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[Spoilers] Shamy: Season 9

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Ok, here is what I remember.  Yes, in the premiere Sheldon looks shocked to find out from Penny that Amy has been thinking about this for a long time.  We see no communication from Penny & Amy BUT I didn't get the feeling Amy has point blank said that BUT we do know she's expressed frustrations about Sheldon through the years.  And Penny probably thinks the physical stuff is a big issue (based off the finale when Penny says to Sheldon "you've been together for 5 years and you haven't even slept together").  For somebody like Penny she probably sees this as a bigger issue and hearing Amy probably make digs through the years, she came to conclusion that yea, Amy has been unhappy for a while. I wouldn't read into this to much, JMO.  Its more speculations from Penny.

 

Now, it did shock Sheldon to the core and I think he is now at the place of trying to make her jealous and also making her miss him. 

In episode 2 we see the Skype call, we find out that he reaches out to contact her every 20 minutes (no breathing space), he mentions that they have a baby together to which Amy is like WTF, and he says FWFs....she just rolls her eyes and says no (so here he is trying to use a little guilt of the baby reference and FWF to get her to come back).  In this scene she says "I am seeing you more now broken up then before" to which he says "see that's why you should come back to me".  She also says "I know this is hard, its hard for me too". 

Then we see the box exchange.  I already wrote the scene in detail, but Sheldon first saying "we made a great team"...then switching over to trying to imply he is getting around (failing horribly at this) is more of signs of him trying to get her back

Then the FWF nightmare.  He is angry and hurt, clear as day and loves & misses her so bad.  You see her watching at her apartment (and for a split second you think "aww she still cares" but we find out later he sent her the link")  We've all done this when you break-up or are in fight with your ex, you lash out but it was lashing out filled with digs to make her feel guilty but in a sweet way.  He said (using country flags to make his point) that she got him/her a birthday cake and ate it even though it tasted horrible. What does that tell you?  And then he says something like "You/We aren't getting any younger".  SO yea, were they nice digs NO, but were they filled with Sheldony goodness YES.  And true to his character, that's how Sheldon expresses himself

and then last you see the tag door exchange.  He still thinks these crazy antics are working.  And as you can see, its not working and she is getting more mad and frustrated.  So, I think the Bad Boyfriend line from Penny did shock him and not always the best with dealing with emotions, Sheldon choose to probably google this stuff and try these antics.  I'm pretty sure next few episodes we will see him come back to focus and really get whats going on. 

 

He has this timeline for them.  That's pretty clear now, and she broke that.  He had the engagement/sex/marriage/babies/etc all probably plotted out and BOOM it's ruined now.  But again, its only been two episodes.  I see major hope from all of this.  And every jab is filled with a double meaning.  And that's not even the half of the sexual innuendos mixed in. 

Amy will realize what she had and appreciate him.  Sheldon will realize she needs to be #1 and be a bit more selfless towards her.  I still don't see them not being in scenes together or anything.  But this episode two stuff kinda needed to happen (and a lot of it was sweetness filled with pain).  As mentioned by Molaro they BOTH have a leg to stand on during this and I have never said this is all Sheldon's fault or all done for Sheldon to learn.  They both need work.  Amy will realize what she had and understand how much he has come for her.  She doesn't see it.  And he needs to put her #1 and do something without it being triggered by Amy's reaction.  I am very hopeful they will both learn and grow. 

 

So indirectly in the premiere we saw he stalk her but didn't really do anything. In episode 2 you see him try crazy antics to try and win her back. 

Thank you so much, Kerry! You are a real lifesaver. Whenever I read your posts, I feel better instantly.

I also think Sheldon sounds really sweet in his own bizarre way. Gotta love him..

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Wait

There was a girls night in episode 2????

Yes but it really served no purpose except to get Bernadette in there. Its Penny saying she never expected Leonard to do this, Amy actually defending Leonard is a sweet way (like I am sure he feels bad and it was a momentary lasp) and Bernadette playing dumb like she didn't know anything which was a lie. Honestly it was a forgotten scene except for funny Bernadette Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Thanks a lot for the extra details, Kerry. I appreciate it. 

I do think that that was largely Penny's interpretation of the situation/Amy's phone call rather than verbatim quotes from Amy. But, still, it seems like a weird bomb to drop on Sheldon only to then go back to having him try all these antics. I mean, it's like you kind of have to explain his behavior in this episode via what we saw in the previous one, but there doesn't seem to be a direct link explicitly made by the writers that he's acting like this because Penny's words stung instead than simply because he wants to get her back? 

I do think the antics are very sweet (in a Sheldon way), and I adore many little things about it, like the scarf scene and I can't even begin to tell you how happy I am to hear him say FWF is their "baby": I always strongly felt FWF was their thing, and it's frankly possibly my favorite Shamy thing ever about them, but some believed it was only Sheldon's thing. Now we get confirmation it's THEIR baby, not just his (not that Champagne didn't explain that in part already). But I guess my frustration is that it seems once again to only focus on Sheldon's side of the story, when I had gotten the impression from CC and interviews that we were finally going to explore Amy's side more. Maybe that will happen in the next episode or two... who knows. I just... I don't know, I feel like all the vibes I'm getting from Amy here is that she's not regretting her choice or anything, but is just waiting for Sheldon to accept it and leave her alone and that the audience is meant to take humor from that. Which, I guess it's understandable if he contacts her every 20 minutes, but still... I mean, was there even any mention at all of her issues during girls' night or was it all about Lenny? At the same time, I did agree with Tallin earlier yesterday about how nobody is forcing Amy to answer his phone calls, open the door, open his links, show up at his apartment etc. Which to me indicates that she's not over him and moving on. So... Yeah, I have no idea what's going on. 

That's what I'm saying though. I get the feeling that they're just framing this in the usual Sheldon-centered context and Amy is the "normal" one that bears the brunt of his weirdness. Where is Amy's side in all this? How does she feel about this? She says it's hard, but does that mean hard as in "I miss you, and I'm not sure I made the right choice" or as in "I made the right choice, as hard as it seems right now"? 

Also, just on a general POV, but I don't think the issue is that he has to be 100% focused on her all the time they're together. I think the Flash comment was a symptom of Amy's more general doubts about what he wants with her. I think she's always had some doubts about whether he wanted more with her and that comment was just a reminder of that at a really bad time. I mean, minds wander sometimes, someone can be distracted. I don't like the whole entitled attitude like "you can't talk TV on date night, you only have to focus on me" and all these ideas about what is and isn't allowed. It's so artificial. I'll never understand why someone would want fake attention instead of honest distraction. Or forced conversation instead of sharing the other person's enthusiasm for whatever it is that they want to talk about. I just think that if Amy's not sure what Sheldon really wants, his being distracted can be seen by her as a sign of general disinterest, rather than just for what it is: a moment of distraction. 

I might be wrong, but I can´t get the feeling out of my head, that it has to do something with her past. All her life, she met people who were mean and hurt her phisycally and emotionally and no one understood her. Then she met Sheldon and they fall in love with the time. First his mean comments were ok for her, but the more feelings she invested in this relationship, the more they hurt, which might remind her of the time, when the rest of the world was mean to her and she felt alone. So she feels somehow trapped between his love for him and the fact, that it is hard for her to have a boyfriend like him, because sometimes he can be a real pain in the ass, annoying and hard to hold out and it´s hard to swallow all these comments and his beahviour of him. But she swallows them anyway, hoping for any sign, that all this leads to somewhere (moving together, marriage, kids). But none of this things has happened til today and Amy is starting to fear that she might never get these things and is starting to think: "Is it worth, to wait or is it better to leave him?"

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Yes but it really served no purpose except to get Bernadette in there. Its Penny saying she never expected Leonard to do this, Amy actually defending Leonard is a sweet way (like I am sure he feels bad and it was a momentary lasp) and Bernadette playing dumb like she didn't know anything which was a lie. Honestly it was a forgotten scene except for funny Bernadette Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ok Cheers!

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That's what I'm saying though. I get the feeling that they're just framing this in the usual Sheldon-centered context and Amy is the "normal" one that bears the brunt of his weirdness. Where is Amy's side in all this? How does she feel about this? She says it's hard, but does that mean hard as in "I miss you, and I'm not sure I made the right choice" or as in "I made the right choice, as hard as it seems right now"? 

Also, just on a general POV, but I don't think the issue is that he has to be 100% focused on her all the time they're together. I think the Flash comment was a symptom of Amy's more general doubts about what he wants with her. I think she's always had some doubts about whether he wanted more with her and that comment was just a reminder of that at a really bad time. I mean, minds wander sometimes, someone can be distracted. I don't like the whole entitled attitude like "you can't talk TV on date night, you only have to focus on me" and all these ideas about what is and isn't allowed. It's so artificial. I'll never understand why someone would want fake attention instead of honest distraction. Or forced conversation instead of sharing the other person's enthusiasm for whatever it is that they want to talk about. I just think that if Amy's not sure what Sheldon really wants, his being distracted can be seen by her as a sign of general disinterest, rather than just for what it is: a moment of distraction. 

I think the crux of the issue here is that all of this is happening in a very short time frame. Amy literally had no time to think so far and I think it fits that she doesn't have much of a side yet cause that's what she planned to figure out if... Sheldon would just leave her alone for a bit. So for now I'm still with the narrative and hope that this leads to her going off the grid by visiting her relatives or whatever and hopefully that'll also lead to a bit more character background.

I absolutely agree with you about the Flash comment being really bad timing that triggered a bigger emotional reaction than it would probably have under other circumstances. As it has been said a lot of times, it's the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back.

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I might be wrong, but I can´t get the feeling out of my head, that it has to do something with her past. All her life, she met people who were mean and hurt her phisycally and emotionally and no one understood her. Then she met Sheldon and they fall in love with the time. First his mean comments were ok for her, but the more feelings she invested in this relationship, the more they hurt, which might remind her of the time, when the rest of the world was mean to her and she felt alone. So she feels somehow trapped between his love for him and the fact, that it is hard for her to have a boyfriend like him, because sometimes he can be a real pain in the ass, annoying and hard to hold out and it´s hard to swallow all these comments and his beahviour of him. But she swallows them anyway, hoping for any sign, that all this leads to somewhere (moving together, marriage, kids). But none of this things has happened til today and Amy is starting to fear that she might never get these things and is starting to think: "Is it worth, to wait or is it better to leave him?"

I don't know that it needs to have something to do with her past. She's in love with him, she obviously wants to be with him in all ways possible and she's not sure he wants the same things. I think that's more than enough to upset her without needing a backstory. I think that would upset any of the other members of the gang just the same with their SO. But to me there's two sides of the same coin to the story, one that I like and one that makes me cringe. One is Amy being upset about whether she's just pushing him into something he doesn't really want and that it's unfair to both of them. And that's fine with me. The other that Amy wants X, Y and Z and now that she realizes she can't get it out of Sheldon and she's fed up with waiting, she's decided to move on and find it with someone else. Which I thoroughly dislike. 

Can I just say though... Amy defending Leonard?!?! Really!? Like... I can't even begin to facepalm to that. Yeah, go on, defend a cheater, Amy. As long as he sweet talks and buys you flower I guess anything goes. That's a good boyfriend after all :icon_rolleyes:  What is up with this show making cheating look like it's something where we should feel sorry for the cheater instead of the one that's been cheated on?? Poor Leonard! Poor Leonard. His insecurity made him do it. His cheating is really just a proof of his love for Penny! Don't you see!

Edited by koops
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Now, it did shock Sheldon to the core and I think he is now at the place of trying to make her jealous and also making her miss him. 

In episode 2 we see the Skype call, we find out that he reaches out to contact her every 20 minutes (no breathing space), he mentions that they have a baby together to which Amy is like WTF, and he says FWFs....she just rolls her eyes and says no (so here he is trying to use a little guilt of the baby reference and FWF to get her to come back).  In this scene she says "I am seeing you more now broken up then before" to which he says "see that's why you should come back to me".  She also says "I know this is hard, its hard for me too". 

Then we see the box exchange.  I already wrote the scene in detail, but Sheldon first saying "we made a great team"...then switching over to trying to imply he is getting around (failing horribly at this) is more of signs of him trying to get her back

Then the FWF nightmare.  He is angry and hurt, clear as day and loves & misses her so bad.  You see her watching at her apartment (and for a split second you think "aww she still cares" but we find out later he sent her the link")  We've all done this when you break-up or are in fight with your ex, you lash out but it was lashing out filled with digs to make her feel guilty but in a sweet way.  He said (using country flags to make his point) that she got him/her a birthday cake and ate it even though it tasted horrible. What does that tell you?  And then he says something like "You/We aren't getting any younger".  SO yea, were they nice digs NO, but were they filled with Sheldony goodness YES.  And true to his character, that's how Sheldon expresses himself

and then last you see the tag door exchange.  He still thinks these crazy antics are working.  And as you can see, its not working and she is getting more mad and frustrated.  So, I think the Bad Boyfriend line from Penny did shock him and not always the best with dealing with emotions, Sheldon choose to probably google this stuff and try these antics.  I'm pretty sure next few episodes we will see him come back to focus and really get whats going on. 

With Sheldon lashing out in this manner, I'm surprised he didn't mention the ring in front of Amy.

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With Sheldon lashing out in this manner, I'm surprised he didn't mention the ring in front of Amy.

I am actually surprised too. Because it sounds like all his jabs are dripping with plans for their future, left right and center, in a very obscure manner that I don't think Amy's getting. But I think we get it because we know about it. I have no idea why the ring hasn't popped up under these circumstances. The only thing I can think of (and hope for) is that it's not popping out because the writers are saving that for a really good and poignant moment.

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I don't know that it needs to have something to do with her past. She's in love with him, she obviously wants to be with him in all ways possible and she's not sure he wants the same things. I think that's more than enough to upset her without needing a backstory. I think that would upset any of the other members of the gang just the same with their SO. But to me there's two sides of the same coin to the story, one that I like and one that makes me cringe. One is Amy being upset about whether she's just pushing him into something he doesn't really want and that it's unfair to both of them. And that's fine with me. The other that Amy wants X, Y and Z and now that she realizes she can't get it out of Sheldon and she's fed up with waiting, she's decided to move on and find it with someone else. Which I thoroughly dislike. 

 

Koops, you always have a way of saying the things I feel but can't express in English.

I am actually surprised too. Because it sounds like all his jabs are dripping with plans for their future, left right and center, in a very obscure manner that I don't think Amy's getting. But I think we get it because we know about it. I have no idea why the ring hasn't popped up under these circumstances. The only thing I can think of (and hope for) is that it's not popping out because the writers are saving that for a really good and poignant moment.

That's what I'm hoping for too. I guess even Sheldon knows this is a no-go..I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

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I don't know that it needs to have something to do with her past. She's in love with him, she obviously wants to be with him in all ways possible and she's not sure he wants the same things. I think that's more than enough to upset her without needing a backstory. I think that would upset any of the other members of the gang just the same with their SO. But to me there's two sides of the same coin to the story, one that I like and one that makes me cringe. One is Amy being upset about whether she's just pushing him into something he doesn't really want and that it's unfair to both of them. And that's fine with me. The other that Amy wants X, Y and Z and now that she realizes she can't get it out of Sheldon and she's fed up with waiting, she's decided to move on and find it with someone else. Which I thoroughly dislike. 

Can I just say though... Amy defending Leonard?!?! Really!? Like... I can't even begin to facepalm to that. Yeah, go on, defend a cheater, Amy. As long as he sweet talks and buys you flower I guess anything goes. That's a good boyfriend after all :icon_rolleyes: 

Did I miss something? When did she defend Leonard? I hope she didn´t do that! If your first choice is correct, than it will be difficult to make Amy believe, that he´s doing everything volunteeringly, because he wants to. And your second option sounds unfair to me, I´m sorry. I mean, we all have expectations for our lifes, dreams,targets. And her dream is to marry the love of her life and to live with him and their kids happily ever after. So what is wrong about hoping for it and then leave if she sees that it is not coming true? Otherwise she would make herself unhappy and I´m sure no one wants to live unhappy. Or would you want to live with someone who has totally different targets than you? Ok, Sheldon never promised to do anything of what she´s seeking, but they were talking about it and he seemed to like the idea, so deep inside her was growing the hope that he would marry her someday and have a family, etc.

Edited by Desdemona
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Did I miss something? When did she defend Leonard? I hope she didn´t do that! If your first choice is correct, than it will be difficult to make Amy believe, that he´s doing everything volunteeringly, because he wants to. And your second option sounds unfair to me, I´m sorry. I mean, we all have expectations for our lifes, dreams,targets. And her dream is to marry the love of her life and to live with him and their kids happily ever after. So what is wrong about hoping for it and then leave if she sees that it is not coming true? Otherwise she would make herself unhappy and I´m sure no one wants to live unhappy. Ok, Sheldon never promised to do anything of what she´s seeking, but they were talking about it and he seemed to like the idea, so deep inside her was growing the hope that he would marry her someday and have a family, etc.

Why would it be difficult to make Amy believe? My first option is essentially this miscommunication issue we have been talking about all along: she thinks he doesn't want the same things, but he does. They just need to find the way to communicate it to each other clearly. That's what I mean when I say Amy's upset because she THINKS she knows that Sheldon doesn't want the same things. As for the second, if we are talking about real life and Amy as if she were a real person, there's nothing wrong with that. I'm just saying that since the writers choose what she wants and where she comes from, I find the idea that Amy just wants the whole nine yards with anyone as long as she can have it, rather than wanting the whole nine yards WITH Sheldon because it's Sheldon to cheapen their entire dynamic (not to mention retcon quite a bit of her story - she's not Raj). It's essentially saying Amy is irreplaceable for Sheldon, whereas Amy could replace him if she "had to". It makes the whole relationship incredibly unbalanced.

I also don't really think Amy has expressed any specific desires about her future with Sheldon. She's tossed an idea here and there, but I think what matters to her, like she said in Mars is to plan their future together, whatever shape it might take. I actually think Sheldon's been obsessing over the whole nine yards way more than she has, given his current state of mind. Even in the Mars episode she just tossed the idea of Martian kids there and he took it and ran with it. I obviously don't know all the lines because I wasn't at the taping, but it does sound like what Kerry was saying, that he had a plan for marriage/kids with her and now she's throwing a spanner in his works and he's going ballistic. I don't think Amy's break from Sheldon had to do with these specifics, as much as more generally about whether he wants her and wants a future with her. That's why I said that last week I was so prepared to hear the classic sitcom!girlfirend lines of "I'm not getting any younger and I want babies and you're just leading me on! I need to move on and start a family!", but instead we keep getting these lines from Sheldon and Amy hasn't even brought that up at all so far. Actually, she seems irritated that he brings it up like he really doesn't get that's not the issue to her.

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I am actually surprised too. Because it sounds like all his jabs are dripping with plans for their future, left right and center, in a very obscure manner that I don't think Amy's getting. But I think we get it because we know about it. I have no idea why the ring hasn't popped up under these circumstances. The only thing I can think of (and hope for) is that it's not popping out because the writers are saving that for a really good and poignant moment.

Maybe him showing her the ring was the initial idea for the premiere and then they figured it would be better left for a later more poignant moment? Plans change after all and maybe that's why things are the way they are with all these surprisingly blatant jabs...?

The more I think about it the more I want Amy to haul out the flip charts and try to decipher his weirdo behaviour with science! lol

 

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I am actually surprised too. Because it sounds like all his jabs are dripping with plans for their future, left right and center, in a very obscure manner that I don't think Amy's getting. But I think we get it because we know about it. I have no idea why the ring hasn't popped up under these circumstances. The only thing I can think of (and hope for) is that it's not popping out because the writers are saving that for a really good and poignant moment.

I am glad he is not mentioning the ring because then Amy might get the idea that it was an after thought as a result of her breaking up with him or another means to get her back , as if she pushed him into it.   I think that would make matters worse.

No, I like the idea of Amy getting confirmation through information she gathers from her friends about Sheldon's plans before the break and what he is going through now, everything except the ring.    I still want the ring to show up as a surprise later, but I can see Sheldon telling her after she has accepted his proposal, that she could have had all this sooner if she had not over-reacted on their anniversary.

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HA!!! OMC that would be a wonderful line to wrap up their engagement scene and SO Sheldon: "You could have had this ring weeks/months ago if you hadn't overreacted, woman!".

I was just about to comment with the exact same line - it'd be so perfect! lmao

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Alright I posted this in another thread but here goes here too cause I think it belongs in there too.  (and maybe in the Season 8 discussion thread but I'm just not ready to go in there yet).  I haven't read most of the thread (not ready too yet, it's just been too negative for me to read through it all but I hear and I hope its been getting better)

I'll be honest here.  I haven't been posting much on the boards or reading most of the threads since the premiere was taped and the reason for that is that this forum has suddenly turned into a really ugly place to be.

Members attacking members, members & non-members attacking cast and crew and all the negativity being spewed over something no one save for those of us who have seen episode 1 taped/played back and episode 2 taped.  I just really wish people would reserve their judgement on the material until they see it on the screen in the way the writers and actors intend for us to see it.  Things are being blown way out of proportion and I just can't be a part of it.  

I will say this.  Regardless if you're a fan of the current story line or not, both episodes are good.  Some are funnier than others but they are both really good and they serve a very real purpose in telling the story they are trying to tell this season.  Its a good story arc and it has so much promise.  I just wish people could stop fixating on the one or two aspects they apparently hate based on spoilers and instead of reserving judgement until they see it as it plays out on screen.  Anyone who watches this show knows how much nuance there is in line delivery, facial expressions, body language etc.

Please stop driving yourselves crazy imagining all this doom and gloom cause I assure you, that's not what these episodes are delivering.

"I haven't been reading the thread so I don't know that everyone right now is actually discussing nicely about Shamy's future and fangirling about how sweet the engagement is going to be, no matter how long this break up drags on, but let me be hella condescending because I saw the premiere and you didn't."

Alright then.

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Oh yes I ca definitely see that line being a huge possibility haha. A bit of comedy at the end of what will probably (hopefully) be a very heartfelt and sweet scene. 

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Thanks Caffeine buzz... I needed that boost of positivity... Narina I think you missed her point there just a little but whatevs...Their engagement will be so epic that people will bow to it...minstrels will write songs about it. There once a couple named Shamy There ship was end gamey When they got engaged The whole damn world went crazy I am not a poet sorry. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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Some of my thoughts re: Shamy.  I thought they left it open ended enough to have this become an actual break up and it did.  My fear is that the once quirky Shamy becomes a caricature of what it once was and starts to follow the traditional break up, make up, sex, flowers...bah to me.

That's not to say that romance isn't a part of Shamy but their own unique brand of what that might be; like the tiara as an example.

I think they need to handle this carefully as S8 showed some of the best Sheldon letting down some of his walls and accepting he is in a relationship with a woman who has her own wants and needs.    

All episodes in which there was Shamy conflict appeared to be resolved by the end of the epi.  So now I am supposed to believe Amy was just placating Sheldon to maintain peace in the relationship.  However, internally she was simmering to an extent.  I mean she had to be somewhat holding back for it to lead to this point. 

This all seems to boil down to miscommunication and of course Sheldon not giving her space isn't helping.  It just seems Amy's anger/frustration further suggests, IMO, that she has been holding back.

It's frustrating to be at this point as so far I am not impressed with what spoilers to think this story will seem organic.  I agree if this becomes all about Shamy coitus...I find that sad, disappointing.  I also don't want the ring to play any part in getting back together.  When they get back together, in my head, it is after they have talked and are a little more on the same page as far as where there relationship is headed, expectations for intimacy, etc. 

And very much over the push/pull, Sheldon needs to grow up. The first 2 episodes seems to follow the one step forward and 2 steps back.  That's just meh to me!

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Thanks Caffeine buzz... I needed that boost of positivity... Narina I think you missed her point there just a little but whatevs...Their engagement will be so epic that people will bow to it...minstrels will write songs about it. There once a couple named Shamy There ship was end gamey When they got engaged The whole damn world went crazy I am not a poet sorry. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I don't think she did? Caffeine's post was pretty condescending and also out of nowhere. Currently absolutely no one on this thread has been acting melodramatically. In fact, some great discussion was going on and Caffeine's post sort of ruined that nice vibe with condescension. And she didn't even read the thread? It was uncalled for.

Edited by Musickat18
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At this point and I said it since the final, the ring was just a prop to end the season with and get everyone wondering if he's gonna propose now or at some point in the future

 

We may not hear anything about the ring until much later on in the season

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HA!!! OMC that would be a wonderful line to wrap up their engagement scene and SO Sheldon: "You could have had this ring weeks/months ago if you hadn't overreacted, woman!".

That is the best line ever! LOVE THE IDEA!

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