Jump to content

[Spoilers] Lenny: Season 9


Tensor
 Share

Recommended Posts

Some folks have put up some recent comments and thoughts about the start of the season Lenny nuptials. Reading each posting, I know I'm in the clear minority here but I just feel as if I want to give a dissenting view. For whatever reason, I have no clue because I really, really don't want to go back and forth on this. So why I'm even opening my mouth here is beyond me. 
 
But for me, it was ugly. They were minimized. They were hijacked.
 
For me, it started with Penny's 'We've put this off long enough. Let's get married'. Yeah. That's a good reason. The couple that I loved and followed for many seasons, after a long and winding relationship that included commitment issues and an infidelity (that has not yet been fully explained), my favorite couple makes it to the altar. But it got glossed over so quickly because it just had to be interrupted by a Shamy fight and then by one of Lenny's own. Even with Howard and Bernadette, a secondary couple, we were treated to the whole event, which was very sweetly and wonderfully done. For Lenny, the wedding was stolen. And I can't imagine why TPTB would think this was a good idea and give them this terrible wedding. 
 
Now I'm not saying that the love wasn't there, it felt like it was. They both looked very happy and very much in love standing there. I loved Leonard's vows and again, unlike most everyone else, I didn't care for Penny's. And that they were alone and it wasn't a big ceremony, I completely agree. Throughout the seasons, they always had their best moments alone. I had no problem with that. But for TPTB, to give the Lenny this long awaited, hard fought for moment with crappy cliche Vegas, multiple interruptions, two fights, and we don't get to see it in it's totality, to me, made it very ugly, dismissive, and minimized. 
 
For me, it would have been much better wedding if Christopher Lloyd had been hired to reprise his 'Reverend Jim' role from the TV from the 70s Taxi. They are alone in a park or on the beach and Reverend Jim comes along and after some funny conversations, tells Lenny that he is an ordained minister and can marry them right then and there. They just have to pay him with a bottle of hooch. Leonard dashes off the nearest liquor store and returns with the required payment, and they are married alone, without an interruption, under the stars. Plot devices and legality aside, for me, that would have been much more infinitely wonderful and memorable (for the right reasons) than that horror we were given. 
 
One is supposed to leave a wedding happy, joyful, and hopeful for the couple. I was left feeling pissed. Still am. I still feel that 'they' and 'we' deserved much better. 

 

Edited by 5Mississippis
  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel the same way you do but i think we're lucky they even got married. To me the only reason tptb got them married was for the on going storyline with the shamy I guess they think it will be funnier with lenny living with seldom than just leonard Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some folks have put up some recent comments and thoughts about the start of the season Lenny nuptials. Reading each posting, I know I'm in the clear minority here but I just feel as if I want to give a dissenting view. For whatever reason, I have no clue because I really, really don't want to go back and forth on this. So why I'm even opening my mouth here is beyond me. 
 
But for me, it was ugly. They were minimized. They were hijacked.
 
For me, it started with Penny's 'We've put this off long enough. Let's get married'. Yeah. That's a good reason. The couple that I loved and followed for many seasons, after a long and winding relationship that included commitment issues and an infidelity (that has not yet been fully explained), my favorite couple makes it to the altar. But it got glossed over so quickly because it just had to be interrupted by a Shamy fight and then by one of Lenny's own. Even with Howard and Bernadette, a secondary couple, we were treated to the whole event, which was very sweetly and wonderfully done. For Lenny, the wedding was stolen. And I can't imagine why TPTB would think this was a good idea and give them this terrible wedding. 
 
Now I'm not saying that the love wasn't there, it felt like it was. They both looked very happy and very much in love standing there. I loved Leonard's vows and again, unlike most everyone else, I didn't care for Penny's. And that they were alone and it wasn't a big ceremony, I completely agree. Throughout the seasons, they always had their best moments alone. I had no problem with that. But for TPTB, to give the Lenny this long awaited, hard fought for moment with crappy cliche Vegas, multiple interruptions, two fights, and we don't get to see it in it's totality, to me, made it very ugly, dismissive, and minimized. 
 
For me, it would have been much better wedding if Christopher Lloyd had been hired to reprise his 'Reverend Jim' role from the TV from the 70s Taxi. They are alone in a park or on the beach and Reverend Jim comes along and after some funny conversations, tells Lenny that he is an ordained minister and can marry them right then and there. They just have to pay him with a bottle of hooch. Leonard dashes off the nearest liquor store and returns with the required payment, and they are married alone, without an interruption, under the stars. Plot devices and legality aside, for me, that would have been much more infinitely wonderful and memorable (for the right reasons) than that horror we were given. 
 
One is supposed to leave a wedding happy, joyful, and hopeful for the couple. I was left feeling pissed. Still am. I still feel that 'they' and 'we' deserved much better. 

 

I feel the same way you do but i think we're lucky they even got married. To me the only reason tptb got them married was for the on going storyline with the shamy I guess they think it will be funnier with lenny living with seldom than just leonard Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

I see your points but there is nothing we can do about it. What is done is done. They are saving the big one for Sheldon. I'm over it because no matter how much the writers try to diminish lenny. They will never succeed because they are the best and most believable couple on the show and nothing will ever change that. The genuine affection and love, the way they touch each other, the chemistry. Best friends and love of each other's lives. Simply beautiful and amazing to watch and lenny have a lot of love to give. :) dcecaa2908935ffab0ea3185efe49ecb.jpg Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk
  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see your points but there is nothing we can do about it. What is done is done. They are saving the big one for Sheldon........I'lSent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk

That's what I've come to believe. The Lenny wedding story arc was going to take too much time and oxygen from the Shamy arc that has clearly dominated the series thus far. And so it was easier to rationalise reasons for that ugly little wedding (didn't mind the actual vows so much) than give it the time that Howardette received.. All unprovable speculation, but that's how cynical I've become I guess. 

Edited by agt_1
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see your points but there is nothing we can do about it. What is done is done. [...] 

That's right. BTW, there's a line from Reinhold Niebuhr's "Serenity Prayer", that applies here I think:

"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,..."

I'm not a religious person, but I try to orientate myself by that line. :shy:

Edited by luminous
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some folks have put up some recent comments and thoughts about the start of the season Lenny nuptials. Reading each posting, I know I'm in the clear minority here but I just feel as if I want to give a dissenting view. For whatever reason, I have no clue because I really, really don't want to go back and forth on this. So why I'm even opening my mouth here is beyond me. 
 
But for me, it was ugly. They were minimized. They were hijacked.
 
For me, it started with Penny's 'We've put this off long enough. Let's get married'. Yeah. That's a good reason. The couple that I loved and followed for many seasons, after a long and winding relationship that included commitment issues and an infidelity (that has not yet been fully explained), my favorite couple makes it to the altar. But it got glossed over so quickly because it just had to be interrupted by a Shamy fight and then by one of Lenny's own. Even with Howard and Bernadette, a secondary couple, we were treated to the whole event, which was very sweetly and wonderfully done. For Lenny, the wedding was stolen. And I can't imagine why TPTB would think this was a good idea and give them this terrible wedding. 
 
Now I'm not saying that the love wasn't there, it felt like it was. They both looked very happy and very much in love standing there. I loved Leonard's vows and again, unlike most everyone else, I didn't care for Penny's. And that they were alone and it wasn't a big ceremony, I completely agree. Throughout the seasons, they always had their best moments alone. I had no problem with that. But for TPTB, to give the Lenny this long awaited, hard fought for moment with crappy cliche Vegas, multiple interruptions, two fights, and we don't get to see it in it's totality, to me, made it very ugly, dismissive, and minimized. 
 
For me, it would have been much better wedding if Christopher Lloyd had been hired to reprise his 'Reverend Jim' role from the TV from the 70s Taxi. They are alone in a park or on the beach and Reverend Jim comes along and after some funny conversations, tells Lenny that he is an ordained minister and can marry them right then and there. They just have to pay him with a bottle of hooch. Leonard dashes off the nearest liquor store and returns with the required payment, and they are married alone, without an interruption, under the stars. Plot devices and legality aside, for me, that would have been much more infinitely wonderful and memorable (for the right reasons) than that horror we were given. 
 
One is supposed to leave a wedding happy, joyful, and hopeful for the couple. I was left feeling pissed. Still am. I still feel that 'they' and 'we' deserved much better. 

 

I feel exactly the same. I believe they and we got taken with this POS wedding. Also the fact that it was interrupted by the Shamy fight  was in my view decidedly pathetic. They have done Lenny and us Lennies a complete disservice. I mean this was nine years in the making, right? They get Sheldon not to interrupt them in person, but TPTB don't show it because they decided to concentrate on something that we find out will be touched upon for the next 10 episodes (at least). I hope that they do some kind of make over at a certain point in time. I also agree with the "we've waited long enough, let's do it". As you say: great reason to get married, right? I don't know why it seems so hard for TPTB to give them their due. They can make it funny also. What proof do I have of this? That as bad as the wedding was, IMO, I like how they are writing them married. They are getting their due, they're being written well together, and they're being funny at the same time. 

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But for me, it was ugly. They were minimized. They were hijacked.
 
For me, it started with Penny's 'We've put this off long enough. Let's get married'. Yeah. That's a good reason. 
 
The couple that I loved and followed for many seasons, after a long and winding relationship that included commitment issues and an infidelity (that has not yet been fully explained)
 
Why is that a bad reason?  And she wasn't wrong, they had put the marriage off long enough.
 
 
Even with Howard and Bernadette, a secondary couple, we were treated to the whole event, which was very sweetly and wonderfully done.
 
Howard and Bernadette are different characters, and a different couple with a different story that was being told compared to Lenny and their story.
 
But for TPTB, to give the Lenny this long awaited, hard fought for moment with crappy cliche Vegas, multiple interruptions, two fights, and we don't get to see it in it's totality, to me, made it very ugly, dismissive, and minimized.
 
Part of it's "minimizing" was to keep from revealing Penny's last name, which does annoy me somewhat I'll admit, but I don't see them being taken "out of focus" because they cared more about a Shamy fight.
 
Also the so called "ugly" wedding night was by design.  You can have a wedding with all the bells and whistles on it and it can seem like something right out of a fairy tale.  HOWEVER a beautiful wedding isn't going to dictate whether you have a happy marriage (just ask Kaley Cuoco recently, too soon?), whether you do is dictated by the two people IN THE RELATIONSHIP, and whether those two people are TRULY right for each other.
 
My fiance (who has been a fan of this show longer than I have) put it into perspective WHY they gave Lenny a less than ideal wedding/wedding night:
 
Penny has always had commitment issues in this series.  Just about every time she has taken steps forward it has been because something scary happened before that, that made her REALIZE she had strength/courage that she thought she didn't have:
 
-In season 5, when Leonard got caught up in wedding fever by popping the question she didn't bail like she did in season 3, when things started getting very real very fast in The Wheaton Recurrence.  Because as season 4 showed us, no guarantee existed that Leonard was always going to be available when it was CONVENIENT FOR HER.
 
-In The 43 Peculiarity she said she loved him, while getting caught up in the moment.  After that you could easily see how vulnerable she felt after saying that, because she felt it was official that she was giving her heart to someone again.  Only to realize that person told her he was willing to wait until she was ready to get married.
 
-In Season 7 to make the idea of marriage and AT LEAST GETTING ENGAGED seem less scary to her, she did something that would be considered by many to be self destructive in quitting her job and fully commit to her acting career to see if it would pan out.  Not everybody would be patient with their significant other through that ordeal and Leonard DID QUESTION HER DECISIONS, but he didn't force her to do anything.  He let her try to figure out if committing 100% to acting was going to mean something, she was left disappointed, BUT all through that, Leonard was by her side, and supported her.  Which made the act of committing to him feel less scary, because even though she tried to commit to something 100%, she was STILL IN ONE PIECE.
 
-In season 8/9 they have a wedding that was done on the fly because even Penny realized that she didn't just want to run away again, even if she was scared; ESPECIALLY after Leonard's confession.
She had a less than ideal wedding night, because her insecurities of her relationship with Leonard were introduced in a cummulative package:
-Another partner that might be unfaithful
-The girl he kissed being beautiful AND SMART
-Her perception of Leonard the man she married being challenged.
-All THAT happened on her wedding night.
 
But through the help of her friends she was able to realize, that yes what Leonard did was boneheaded, but at the end of the day having a drunken moment of weakness does NOT automatically mean he's just like all the other guys that had cheated on her; he was and is still human.
After surviving a less than ideal start to their marriage, Penny and Leonard REALIZE they are in one piece DESPITE ALL THAT HAD HAPPENED.  It's easy to see how they both would realize they had the strength to face the world together married after reconciling from THAT.
 
It's somewhat similar to Homer and Marge's flashback marriage in The Simpsons, where they had a less than ideal start to the beginning of their married life (they got married at a small casino by the side of the road, and spent the wedding night in Marge's parents house in their living room).  But despite ALL OF THAT, they survived it and are married with 3 kids, and have a lovely (if not entirely ideal) life.
 
That is most likely WHY they didn't get a beautiful and glamorous wedding.  Because THESE TWO characters dictated the story that needed to be told, that they would go through a less than ideal start to their marriage in order to find the strength they didn't know they had by SURVIVING a rocky start.  Especially when they realized that rocky start happened mostly because they were both fearful.
 
One is supposed to leave a wedding happy, joyful, and hopeful for the couple. I was left feeling pissed.
 
Yeah in ideal circumstances.  But this was written as less than ideal by design.  But despite having a less than ideal wedding & wedding night.  They are happily married, which just confirms that having a wedding that is happy and joyful won't make the relationship/marriage work.  The 2 people involved in the wedding & marriage have to be willing to make it work.  I can only speak for myself saying this, but I care MORE ABOUT Leonard, Penny, and their relationship first more than I do about whether their wedding was beautiful enough.
 
It doesn't mean I didn't have any issues with it's execution.  If I could change ANY ONE THING it would be that when they cut from the shamy breakup aftermath back to the ending of Leonard & Penny's wedding, it would be us SEEING the finality of Leonard and Penny's commencement kiss.
The only reason I can think of why they wouldn't show that, is that they wanted the next time we saw them kiss, they wanted us to see it be awkward for Penny.  
 
But not every single second of them kissing in the wedding suite was awkward, they could've just cut back to the specific point where we don't see it being awkward for either of them.  Maybe TPTB just second guessed on whether viewers would understand that nuance if they showed the commencement kiss, and that's assuming THAT is the reason they didn't show the commencement kiss.  I believe they didn't show it FOR A REASON; but we can only guess as to what that reason is, until TPTB confirm it.
 
But that doesn't mean it was a deal breaker for me, I enjoyed the low-key wedding for what it was.  How Leonard's vows took Penny's breath away (just like he did in the lab scene in season 6), how Penny came up with something on the fly, that is not only endearing to Leonard, also encompasses how Penny feels about Leonard, the love of her life, and her best friend.  I'd also be remiss in not mentioning how adorable Kaley's facial expressions for Penny were when she delivered her vows.
 
No, the wedding didn't give us EVERYTHING we wanted, but I feel it gave us WHAT WE NEEDED.  A Lenny who triumphed through a bad wedding night, and now realize they have strength they didn't know they had BECAUSE they survived through something that they and perhaps what many yet-to-be newlyweds fear going through, a less than ideal wedding and/or wedding night (and that night included issues that they both have always had when it comes to this relationship).
Edited by meka3000
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That as bad as the wedding was, IMO, I like how they are writing them married. They are getting their due, they're being written well together, and they're being funny at the same time. 

I agree. What is still missing so far are some intimate onscreen situations for Lenny like a nice couch/bed snuggling or a pillow talk. A breakfast together (without Sheldon of course) wouldn't be bad either.

  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Look I think if it was season 6 the wedding would of been given much thought. But like Kaley said they dragged it out so long, to the point of being anti-climatic. They even dragged out the Engagement, they didn't talk about the wedding for 2 seasons. So it was a product, of like IWD said A: Writers writing them like they have in the first 8 seasons B: Or not getting exactly what they deserved. I think by this point writers wanted it out of the way, just the way it is. In Friends Monica and Chandler never had to deal with this kinda rubbish lol, like Joey hijacking the wedding. But hey it woulden't be Big Bang without Sheldon  ;). I have a feeling some here expected a big, elaborate wedding. With Lenny as the centre piece. But this is not the show, nor is it Lenny.

The way they have been written, very realistic. It has not been some star crossed lovers fairy tale. It has been two people meeting, two very flawed people. and both realizing their differences run skin deep, but their sames run straight to the bone. It has been a very real relationship, a relationship they work very hard on. I agree it is very similar to Homer and Marge (although they are cartoon characters lol) but in terms of having a rocky start. It is rocky, because their relationship is like a big bridge, fragile but if you tread carefully, you well get to the other side. A Big wedding implies perfection, nothing about Lenny is perfect! The decision to get married in Vegas, really ties in with their story. It has never been smooth sailing. But I think the combination of street smart and book smart, has always made Lenny so unique. They are now married, and they can work through their issues. Having Ahem next door lol, can't be easy. But it is what it is, Sheldon well prob get a room when Lenny find a house eventually when the show ends, when they get their smart and beautiful babies (not on the show of course).

I agree. What is still missing so far are some intimate onscreen situations for Lenny like a nice couch/bed snuggling or a pillow talk. A breakfast together (without Sheldon of course) wouldn't be bad either.

I think the last pillow talk was season 5. Not sure we well see those scenes ever again.

Edited by 3ku11

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Penny and Leonard remind me of this statement: "The whole is greater than the sum of its parts."

All the episodes, all the seasons, all that we liked, all that we didn't like, the good, the bad and the ugly have brought us the Hofstadters we know and love today.:friends: I don't think the writers hate them,diminish them or neglect them.I think they love them. I think they write them the way they want them to be, the way they think they should be, the way their collective minds have imagined them. And also they want them to be funny. I haven't always liked their choices, but I've never thought the writers hated  the Leonard and Penny I have loved from so early on and still do. They created them! Why would they hate them?  I'm amazed at where they are today given their misadventures (as Itwasdestined has so eloquently detailed above).(And, IMO, they've survived in spite of Sheldon and because of Sheldon).Their love for each other, now truly devotion, their knowledge of and appreciation for each other, their humor , their fun, their romance, their passion and hunger for each other, their cuteness and silliness- all of this has grown from their first "hi" to each other. I feel lucky and happy  to have  watched the evolution of these two.:kissing:

So the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. We've loved parts and hated parts. But what a great couple we get to enjoy (most of the time).To me this means the writers are doing  a good job.:clapping:

 

download  1st day we met..jpg

 

New Penny and Leonard.jpg

This is a wonderful post. And I know I've said it before, but I just love how normal and not over-the-top Leonard and Penny's relationship is. They seem like a couple you'd meet in real life, IMO, and that makes it really easy to relate to them. 

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 3.11.2015 at 6:42 AM, Strawberry PopTart Fan said:

Penny and Leonard remind me of this statement: "The whole is greater than the sum of its parts."

All the episodes, all the seasons, all that we liked, all that we didn't like, the good, the bad and the ugly have brought us the Hofstadters we know and love today.:friends: I don't think the writers hate them,diminish them or neglect them.I think they love them. I think they write them the way they want them to be, the way they think they should be, the way their collective minds have imagined them. And also they want them to be funny. I haven't always liked their choices, but I've never thought the writers hated  the Leonard and Penny I have loved from so early on and still do. They created them! Why would they hate them?  I'm amazed at where they are today given their misadventures (as Itwasdestined has so eloquently detailed above).(And, IMO, they've survived in spite of Sheldon and because of Sheldon).Their love for each other, now truly devotion, their knowledge of and appreciation for each other, their humor , their fun, their romance, their passion and hunger for each other, their cuteness and silliness- all of this has grown from their first "hi" to each other. I feel lucky and happy  to have  watched the evolution of these two.:kissing:

So the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. We've loved parts and hated parts. But what a great couple we get to enjoy (most of the time).To me this means the writers are doing  a good job.:clapping:

Well said....

n_00167.gif.e4173bedb4ae5ca4a6675a9a80dbd090.gif

 

:icon_wink:

Edited by veejay
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not a big fan of weddings. But I like being married. I can see that Leonard and Penny got trampled on somewhat and the consolation is that we get to see them being married - wherever they lay their heads down at night. And TPTB can't easily take that away. I have to accept that the triumvirate is here to stay and I do tune out a little (a lot) when the now apparent house pet gets off the leash.

Karen and others arer ight to be disgruntled by the stepping on of L/P. I lost it when Leonard opened up about Mandy - who was delightful and authentic by the way - and I could have done with a more uplifting dénouement than the unrealistic separation at the top of the stairs. Still, Leonard and Penny are durable and resilient, if not a bit soft in the head about "a man in his thirties pretending to be a man in his twenties" (and winking at the audience all the while, because aren't some people forty pretending to be thirty?).

Regardless, when I watch the nonsense on screen I can still find bits to laugh at, despite the pretty obvious creakiness of the premise. And I thought that 2003... represented a soft reboot of the situation of the comedy. Sheldon is their dependent - until some magical development whisks them all away from their predicament.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I still think maybe Lenny could get a another apt. Maybe one above 4A. Just so they can have some privacy. But that also means most of their plots would just be them. I think the sooner Shamy reconcile, the better for Lenny. Because Sheldon well continue to be the third wheel, until that happens. Either that or Sheldon interviews prospective roommate. I Think Sheldon just needs a shiny new toy, he is like a dog, Sheldon Sheldon where are you boy! Come get the toy, come get the toy lol.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On my way to work without coffee and I opened this thread to some beautiful comments and analysis of lenny. The long road to get where they are, the ups and downs. The wonderful moments they have shared and good massively out weight the bad. Thank you all for brighten up my morning without coffee . :) 93be6fc443405730fa5e09d9294fdb4a.jpg Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, their relationship has so many aspects you can find in real life. This normal and non-fairytale-like approach, and the genuine and honest feel of this relationship is one of the reasons I became a Lenny shipper.:)

Well their is a reason why they are the most realistically written couple on tv. You even see their break up, their fights, arguments, make up's. Depicted so realistically. I mean in Valentines s6, they had that fight. The fight was so real and realistic, like watching a real couple in your living room in real time. The intimacy of their relationship has been one of the highlights of the shows run. Kaley doesent have more chemistry with anyone other then Johnny.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 3.11.2015 at 11:27 AM, 3ku11 said:

I found this scene sweet and funny. Penny touched by Leonard saying he well love her to the end of time. And then Leonard amps up the corniness lol.

 

tumblr_nvgdu8gIfQ1tllb7go4_250.gif

 

tumblr_nvgdu8gIfQ1tllb7go2_250.gif

"It's getting kind of cheesy, Leonard."

LOL   :shy:

Edited by veejay
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Tensor locked this topic
  • Tensor unlocked this topic

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.