Episodes 7.12 "the Hesitation Ramification" (January 2)

[BlackWhiteRose]

I loved Bernadettes laugh at the Cheesecake Factory *LOL* OMG that was so hilarious I couldn`t stop laughing *LOL*

And Howard at the end *LOL*

Sheldon dropping his pants in front of Amy *LOL*

Raj and Stuart were pretty amusing too *LOL*

Awww the Leonard/Sheldon scene was so sweet! (where Leonard was awake at night ´cause he couldn`t sleep) I love their friendship!

Poor Penny they cuted her scene on that TV Show. I felt sorry for her. And it was okay from Leonard he didn`t accept Pennys drunk proposal.

 

I´ll figure out what I`ll vote for.

Edited January 3, 2014 by BlackWhiteRose

[Dracones]

Ugh, terrible episode. So incredibly awkward; something I don't want in a comedy.

[koops]

I thought the episode was good. Better than I expected. It started off rather weak with the first 2 scenes, but then it picked up from there.

 

I really enjoyed Shamy in this episode, like I said in the Shamy thread, although I was expecting Amy to be a Debbie Downer, from the report and the promo, it actually doesn't come across this way at all in the end, because she seemed to have her own stance on the scientific theory of humor. I think this episode was kind of reminiscent of Herb Garden/Zazzy, the two of them spending an afternoon arguing over scientific theories. Even though nowhere near as good as those episodes, it was funny and sweet. They seem pretty solid and comfortable with each other, I think the fact that they can joke over breakups is proof of that. And I thought the prequels scene was very sweet. I think my favorite line of the episode is "Maybe you have stick up your prefrontal cortex". LOL!

 

I also though Raj and Stuart were funny, although nothing extraordinary. 

 

But now for the meaty part of the episode. It was a tough one for Lenny, but I think it wasn't as bad as it seems.

 

I would not make this into a women vs men argument. I think it's really simplistic and reductive to do that. I don't think the writers were implying Leonard was wrong and Penny was right, or that they were implying we should empathize with Penny. I think they just portrayed an argument between them in a pretty realistic way given who these characters are. 

 

I don't think Penny has ever genuinely faced the reality of her situation, and has been hiding her head in the sand for many years, thinking "One day… One day I'll make it big". I think she finally realized that this is serious, and it's probably not going to happen. And to have Leonard voice that realistic and rational fear out loud to her made her lash out not because she is angry at him but because it hits too close to home.

 

And Leonard, being Leonard, he doesn't get angry. He's a nurturer and he tries to fix things. So he acts like it's his fault even though it's not. The problem is, things now have nothing to do with him and there's not much he can do to fix things. It's all about Penny having to grow up and buck up for herself. All he can do is support her, but he's much more mature than her when it comes to career stuff, and so he will say things she won't like to hear. And he will feel bad about it, because it's Leonard and he has a huge heart. 

 

I'm not saying Penny was right in acting like she did, or that the timing and the way she proposed wasn't awful for Leonard. At all. I felt bad for Leonard throughout the episode. But just because the story we're being shown is Penny acting stupid and Leonard being apologetic, it doesn't mean the writers are saying Penny is right and Leonard is wrong. They're just saying "This is the way life is sometimes". People react badly and say and do stupid things and people like Leonard, whose nature isn't to be passive-aggressive and angry and dramatic about it, will try to make things better even though they did nothing wrong. I think Leonard acts mature because he looks at himself and asks "What did I do wrong, and how can I fix this?" whereas Penny is immature and is still at a stage where she wants to blame others for her failures. 

 

I understand that this was not an easy episode, Lenny wise, but I found it very realistic and I think it could be a sign of some good character growth for Penny. She does need to face the truth about her dreams and hopes and deal with it before it's too late. I think it's very grown-up stuff and I think for Lenny to come out of this together would only do good to their relationship. It's not about passion and sex anymore, it's about real, grown up, life-long planning. And facing it together. 

 

eta: Oh, I forgot. The Shelnard moment. I was very happy to see that, since I had been worrying about these two recently. You can say a lot of bad things about Sheldon, but he is always very delicate when it comes to Leonard and his problems with Penny and always has Leonard's back about that. Yes, they put in the sign joke to dampen the heaviness of that scene, but all in all it was a very sweet moment with Sheldon trying to be there for him the best that he knows how to. 

 

I know it was very heavy an episode by TBBT standards, but 7 years on I think they can afford a serious heavy moment every once in a while. These characters are all on the verge of some big changes in their lives, and friendships, as well as relationships, are strengthened by hard times as much as they are by companionship and fun. 

Edited January 3, 2014 by koops

[tmp]

BRAIN LESIONS!!!

[Convict13]

First how do you put up with all those adds on CBS?  

 

Anyway,

Interesting episode,  I liked the darker humour of the Lenny, and I thought fine acting by both Kaley and Johnny in this episode.

It was an interesting idea about how hard it is to become an actor and how many people make it etc. bearing in mind that they are in the midst of contract negotiations for the main three.

And slowly, slowly Bernadette becomes Howard's mum, when she is not doing her "Sally" impression.

Sheldon's bi-story was really not very funny at all, a bit like his jokes.

 

I would say good bordering on OK but no more.  

Edited January 3, 2014 by Convict13

[Radagast]

I have not watched this yet, nor have I read the thread. I just needed to vent somewhere about the show's stupid official Facebook page. I didn't even know that last night was a new episode, although I'm sure my PVR automatically recorded it, but the stupid facebook page had the climatic moment of the show in a massive picture with large impossible-to-not-read text.

 

I *hate* spoilers.

 

That's one less "Like/Follow/WhateverTheyCallItNow" they have on Facebook now.

[djvang]

Wow, so that episode was ummmm...... .....I don't know it felt off to me.   Not nearly as funny as I would expect from an episode coming back from the winter hiatus and right after the adorable Christmas episode we left off on, this one felt strange and kind of sad.  I mean why would Sheldon suddenly care whether people think he is funny or not.  Also, Sheldon is definitely funniest when he's not trying to be, so watching him try to be made him seem I don't know out of character a little bit and less funny.  I know he likes  trying to come up with equations, formulas and theories that definitely prove complex sociological constructs like the time he tried to make an algorithm for making friends, or the time Amy and Sheldon worked on a theory about how gossip travels through social groups.  But, those episodes where a LOT funnier than this one.  This one felt like filler.

 

The best part of the episode for me was all Raj/Stuart scenes. I love fact that Raj and Stuart are hanging out together again, I've never been a fan of turning them into a "couple."  But with LENNY hanging on the edge of a cliff, I don't know I wouldn't mind see Raj and Stuart pick up the slack a little bit.  They are adorable together as "friends."  and I think they could even be just as cute together as main bro-ships on the show if given more time to spend together.  Their scenes in the mall were my favorite.

 

I liked the scene where Sheldon pulled his pants down in front of Amy, and she really STARED for a long moment there didn't she before grinning like the Cheshire Cat, so that was cute.  But, I didn't really care for the fact that Sheldon acted oblivious  towards LENNY's troubles or Penny's disappointment over her scene getting cut.  I prefer it when they use to make Sheldon the unknowingly wise one.  Like the times when he would give his friends helpful advice.  Remember when he tried to help Raj meet women or that time he tried to help Leonard with his relationship with the Doctor.   I like it when they show Sheldon actively taking an interest in his friends lives instead of  ignoring their problems to focus on his self.  They always make him look bad when they do that.  This week it looks like they really made both Sheldon and Leonard look super DUMB this week and it made everything they said and did in the episode a lot less funnier than usual.

 

Leonard is usually really good at "lying" to Penny he lied to her about his sadness over his mom so he could get laid.  He pretends to be interested in things he can't stand like football just to make her happy, so it seemed odd that this week he just haphazardly goes around spitting out hurtful truths that seemed designed specifically by writers to put their relationship back on the rocks again.  I mean what gives, last episode during Christmas they were happy couple decorating a tree together and getting along fine, even flirting and teasing each other without either side getting their feelings hurt to badly.   Leonard knew when Penny walked out the door she was really devastated and embarrassed by losing her chance to be on NCIS.  Its obvious he went over there to comfort her, but instead they just have him put his foot in his mouth the way Sheldon usually would and make things worst.

 

Then later he tries to fix it by getting Penny an audition for a movie, but come on Leonard knows she doesn't really like Star Wars that much none of the girls do, so it just came off self centered he'd choose a movie he'd like to see her in probably fantasizing about her dressed up in Princess Leia bikini then actually thinking about her career and what kind of films or shows she'd actually want to be in.  I mean COME ON!  Leonard is not that big of jerk.  He's not.  He is a sweet, smart guy who even has the nickname of ROMANCE NINJA for his ability to woo his lady and make her feel better.  Why not pull out the cello again and serenade her with a cutesy song at the door like he did when she was mad at him over Alex flirting with him.  I mean why do the have to keep screwing up this relationship its not really funny anymore! 

 

I get that they have 23 episodes each season so the have got to fill the time with something, but i mean why not just let them get engaged already its just stalling at this point!  What are they waiting for the final season or something!  They can get SHAMY together then instead and move LENNY forward for crying out loud.  If LENNY breaks up over this its clearly just stalling for time.  Its ridiculous!!  They were fine last episode, absolutely fine and then Penny gets upset over something that has nothing to do with Leonard, she gets drunk and Leonard acts like an idiot and suddenly he thinks it could be all over.  That is crappy writing that is!!!

 

LENNY isn't even my favorite couple on show, SHAMY and Howardette passed them a long while back, but I still want them together and it really annoys me when writers do crap like this just out of blue.  No build up nothing.  Even if they don't break up it doesn't matter this clearly made LENNY look bad for each other for no good reason, wasn't even funny like when Penny turned out to be married to Zack.  Zack at least brought the jokes!!  What did this accomplish exactly??   I mean Penny needs to go to AA or something watching her drink every episode has long sense stopped being funny, she looks pathetic now!   I mean seriously has it really been ten years and she is still a waitress at the cheesecake factory?  That is just sad I feel bad for her character now.  She has had so little growth in fact she's getting worst in some ways.  In the beginning of the show she wasn't like this total drunkard that she has become.

 

 

I mean I'm glad next week synopsis says she quits her job, I hope it sticks, I'm tired of seeing her waste her life away.  What happened to her going back to school?  Did she ever finish that?  I mean writers just keep dropping the ball on so many story lines! What about the guys getting tenure?  Why isn't Sheldon more concerned with figuring out how to make up for that mess of his own career he made when Leonard disapproved his element existence?  Instead they have him wasting time on trying to come up with a way to be funny.  THAT IS JUST STUPID!!  HE IS ALREADY FUNNY!!

 

He doesn't need to try to be funny it ruins all his jokes.  Sheldon has always thought he was funny before he ever tried to prove it so why should he suddenly care if Leonard doesn't laugh at his jokes.  Leonard never really laughs at his jokes much and it never seem to bother Sheldon before.  Also, Amy and Sheldon use to have the same sense of humor what happened to that!!??  I remember when he would tell a lame joke and she laugh at it because she genuinely thought it was amusing now its like they are trying to make her more like Penny and Bernadette to the point its messing with the SHAMY and I don't like that!!  She doesn't need to be like them, faking her laughter at her boyfriend's/husband's jokes, the girls don't need to all morph into the same stuck up type girl  The kind that thinks "I'm better, cooler, smarter, sexier, funnier than you" type person.  Penny has always acted that way towards Leonard and it's always been one of her most unattractive qualities to me that she behaves as though she is so much "cooler" and his nerdy hobbies are all lame and pathetic.  Well her drinking all the time and acting like a dumb blonde waitress makes her look ten times more pathetic than Leonard's nerdy love for Star wars or comic books or whatever.  I mean its CRAZY for hr to act like she is in anyway better than he him! I love this show, but sometimes they just mess around with these people and don't even try to make them act sensible or caring, or even FUNNY!!  I mean if they are going to have another bump in the Leonard/Penny relationship for the umpteenth time at least let it lead to something truly hilarious!!  Not just waste our time.

 

So far from what I've seen of next week in that little preview, well I'm not impressed.  Why do they have Sheldon acting like a DOG!?? I mean really a dog?  First he acts like their kid back in season 3 which was mildly cute, but now he's acting like he's their pet give me a break!  It doesn't make any sense and it doesn't look funny either.  It really looks like they are trying to find every way imaginable to keep each of the main relationships from growing any further.  What are they all so afraid of?  Will it really kill the show if Penny actually was good at her job and didn't drink all time I DON'T THINK SO!!  Would it really kill the show if they didn't have Leonard act so afraid of losing Penny all the time and grow some BALLS!!  I DON'T THINK SO!! and I know it wouldn't kill the show to have Sheldon act like a grown ass man for a change instead of like a damn one note joker or childish prankster.  That kick me sign joke was terrible I mean just awful!     Sheldon may be selfish, egotistical, whiny, quirky, crazy at times and even down right childish, but is not plain STUPID!!  That was just STUPID!!   He is someone who hates change also, so when Leonard told him their relationship might be over it makes no sense that he would pull a prank like that.  The Sheldon we all know and love would have been telling Leonard that according to their roommate agreement they can't break up or going on about how he thinks Leonard could fix things with Penny.  That is what the old Sheldon would have done, the one that said "Please don't hurt my friend to Penny"  and told her that he likes homeostasis!  Why now would he suddenly not give a damn about the possibility of them breaking up and totally ignore Leonard's pain over it.  Makes no sense whatsoever!!  When Leonard was upset before in past Sheldon actually try to genuinely comfort him even if he was really bad at it he at least TRIED.  This time it was obvious from the start of the scene Sheldon was just there to make some dumb joke by the end.  I'm just glad he didn't say BAZINGA too, it would have ruined the show's most famous quote for one of the lamest jokes of the episode.

 

I really don't know what else to say except for I don't really care about this silly fake drama they are cooking up for LENNY, because before you know it they will be making up again and the whole thing will be forgotten about like yesterday's garbage.  I am not usually so harsh about these episodes, but this one was really not that great considering it was the first show back from break they should have wanted to come out with a real HIT leading into second half of the season not a time waster filler type episode.

 

I will give them some credit for Raj/Stuart scenes those were most appealing ones, and for at least not totally recklessly, wrecking SHAMY or Howardette too.  But, man poor LENNY, I feel sorry for this couples its like they are always the show's punching bag, They have become "that couple" you know the one on every romance drama type TV show that you know are going end up together in the end, but really shouldn't because they seem so incompatible and can just never quite seem to get their S H I T together.  No matter how hard they try to.  They go through so much unnecessary over top nonsense over the course of the show that by the end of it you really do start to almost wish they never got together in the first place because they drag things down to a sad place too much.  This show is not supposed to be like One tree Hill, this is not Dawson's Creek or any number of other cute, but overdramatic teen soapy romance dramas, i mean why so much DRAMA this week! 

 

Its not necessary, its certainly not funny.  Its supposed to be a SITCOM!  Things should be lighthearted most of the time and funny ALWAYS!  Comedies should make you smile not make you want to roll your eyes or worst feel "emo." and depressed.  I mean yes couples break up or fight over stuff on sitcoms all the time too, but they are supposed to make the fights FUNNY FIGHTS!  So you don't feel sad for the couples you just laugh at them.  There is nothing funny about having Penny propose while depressed and drunk and having Leonard awkwardly reject her because he's scared she is only saying it because she is drunk.  I mean that is the kind of thing that happens on teenage dramas that leads to one of them crying on floor of shower while the other stares sadly out of the window while it rains and emo rock music is playing in the background.  No! Hell No!  Not on my Comedy! 

 

I don't tune in to watch Big Bang Theory to be saddened, if I wanted that I'd go watch dramas!!  I have lots of actual dramas to watch for that.  I watch Big Bang Theory to laugh and to say "awww he is so cute."  and "aww she is so sweet." and oh there they go those silly nerds Hahahaha!! I come to laugh at the jokes!!   Bernadette wasn't sweet or funny, Amy wasn't sweet or funny,  Sheldon was mean like usual but totally unfunny type of mean not his usual hilarious mean behaviour, Leonard acted like a jackass and wasn't funny, Penny acted like a jackass and was totally depressed that i felt sorry for her.  Howard did nothing much this week at all really which is sad cause Simon is one of the funniest ones usually, but he was given nothing to work with here and only Raj and Stuart were adorable and funny this week.  That is sad!  I almost laughed more during the promo for this week then I did the episode, they put all funniest bits in the promo except for scenes in the mall.  The rest of the episode was either plain unfunny and way too depressing or just felt like filler time wasting stuff that has no real greatness to it.

 

GET IT TOGETHER WRITERS PLEASE!!   Remember this show is supposed to be a COMEDY about a bunch of super intelligent, adorable adult geeks and one really cute, sweet and only slightly ditzy blond waitress not a show about unfunny "EMO" RELATIONSHIP DRAMA NONSENSE that only makes the characters look DUMB and like they don't belong together.   This is not meant to be a cheesy soap opera jeez!

Hmmmmm, sounds familiar. Why don't you just stop watching the show if you hate it so much?

[Guest crankorgan]

The show "Jumped the Shark" and then got Amy!   BA (Before Amy) episodes are better. Every night my local station runs a newer and old episode. The first few seasons are very funny. Then it seems like they started giving every body equal screen time. This caused the plots to get thin!  The best screen moments are always Penny and Sheldon. Sheldon dressing Penny when she fell in the tub!  Junior Rodeo On!   Sheldon cleaning Penny's room.  Last nights show was the worst episode ever! 

[Chaliceinnana]

This was a weird one. It felt like watching Big Bang theory as imagined by a depressed French existentialist.

 

Nothing flowed, everybody seemed doomed and like they knew it. The subplots were about the esoteric nature of humor and about the separation of humanity from itself in a shopping mall...even the pants dropping and fake laugh orgasm seemed like cries of ennui.

 

Just saying, it felt like the episode came from a little darker place than usual.

[koops]

I'm just kind of surprised at the reactions over the "drama" to be honest. And the assertion that sitcoms should ALWAYS ONLY be funny. I have watched a lot of sitcoms in my life (although not a fan of any other than this) and TBBT has by far the less drama of any of them. They shy away from drama whenever possible. Even compared to many sitcoms that are currently airing. Maybe that's why people react so strongly when they throw some in. We are not used to it.

But it's hardly like every episode is as heavy as this one. S7, for the most part, was a lot of fluffy, feel good fun. Other than the weirdness of 7x08. I understand some people might not have liked it but it is a VERY rare occurrence on this show. I think comparing it to teen dramas, especially, seems like a bit of a stretch. Penny's career has always been a ticking bomb, it was bound to come out biting her in the ass. I don't think it compares to Emo moping of teenage breakups. And I don't think one episode like this means the writers are suddenly writing a drama.

[BubbaGump]

I've got to tell ya, I was very disappointed in last night's episode. In fact, I'm not enjoying this current season the way I have past seasons. My favorite episode this season was the Thanksgiving dinner at Howard's with Bernie's dad, Zach and the rest of the crew. My wife and I cried tears of laughter throughout that episode. Sheldon was in rare form. As to last night's episode... I feel Penny was very out of character and so was Leonard. As with a previous Halloween episode, where Penny was drunk and mad at Kurt, Leonard would have gently called it for what it was and let her down gracefully as a gentleman. Remember, Penny said "you're so smart" and Leonard said "yeah, I'm a friggin genius". I've seen posts where people bash Sheldon for being always insensitive and using the kick-me sign (I thought that was hilarious). Apparently, people forget the episode where Sheldon is leaving Penny's room late at night, turns to her and says "Penny, please don't hurt my friend". That was very human and touching. People need to remember, Sheldon is a boy genius and obviously suffers Asperger's Syndrome. As such, he will be very socially awkward, literal to a fault, often clueless and have little sense of humor. That's his character. Although not meant to be a comedy, Fun with Flags, slayed me. What I see as an ongoing problem is that the show is changing direction too much. The girls don't always need to be there and then all of them together. Stewart should be intermittent. Part of the magic with Leonard and Penny was their on and off relationship and their friendship in between. I'll never forget Penny standing outside her door as Leonard came up the stairs, totally racked out from the night before with Jessica Walters, Penny with that big Penny smile, mentioning "the walk of shame". I about died. Lorre and Prady need to get back on track. Remember the format that made the show great, bring in more cameo appearances and for Raj, an occasional Lucy. Otherwise, quit this nonsense or a Season 8 will be unlikely and that would be a travesty. TV stinks!! There is no show I enjoy more than BBT.

[Chrystalie]

 

This was a weird one. It felt like watching Big Bang theory as imagined by a depressed French existentialist.

 

Nothing flowed, everybody seemed doomed and like they knew it. The subplots were about the esoteric nature of humor and about the separation of humanity from itself in a shopping mall...even the pants dropping and fake laugh orgasm seemed like cries of ennui.

 

Just saying, it felt like the episode came from a little darker place than usual.

 

I agree with you (even if, as a old french depressed girl, I'm sure I can be funnier lol).
I found this episode boring. We had better ones in this season.

The fake laugh just remind me "when Harry met Sally" It was probably a big wink to that movie. Why? I don't know.
The part about Sheldon dropping his pants ... I'm glad they kept Amy "oh that is funny" sentence (for those who read the spoilers, they know what I'm talking about) but I don't understand why Sheldon is doing that. 

Actually, he was looking for a way to be funny "orally" not "physically". 

And I notice that Amy is more and more annoyed by the way he is and he acts. And the part she just told him that they should break up (not in that exact way and probably with sarcasm) make me think it's probably time for Sheldon to wake up ... because if their relationship has to stay like this forever, and as much as I'm a Shamy fan, I prefer that they stop and I wish someone better for Amy.

I know Sheldon is growing up, he seems sincere with Leonard. But I'm starting of being tired of the emotionless robot.

 

I hope Leonard and Penny will go through this bad time. They are great together.

And seriously, writers don't know what to do with Rajesh and Stuart or is it just me?
I prefered Raj when he was unable to talk to woman, he seems more confident and funny in a an another way

 

This is my opinion, please don't kill me
 

[Disgusted]

 I have watched a lot of sitcoms in my life (although not a fan of any other than this) and TBBT has by far the less drama of any of them. They shy away from drama whenever possible. Even compared to many sitcoms that are currently airing. 

 

Here's a crazy thought, could the lack of "drama" have something to do with the fact the show is the #1 COMEDY???

[phantagrae]

I didn't post my thoughts about the episode last night because it was very late when I watched it and I was hanging out with my sister.

Anyway, I did enjoy it, as I said before.

I think that there was probably nothing Leonard could have said that would have made Penny happy. If he had gushed about how great an actor he thought she was, she would have called him on the BS. I do wonder what he thinks he knows about her real chances in the business, though. I mean, he was right in pointing out the odds against her, but that doesn't mean that she won't accomplish the things that Penny mentioned. She might not win awards, but there's nothing to say that she couldn't have a real career as a working actor.

So I don't think he should have completely shot her down. In that regard, I think he was, if not wrong, just not as careful as he could have been. He could have left it to her agent to say th harder things.

However, I do think it was pretty realistic for that conversation to go the way it did and I liked that it was awkward and uncomfortable.

I also liked the Shamy scenes. Though there wasn't any big arc of revelation for Sheldon's humor project, I don't think that was the point of those scenes. I like that they were just hanging out, even if Amy was getting tired of his single-mindedness. I actually loved her "I don't think I want to go out with you anymore" or whatever that line was. I think it's good that she can joke and express her boredom with the moment in such a way.

And can I say that I also love the "stick up your cerebral cortex" line. Brilliant!

Anyway, though I thought the Raj/Stuart stuff wasn't as strong as it might have been, I still found some humor there.

And I loved Howard's Star Wars audition tape!

[phantagrae]

I'm just kind of surprised at the reactions over the "drama" to be honest. And the assertion that sitcoms should ALWAYS ONLY be funny. I have watched a lot of sitcoms in my life (although not a fan of any other than this) and TBBT has by far the less drama of any of them. They shy away from drama whenever possible. Even compared to many sitcoms that are currently airing. Maybe that's why people react so strongly when they throw some in. We are not used to it. But it's hardly like every episode is as heavy as this one. S7, for the most part, was a lot of fluffy, feel good fun. Other than the weirdness of 7x08. I understand some people might not have liked it but it is a VERY rare occurrence on this show. I think comparing it to teen dramas, especially, seems like a bit of a stretch. Penny's career has always been a ticking bomb, it was bound to come out biting her in the ass. I don't think it compares to Emo moping of teenage breakups. And I don't think one episode like this means the writers are suddenly writing a drama.

I agree so much!

I posted in the other forum that it is amusing to me that so many people love to complain that the show doesn't do serious moments without puncturing them with humor, but then when the show does a more serious episode, then all of a sudden, some if the same people are complaining that this episode was too serious for a comedy. Can I just say, OH BROTHER!

I think this show has always kept the drama to a minimum, leavening the heavier moments with a funny line. But as koops pointed out, I think this show and the characters have earned the right to take a more serious tack for a moment and address some significant questions. We don't yet know the ultimate outcome, but we do know that this is indeed a comedy and we also know that Leonard and Penny will ultimately be together--I mean, really, we KNOW that. So whatever drama we had in this episode, we know it's not going to last forever, and we also know that this issue between Leonard and Penny isn't over with. The writers would never leave this up in the air, and we know that everything will be okay in the end, even if it takes a little while to get there.

[BazingaFan]

I also agree, phantagrae.  I was surprised that there were so many negative reactions to this one.  I thought it was excellent.  Yes, things are getting stirred up, but it makes things more interesting (and we've had moments like this in the past too).  To each their own, I guess.

[yeahitsmeiknow]

Even though I felt like I was expecting the episode to start and it never really started, I have to admit this episode was actually quite interesting. 

I think Penny's character is really important because she's almost the only one who acts like "normal" people in the show. 

"Normal" people do bad things, get upset, have failures, and she's there to bring contrast in the show.

 

I am actually glad this episode happened because I would like to see penny caring about something else than her relationship with Leonard.

She needs to grow up more than the others characters of the show, and I don't find it bad.

Edited January 3, 2014 by yeahitsmeiknow

[djvang]

I thought the opening scene with the smartphones was very good and very true. I've seen that exact thing at restaurants many times. But then they had to ruin it with the obligatory sex-starved Amy line. At least they got it out the way early this time. For those who might not have caught on yet, I hope this isn't a spoiler, Amy really, really, really wants to have sex with Sheldon but he's not interested.

The rest of the show was just strange. More like a soap opera than a sitcom.

[Chiany]

I'm just kind of surprised at the reactions over the "drama" to be honest.

 

I don't mind Drama, even in a Comedy show.

Hell, it is even mandatory in my opinion from time to time.

 

I would even like to see it happen to Shamy.

The drama in this episode wasn't that bad, it was just everything around it that was just, off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 And the part she just told him that they should break up (not in that exact way and probably with sarcasm) make me think it's probably time for Sheldon to wake up ... because if their relationship has to stay like this forever, and as much as I'm a Shamy fan, I prefer that they stop and I wish someone better for Amy.

 

I've been saying this (about the wake up call) for a few months now, and I stand by my statement this is where they should use Mary for.

Maybe Leonard or Penny can tip her off (Leonard did it before when they broke up).

[queuetee]

I want to commend J and K for their acting. They were both  fantastic in that painful scene and it was painful to watch. When she complains that she has nothing after 10 years in CA, L 's reaction is so poignant  " You have me".   Her hesitation in agreeing that she does is even more poignant because it isn't clear if she still wants an acting career and fame more than him.( IMO!!!)

[Chrismo]

 

I want to commend J and K for their acting. They were both  fantastic in that painful scene and it was painful to watch. When she complains that she has nothing after 10 years in CA, L 's reaction is so poignant  " You have me".   Her hesitation in agreeing that she does is even more poignant because it isn't clear if she still wants an acting career and fame more than him.( IMO!!!)

I agree it was poignant. When she was complaining about having nothing in CA for 10 years at least for me she meant just her acting. But when Leonard said you have me I think her hesitation was more that at that moment she wasn't thinking of her relationship with him. It kind of hit her all at once and IMO that she knew he was right that she did have him and that's why she proposed. I think though she wants the acting career now not just for her though but to please Leonard. Penny has never handled looking bad in front of Leonard.

[djsurrey]

As much as we all enjoy Sheldon dropping his trousers, I just could not give it an excellent.  I think the scene was really odd and really out of character.   Plus the whole episode was really, well just odd (heavy, depressing and the rest was really strange).   I don't think it was bad, but I could only give it an okay.  It was an important episode so it can't be "bad" or below, but it could have been done less heavy as well and been better I think.  I think they could have gotten their point across and still made it a bit more humorous.  Plus I think it was the combination of a depressing Lenny story+odd and uncharacteristic Shamy story+depressing and pathetic Raj/Stuart story that made it really hard to give it above an okay.   Too many negative things going on all at once.

 

The fact that pants dropping was out of character was part of what made it funny. Sheldon reads the element of surprise is often an element in comedy. He yells at Amy and that does not work since it is too jarring and startling. So he drops his pants and she is surprised and finds it funny. This would not be funny if Howard had done it. Since it was Sheldon and all his failed attempts at humor it was so out of normal character and it was hilarious. By the way what guy is hoping his girlfriend will laugh when he drops his pants? Hilarious.

 

As I pointed out in an earlier post Raj could have a lot of success talking to women if he would just choose the right environment. One where his is in his comfort zone. Like an advanced cooking or chief class. Going the mall or bars clearly does not work for him and it is kind of funny that there is an obvious alternative that he has not realized yet. He spent too much time following Howard around. He has to dump those old failed theories. He will find love when he stops looking so hard and instead concentrates more on just developing his interests. He had more dates with anyone else with Lucy and he ran into her when he was not expecting to meet anyone and just being himself.

 

The "Lenny" story was quite consistent with their overall arc over the last six seasons. One never knows when their story will take a twist but we know a twist will come.

 

I would not call the "Shamy" development uncharacteristic. This is just a little bit of Sheldon becoming more humanized. The man who originally did not get sarcasm has progressed to the point that he is attempting to understand humor. He wants to be able to make other people including his girlfriend laugh. In season one that would have been beneath him.

 

I thought it was an excellent episode.

Edited January 3, 2014 by djsurrey

[luke]

Here's a crazy thought, could the lack of "drama" have something to do with the fact the show is the #1 COMEDY???

 

I agree with this, I think people forget it is a sitcom sometimes, whose main obligation is to make you laugh I don't want to see to much drama in a sitcom, I have soaps for that - I really don't think Penny will hit it big in acting or that Lenoard and Penny wil get together for good, as in get married,  until the end of the series - that being said this wasn't one of the better epidodes - Sheldon trying to understand humor was hit and miss, but generally amusing, however, Stuart and Raj hanging out at the mall was completely pointless - the Leonartd and Penny  part was good - they both made mistakes - Leonard should have been more supportive about her part in the show being cut, and Penny should have not proposed to Leaonard while drunk, that was worse than when Leonard proposing to her while they were having sex.

Edited January 3, 2014 by luke

[Cecilia]

I finally got to watch the episode!! I read the thread before watching it and the shamy thread and I expected that I wouldn't like that episode very much but I am glad to say I did like it. It isn't my favourite of the season but it was good. It had a lot of drama and whereas my favourite gerne is dramatic shows including many funny moments the opposite makes me a little uncomfortable. Maybe I never really had the chance to watch a sitcom with bits of drama and actually like it. That is just my personal preference and having said that I'll add that in TBBT they managed to include drama in an otherwise comedic show and I liked it! It wasn't really funny but it gave me the impression that it had to happen because all that plot with Penny and her job will lead to something bigger. I have no idea what that could be but it was like a transitional episode.

 

As far as the main plot concerns which is the Lenny. I felt so so bad for Penny when she realized her scene was cut!!! That must have been a really difficult and embarassing moment for her!!! But I don't really think Leonard was wrong here. He was a little harsh but frankly the truth can be painful but it is absolutely needed!!! She told herself that nearly ten years passed and she has accomplished nothing in relation to her profession. If she wants to be something other than just a waitress then someone had to tell her right?? Someone had to tell her exactly how things are in the real world and give her her options. Either you fight until you do it or you do something else. She is a decent actress but that cannot be her only talent. I get that she needed support at the time and I understand why she was offended but only Leonard cares enough for her to tell her that harsh truth in order to make her move forward. She will set up the destination she just needed the nudge. As for her drunken propose Leonard did very well he said no. Although he really wanted to say yes!! But it has to be done properly!!

 

Aside the drama I actually found the rest of the episode quite funny. I've said that so many times before but s5 and s6 weren't that good for IMO and every episode I enjoy his stories is just a plesant surprise for me!! He was a little pathetic along with Stuart there but it was done in a funny way!! And to tell you guys the truth I am really shy myself and I really get Raj and his anxiety talking to people. I just didn't get one thing. What is the difference between beautiful people and ordinary people??? I mean aren't beautiful people ordinary?? That's just stupid.. But the rest of it is not that far fetched. Damn I wish I had a friend like Stuart for support!! :-p And when Stuart waved to realize that he was looking at a mirror LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Raj's line was also funny ''we'll die here''.

 

The moment I laughed the most was at TCF with Bernie's fake laugh!! That was so funny!!! Melissa nailed it!!!!!!!!! Bernie was a delight in every scene she was!!!! The car scene LOL!!!!!!!!

 

And of course I liked the shamy!!! @Star I get where you're coming from about the whole thing being OOC and odd but I don't know it kind of worked for me. Actually that whole thing with Sheldon trying to be funny reminded me of that scene

If you notice in that scene Sheldon accidentally makes some very good jokes. Of course he only realizes that when everyone laughs with his jokes. And he chuckles a little but in a way that kind of shows that he really really likes that he is funny. That he can make other people laugh. Now we all saw what happened on the Itchy Brain I think it was just a matter of time before he fixated on making other people laugh. He couldn't do it back then and now he just cannot get a simple joke. That was a bit much for him I believe. I enjoyed the shamy and as koops said I really like the place they are right now. I also had a feeling that she is annoyed by his fixation but she tried to approach the issue scientifically and frankly she was right. OK that BRAIN LESIONS was so funny and what he said when she didn't laugh(sorry don't remember it!!). I won't even get started with the pants dropping cause I laughed so much at that!! After Amy's line that it isn't sexier when things are left in the imagination?? Really Shelly??? And by the way this is one of her classic sex jokes that I really didn't mind!! It was funny!!! Plus her casual joking about not wanting to go out with him!!! And he got the joke with no comments like ''why would you wanna stop I am so great''???? Oh how I loved that!!!!!!!! That kind of thing coming from Amy makes me see even her joke comments under a different light. It feels like she has reevaluated things mayme because she realized how much Sheldon cares for her at the last episode. Either way I enjoyed the shamy and I love their interactions and I feel things will only get better!!!!!!

 

Other moments I liked was Sheldon and Leonard walking up the stairs and Sheldon asking Leonard if he thinks he is funny!!!The whole scene was hilarious!!!And their sweet moment at the end!!It was so quiet but it realy had to be it was like a statement..There must be a reason that writers created a scene like that in which literaly no one could even remotely be heard!!!No ''awwwws'' no little chuckles no nothig!!Just at the end with the kick me sign which wasn't all that important!!!!! Amy's face when Bernie faked the laughter and Howard's response ''well I fake my orgasms'' and Howards tape!!! And Amy's ''knock knock knock Amy'' comment!!! I mean LOL!!!!!

 

All in all it was a good episode. I enjoyed it and I enjoyed the actors very much too!!! John throughout the whole episode Kayle epsecially after Penn realized her scene was cut Mayim when Amy was startled and her laughter when she saw Sheldon dropping his pants. Season 7 still looks pretty good to me!!! I hope the second half will be even better!!!!!!!! (I mean for the Lenny too because I have a feeling they are going in a good place with these two).

[Joshcon123]

I liked this episode.

I thought the drama between Lenny worked well, and left me waiting to see what would happen next episode.

I thought that the Shamy parts were quite good, and Amy's reaction to Sheldon pulling his pants down was funny.

Bernadette's fake laugh was hilarious, left me laughing for a while, and Howard's retort was very well done too.

Also, Howard's Star Wars audition provided a few laughs.

The vanity card at the end was truly ironic, though.

All in all, it left me waiting for next week! :-)