't think as annoyed as some.

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And I said he was wrong for during that.  At least I admit Leonard does wrong.

 

 

To me Penny has done nothing wrong in the Lenny relationship since Tangible Proof. This episode and the last she was reacting to what Leonard did. Obviously the first 5.5 seasons she has but that's really hasn't been the discussion. BTW you say Penny is your 2nd favorite character but  you always seem to want revenge on her. I like Penny but I would never want to seek revenge on Leonard.

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I don't think she is an evil shrew but she hasn't ever shown love or pride towards Leonard that I can recall. Now if the Skype has her saying something "nice" to Leonard then I might not feel as apprehensive as I do right now. Otherwise I just can't wrap my head around the concept that Penny calling Leonard's mother is appropriate. Sure he took things a bit too far supposedly but...I guess I have to wait to see the actual episode...

Beverly might say something to cut them both down. Yikes.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
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To me Penny has done nothing wrong in the Lenny relationship since Tangible Proof. This episode and the last she was reacting to what Leonard did. Obviously the first 5.5 seasons she has but that's really hasn't been the discussion. BTW you say Penny is your 2nd favorite character but  you always seem to want revenge on her. I like Penny but I would never want to seek revenge on Leonard.

 

We will have to agree to disagree about you not wanting revenge on Leonard. It's been nice posting with you though.

Beverly might say something to cut them both down. YIKES!

 

nahhh it's Leonard she loves to torture.

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Wouldn't want her as a mother, but the character is funny. I just don't think she's intentionally mean

No, you're right, she isn't intentionally mean, she's just a psychopath who decided that it would be perfectly fine to use one of her children as a psychological guinea pig.

 

Wow, you're reading more into my posts than I think I intended. I'm in no way excusing her.

Maybe, but that kind of emotional abuse isn't funny, no matter how you present it.

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I'm going to reserve judgement on the episode until I see it, as the actual episode has played much more sympathetically than the taping reports and other spoilers. I'm sure those providing the taping reports are accurately reporting what they see, but it seems that the episodes seem to knit together so as not to be as hard as it sounds, and the actors are able to do a lot with the parts.

Historically, Beverly has been a wild card. Her first appearance pretty much knocked everyone but Leonard around (he knew what to expect). Even Sheldon did some odd things (kareoke? Sheldon?). The second time, she bonded with Penny and got lit. She point blank told Leonard she approved of her for him, although getting a dig in regarding Penny's dead end career. The only time I recall her being completely negative was in the Skype call set up by Sheldon to "help" Leonard deal with Priya leaving and Penny supposedly having sex with Raj. This is exactly the sort of situation she would be of the least use to Leonard. Christine Baranski's unavailability does hampermthe writers from a truly good episode with her, since ai think she's the best when she can mess with everyone's head. This Skype things just have her show up to dis Leonard, while everyone else gets away scott free.

Given that Penny seems to have gone to some length to set up her negative reinforcement to Leonard, she's probably coached Beverly. I do see the possibility that this could backfire unless Beverly sticks to Penny's script. Beverly could easily say something that drive Penny right into Leonard's arms. Leonard has also proven adept at redirecting Beverly, as we saw when he sicced her on Howard in her first appearance. He could easily shift the conversation to be about Penny, if he has the presence mind to do so (unlikely given the situation, but he's the one that best knows his mother). I think this Thursday could be very interesting.

I think we have to remember that Beverly does approve of Penny for Leonard. Further, I don't she's evil per se, just clueless. She is unaware of the damage she did to Leonard. This doesn't excuse it, rather I think she can do good things for Leonard as well as bad. Recall that Sheldon experimented on Leonard (grinding up bugs in his food "for science"), yet later pleaded with Penny to not hurt Leonard and to stay with him. Depending on the rest of the scene, this could play out very differently. The promos for "The Tangible Affection Proof" were very misleading.

Edited by hamerman55
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Further to Armygirl's and Chrismo's comments about Beverly, I find her distant and clinical, but in no way the evil shrew some people paint her as. Just MHO.

I completely agree with you. With a twist ;)

 

She is distant, clinical and... Not that good at her job. This is what makes her funny to me. She is a world-famous expert on child-rearing yet we are given proof after proof that she made terrible mistakes (nothing mean-spirited) when raising her own kids, especially her middle son.  So for all her remarkably complex syntax and intimidating vocabulary,  she has never had any idea how to be a "good" parent (like most parents) so she messed up (like most parents).

In this regard, she is the archetypal comedy shrink (technically, she is a neuropsychiatrist or something like that, but you get the idea) : desperately Freudian, somewhat exploitative, capable of explaining away any human emotion and, above all, just as cuckoo for Coco Pops as any of her patients. 

That is the fun of her; under her cool exterior, she is messed up : it only took Penny the lightest of pushes to extract from her an ex-wife all-time classic ("son of a bitch") even though Bev tried to pretend she did not care about her husband cheating; only a couple of drinks are needed to turn her into a sex fiend; she does get a warm feeling when hugging her son but has no idea what that is; etc. 

 

Furthermore, she can actually be useful when she is not trying to be professional about it. While I agree with hamerman55 to an extent in that her appearance in The Skank Reflex Analysis was very undermined by her not being physically present, her "buck up" was ultimately a great piece of advice (the "sissy pants" was a bit overkill). Leonard was agonising, torturing himself over things he did not have the power to change (Penny "sleeping" with Raj, Priya leaving for India). That was a waste of time and energy. So Bevely basically told him to stop overthinking : plow through and see what happens. Eventually, that is what he did and it worked ! When he went to Penny to tell her that no matter what (and whom she slept with), he would always be her friend, that was him bucking up. When he told Priya about Alice, that was him bucking up. When he dumped Priya, that was him bucking up. When he took the jump and asked Penny out (in spite of having thought it through), that was him bucking up.

Beverly can have good ideas, when she does not filter them through all the theoretical horsefaeces.

Edited by Chiara
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