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One ship I don't hear that much about is Howardette. They seem to be pretty drama-free, considering what Lenny and Shamy are always going through. 

 

I think they are supposed to be kind of a perfect couple, so we can worry more about the higher-profile couples.

 

Hopefully no babies until season 9!

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Yeah, I know, that's the huge issue - it's very hard to tell. Sheldon tried masturbating for money, but that was the pilot and we know that they changed him after that. We also know that he agrees that sexual arousal is "a cross we all must bear," so apparently he has experienced it. But over what? We know he's "pictured the universe naked" and shuddered in a way that suggests he was mightily horny over that picture. We also can imply from Leonard's teasing that Sheldon's one-night stand with the Geology book was not so innocent, either.

 

Not to mention, by the way, that this is a TV show. He's a character that will be brought along as the show sees fit, and his sexuality is going to operate more to serve the plot and the punchlines than by reality.

 

That said, he sounds a lot like someone who finally had his testosterone tested after his second marriage was about to fail due to his lack of interest and open mocking of sex. He was a large hairy guy, and the doctors thought he was crazy to think that this was a problem, but tests proved he had the testosterone levels of a 10 year old boy. Treated himself to raise his testosterone levels and he was a whole different person. Not sure that I really want to see this happen to Sheldon, and I am positive that the show is never going to go there, but boy. Sometimes I wonder.

Maybe there is some level of kink that will light his fuse. Thankfully it's not Catholic school children, but maybe there is some kind of paraphilia. I'm sure it's widely speculated on in FF but I do picture him a little like what I've read of John Ruskin. Or, after, shellshocked and pale, but determined to do his duty, he returns to the, ahem, front to continue his service out of love. Alternatively, they sit companionably and read together the rest of their lives. I'm sure there is someway they can bring this to an, um, climax.

They are certainly going to use the rest of the time they have to get there. Sad really, because there is more to life than sex, and he can have all that other stuff now, if he wants.

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This is brilliant. They would be terrific as a couple. They should come to the next public social event. Raj would not know in advance and become all jealous.

Can anyone write a fic about them, please? I seem to be the only person doing that :(

Also I currently ship Raj/Yvette. I think that it was a very romantic set-up because Raj really cares about Cinnamon and every time she is in pain etc. that really worries him, so it was nice that not only everything with Cinnamon turned out well but he also met a girl who was interested in him after being lonely for do long. Also I like Tania Raymonde, she is a very good actress.

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Yeah, I know, that's the huge issue - it's very hard to tell. Sheldon tried masturbating for money, but that was the pilot and we know that they changed him after that. We also know that he agrees that sexual arousal is "a cross we all must bear," so apparently he has experienced it. But over what? We know he's "pictured the universe naked" and shuddered in a way that suggests he was mightily horny over that picture. We also can imply from Leonard's teasing that Sheldon's one-night stand with the Geology book was not so innocent, either.

Not to mention, by the way, that this is a TV show. He's a character that will be brought along as the show sees fit, and his sexuality is going to operate more to serve the plot and the punchlines than by reality.

That said, he sounds a lot like someone who finally had his testosterone tested after his second marriage was about to fail due to his lack of interest and open mocking of sex. He was a large hairy guy, and the doctors thought he was crazy to think that this was a problem, but tests proved he had the testosterone levels of a 10 year old boy. Treated himself to raise his testosterone levels and he was a whole different person. Not sure that I really want to see this happen to Sheldon, and I am positive that the show is never going to go there, but boy. Sometimes I wonder.

First of all, you don't have to be aroused to masturbate and have orgasm. Sometimes physical simulation is all that takes. I am not going to use that as proof that Sheldon doesn't have urges, because I think that he does, but it isn't a proof that he has urges either.

Uh, the universe thing... he seemed to be aroused by that to me too, but it may be simply his excitement at the realization of greatness of the universe. Also, he didn't say that he pictures universe naked. He said that it makes him happy to look at the universe naked. It can mean that he pictures universe naked but the way I understood it he was talking about looking at universe while he is himself naked. There might be a sexual element in that but it can also just resemble a sense of freedom that he rarely feels (due to his OCD and so).

Geology book... not even going to discuss your theory. So ridiculous.

I agree with you about his comment about sexual arousal. The way he said it was basicly him confessing that he can get sexually aroused, too. The truth, I believe, is quite simple. Sheldon has sexual urges. He is likely heterosexual. Although he doesn't like to talk about sex he probably knew quite a lot about it from an early age, like he knew about lots of other things. After learning about it, he simply decided that sex is something that would take his mind away from more important things and something that he would most likely not enjoy, due to his aversion toward dirt and germs. He probably came to that conclusion even before he hit puberty. When he did, he simply found a way to control his urges. If anything, he masturbates, but even that is questionable. But Amy is slowly changing him, showing him that it is OK to act upon those urges with the right person, which is a good thing. He doesn't have some sort of a disorder or weird sexual habits, he just has a good sense of self control, his own views of sex, and some problems that turn him off from sex, such as mysophobia.

Don't read too much into things. Some of the things you wrote seemed just off and even disturbing to me. No offense to you.

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First of all, you don't have to be aroused to masturbate and have orgasm. Sometimes physical simulation is all that takes. I am not going to use that as proof that Sheldon doesn't have urges, because I think that he does, but it isn't a proof that he has urges either.

Uh, the universe thing... he seemed to be aroused by that to me too, but it may be simply his excitement at the realization of greatness of the universe. Also, he didn't say that he pictures universe naked. He said that it makes him happy to look at the universe naked. It can mean that he pictures universe naked but the way I understood it he was talking about looking at universe while he is himself naked. There might be a sexual element in that but it can also just resemble a sense of freedom that he rarely feels (due to his OCD and so).

Geology book... not even going to discuss your theory. So ridiculous.

I agree with you about his comment about sexual arousal. The way he said it was basicly him confessing that he can get sexually aroused, too. The truth, I believe, is quite simple. Sheldon has sexual urges. He is likely heterosexual. Although he doesn't like to talk about sex he probably knew quite a lot about it from an early age, like he knew about lots of other things. After learning about it, he simply decided that sex is something that would take his mind away from more important things and something that he would most likely not enjoy, due to his aversion toward dirt and germs. He probably came to that conclusion even before he hit puberty. When he did, he simply found a way to control his urges. If anything, he masturbates, but even that is questionable. But Amy is slowly changing him, showing him that it is OK to act upon those urges with the right person, which is a good thing. He doesn't have some sort of a disorder or weird sexual habits, he just has a good sense of self control, his own views of sex, and some problems that turn him off from sex, such as mysophobia.

Don't read too much into things. Some of the things you wrote seemed just off and even disturbing to me. No offense to you.

The thing that disturbs me is that he had made a choice of how to live, which hurt no-one and with which he was content, and he keeps getting pushed into what are for him really uncomfortable situations. There was nothing wrong with his prior choices. It worked for him. I get confused by the difference between coercing, re-programming and wooing. But things got so uncomfortable for him all round that he effectively had a breakdown and ran off. One generally runs toward what one wants, not away. I so don't get Sheldon.

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The thing that disturbs me is that he had made a choice of how to live, which hurt no-one and with which he was content, and he keeps getting pushed into what are for him really uncomfortable situations. There was nothing wrong with his prior choices. It worked for him. I get confused by the difference between coercing, re-programming and wooing. But things got so uncomfortable for him all round that he effectively had a breakdown and ran off. One generally runs toward what one wants, not away. I so don't get Sheldon.

He is slowly warming up toward acting upon his urges but to actually act upon them and going further than kissing is still a big step for him. And we know how he hates change. I think that he just needs time to think about all that and slow things down, that it is way he ran away.

The thing that disturbs me is that he had made a choice of how to live, which hurt no-one and with which he was content, and he keeps getting pushed into what are for him really uncomfortable situations. There was nothing wrong with his prior choices. It worked for him. I get confused by the difference between coercing, re-programming and wooing. But things got so uncomfortable for him all round that he effectively had a breakdown and ran off. One generally runs toward what one wants, not away. I so don't get Sheldon.

He is slowly warming up toward acting upon his urges but to actually act upon them and going further than kissing is still a big step for him. And we know how he hates change. I think that he just needs time to think about all that and slow things down, that it is why he ran away.

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The thing that disturbs me is that he had made a choice of how to live, which hurt no-one and with which he was content, and he keeps getting pushed into what are for him really uncomfortable situations. There was nothing wrong with his prior choices. It worked for him. I get confused by the difference between coercing, re-programming and wooing. But things got so uncomfortable for him all round that he effectively had a breakdown and ran off. One generally runs toward what one wants, not away. I so don't get Sheldon.

 

There is a termination clause in the RA, so all this "pushing" argument seems simply hollow to me. Amy plays it hard sometimes (or at least she thinks so), but she played it much harder before, and Sheldon has proved to be far from defenceless.

Edited by LMD3014

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There is a termination clause in the RA, so all this "pushing" argument seems simply hollow to me. Amy plays it hard sometimes (or at least she thinks so), but she played it much harder before, and Sheldon has proved to be far from defenceless.

 

He is travelling from being beyond such things, and not being unhappy about it, to being peturbed by such things and being distressed about it. And many think he is on the right trajectory with this, but I tend to wonder if maybe ignorance of eros was blissful for him.  Also, though I know many root for him, the politics of his conversion sits uneasily with me. Even though there is no intent do anything but tell a story, part of this goes to how individuals find fulfillment and what is the most desirable (sorry) outcome for a life. There are more diverse outcomes for people in the world than encouplement and I'm not predisposed to think that every ending actually requires "a happy ending".  And his continual resistance against himself makes me unsure of what his inclinations are. Usually the hero struggles with externalities but Sheldon is his own obstacle - if being a partner/parent is actually his objective.

 

But don't mind me,  I obviously just can't read his signals that are telling many others that he is really keen on going down that path and he just needs more coaxing, and I don't have faith and I know nothing. Or I believe Sheldon when he says no. LOL. But it will end where it ends and that's fine.

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@Norg I think that one of the mysteries of the show was that "what is Sheldon's deal" and actually we still have no definite answer to that. I won't pretend I myself never thought that he might be better without sex or anything sexual whatsoever. But the thing is that it's not just Sheldon not wanting sex but it's also Sheldon wanting Amy. You'll say that when he asked her to be with him he made it clear that nothing will change in physical terms and you'll be right. But then again Sheldon is not stupid. At some point he must have realized that Amy wants all the physical things to happen. So next to the big question of why Amy keeps pushing while she knows Sheldon isn't willing to participate in any physically intimate act I would have the question of why Sheldon remained in this relationship knowing Amy wants more. Not only that but he altered the no physical rule by kissing her. Or grabbing her hand and then saying that he hates it. That looks like a bunch of mixed signals to me. As LMD said Amy thinks she pushes hard but I really doubt that and I am pretty sure that lately it's Sheldon the one who has all the control. I think the real problem is that Sheldon doesn't know what he wants. Does he want his life before Amy?? Does he want Amy no matter what?? Does he want to get physical with her and he is scared?? I have no clue and neither does Sheldon. Amy wants him, she believes he wants her back probably doesn't have much confidence to believe she'll make him show his interest without trying hard so she comes across as being pushy but I don't think she pushes more than Sheldon allows her to. In addittion to that I find her pushy ways to make him do something he doesn't want to just as disturbing with his slick ways to keep her from doing something she wants to(not that she would otherwise but Sheldon's comment still bothers me). So finally Sheldon realized he has to make a choice. I don't know if the fact that he went away means he ran from Amy so he doesn't care. Personally I think he just needed to think without her influencing his decision. But I really want for him to finally realize what is that he wants and be with her or let her go. Same goes for Amy. She needs to decide if she can live with Sheldon and no sex or if she wants to leave him. They both need to grow. Anyway that's the way I see it hope I managed to make you understand how I perceive that situation.

@MisLav tbh I am not sure that Sheldon's night with the geology book was in any way a sexual experience for Sheldon. But I am positive that the writers intended for that scene to have a sexual undertone mainly cause they are trying to make the audience familiar with the notion of a sexualy interested Sheldon and mainly to tease us into thinking he slept with Amy. I don't find rediculous the idea that it might be a sexual experience for him. Personally I just think that he read the book out loud and Leonard took the chance to tease him. As for the naked universe or him being naked while gazing at the universe. I don't know I think that it doesn't really make sense to strip off his clothes and go the roof and gaze at the sky. I really believe he was referring to the naked universe and I think he was a bit turned on. Same goes with the self massage and maybe when he failed to deal with his closure problems but I have doubts about those. What I think tho is that Sheldon has a level of sexuality he is just not sure if he wants to use it.

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@Norg I think that one of the mysteries of the show was that "what is Sheldon's deal" and actually we still have no definite answer to that. I won't pretend I myself never thought that he might be better without sex or anything sexual whatsoever. But the thing is that it's not just Sheldon not wanting sex but it's also Sheldon wanting Amy. You'll say that when he asked her to be with him he made it clear that nothing will change in physical terms and you'll be right. But then again Sheldon is not stupid. At some point he must have realized that Amy wants all the physical things to happen. So next to the big question of why Amy keeps pushing while she knows Sheldon isn't willing to participate in any physically intimate act I would have the question of why Sheldon remained in this relationship knowing Amy wants more. Not only that but he altered the no physical rule by kissing her. Or grabbing her hand and then saying that he hates it. That looks like a bunch of mixed signals to me. As LMD said Amy thinks she pushes hard but I really doubt that and I am pretty sure that lately it's Sheldon the one who has all the control. I think the real problem is that Sheldon doesn't know what he wants. Does he want his life before Amy?? Does he want Amy no matter what?? Does he want to get physical with her and he is scared?? I have no clue and neither does Sheldon. Amy wants him, she believes he wants her back probably doesn't have much confidence to believe she'll make him show his interest without trying hard so she comes across as being pushy but I don't think she pushes more than Sheldon allows her to. In addittion to that I find her pushy ways to make him do something he doesn't want to just as disturbing with his slick ways to keep her from doing something she wants to(not that she would otherwise but Sheldon's comment still bothers me). So finally Sheldon realized he has to make a choice. I don't know if the fact that he went away means he ran from Amy so he doesn't care. Personally I think he just needed to think without her influencing his decision. But I really want for him to finally realize what is that he wants and be with her or let her go. Same goes for Amy. She needs to decide if she can live with Sheldon and no sex or if she wants to leave him. They both need to grow. Anyway that's the way I see it hope I managed to make you understand how I perceive that situation.

@MisLav tbh I am not sure that Sheldon's night with the geology book was in any way a sexual experience for Sheldon. But I am positive that the writers intended for that scene to have a sexual undertone mainly cause they are trying to make the audience familiar with the notion of a sexualy interested Sheldon and mainly to tease us into thinking he slept with Amy. I don't find rediculous the idea that it might be a sexual experience for him. Personally I just think that he read the book out loud and Leonard took the chance to tease him. As for the naked universe or him being naked while gazing at the universe. I don't know I think that it doesn't really make sense to strip off his clothes and go the roof and gaze at the sky. I really believe he was referring to the naked universe and I think he was a bit turned on. Same goes with the self massage and maybe when he failed to deal with his closure problems but I have doubts about those. What I think tho is that Sheldon has a level of sexuality he is just not sure if he wants to use it.

I agree, he was just reading the book but writers decided to tease us.

About the universe, I was always imagining that he would look at the sky from his room window, naked. Not as good as being on the roof, but possible, maybe wirh the help of a telescope... Also, how exactly do you picture universe... naked?

Edited by Mislav

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I do think that people are overthinking the line about seeing the universe naked.  I think it was simply a line to show how much Sheldon is intrigued and fascinated by physics and the ability of physics to see into the depths and origins of the universe--the equivalent of seeing a person naked, that is, opened up for scrutiny.  The little shiver was meant to play up the "naked" line, but, IMO, not to imply a direct sexual connotation.  It's similar to the way they have exaggerated the L/P as parents trope--the more they play up the metaphor, the sillier and funnier it gets, but it doesn't mean that they are really his parents.

 

Anyway, I do think that Nogravitas is right in saying that Sheldon had made a choice about how to live and likely made that choice at an early age, before puberty, since he had already set himself the goal of winning a nobel prize early on.  He has seen sex and the pursuit of sex as a distraction from the true faith.  My opinion is that much like a monk sets aside the pleasures of the flesh and worldly things in order to more purely seek spiritual knowledge and understanding, Sheldon at an early age chose to set aside sexual pursuits and romantic relationships in order to devote himself to "pure science".  And this was likely made that much easier by the fact that he was not really around people his own age when he was beginning to hit puberty.

No self-respecting college student is going to hang around with a pre-teen, much less develop any kind of sexual or romantic relationship unless they want to go to jail.  And if he had no sexual curiousity, again, finding all that "nonsense" beneath him, then he wouldn't have been asking questions or anything like that.  Couple all of that with a religiously conservative, likely overprotective mother, and he basically skipped all that stuff most kids go through in their middle school or high school years.

 

The way to SHeldon's heart (and likely his loins) is through his brain.

 

I don't think gender matters to him much at all.  What matters to him is whether a person is smart or dumb.  I do think that he tends to be somewhat dismissive of "girls" because he feels they're often compromised by their hormones and/or their need or desire to make babies (if their biological clock is ticking, for instance) and that all of that interferes with their ability to focus on intellectual pursuits.

But he also looks down his nose at men, like his friends, who similarly waste their time and energy chasing women and pursuing sexual partners.  Again, they allow sexuality to take their focus off of "higher" pursuits.

 

He sees it all as giving in to baser urges that serve little purpose, in his view.  In many ways, he is stuck in that prepubescent way of thinking, the way young children usually do not consider "romance" and kissing and all those "yucky" "lovey-dovey" things to be desireable.

 

But that doesn't mean that there isn't something or someone out there that would eventually poke a hole in his finely constructed ivory tower.

I don't think that it's a matter of challenging his choices or forcing him to change as much as it is a matter of maybe offering him a vision of how a romantic relationship might not be as much of a waste of time or energy as he once thought.

 

If he made those decisions when he was a child, he made them with a child's perspective and a child's understanding.  Even though he is an adult and knows the scientific aspect of the physical demonstrations of sexuality--he knows how babies are made, he knows the bodily functions of genitalia, he knows how many muscles it takes to kiss--what he doesn't know are the emotions behind the physical aspects, from kissing to hugging to sex.

 

I think that his relationship to Amy began as a pleasure at finding someone who seemed to be an intellectual equal who also seemed to eschew sexual pursuits (she wasn't looking for a romantic/sexual relationship) and with whom he could talk an an intellectually pleasurable level.

 

I think that what has happened is that both of them have blossomed in their own ways into a different level in their relationship but in different ways.

Once Amy started hanging out with Penny and Bernadette and found the friends she'd never had in childhood, her seemingly long-buried self came forward.  To me, one of the most important steps was when she found out that Penny and Bernie were having a "girls night" and went to Penny and said, "I'm a girl."  In that moment she was sort of reclaiming that part of her that had been sublimated.  Although she had apparently decided that her once-a-year-to-appease-her-mother dates were not going to be romantic or sexual, it seems that her sexuality was still there, simply waiting for a chance to grow again, now that she's in a "safe" environment, if you will.  These friends aren't going to shun her or make fun of her (apart from friendly banter) or play tricks on her.  That was apparently the germ of the idea of Amy having a girl-crush on Penny, experiencing a delayed development of something that some girls go through in adolescence.

I think that Amy was also developing more affection for Sheldon as a friend.  Then coupled with her growing sense of herself as a person with romantic possibilities, her feelings for Sheldon started going down a different path.

 

For Sheldon, I think that he consciously or intellectually freely acknowledges his friendship with Amy, but considers it superior to the others' relationship because it doesn't involve "unsanitary" exchanges or other wasteful, germy, icky things.  But underneath it all, he is very attached to Amy from the beginning--hence the cat accumulation in her absence.  And as their relationship develops he becomes more possessive of her in a way much deeper than his "normal" level of possessiveness.

He was possessive of Dr. Plimpton, but again, in only an intellectual sense.  His angry "she's my friend and you're playing with her" was, of course, not about wanting her romantically or sexually.  In fact, his ability to buy and offer her things like sanitary napkins and bowel-regulating yogurt speak to his complete disconnect of any sexual connotations over those items.

Sheldon is also possessive of Leonard and of his own mother.  He didn't like it when Leonard seemed to be picking Wheaton over himself and he really didn't like it when his mother seemed to be paying more attention to his friends than to himself.

But with Amy, we get the one and only time Sheldon has ever physically struck someone, and it's because Leonard dared to mention his groin and Amy in the same thought.  BAM!  Sheldon's inner caveman immediately makes it clear that Leonard's groin was not to come into play with Amy.  "She's not for you!" is another way of his inner caveman saying, "The woman is MINE!"

Sheldon had no problem with Leonard spending the evening with Amy--in fact, he was happy he didn't have to go, himself.  But he felt the need to make it clear that Amy was not to be seen as anything more.  It's funny to me that both Sheldon and Amy kind of had the same thought that night.  Sheldon thought Leonard might be making the moves on Amy and Amy thought that Leonard had fallen in love with her.  :)

 

Even so, Sheldon still doesn't feel the need to change the relationship.  Until Amy goes out with Stuart.  Sheldon is confident that she couldn't possibly be interested, but he also acknowledges that the nature of their relationship doesn't preclude her from going out with someone else, since they're not "pair-bonded".

But once the reality hits home, the inner caveman begins to reassert himself and Sheldon finds the idea of her developing a romantic or sexual relationship with anyone other than himself to be "abhorent".

While he tries to change things without changing them--as is his wont--he nevertheless feels the need to bind her to him, at least, as long as there's no touching.

 

Amy doesn't ask him to change their relationship.  She doesn't tell him that she wants to be his girlfriend.  She wasn't wooing or pursuing him, other than that drunken stolen kiss and a couple of requests for physical interaction ("Kiss me where I've never been kissed before" and "French kissing...culminating in second base", but settling for some cuddling.)  He was the one who felt the need to go after her--so much so that he couldn't wait until the day after her date, but barged in on it, and then had the Relationship Agreement ready to go by the time she got home.

 

But though she may be wanting to move forward faster than he does, I think that for him it's a matter of not knowing that it may indeed be possible to have both a full relationship as well as the intellectual focus to achieve the heights of his field.

 

What worked for 11-year-old Sheldon doesn't have to be all there is for him.

However, I don't think it's simply a matter of "well, you've been dating for 4 years, it's about time you just gave it up to her".  I do think that he has to achieve the desire on his own, just as he developed the romantic desire on his own--through enjoying her intellect and her company and finding her to be the kind of person that engendered those feeling in him.

I think his development of physical desire--not just as expression of affection, but also as something that he can come to terms with in relation to his other issues--is something that he has to do in his own way, not because he's being pressured or teased or threatened with a break-up.

 

I've been saying all along that if it was Sheldon who wanted a sexual relationship and Amy was the one holding back, I don't think anyone would feel comfortable saying that after 4 years she should just give in and let him have his way with her.  If she was the one who had issues with physical desire or the actual physical act of sex, would anyone be saying, "Come on, you're a grown woman!  Just spread those legs--you'll like it!"??  Or that Sheldon should break up with her if she wouldn't have sex with him just because he was ready for it before she was?

 

Likewise, I think that it's perfectly okay for him to take his time getting there.  I don't think there is any doubt of his affection for her, but his sense of the speed of the progress of their relationship is different than hers.  He's always saying, "It's ONLY been  ___ years".  The four years they've been dating have seemed to be flying by to him, faster than he seems ready to deal with.

 

So, again, I think the way to Sheldon's heart is through his brain.  I think that nothing excites him more than intellectual stimulation--smart conversation with a smart woman is what fascinates him and makes him want to spend time with her, and from that grows affection and love and desire.

 

He's not interested in supermodels or Catholic School Girl outfits or Snow White costumes.  That Star Trek costume, on the other hand...

 

I think that when he does begin to have sexual desires for Amy it will begin in a subconscious way.  I think it could very well be like the way he found her attempts to make him like her by making him happy, just on a deeper scale.  Again, not because she puts on some "sexy" outfit (unless it's to play more Star Trek-style "doctor"), but because she fascinates him with her intellect.

 

And serves him spaghetti with little hot dogs.

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I do think that people are overthinking the line about seeing the universe naked. I think it was simply a line to show how much Sheldon is intrigued and fascinated by physics and the ability of physics to see into the depths and origins of the universe--the equivalent of seeing a person naked, that is, opened up for scrutiny. The little shiver was meant to play up the "naked" line, but, IMO, not to imply a direct sexual connotation. It's similar to the way they have exaggerated the L/P as parents trope--the more they play up the metaphor, the sillier and funnier it gets, but it doesn't mean that they are really his parents.

Anyway, I do think that Nogravitas is right in saying that Sheldon had made a choice about how to live and likely made that choice at an early age, before puberty, since he had already set himself the goal of winning a nobel prize early on. He has seen sex and the pursuit of sex as a distraction from the true faith. My opinion is that much like a monk sets aside the pleasures of the flesh and worldly things in order to more purely seek spiritual knowledge and understanding, Sheldon at an early age chose to set aside sexual pursuits and romantic relationships in order to devote himself to "pure science". And this was likely made that much easier by the fact that he was not really around people his own age when he was beginning to hit puberty.

No self-respecting college student is going to hang around with a pre-teen, much less develop any kind of sexual or romantic relationship unless they want to go to jail. And if he had no sexual curiousity, again, finding all that "nonsense" beneath him, then he wouldn't have been asking questions or anything like that. Couple all of that with a religiously conservative, likely overprotective mother, and he basically skipped all that stuff most kids go through in their middle school or high school years.

The way to SHeldon's heart (and likely his loins) is through his brain.

I don't think gender matters to him much at all. What matters to him is whether a person is smart or dumb. I do think that he tends to be somewhat dismissive of "girls" because he feels they're often compromised by their hormones and/or their need or desire to make babies (if their biological clock is ticking, for instance) and that all of that interferes with their ability to focus on intellectual pursuits.

But he also looks down his nose at men, like his friends, who similarly waste their time and energy chasing women and pursuing sexual partners. Again, they allow sexuality to take their focus off of "higher" pursuits.

He sees it all as giving in to baser urges that serve little purpose, in his view. In many ways, he is stuck in that prepubescent way of thinking, the way young children usually do not consider "romance" and kissing and all those "yucky" "lovey-dovey" things to be desireable.

But that doesn't mean that there isn't something or someone out there that would eventually poke a hole in his finely constructed ivory tower.

I don't think that it's a matter of challenging his choices or forcing him to change as much as it is a matter of maybe offering him a vision of how a romantic relationship might not be as much of a waste of time or energy as he once thought.

If he made those decisions when he was a child, he made them with a child's perspective and a child's understanding. Even though he is an adult and knows the scientific aspect of the physical demonstrations of sexuality--he knows how babies are made, he knows the bodily functions of genitalia, he knows how many muscles it takes to kiss--what he doesn't know are the emotions behind the physical aspects, from kissing to hugging to sex.

I think that his relationship to Amy began as a pleasure at finding someone who seemed to be an intellectual equal who also seemed to eschew sexual pursuits (she wasn't looking for a romantic/sexual relationship) and with whom he could talk an an intellectually pleasurable level.

I think that what has happened is that both of them have blossomed in their own ways into a different level in their relationship but in different ways.

Once Amy started hanging out with Penny and Bernadette and found the friends she'd never had in childhood, her seemingly long-buried self came forward. To me, one of the most important steps was when she found out that Penny and Bernie were having a "girls night" and went to Penny and said, "I'm a girl." In that moment she was sort of reclaiming that part of her that had been sublimated. Although she had apparently decided that her once-a-year-to-appease-her-mother dates were not going to be romantic or sexual, it seems that her sexuality was still there, simply waiting for a chance to grow again, now that she's in a "safe" environment, if you will. These friends aren't going to shun her or make fun of her (apart from friendly banter) or play tricks on her. That was apparently the germ of the idea of Amy having a girl-crush on Penny, experiencing a delayed development of something that some girls go through in adolescence.

I think that Amy was also developing more affection for Sheldon as a friend. Then coupled with her growing sense of herself as a person with romantic possibilities, her feelings for Sheldon started going down a different path.

For Sheldon, I think that he consciously or intellectually freely acknowledges his friendship with Amy, but considers it superior to the others' relationship because it doesn't involve "unsanitary" exchanges or other wasteful, germy, icky things. But underneath it all, he is very attached to Amy from the beginning--hence the cat accumulation in her absence. And as their relationship develops he becomes more possessive of her in a way much deeper than his "normal" level of possessiveness.

He was possessive of Dr. Plimpton, but again, in only an intellectual sense. His angry "she's my friend and you're playing with her" was, of course, not about wanting her romantically or sexually. In fact, his ability to buy and offer her things like sanitary napkins and bowel-regulating yogurt speak to his complete disconnect of any sexual connotations over those items.

Sheldon is also possessive of Leonard and of his own mother. He didn't like it when Leonard seemed to be picking Wheaton over himself and he really didn't like it when his mother seemed to be paying more attention to his friends than to himself.

But with Amy, we get the one and only time Sheldon has ever physically struck someone, and it's because Leonard dared to mention his groin and Amy in the same thought. BAM! Sheldon's inner caveman immediately makes it clear that Leonard's groin was not to come into play with Amy. "She's not for you!" is another way of his inner caveman saying, "The woman is MINE!"

Sheldon had no problem with Leonard spending the evening with Amy--in fact, he was happy he didn't have to go, himself. But he felt the need to make it clear that Amy was not to be seen as anything more. It's funny to me that both Sheldon and Amy kind of had the same thought that night. Sheldon thought Leonard might be making the moves on Amy and Amy thought that Leonard had fallen in love with her. :)

Even so, Sheldon still doesn't feel the need to change the relationship. Until Amy goes out with Stuart. Sheldon is confident that she couldn't possibly be interested, but he also acknowledges that the nature of their relationship doesn't preclude her from going out with someone else, since they're not "pair-bonded".

But once the reality hits home, the inner caveman begins to reassert himself and Sheldon finds the idea of her developing a romantic or sexual relationship with anyone other than himself to be "abhorent".

While he tries to change things without changing them--as is his wont--he nevertheless feels the need to bind her to him, at least, as long as there's no touching.

Amy doesn't ask him to change their relationship. She doesn't tell him that she wants to be his girlfriend. She wasn't wooing or pursuing him, other than that drunken stolen kiss and a couple of requests for physical interaction ("Kiss me where I've never been kissed before" and "French kissing...culminating in second base", but settling for some cuddling.) He was the one who felt the need to go after her--so much so that he couldn't wait until the day after her date, but barged in on it, and then had the Relationship Agreement ready to go by the time she got home.

But though she may be wanting to move forward faster than he does, I think that for him it's a matter of not knowing that it may indeed be possible to have both a full relationship as well as the intellectual focus to achieve the heights of his field.

What worked for 11-year-old Sheldon doesn't have to be all there is for him.

However, I don't think it's simply a matter of "well, you've been dating for 4 years, it's about time you just gave it up to her". I do think that he has to achieve the desire on his own, just as he developed the romantic desire on his own--through enjoying her intellect and her company and finding her to be the kind of person that engendered those feeling in him.

I think his development of physical desire--not just as expression of affection, but also as something that he can come to terms with in relation to his other issues--is something that he has to do in his own way, not because he's being pressured or teased or threatened with a break-up.

I've been saying all along that if it was Sheldon who wanted a sexual relationship and Amy was the one holding back, I don't think anyone would feel comfortable saying that after 4 years she should just give in and let him have his way with her. If she was the one who had issues with physical desire or the actual physical act of sex, would anyone be saying, "Come on, you're a grown woman! Just spread those legs--you'll like it!"?? Or that Sheldon should break up with her if she wouldn't have sex with him just because he was ready for it before she was?

Likewise, I think that it's perfectly okay for him to take his time getting there. I don't think there is any doubt of his affection for her, but his sense of the speed of the progress of their relationship is different than hers. He's always saying, "It's ONLY been ___ years". The four years they've been dating have seemed to be flying by to him, faster than he seems ready to deal with.

So, again, I think the way to Sheldon's heart is through his brain. I think that nothing excites him more than intellectual stimulation--smart conversation with a smart woman is what fascinates him and makes him want to spend time with her, and from that grows affection and love and desire.

He's not interested in supermodels or Catholic School Girl outfits or Snow White costumes. That Star Trek costume, on the other hand...

I think that when he does begin to have sexual desires for Amy it will begin in a subconscious way. I think it could very well be like the way he found her attempts to make him like her by making him happy, just on a deeper scale. Again, not because she puts on some "sexy" outfit (unless it's to play more Star Trek-style "doctor"), but because she fascinates him with her intellect.

And serves him spaghetti with little hot dogs.

I agree completely. Sheldon has never been a simple person and the one needs to try real good if she wants to find a way to his heart and become physically intimate with him. Just a nitpick: I made a theory about Sheldon deciding that sex isn't something that would work for him early on, not Nogravitas (I was quoting his previous reply when I was posting that comment).

And yes, I agree about you with the whole universe thing. It was probably just what you said: something actually innocent. After all, Sheldon is often over-reacting and is excited with simple things or things that no many other people find interesting, and he has a special mind.

But it looks like we are getting off topic, so I think that everything that needs to be said was said.

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I agree completely. Sheldon has never been a simple person and the one needs to try real good if she wants to find a way to his heart and become physically intimate with him. Just a nitpick: I made a theory about Sheldon deciding that sex isn't something that would work for him early on, not Nogravitas (I was quoting his previous reply when I was posting that comment).

And yes, I agree about you with the whole universe thing. It was probably just what you said: something actually innocent. After all, Sheldon is often over-reacting and is excited with simple things or things that no many other people find interesting, and he has a special mind.

But it looks like we are getting off topic, so I think that everything that needs to be said was said.

 

I was referring to Nogravitasatall's post number #612

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There is no topic here. It's an open forum about ships and whatever creams your corn.

And thanks Phanta, the consent issues do bother me. If he decides he wants to go that way, in his own time, great. Alternatively he may end up just collaborating from duty or agape, and then going on to what really interests him primarily, which is the stuff she generates from what's under her hat, not under her skirt (and behind the Blu-Ray copy of Gravity). That's a kink for him I could get on board with. Not quite like "Kiss of the Spiderwoman", but maybe similar.

He is an unconventional character and deserves an unconventional trajectory. I have issues about the thinking that, if he just gets enough of a taste of the sugar, he will experience a "conversion", because if you consider history there has been a lot of suffering arising from that thesis, and in the US particularly the "normal" paradigm has recently been overturned. However, if he does make his own choices then who am I to get bugged by that (other than there is just one less diverse model out there in the public view).

As an additional thought maybe Amy will stop with the comfortable stereotypes, embrace him for what he is and devise some other solution for them, without the metaphorical white picket fences.

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I agree with phanta about the universe thing. I think the naked part was referring to the mysteries of the universe so when he understands some of those mysteries it's like the universe is being naked before him. The way I saw it that was meant to be the joke that the "asexual" Sheldon was kinda turned on by that. And tbh I know people who love what they do as much as Sheldon and they find it truly fascinating so that whole scene made sense to me.

Anyway I really liked your comment phanta. You are right when you're saying that probably the reaction would be different if Amy was the not ready one. But and I speak only for myself if the roles where reversed I would be really ok if Sheldon decided that he cannot be with Amy if they are not being physical. And I am not referring to the case that Amy didn't want to have sex yet but at all. Cause right now Sheldon isn't sure he is ever going to get there and it's his right. So that changes it for me. So if Sheldon wanted sex and Amy didn't I would much prefer it if he left her instead of cheating on her or forcing her. I think it's more decent. At this case that Amy wants to have sex Sheldon said that it's not impossible for it to happen so I suppose that is why she tries to make it happen but and that's just my opinion she would stay whatever Sheldon decided cause he is more important to her. I could only picture her leaving him if he treated her badly or questioned her intellect or something like that.

Anyway I also enjoyed very much your interpetation of the characters and how they percieve a romantic relationship or a sexual desire. Thanks for posting!!!

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Penny: I know this is none of my business, but I just... have to ask - What's Sheldon's deal? 

 

Leonard: What do you mean deal?

 

Penny: You know, like, what's his deal? Girls? Guys? Sock Puppets?

 

Leonard: Honestly we have been operating under the assumption he has no deal.

 

Penny: Come on everybody has a deal.

 

Howard: Not Sheldon. Over the years we've formulated a number of theories about how he might reproduce. I'm an advocate of mitosis.

 

Penny: I'm Sorry?

 

Howard: I believe one day Sheldon well eat an enormous amount of Thai food and split into two Sheldons.

 

Leonard: On the other hand, I think Sheldon might be the larval form of his species and someday he''ll spin a cocoon and emerge two months later with moth wings and an exoskeleton.

 

Penny: Okay, well, thanks for the nightmares.

 

Haha I think all his friends even Sheldon just presumed the same assumption, that Sheldon had no interest in procreation or any form of romance. To the point any one of those crazy scenarios would be plausible. Enter Amy although he has resisted change, I think he just hates being out of control, she has incorporated some form of romance into his murky existence. I agree that if Sheldon shiver lol wants coitus with Amy, and she doesent unlikely at best, then Sheldon should end his relationship with Amy. But we all know Amy Is 100% in, and has really compromised a lot of her ideals and values, and pretty much self respect to be with Sheldon. Sheldon however did say to Leonard and Penny in S6 he has not ruled out the idea of coitus, so who knows no one would even imagined Sheldon and Procreation would go together in one sentence, but hey things change, people change every day even Sheldon.         

Edited by 3ku11

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YOU'RE reading Affectation? Heavens! Tensor, if I lived a thousand lifetimes I wouldn't deserve you as a friend. You're way too kind.

Couldn't have put it better myself. "Ships are like wands, you don't choose them, they choose you." So lame, but so, so true.

I'm a fan of canon (and the Shamy, and the Lenny, and the Howadette, oh my!) but absolutely detest anyone who hides behind it to vindicate their hatred, aka the wails of the "you delusional Shenny shippers! eat sh*t!" (I swear I've seen that somewhere, probably on one of my Shenny fic reviews...) Jim and Kaley are extremely good looking, thus are thrust together often (not just in 'delusional' fan fic, but in the media, does anyone remember their spread from People's Most Beautiful People?) so of course people will 'ship' them. And it's not a slight on Johnny or Mayim, because Christ Almighty it's just a SITCOM. Where's the harm in being imaginative? Which brings me to...

Okay, hold the phone. You live in a reality? Last time I checked, Penny and Leonard are characters on a sitcom, not the First Couple. When you aggressively attack anyone who disagrees with your precious canon, you, and everyone who echoes your sentiment, sound extremely threatened and frankly, lead me to believe that Shenny shippers are not the ones living in a fantasy world. Until you get royalties from TBBT writers to defend the couples they write, you could stand to back off a little because you're not articulating, you're spewing.

Look at it like this -- no one is changing your mind about Penny and Leonard, and you're not changing anyone else's about Sheldon and Penny. Take a knee.

I would actually be OK with Shenny stories if there wouldn't be so much Leonard and Amy bashing-especially stories written by Risknight, for example, are well written but the constant bashing evident in some of her stories makes it impossible to keep my interest and get into it. I don't like the character bashing. Also, reasons for the bashings often seem way over the top and blown out of porportion for me, not to mention that most of them seem to be changing Sheldon too fast or simply make it the case that he actually had feelings for Penny all along but but hid and make the same with Penny it instead of describing how they fall in love etc. I enjoyed very few Shenny stories, The Fledgling Attachment Quandry being one of them, I am also planning to read Affectation and I have feeling that I am going to like it. Sure there are character bashing in stories with other pairings too-there are some Lenny stories bashing Sheldon, for example-but character bashing seems to be most common in Shenny stories than stories about any other couple in this fandom. For me, the Shenny is one of the pairings that I don't especially like but I sometimes I find a good fic written about that pairing that I enjoy reading and I know that with good open minded writing it can work. Not insluting anyone, just my opinion about Shenny, since I don't ship them but I don't ignore or bash that pairing either and I would like to see them as friends on a show since I like both Sheldon's and Penny's character.

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Tbh i dont think anyone even shippers or non shippers doesent matter what ppl think or say, beleive or think S and P shld be a couple, as it would be disengenious to the show. Ive nvr seen appeal i diddnt even kno wat Shenny was until i went online, i thought it was a form of choc bar lol im serious. Obviousley its not real never has been, its all perception and just selective thinking to suit your ethelogy, if you choose to see something, you see something even if its farfetched concept at best. I think they always played them as friends, antagonists e.t.c I dont really beleive Penny can be bothered to tolerate Sheldon anymore, as she becomes more and more cyincal about aspects of her life she starts to become more smarter to Sheldons blatant insults. S and P have never wanted anything from each other, i have always enjoyed their comedic chemistry, it has always eluded me as to why anyone would want to ruin tje show for one ep, just to see them date. The concept has always been a foreign one, and creepy at best. But like some have said here its a sitcom, imagination is a neccessity, not a big deal, theirs a difference in wanting something to happen, and expecting it to. I have never got the whole bashing, the relationship of Sheldon and Penny would nvr of existed without Leonard, vice versa for Lenny when it comes to Sheldon, even go as far and say no Leonard, no Howard & Raj, then no Shamy. While Leonard is the social nuclues of the group according to Amy haha, Penny, Leonard, Sheldon and co despite their differences are all true friends. So portraying any form of imagery that indicates conflict, or bashing of certain characters is just 1. OOC 2. Uneccessary.

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