S8 Discussion Thread

[3ku11]

Maybe the writers should build a cage that the gang lock him in every night, so he doesn't run loose in the apartment haha.

[Nogravitasatall]

Maybe the writers should build a cage that the gang lock him in every night, so he doesn't run loose in the apartment haha.

Heheh. My point was that he won't have the opportunity in the future, so they will have to try something else. Leonard could have left at anytime, but Sheldon made him happy and filled an need in his life; until he met Penny. TPTB will have to find different jokes once they wed (Leonard and Penny, not Sheldon and Leonard).

[Tensor]

If it bothered them so much, Leonard should have moved away and learned to lock doors.

So, really it's kinda their own fault he kept "interfering"

Yeah, love how you blame L/P because of Sheldon's the one being a jerk. As for locking the door, ask Penny how effective locking her door was in keeping Sheldon out. I suppose it's her fault he's broken into her apartment, with her door locked, while she was asleep, twice. You also did a good job making a victim out of Sheldon for his own actions.

[djsurrey]

Yeah no one's saying Sheldon has ultimately degressed their relationship. But he has been a thorn in their lifes at the very least. Sheldon is by no means perfect, none of the characters, but anyone who watches the show well tell you Sheldon has intervened or been intrusive in their relationship, how anyone can say other wise, you have to be watching another show.

 

There is always multiple ways to look at things. Sheldon is definitely an irritant. The group seems to miss him when he is not around. Like say in the Toast Derivation

 

 

Since a common enemy can unite people who would not otherwise be close I think that the irritating Sheldon has actually helped to unite Penny and Leonard. He is an irritant they share in common. Still I agree that Leonard and Penny need time away from Sheldon.

 

Interesting how he ends up between Priya and Leonard at the end of the scene shown above. All in all the fact that both Penny and Leonard have actually been able to befriend Sheldon, while most people would simply run away, actually shows that there really is some common ground between Leonard and Penny in the way they can relate to people (even irritating people). They are a most likeable couple.

Edited June 20, 2014 by djsurrey

[Nogravitasatall]

There is always multiple ways to look at things. Sheldon is definitely an irritant. The group seems to miss him when he is not around. Like say in the Toast Derivation

 

 

Since a common enemy can unite people who would not otherwise be close I think that the irritating Sheldon has actually helped to unite Penny and Leonard. He is an irritant they share in common. Still I agree that Leonard and Penny need time away from Sheldon.

 

Interesting how he ends up between Priya and Leonard at the end of the scene shown above. All in all the fact that both Penny and Leonard have actually been able to befriend Sheldon, while most people would simply run away, actually shows that there really is some common ground between Leonard and Penny in the way they can relate to people (even irritating people). They are a most likeable couple.

DJ. Yes in the absence of any other, Sheldon is the built-in antagonist. Which is where the show will be going into new territory one once Leonard and Penny move together, because they will have to think of different and less personal ways for him to be unsettling for comedy. Interestingly, Amy does not care too much for Leonard, so at some point we may see Sheldon defending him against her, which would be novel. And Penny has her priorities sorted with Amy too, so Shelddon might find himself in a pinch at some point. It will be fun to see how things change.

Or maybe it's the writers' fault since they are the ones who decide what these sitcom characters say and do!

( just sayin'. I usually overanalyse everything in this show. Thought I'd keep it simple this time.)

Yeah, I used think like this occasionally, then I decided wholeheartedly to give the idiots on screen their own agency. If they are puppets it's not worth the worry. And... um, go the Blues (though I worry about the boys in the meat grinder, the cumulative concussions and the lack of finesse).

[ajond]

If it bothered them so much, Leonard should have moved away and learned to lock doors.

 

So, really it's kinda their own fault he kept "interfering"

Wow, that is one amazing and confused statement.

[cassidyeden]

So, speaking of Sheldon and Amy, I got a question. Why do you guys think Sheldon hates change? Why he is so afraid of it? Why is he afraid of taking the next step in his relationship with Amy? 

[kerrycec03]

I actually never got the impression Amy doesn't like Leonard.  I think they just aren't super close but she does like him.  As her boyfriends best friend and her best friend's boyfriend, she does see the value of Leonard. 

I think he is scared of change, plain & simple.  He is somebody who has to have order in his life to go day by day.  Change means these "orders or rituals" will be altered. 

 

Its also a control thing.  He as we know has to be in control to function generally.  These changes are above his control (in a way) and again, that scares him.

 

A lot of people don't embrace change, but this would be extremely challenging for anybody dealing with some of his "quirks". 

 

In addition to the Amy change, he's made a philosophy of being above the notions of giving and receiving another person on that level.  But he'll get there...that's what this journey should SLOWLY open his eyes to.  Not an immediate change, but being ok to go a little further (not just physically, but even a declaration or seeing a possible future)

Edited June 21, 2014 by kerrycec03

[Itwasdestined]

Yeah, I used think like this occasionally, then I decided wholeheartedly to give the idiots on screen their own agency. If they are puppets it's not worth the worry. 

Don't disagree with you nograv, and as I said I usually enjoy overanalysing on this forum. This was my one-off " they're just characters controlled by the writers" reaction to some of the posts in this thread. Any fan forum treads a fine line between talking about characters in a show and "anthropomorphising' (to quote Leonard from "Table Polarisation") them into real people we attack or defend. When Chiany threw in the its Lenny's fault for letting him interfere line, I thought the line was crossed.

 

Anyway, I think the days of Sheldon 'interfering' in Leonard and Penny's life are over in Season 8. He'll continue to interrupt, interject, intercede, interact, intercept, interest and interpret throughout next season but their relationship is too strong to be interfered with by anyone other than themselves. And I don't think he interfered greatly anyway. Any seeds of doubt he planted in the early days were already in the minds of Leonard and Penny IMO.

[cassidyeden]

I actually never got the impression Amy doesn't like Leonard.  I think they just aren't super close but she does like him.  As her boyfriends best friend and her best friend's boyfriend, she does see the value of Leonard. 

I think he is scared of change, plain & simple.  He is somebody who has to have order in his life to go day by day.  Change means these "orders or rituals" will be altered. 

 

Its also a control thing.  He as we know has to be in control to function generally.  These changes are above his control (in a way) and again, that scares him.

 

A lot of people don't embrace change, but this would be extremely challenging for anybody dealing with some of his "quirks". 

 

In addition to the Amy change, he's made a philosophy of being above the notions of giving and receiving another person on that level.  But he'll get there...that's what this journey should SLOWLY open his eyes to.  Not an immediate change, but being ok to go a little further (not just physically, but even a declaration or seeing a possible future)

Do you think Sheldon will ever get rid of his fear of change?

[Nogravitasatall]

I actually never got the impression Amy doesn't like Leonard.  I think they just aren't super close but she does like him.  As her boyfriends best friend and her best friend's boyfriend, she does see the value of Leonard. 

Yeah, I choose to read more into the "like a dog boy" comment, her comments on the sweater treatment during "Itchy Brain", or in "Anything Can Happen" when she says of her and Leonard being together as weird. He is an inferior mind with whom Sheldon shares a house Lots of reasons why she would not be partial to him. She hangs  around for¹ Sheldon's big organ* and for the cheesecake scented goddess. LOL

(*Umm... his brain)

 

¹edit: for

Edited June 21, 2014 by Nogravitasatall

[3ku11]

I think their is a a lot of proof to say Leonard is smarter and superior to Sheldon, don't tell Dr Cooper shhhh..

[Itwasdestined]

Sheldon getting rid of his fear of change is quite possibly one of the major themes of Season 8 and beyond if the writers are serious about dealing with all the chaos they threw at him by the end of Season 7. In many of his serious talks with Amy through Seasons 4-7, Sheldon made it clear that he was only just handling the speed of the relationship as it was up to Season 6. Late Season 6 and throughout Season 7, from his perspective it was approaching warp speed with all the pressure of living together, kissing, the thought of sex highlighted by his conversation with Raj re Emily, the psychic comment. His hiatus train journey and his decision making when he returns needs to be about his fear of change. It shouldn't be easy but people with 'quirks' like him can overcome them, if the writers want him to. I've taught a lot of kids with 'Sheldon quirks' and have met up with them years later in their late teens and adult years and they have overcome them. Let's see if Season 8 starts the process or not.

[Chiany]

So, speaking of Sheldon and Amy, I got a question. Why do you guys think Sheldon hates change? Why he is so afraid of it? Why is he afraid of taking the next step in his relationship with Amy? 

 

Sheldon is someone who likes to be in control, and to me he isn't afraid of change.

He's afraid of things changing where he has no control over.

 

As long as he decided how, and at what pace things change, he has no problem with it.

But as soon as things start to happen outside his reach, but still affect him, then he starts to worry.

 

I think their is a a lot of proof to say Leonard is smarter and superior to Sheldon, don't tell Dr Cooper shhhh..

 

Leonard disagrees with you, this is what he said in the Proton Displacement:

 

You know what, Sheldon is the smartest person I have ever met

 

No doubt in his voice or words, it's a fact to him.

[3ku11]

Depends how you define smart, and depends whether or not Leonard meant it It's up to interpretation.

[kerrycec03]

We'll book smart Sheldon technically might smarter but has issues. Leonard is more socially aware and because of this he actually will probably succeed more (tenure for example). Even early Leonard was always more the everyday nerd while Sheldon didn't get sarcasm, social hints, etc

Season 8 should bring so much

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[Itwasdestined]

I think their is a a lot of proof to say Leonard is smarter and superior to Sheldon, don't tell Dr Cooper shhhh..

Depends on your definition as you say below.

 

Leonard disagrees with you, this is what he said in the Proton Displacement:

 

You know what, Sheldon is the smartest person I have ever met

 

No doubt in his voice or words, it's a fact to him.

Depends how you define smart, and depends whether or not Leonard meant it It's up to interpretation.

Agree, smart has different interpretations. More on that below.

No doubt Leonard meant it. That was a very serious conversation with Proton.

 

We'll book smart Sheldon technically might smarter but has issues. Leonard is more socially aware and because of this he actually will probably succeed more (tenure for example).

Success doesn't necessarily measure level of smarts or intelligence.

 

Interesting discussion here (not necessarily Season 8 discussion but I'll get it there!)

As a teacher, I've come across many very intelligent students including extremely gifted students like Sheldon and Leonard. Often the most gifted Sheldons were not the most successful because they were too distracted by their own genius to focus on finishing anything. They couldn't accept they were wrong so often didn't see mistakes. They spend so much time trying to solve the impossible but never got to finish the simple. But they thought on a completely other level than everyone else in the class and new stuff so far in advance of everyone else it was ridiculous sometimes.This is the definition of Sheldon and why Leonard ( and Sheldon himself of course ) sees him as the smartest person he knows. He has picked the hardest, unproveable theory in science and his greatest achievements have been ruined by his own inability to accept he can make mistakes. Leonard on the other hand as an experimental physicist ( I'm no expert here so correct me if I'm wrong. physicists) by nature of his field is more thorough, spends more time checking theories, creates feasible experiments and so has more opportunity for success and achievement. But lining them up together, by the definition of gifted genius I have become accustomed to as a teacher, Sheldon is the smarter of the two.

 

What has this to do with Season 8? Comes down to Sheldon's Season 7 challenges with his career. He's started doubting himself and the one thing he has had supreme confidence in since episode 1 is his intellect. We've spent so much time on this forum since the season ended debating his relationship with Amy and his changing circumstances with Leonard and Penny but what truly defines Sheldon Cooper and what he wants more than anything is success in Physics. His doubting his ability to succeed in string theory compounded by Caltech not allowing him to switch to a new field he sees the opportunity to succeed in adds up to a massive challenge for Sheldon to return to when his voyage of self examination ends early in Season 8. If Leonard gets tenure, if Howard gets another opportunity to contribute to NASA's space program, if Raj finally achieves something worth doing an episode about, if Amy is recognised for her research, if Bernadette creates a new wonder drug and GOD FORBID, if Penny gets a big acting role, and conversely, Sheldon continues to go nowhere with String Theory, there is going to be much tall poppy cutting in the world of Dr. Sheldon Cooper in Season 8. Whether this turns Season 8 into the Sheldon version of the Penny career story from Season 7, I don't know and I probably don't want a rehash of that same story. But I do hope to see a story arc where Sheldon's doubts about his undoubted genius are addressed, and, as much as he is copping a bit of a pasting during the hiatus on this forum, I hope Season 8 leads to some much needed success for our resident tortured genius (yes, while he continues to torture everyone else in the process!)

[cassidyeden]

Obviously, by the way he looks at her here after the kiss, do you guys think this is when he realized his feelings for Amy? Is this when Sheldon is starting to fall in love with Amy? I mean, what do you guys think it means when he looks at her like that after the kiss? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2890FT7CdH0

Edited June 21, 2014 by cassidyeden

[Chiany]

I think he fell a lot sooner for, but only realized/admitted for the first time with "not for you" line to Leonard.

His look after SIK 1, was because of the surprise he enjoyed the kiss, to his own surprise.

[kerrycec03]

Obviously, by the way he looks at her here after the kiss, do you guys think this is when he realized his feelings for Amy? Is this when Sheldon is starting to fall in love with Amy? I mean, what do you guys think it means when he looks at her like that after the kiss? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2890FT7CdH0

Maybe. I think in season 6 when he gives her the emergency contact it shows he knows he needs her. I actually think his romantic feelings towards getting closer started after D&D last season (and based off the subtle looks and jabs when anything physical is brought up in season 7).

I think his look after the kiss is shock, taking his breath away, and lust. It's just the fact that he enjoyed something he was certain he wouldn't.

I really think he doesn't know he loves her yet. He obviously does but he is a man who has always conducted life by what his brain says (not his heart or anything else lol). So it's not in his mind just yet but I am pretty sure season 8 this will come to surface

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[cassidyeden]

I think he fell a lot sooner for, but only realized/admitted for the first time with "not for you" line to Leonard.

His look after SIK 1, was because of the surprise he enjoyed the kiss, to his own surprise.

Or maybe it was their first meeting.... He gave her looks then like he was intrigued by her.<3

[kerrycec03]

Or maybe it was their first meeting.... He gave her looks then like he was intrigued by her.<3

Intrigued yes but nothing more than that back then

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[Chiany]

Intrigued yes but nothing more than that back then

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Yeah, intrigued is the right word for that first meeting.

Both were expecting nothing from that date, but after that first conversation they realized they actually were on the same level back then.

 

Neither was thinking about love, and sure as hell didn't expect to meet their SO.

But now they do, even though they are not physically together at the moment.

 

To me it seems, the writers have slowly (not fast and bumpy as with Lenny for example) been giving Shamy more troubles on their road, usually coming from Sheldon's fear of losing control, combine that with Amy's insecurities on this matter and you have a very interesting situation.

 

That situation will start to resolve (in whatever way) during season 8.

[djsurrey]

[snip]

 

 Leonard on the other hand as an experimental physicist ( I'm no expert here so correct me if I'm wrong. physicists) by nature of his field is more thorough, spends more time checking theories, creates feasible experiments and so has more opportunity for success and achievement. [snip]

 

You can't really make that first generalization.

There are probably a lot more positions for experimental physicists (so I read).

 

For example Peter Higgs proposes a mechanism that gives matter mass but it takes an international effort to verify the Higgs particle and this requires the work of thousands. To verify string theory would take a machine many orders of magnitude larger. It can't be done with technology we have.

 

The LHC produces so much data it could not be analyzed without modern computers and computer networks.

 

http://home.web.cern.ch/about/computing

 

 

CERN does not have the computing or financial resources to crunch all of the data on site, so in 2002 it turned to grid computing to share the burden with computer centres around the world. The Worldwide LHC Computing Grid (WLCG) – a distributed computing infrastructure arranged in tiers – gives a community of over 8000 physicists near real-time access to LHC data. The Grid builds on the technology of the World Wide Web, which was invented at CERN in 1989.

Edited June 21, 2014 by djsurrey

[phantagrae]

Sheldon is smarter than Leonard by IQ score, as has been mentioned on the show, but it's true that Sheldon is hampered by overthinking everything. Though it shows his ability to extrapolate from a certain starting point, he doesn't necessarily extrapolate in the right direction.

Leonard has more social skills and common sense and thus can more easily make everyday decisions and interactions than Sheldon.

I don't think that Sheldon can just overcome his fear or dislike of change. I do think he can handle change that he initiates or is control of, but the issue is again all about controlling his environment, which is about his aversion to change.

I can relate to a certain degree. I would love to change apartments, for instance, to an apartment that has certain pluses that are important to me, but at the same time, I love certain important aspects of my current apartment. If I get a chance to move, it will be both exciting and difficult.

I do t think that there's anything that will make change easy for him. I think that the only way he can handle change is to build parameters around that change. He needed a new roommate, but the only way he could tolerate it was to put that roommate through a series of "tests" and bind him to a series if rules governing everything from thermostat setting to bowel movement schedules.

And though his inner caveman insisted that he claim Amy as his girlfriend, the only way his conscious mind could handle it was to declare that nothing would change in their relationship, and then he had to bind her to a written agreement that would govern that.

While he has obviously agreed to certain changes in the relationship (holding hands at the movies, and now kissing at the end of date night), he still cannot just throw caution to the wind and accept every change that comes along, no matter what it's related to.

I think that his desire to change his field of study is something he struggled to do. He was obviously upset at the prospect of his original field being a dead end, and it was a struggle for him to choose another field, but science is something where he seems to be more adaptable and he seems to feel that he knows enough about "everything", which may make it easier to change focus.

I don't think there's going to be some miraculous change in him after his journey. I hope not anyway, because I think it would be kind of a cheat for any kind of drastic thing to happen offscreen.