Episodes 7.18 'the Mommy Observation' (March 13)

[Kasey]

I thought the episode was good.  It flowed nicely and had some funny and tender moments.  

 

 

Loved Stuart's comments about Lenny.  They were truthful and made me that much more of a Team Lenny fan.  

 

Loved seeing Mary and as a Christian, loved her statements to Sheldon about her struggles.  It was honest and I appreciate the way the writers handled it.

[ehsh]

This show would benefit from hiring writers who have watched previous episodes. If they had, they would not have neglected to mention the scene in series 6 episode 4 ( http://bigbangtheory.wikia.com/wiki/The_Re-Entry_Minimization ), in which Howard discovers Dr. Schneider, his former dentist, leaving his own mother's house via the window. An almost identical situation, which he would almost certainly related to Sheldon, had Sheldon not recalled it already from his eidetic memory.

It is surprising that the actors themselves don't notice these yawning cracks in the continuity, but then again, if the writers are plummeting as they seem to be, I expect most of them are too busy job hunting to notice.

Also a much better gag at the end of the show would have been for Stewart to say, "Well I guess I can go wash my hand now". Seriously guys, the recent quality smacks of plain lazy. get your butts in gear.

[lindofree]

 

 And there are some very good scenes the episode and had more backstory for Howard’s mom having a boyfriend before his Bar Mitzvah

I got a laugh with Howard's backstory.  After the first few words I knew the speech - from Hawkeye to Radar in M*A*S*H

[Martin Pollard]

This show would benefit from hiring writers who have watched previous episodes. If they had, they would not have neglected to mention the scene in series 6 episode 4 ( http://bigbangtheory.wikia.com/wiki/The_Re-Entry_Minimization ), in which Howard discovers Dr. Schneider, his former dentist, leaving his own mother's house via the window. An almost identical situation, which he would almost certainly related to Sheldon, had Sheldon not recalled it already from his eidetic memory.

It is surprising that the actors themselves don't notice these yawning cracks in the continuity, but then again, if the writers are plummeting as they seem to be, I expect most of them are too busy job hunting to notice.

Also a much better gag at the end of the show would have been for Stewart to say, "Well I guess I can go wash my hand now". Seriously guys, the recent quality smacks of plain lazy. get your butts in gear.

 

Nothing like astute analysis from someone whose first post is filled with unsubstantiated bitching and moaning. You wanna talk about "lazy writing"...

[ChrisK]

I think that's a good point, though. This almost happened to Howard before. I guess we're just supposed to forget like he did.

[phantagrae]

I'm basically going to copy/paste my comments from the other forum with a few observations based on some of the stuff I've read in this thread...

 

I finally watched it late last night--and then I watched it again.

I had been feeling kind of disappointed that they had Mary doing something so hypocritical, but in the end I kind of like the way they handled it, with Sheldon calling her out on it and she talking about how she's struggling with it. I also like the little touch of her sitting on the couch reading her Bible when he comes out to talk to her.

I still don't like that they made that choice, but I can understand how it might affect Sheldon's progress with Amy.

I also thought it was interesting that although he claims to not share his mother's beliefs, he's quick to act as if she ought to adhere to them, and that he is judging her for failing, rather than mocking her beliefs or whatever. And it's interesting that his feelings were not just about her having sex with someone--he didn't seem to think of it as a betrayal of his father and even not exactly like a betrayal of himself (as in, having to share his mother with someone else, etc.)

I loved when she sent him to his room and his faltering attempts to stand up to her--and his very last, "I'm a grown man" was hilarious.

As for the other story, I thought it was fine. Poor Raj trying to get everyone to play along and everyone kind of rolling their eyes at him, but in the end they do go ahead and try to kind of give it a go.
At least poor Stuart got invited this time.

I liked Leonard and Penny's banter about whose career would be more important, etc.--I loved Penny's comment about nothing being better than making big as an actress. I don't remember exactly how it was worded, though.

And though Leonard kind of wanted to pin it down a bit, in reality, I don't think it was necessarily bad that they hadn't discussed it before now.  Before, her desire to make it big in Hollywood were kind of far off.  She was working as a waitress and randomly getting a few bits and didn't really seem to think too seriously about the future.  And Leonard has been more interested in solving his relationship issues than in thinking about what he might do if Penny really were to hit it big.  I think that the idea of either of them being truly successful just hasn't been on their personal radar as they've been dealing with day-to-day issues, especially now that Penny is walking this tightrope.  Their sights have been set on what they're doing now.

I don't know that any of the gang has really set their sights all that far into the future, except for Sheldon and his Nobel prize goal.  But of course, the RelAg would address some aspects of the future, just as the RA does in many ways.

And speaking of words, I didn't notice it in this episode, but last week Kunal seemed to mumble through several lines--it took me forever to figure out what he says after Sheldon mentions Penny's character dying so many minutes into the film. Raj says something about it happening just after her character having a pillow fight with her sorority sisters. Very mumbly.
So, I didn't notice Kunal doing it last night, but I did have trouble with one of Howard's lines. When Sheldon asks why he isn't going to go in with him (to confront his mother) Howard says something about going back to the bar. I finally figured out he was saying something like, "I'd rather go back to that bar in [or wearing?] a**-less chaps."

Anyway, I did like Stuart's lines about L/P being a great couple--and Bernie and Amy's reactions!--and I think that the writers are again getting a little underscoring in there to show that despite whatever tiffs they may get to week by week, especially over Penny's career issues, that they are still rock solid.
Just like they used Raj and Leonard to help Amy see the strength of her relationship with Sheldon, they've had Stuart help to point out the stability of the Lenny.
 

Also, I think that Stuart being the only one to show up could have been seen as nothing more than Stuarts sad imagination.

 

I agree with koops that having the gang be less than enthusiastic about Raj's game is right in line with their reaction to the idea from Scavenger Hunt and I loved Amy's "oh ick" comment, and also at the end when she kind of half-heartedly was pretending to have enjoyed it.

So overall, I really enjoyed this one. Had me laughing throughout.

[robertc]

The Outer Limits episode they mentioned is called "Soldier," not "THE Soldier."

The Terminator was very similar to this episode so they had to put an acknowledgement to Harlan Ellison in the credits of The Terminator.

 

There was an episode of The Office where they played Murder Mystery and it was one of the worst episodes they ever made.

 

Stuart was not wearing the boots that Raj bought him.

[bigbangsheldon]

I thought of that, but Howard never really saw it. He just saw the guy coming out the window.

[Irene]

Loved seeing Mary and as a Christian, loved her statements to Sheldon about her struggles.  It was honest and I appreciate the way the writers handled it.

Interesting. While I appreciated Mary's struggles and enjoyed seeing her character rounded out in a more human, less caricature way, I found other parts of their conversation to be a dig at Christianity from the writers. Specifically, that Sheldon disapproving/condemning internally but maintaining a surface appearance of acceptance was "very Christian."  

[Pranjal Gupta]

I felt very sad at the ending. Stuart being all alone.

[MissSarah]

I really enjoyed this episode! Raj was hilarious. The "time-travelling" scene was awesome.

I also loved to see Sheldon's mum again.

Great episode!

[phantagrae]

I think that's a good point, though. This almost happened to Howard before. I guess we're just supposed to forget like he did.

 

I think the incident with Howard running into the dentist at his mom's house was different from the incident he described to Sheldon.

With the dentist, I don't think he really had to have any kind of a talk with his mother.  I do think that at some point--when he asked Raj to go check in on her while he and Bernie were in Vegas--he mentioned that the dentist had broken up with her, but he never mentioned that he ever talked to her about that relationship.  I think it was implied that he was just kind of resigned to it.

 

But the story he told about the man she was dating before his bar mitzvah seemed to me to be more related to how he felt about his father--his father had left them probably just a few years before and here she was taking up with a new man.  One could infer that he was conflicted because he still loved his father and wanted him to come back.  By taking up with another man, his mother was essentially giving up on her husband ever returning, moving on with her life, etc., which would have been completely different from her relationship with the dentist.  I think the dentist thing just grossed him out, but the first man made him angry.

We see Howard's point of view in saying that Sheldon's father has been gone a long time and that Sheldon might not want to stand in the way of his mother's happiness.

 

For Sheldon, this is the first man he knows his mother has taken up with.  In the first season we saw him puzzling over whether or not she was going to get involved with Dr. Gablehauser, but the question he asked was if Dr. G was going to be his new daddy (meaning that he was asking if they were going to get married), not if she was going to be having sex with him (without getting married.)  And of course, she never did take up with Dr. G, so it never became an issue.  But in that moment, he didn't seem bothered by the idea of his mother "moving on" to a new relationship.

 

And I don't think his issue in this case had anything to do with her dating another man or necessarily about her future happiness.  It had everything to do with the fact that he found out--the hard way--that she was having sex with this man--and betraying the very values she had taught him.  I think that if she had simply been going out on dates with this man and had suddenly announced to Sheldon that she was going to marry this new man, he would have been upset about different things (his mother's attention/affection, change, having a stepfather, etc.), and though he might have balked at the idea of his mother having sex at all, I think that if she had been married, it wouldn't have been as much of an issue.

 

I have a personal connection to this kind of idea.  Several years ago my dad was working in another state.  He ended up having an affair and my parents got divorced.  He even married this other woman and lived with her until she passed away.

Now, I was raised in a Christian home and taught Christian beliefs and I have adopted them myself and live by them.  My dad was even a lay minister and pastor of a couple of small churches for a time, before he took this other job (in part to help pay for my younger sister's college.)

So, for me, it was a major betrayal of everything I had been taught, and everything I knew he truly believed.  I think for him it was something of a delayed mid-life crisis.  He had also grown up in a Christian home, but his mother had recently passed away and he was now far from home with no one to see him give in to whatever indulgences.

 

There was a time when I couldn't even speak to my father because of things he had said in trying to justify his behavior (including trying to blame my mother.)  And after this other woman had passed away, my younger sister wanted him to move back to live near the family because she worried about his health and because he barely knew his grandchildren.  In that process, he reconciled with my mother and they remarried.

 

So, I've had to deal with betrayal of strongly held beliefs, with forgiveness, and with all of the layers of what happened, and we've all moved forward.  It's not like it never happened, but I will not hold his past mistakes against him.

 

I say all of that to say that I like that without getting too deep into beliefs, drama, etc., they still handled Sheldon's reactions in a complex way.  For Sheldon it was about seeing his mother's feet of clay (and other things... ) and feeling betrayed that she had drilled all these beliefs into him and now she seemed to be disregarding those beliefs herself.

As I said above, I do like that they had her explain that she was struggling with her behavior--she still does believe what she believes, I think, but she has given in to temptation.  She has found her own feet of clay, and that can be hard if you've prided yourself on sticking to your beliefs.

 

I don't expect them to deal with this issue so much in the future--at least, not with Mary--but I can see where they might eventually use it to color Sheldon's perspective on whether or not he believes what his mother taught him.

I do like that they didn't have Mary just cavalierly brush past her beliefs, as if she was just going to do whatever she wanted or that her beliefs no longer mattered.

[BipolarBear]

I liked the episode but would have liked for the gang back at the apartment to enjoy the murder mystery a little bit more. Raj always tries to make fun things for them but it seems no one ever wants to play along; what I loved about "the scavenger vortex" episode was that even though the group was a bit put off at first, they ended up enjoying the treasure hunt very much, until they discovered there was no prize at least.

I loved Sheldon's interactions with his mom and Howard, I enjoyed very much that part of the story line. so all in all, I really enjoyed the episode.

[Tensor]

what I loved about "the scavenger vortex" episode was that even though the group was a bit put off at first, they ended up enjoying the treasure hunt very much, until they discovered there was no prize at least.

I'm not sure that they enjoyed it. Bernadette was extremely competitive and very unhappy about being stuck with Leonard the whole time. Leonard wanted to quit, because he thought he pissed off Penny, and only stuck around because Bernie lied to him about what Penny thought. Penny was not enjoying herself, being mad at both Leonard and frustrated with Sheldon. And Howard and Amy just abandoned the hunt, preferring to do karaoke, to continuing the hunt.

[Martin Pollard]

I liked the episode but would have liked for the gang back at the apartment to enjoy the murder mystery a little bit more. Raj always tries to make fun things for them but it seems no one ever wants to play along; what I loved about "the scavenger vortex" episode was that even though the group was a bit put off at first, they ended up enjoying the treasure hunt very much, until they discovered there was no prize at least.

 

Perhaps, but it is consistent. The gang has expressed their lack of interest in Raj's murder mystery dinners before, so their beefing about it fits perfectly into continuity (as does Bernadette's hyper-competitive nature).

[Kasey]

Interesting. While I appreciated Mary's struggles and enjoyed seeing her character rounded out in a more human, less caricature way, I found other parts of their conversation to be a dig at Christianity from the writers. Specifically, that Sheldon disapproving/condemning internally but maintaining a surface appearance of acceptance was "very Christian."  

 

I'm not sure what you really mean....

[BipolarBear]

I'm not sure that they enjoyed it. Bernadette was extremely competitive and very unhappy about being stuck with Leonard the whole time. Leonard wanted to quit, because he thought he pissed off Penny, and only stuck around because Bernie lied to him about what Penny thought. Penny was not enjoying herself, being mad at both Leonard and frustrated with Sheldon. And Howard and Amy just abandoned the hunt, preferring to do karaoke, to continuing the hunt.

I still think they tried harder to enjoy it and Penny got excited when she got the clues right; even Howard and Amy had fun. I don't know maybe I'm a bit tired of Raj trying so hard, however I did enjoy the rest of the episode.

Perhaps, but it is consistent. The gang has expressed their lack of interest in Raj's murder mystery dinners before, so their beefing about it fits perfectly into continuity (as does Bernadette's hyper-competitive nature).

Perhaps I'm just a bit tired of seeing Raj try so hard and everyone dissing him, JMO but sometimes it feels like they don't like each other that much

Edited March 14, 2014 by BipolarBear

[Tripper]

Quotes from the episode: http://the-big-bang-theory.com/quotes/episode/718/The-Mommy-Observation/

[stardustmelody]

I'm not sure what you really mean....

I think what Irene meant is that even though Sheldon on the exterior would act like he was accepting the relationship his mother was having, he was internally condemning her and not truly "forgiving" her which Mary then says is very Christian-like of him.   Basically the writers took a dig at Christians by saying that they put on false exteriors all the time while inside are totally different (which is irony in a way because in essence Sheldon was accusing Mary of that as well with her preaching one thing and doing another).   Again it was the writers having Mary show that Christians are full of hypocrisy (a dig at Christianity). 

[BipolarBear]

by the way, I think it was super cute how Amy was defending Sheldon's spot when he wasn't there LOL. I think it showed how devoted Amy is to Sheldon that even when he is not there, she thought it was wrong for someone else to sit on his spot.

I really enjoyed this episode! Raj was hilarious. The "time-travelling" scene was awesome.

I also loved to see Sheldon's mum again.

Great episode!

I also loved the time travelling scene! I wish I had a friend like Rajesh who organized all kinds of cool nerdy stuff.

[Irene]

Thanks stardustmelody--that is indeed the sort of thing I meant. I thought the writers were having a dig at Christianity, as Sheldon could have simply said "I don't want to stand in the way of your happiness" and had Mary reply "that's kind of you" or similar. Adding in the "I'll condemn you internally while giving the appearance of acceptance" line right before Mary's "very Christian of you" reply was a dig from the writers, IMO.

 

I want to add that this is NOT my personal view of Christianity or Christians, of which I include many of my closest friends and family. I don't want to offend anyone by my comment--it was about what I thought the writers were implying, not MY views. Well, my views on TV evangelists, maybe. :-)

[Tensor]

The Outer Limits episode they mentioned is called "Soldier," not "THE Soldier."

The Terminator was very similar to this episode so they had to put an acknowledgement to Harlan Ellison in the credits of The Terminator.

I was just so happy that they mentioned Ellison. I am a huge fan of his and his impact on science fiction, both print and visual, is enormous. A shout out to him was, I though, overdue.

[delsino]

Thanks stardustmelody--that is indeed the sort of thing I meant. I thought the writers were having a dig at Christianity, as Sheldon could have simply said "I don't want to stand in the way of your happiness" and had Mary reply "that's kind of you" or similar. Adding in the "I'll condemn you internally while giving the appearance of acceptance" line right before Mary's "very Christian of you" reply was a dig from the writers, IMO.

 

I want to add that this is NOT my personal view of Christianity or Christians, of which I include many of my closest friends and family. I don't want to offend anyone by my comment--it was about what I thought the writers were implying, not MY views. Well, my views on TV evangelists, maybe. :-)

 

Big Bang Theory makes fun of multiple religions not just Christianity

[Rama]

Poor stuart, he is never invited at their activities and when he is, they kill him. And at the end, he's again alone  

[BipolarBear]

Poor stuart, he is never invited at their activities and when he is, they kill him. And at the end, he's again alone

I know right, the best part of the night IMO was when Stuart analyzed Lenny's relationship. I did not expect that from him, but it was clear to me that Stuart cares a lot about the group even if they don't invite him that often.