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I agree with a lot of the things being said here, in particular in relation to the Shamy, since it's true they have regressed them. I guess what I find annoying more than anything is the lack of continuity and how the characters go back and forth in how they are. Also, I don't know if you've sensed this, but doesn't it feel that Molaro always plays coy when giving interviews about the show, and wants to project a sort of "false innocence"? I mean I don't think they "let the characters" take them where they want to go, or that they don't at least have an idea when a season begins, of what they want to accomplish in that particular season. it seems almost unconscionable for that to be the case in a sitcom with almost 20 million viewers.

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Maybe i am not seeing the point of Lenny... dont get me wrong they are cute, they are really cute and both are fantastic acters...

Maybe i dont see the point... i just love the show and amy and sheldon are my favourite caracters, but you are right... lenny is important too, but maybe sometimes too important... for example i found it very sad that the whole 100th episode is just of Lenny... sometimes they are a little bit to much in the forground, sometimes they are a öittle bit annoying... 

but again, i love the show, if i understand it or not... i cant analyse or so, i just enjoy the show...

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I'm glad that different people are expressing preferences, and ideas. For those that just keep repeating the same worn out ideas(canon,canon), they are the equivilent of grave diggers. Glacial relationships aren't viable, chemistry plus passion burns brightly! I'm so bored of canon fodder, and if anyone quotes viewing figures, it's Sheldon that makes the show popular(there are plenty of shows involving boring couples, but only one with a Sheldon!). 

Edited by Tripper
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I'm glad that different people are expressing preferences, and ideas. For those that just keep repeating the same worn out ideas(canon,canon), they are the equivilent of grave diggers. Glacial relationships aren't viable, chemistry plus passion burns brightly! I'm so bored of canon fodder, and if anyone quotes viewing figures, it's Sheldon that makes the show popular(there are plenty of shows involving boring couples, but only one with a Sheldon!), stop deluding yourselves. 

Oh i agree with all you said!! thank you i couldnt say it better!!

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I got very tired of the Shenny after a while. i just don't think they have that much in common. The on-again-off-again schtick got old quick. i'm glad they're more stable now, but I still Ship Leonard and Stephanie. They seem like a better match to me.

 

And now I wait for the heated replies to come...

Yes that idea of lining a couple up from the beginning, is just old fashioned and lazy writing. Yes I'm talking to you TBBT writers, this is the post- Postmodern period; of freedom and experimental creation, referencing everything, we are not expecting a nineteenth century novel.

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Yes that idea of lining a couple up from the beginning, is just old fashioned and lazy writing. Yes I'm talking to you TBBT writers, this is the post- Postmodern period; of freedom and experimental creation, referencing everything, we are not expecting a nineteenth century novel.

yes it was there many many times, but for me tbbt is a show that basically isdifferent from all other sitcoms and shows, wich are just about love and couples... thats why i love shamy, cause it is definetly a relationship but not in a normal way... i am not normal too so i love it... lenny is just a repeat of what we have seen many times...

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I think you are wrong. Sheldon is NOT the heart of the show. Why? Because he needs someone to play off of.  Sheldon is NOT what makes the characters come together. As said in the show itself, Leonard is. But if we look at the bigger picture what is really central to the show are NOT Sheldon and Amy, but Leonard, Sheldon and Penny. Leonard and Penny for the obvious reasons (stated in the first episode of the show) but also, and this is what you seem to forget, the dynamic between Sheldon and Leonard. Sheldon and Leonard's relationship will always be, within the confines of the show, more important than Sheldon and Amy's.

There is some evidence to say Sheldon is the heart of the show though, or at least was. He show wouldn't be where it is without him I don't think. He won an Emmy for Season 2 and then a Golden Globe and Emmy for season 3, which just shows how strong the character was early on.

Then after the 'Sheldon effect' there is the power of three. Sheldon, Leonard and Penny. These three are the central characters and their wages reflect this. They are paid substantially more than the others and this hasn't changed even though they claim its an ensemble show.

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 it's Sheldon that makes the show popular(there are plenty of shows involving boring couples, but only one with a Sheldon!)

 

I think this is a very important statement to the whole concept of The Big Bang Theory and why it might be frustrating to be a Shamy fan.  I am although I just happen to like Lenny better.  I think the problem for Shamy fans is that to keep Sheldon "Sheldon" is to basically keep him a guy who still thinks girls have cooties.  For Shamy to grow, Sheldon must grow and I think that is the problem the writers face.  How do you please Shamy fans with a normal (to a certain degree) relationship development, while maintaining everything we like (or find annoyingly cute) about Sheldon.

 

And I'm not sure how there can be a real discussion about the show if we don't adhere to what is canon unless we want to have a thread about alternate universes and the show...

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I think this is a very important statement to the whole concept of The Big Bang Theory and why it might be frustrating to be a Shamy fan.  I am although I just happen to like Lenny better.  I think the problem for Shamy fans is that to keep Sheldon "Sheldon" is to basically keep him a guy who still thinks girls have cooties.  For Shamy to grow, Sheldon must grow and I think that is the problem the writers face.  How do you please Shamy fans with a normal (to a certain degree) relationship development, while maintaining everything we like (or find annoyingly cute) about Sheldon.

 

And I'm not sure how there can be a real discussion about the show if we don't adhere to what is canon unless we want to have a thread about alternate universes and the show...

I think the 'alternative universes' ideas are fun to play with. With Sheldon changing, that is a dilemma for writers and fans. I don't see him changing, even when Amy attempted, he just got his closure after she had left. I think sheldon, rightly sees the rest of the characters as wrong thinking! I think if they all started acting like him(mirroring) , he might have something to think about.

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I am sure that those professionals who write for or produce the number one comedy on television will give the criticism and advice from those who have no idea what they are talking about all of the attention that such criticism and advice deserves. 

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I am sure that those professionals who write for or produce the number one comedy on television will give the criticism and advice from those who have no idea what they are talking about all of the attention that such criticism and advice deserves. 

If I was a CBS drone, I'd keep repeating this as well!

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I definitely think there should be an episode where Sheldon thinks he has gone mad for whatever reason. An episode without a single undertone of relationshippery would be a breath of fresh air.

 

I noticed that Sheldon got his closure after Amy left too... What does that tell you!

He needs closure on his closures!

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I am sure that those professionals who write for or produce the number one comedy on television will give the criticism and advice from those who have no idea what they are talking about all of the attention that such criticism and advice deserves. 

 

Two for one!!!!!

Logical Fallacies

Search LogicalFallacies.info

 

 

You are here: Logical Fallacies > Fallacies of Relevance > Irrelevant Appeals > Appeal to Popularity

 

Appeal to Popularity

Explanation

Appeals to popularity suggest that an idea must be true simply because it is widely held. This is a fallacy because popular opinion can be, and quite often is, mistaken. .

 

Appeal to Authority

Explanation

An appeal to authority is an argument from the fact that a person judged to be an authority affirms a proposition to the claim that the proposition is true.

Appeals to authority are always deductively fallacious; even a legitimate authority speaking on his area of expertise may affirm a falsehood, so no testimony of any authority is guaranteed to be true.

 

Also might be an Ad hominem in there too. :icon_biggrin:

Child_eating_popcorn.jpg

 

Edited by Disgusted
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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl

I think this is a very important statement to the whole concept of The Big Bang Theory and why it might be frustrating to be a Shamy fan.  I am although I just happen to like Lenny better.  I think the problem for Shamy fans is that to keep Sheldon "Sheldon" is to basically keep him a guy who still thinks girls have cooties.  For Shamy to grow, Sheldon must grow and I think that is the problem the writers face.  How do you please Shamy fans with a normal (to a certain degree) relationship development, while maintaining everything we like (or find annoyingly cute) about Sheldon.

 

And I'm not sure how there can be a real discussion about the show if we don't adhere to what is canon unless we want to have a thread about alternate universes and the show...

 

The problem with your argument is that Sheldon has never ever been the kind of guy who thinks or acts as if "girls have cooties" (pre.Amy Farrah Fowler example: Dr Plimpton- Post Amy Farrah Fowler example: Amy Farrah Fowler). He thinks everybody who he considers beneath his intellectual level to "have cooties". He made no distinction between men and women, to him, they all had "cooties"

 

Except, of course, for Amy Farrah Fowler, since he considers her to be on his intellectual level. Although last season was spotty on that regard.

Edited by Sursonica
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The problem with your argument is that Sheldon has never ever been the kind of guy who thinks or acts as if "girls have cooties" (pre.Amy Farrah Fowler example: Dr Plimpton- Post Amy Farrah Fowler example: Amy Farrah Fowler). He thinks everybody who he considers beneath his intellectual level to "have cooties". He made no distinction between men and women, to him, they all had "cooties"

 

Except, of course, for Amy Farrah Fowler, since he considers her to be on his intellectual level. Although last season was spotty on that regard.

 

Okay but then how does Sheldon remain Sheldon and still grow with respect to his relationship to Amy? 

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Okay but then how does Sheldon remain Sheldon and still grow with respect to his relationship to Amy? 

 

There's a song in there somewhere.....

 

"I'm so alone, and I feel just like somebody else

Man, I ain't changed, but I know I ain't the same"

 

Or, for the real old-timers:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKlSVNxLB-A

 

There is a riddle from an old computer game.....What can change the nature of a man?

 

Regret

Edited by Disgusted
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Okay but then how does Sheldon remain Sheldon and still grow with respect to his relationship to Amy? 

They just stay friends! It's strange, but it seemed to me that in a way, L forced himself on P, and A seems to be forcing herself on S. First they inculcate themselves into the others life, and then they try to change them into what they want. 

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There's a song in there somewhere.....

 

"I'm so alone, and I feel just like somebody else

Man, I ain't changed, but I know I ain't the same"

One Headlight, The Wallflowers.

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Guest I'm not dead Cheryl

They just stay friends! It's strange, but it seemed to me that in a way, L forced himself on P, and A seems to be forcing herself on S. First they inculcate themselves into the others life, and then they try to change them into what they want. 

 

Sheldon was the one who started "hanging out" more with Amy due to Leonard's suggestion.

It was Sheldon the one who hit Leonard when he thought he was pulling the moves on Amy.

It was Sheldon the one who asked Amy to be his girlfriend.

it was Sheldon the one who drafter the Relationship Agreement including stuff like date nights, physical displays of affection during anniversaries, boo-boo's and ouchies, etc.

It was Sheldon the one who initiated hand-holding.

It was Sheldon the one who decided to take care of sick Amy even after she told him to leave her alone.

It was Sheldon the one who told first Penny and then Amy how he hadn't ruled out physical intimacy with Amy.

and I could go on.

 

How is that Amy "forcing" herself on Sheldon?

 

First they inculcate themselves into the others life, and then they try to change them into what they want.

 

oh, you mean like when Sheldon tried to condition Penny using Chocolates as postiive reinforcement?

Edited by Sursonica
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They just stay friends! It's strange, but it seemed to me that in a way, L forced himself on P, and A seems to be forcing herself on S. First they inculcate themselves into the others life, and then they try to change them into what they want. 

 

I don't see how Leonard made Penny change.  Could you elaborate?

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Sheldon was the one who started "hanging out" more with Amy due to Leonard's suggestion.

It was Sheldon the one who hit Leonard when he thought he was pulling the moves on Amy.

It was Sheldon the one who asked Amy to be his girlfriend.

It was Sheldon the one who initiated hand-holding.

It was Sheldon the one who told first Penny and then Amy how he hadn't ruled out physical intimacy with Amy.

 

How is that Amy "forcing" herself on Sheldon?

 

oh, you mean like when Sheldon tried to condition Penny using Chocolates as postiive reinforcement?

 

Sheldon is so caught up in that "stop it, I love it" phase with Amy...

 

Is there a song in that?

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I don't see how Leonard made Penny change.  Could you elaborate?

 

I would like to know this also. 

 

The only person on the show that has tried to change Penny is Sheldon ---- S3E03 The Gothowitz Deviation

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They just stay friends! It's strange, but it seemed to me that in a way, L forced himself on P, and A seems to be forcing herself on S. First they inculcate themselves into the others life, and then they try to change them into what they want.

It's a reflection of life. It's more about creating new opportunities. Penny did things her way, then saw a different way of doing things and adopted some of those things that appealed to her. It's not coercive, but it is a lot about propinquity. If I move to Germany I learn German, whether I want to or not. Or I stay isolated.

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Sheldon was the one who started "hanging out" more with Amy due to Leonard's suggestion.

It was Sheldon the one who hit Leonard when he thought he was pulling the moves on Amy.

It was Sheldon the one who asked Amy to be his girlfriend.

it was Sheldon the one who drafter the Relationship Agreement including stuff like date nights, physical displays of affection during anniversaries, boo-boo's and ouchies, etc.

It was Sheldon the one who initiated hand-holding.

It was Sheldon the one who decided to take care of sick Amy even after she told him to leave her alone.

It was Sheldon the one who told first Penny and then Amy how he hadn't ruled out physical intimacy with Amy.

and I could go on.

 

How is that Amy "forcing" herself on Sheldon?

 

oh, you mean like when Sheldon tried to condition Penny using Chocolates as postiive reinforcement?

Inculcate and manipulate the other into doing what you want, while making it seem like their idea!

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