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[Spoilers] Shamy: Season 9


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5 hours ago, April said:

I mean, in the end Shamy are cut from the same cloth. And while that is an advantage in many ways when they are in sync it becomes a bit of a challenge when they have to deal with a problem that they are both ill equipped to deal with cause neither of them can balance out the other's weakness in this case. Neither of them had the experience to deal with a heartbreak and they did have a bit of a hard time opening up to each other about certain things. So with that in mind it's really no surprise the breakup went down the way it did even though we'd be sitting here screaming "OMG JUST TALK TO HER AND APOLOGISE, YOU IDIOT!" lol

It was Sheldon's extraction of the ring from the drawer and what he said to Gollum that took me by surprise, rather than Amy's request for time off while she thought about her relationship. My thoughts when she said she loved him but needed a little breather were along the lines of 'about time too' because she'd been working pretty hard for ages. His frequent belittling of her and threats to dump her if she didn't see things his way, interspersed with declarations of love, would put a strain on anybody let alone someone like her.

Sheldon's response to  (what anybody else but him would see as ) such a fair and reasonable demand surprised me. For a man who mostly takes things absolutely literally without grasping implications behind and beneath others' actual words, his hearing what Amy didn't say and his imagining her to mean it was all over puzzled me.

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Morning peeps! Let me clear up and give a more in depth shamy reportings!   There were 2 takes of the second kiss... As they finish kissing the first time round. They break apart. Sheld

Ok fellow Shamies, I typed up this report on the plane home just now. I've just landed and have another hour or so until I'll be home, but I thought I'd post this at least for you all real quick.  Sor

Oh...I thought someone has already posted a TR? No? Ok. First of all, English is not my first language, so I may have misunderstood a lot of the lines. Please forgive me if the episode turns out

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4 hours ago, April said:

Idk I think having the breakup at the end of 8x24 made perfect sense for me. Yes, there were quite a few important steps forward but there were also plenty of moments during the season that must've cast doubts on Amy's mind. I think his admission in 8x01 that he's afraid of what she'd think of him gave her enough to give him another chance. But thorough the season you can see little moments of when she's insecure about their relationship and Sheldon can barely patch things up sometimes.

I mean, you list 8x12 when Amy was concerned that Sheldon was still a "flight risk" as a good thing? I think it's a red flag that tells us a lot about her state of mind, especially within the context of the episode that has her admitting she'd do anything to keep her friends. Likewise, Amy's fanfic is somewhat bitter-sweet because it tells us so much about what Amy is yearning for and it's telling when Penny and Bernie point out that her fanfic!Sheldon isn't that much different from the real one. She didn't turn him into some romance novel caricature and the key scene between Amelia and Cooper is simply about him coming back to her and proclaim his commitment. And I think that this is exactly what she wants from Sheldon.

Fast forward a few episodes and Mars happens which seems to confirm her worst fears that Sheldon would ditch her at the next best opportunity. And for the longest time Sheldon doesn't get it why she'd be upset. They manage to sort things out but the next bump on the road comes with the anniversary and Sheldon ruining the moment. And Amy gives him a few chances to say something nice but again he doesn't get it. And it's really not Amy's fault for being too ambiguous or whatever cause later on Penny spells it out to him and he still doesn't get it. /facepalm

I think if anything Fort was the big episode showing us how good they are for each other despite all of the bumps on the road. An early preview of "what could be" with them bonding over being left out as kids and reclaiming part of their childhood by building the fort and having a great time playing games. And it also showed us a completely relaxed Sheldon being able to let go of his rules for Amy. All in all we're seeing a lot of the good things that we're also seeing now after reconciliation. So the essence of that has always been there - it just needed a shift of focus (especially from Sheldon) to move the relationship forward like that permanently.

But, like you said yourself, there was a certain maturity absent and their communication was lacking in some aspects that led to repeated conflicts. However now all of that is so much better with Shamy 2.0 and I love the contrast the writers draw between their old dynamic and their new one (even if that means repeating some plot beats to the ire of certain fans).

These are valid points albeit from a different perspective! See, I saw Amy's fear of Sheldon being a flight risk, in addition to professing her love to him mid-season, and wanting to plan their lives together as all being consistent with someone who would NOT be leaving a relationship, certainly not over a blow up over a distracted make out (albeit on an anniversary of all things, dumbass Sheldon!) that frankly she has seen before.

And Sheldon WAS taking small steps in the right direction. Maybe not huge strides but certainly more than any other season. 

So yeah, Im gonna be stubborn and maintain for me at least that I felt the timing of the break up sucked. But to each their own! We can all agree, on THIS thread anyway, that we like the end result of it!

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30 minutes ago, 2L344 said:

These are valid points albeit from a different perspective! See, I saw Amy's fear of Sheldon being a flight risk, in addition to professing her love to him mid-season, and wanting to plan their lives together as all being consistent with someone who would NOT be leaving a relationship, certainly not over a blow up over a distracted make out (albeit on an anniversary of all things, dumbass Sheldon!) that frankly she has seen before.

And Sheldon WAS taking small steps in the right direction. Maybe not huge strides but certainly more than any other season. 

I don't think that these things are mutually exclusive with Amy wanting to take a break and evaluate their situation at the end of 8x24. In fact I think these bits and pieces build upon each other. I don't believe that she wanted to break up with him over a little spat like that. Heck, I don't even believe that she wanted to break up with him in 9x01 cause immediately afterwards she had second thoughts but was encouraged by Howardette and Stewart to find someone better. I think if Sheldon had respected her boundaries she would've just taken her time, maybe looked at all the progress they made in S8 and found a way to talk to him about what was bothering her - or at least that would've been her plan. But it all fell apart when Sheldon overreacted in 9x01 and pushed her over the line. It's not something she did on a whim but as a last resort.

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So yeah, Im gonna be stubborn and maintain for me at least that I felt the timing of the break up sucked. But to each their own! We can all agree, on THIS thread anyway, that we like the end result of it!

Haha, absolutely! :D

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1 hour ago, joyceraye said:

It was Sheldon's extraction of the ring from the drawer and what he said to Gollum that took me by surprise, rather than Amy's request for time off while she thought about her relationship. My thoughts when she said she loved him but needed a little breather were along the lines of 'about time too' because she'd been working pretty hard for ages. His frequent belittling of her and threats to dump her if she didn't see things his way, interspersed with declarations of love, would put a strain on anybody let alone someone like her.

Sheldon's response to  (what anybody else but him would see as ) such a fair and reasonable demand surprised me. For a man who mostly takes things absolutely literally without grasping implications behind and beneath others' actual words, his hearing what Amy didn't say and his imagining her to mean it was all over puzzled me.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think that might have been the first time that he actually felt rejected by Amy. And I don't mean those "oh Amy is mad at me" situations because they had plenty of those and it didn't bother him that much cause he took for granted that they'd patch things up and everything would be peachy. But now there's the suggestion that everything won't be peachy and it threatens the status quo and no matter if he understood the difference between "break up" and "taking a break" or not (and apparently he didn't) I think it still would've hurt him just as much. I mean, if we believe that one of his greatest fears is that Amy might think less of him this is certainly the first hint that she might. And I think the sting of rejection and the uncertainty was kind of driving him bonkers in 9x01. And it certainly doesn't help that he's lacking experience when it comes to relationships or properly dealing with conflict and his emotions, and neither does it help Lenny being far away in Vegas and not talking some sense into him or whatever. So yeah, I think there's where his overreaction is coming from. Does that make any sense?

As for the ring I think it was mainly a handy tool for the writers to show that his heart is in the right place and allow the audience to root for them even though what we saw from Sheldon in the first episodes was probably the most unpleasant we've seen him as for quite some time.

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There was a bit of shock only because they had rows before over more serious things and they managed to patch things up. I guess it was just a build up over time that in her words exhausted her and just needed to take a step back and reassess.

Penny knew it might be coming, it's not easy being friends of both people in the couple but I always thought perhaps Penny should have maybe spoken to Sheldon especially when he was starting to worry in the final episode of season 8 that he had not heard from her. Obviously that would have taken away from the storyline drama but in real life maybe she would have said something. Maybe a last ditch to try and fix it, though that again could have gone wrong.

I can understand why Sheldon reacted in the way he did overall in S9E1 as he was still in shock but he did go a bit too far in the confusion. I think to someone like Sheldon with a lack of relationship experience you are either together or not, taking a break I guess to him is a kind of limbo which he would have found really confusing.

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12 hours ago, 2L344 said:

I agree with some of what you say. You're right, the compatibility test episode in 8x3 started out with Shamy believing themselves to be a superior couple to Lenny but you could see that Amy wanted the intimacy that Lenny shared when they talked with one another. And no doubt, both Sheldon and Amy did their share of hurting one another, and your characterization of both of their personalities is spot on. I didn't like the break up (still don't) but in the end the writers were able to justify all the good things that came as a result of it, and like you pointed out Sheldon (and Amy) believe their relationship was strengthened from it. I believe the same things could've been accomplished with other plots instead of the break up, but that's a whole different topic.

But frankly, I think the break up would've made more sense earlier, at the latest 8x1 when Sheldon returns from his lengthy train trip that he sprung on everyone. I think there was enough milestones and momentum carrying through S8 that made the timing of the break up strange, and I think for me that was what irritated me about it. No doubt Amy had reasons to break up with Sheldon, for the obvious reasons we all know, but to me S6 into S7 would've made more sense. 

Look what we had in S8--

8x8 had the prom and declarations of love (that was BIG for both of them)

8x11 had Sheldon continuing to acknowledge his love for Amy, this time to Bernie while shopping for a Christmas gift (albeit to seek revenge for a missletoe kiss at the tree lot lol). In the end it's a sweet ending for them both.

8x12 had Amy concerned that Sheldon was still a "flight risk" when Leonard revisits moving out of 4A during the shopping incident

8x14 had the revelation of Amy's fan fic involving her and Sheldon.

8x17 had them buying a turtle together, and though there is a falling out over the Mars expedition it ended with them planning the Mars trip together. There is talk of raising kids as Martians. Amy confesses she wants them to plan their lives together.

8x20 had the fort scene and their first official "sleepover". Sheldon breaks the RA parameters to spend the rest of the evening with Amy in the fort they made.

8x24 begins with a make out session on the couch that we've never seen before. It ends with the "break", over Skype of all things...

Its not hard to see why some of us were shocked that the break up occurred after 8x24, the writers had us believing the couple was going somewhere forward for a change in S8, more so than previously seen IMO. I just think the timing of the break up was suspiciously off, and it felt to me to be a reversal of the foundation the writers were laying throughout the season. It's just my opinion but I think others shared it too at the time.

In the end, however, it doesn't really matter now. After a grueling 9 episode break up plot we have a Shamy that progressed forward at lightning speed for a while, with reconciliation and love being professed again, SEX, and a maturing of the relationship that was absent in the past. The couple communicates better and Sheldon has a better appreciation of what he has in Amy, which was lacking in the past. Shamy IMO is lookin pretty good going into S10.

Uh oh, I feel like we're all about to revisit "the debate" again lol! These taping breaks and quiet moments give us too much time on our hands lol, just wait til S9 ends and that long summer to come!

I know, they didn't have to use a break-up to advance their relationship. It was a cliche and something that many people saw as taking away from their uniqueness. Personally, it didn't ruin their uniqueness for me. I could tell it was going to happen anyway. And I guess I'm willing to make way for a cliche or two - this is a TV sitcom afterall. Besides, marriage is also a cliche for couples on TV but I think we can safely say that most Shamy fans here want them to get married so, why discriminate? :icon_razz: Of course, it also matters how the cliche is portrayed and for me it was something enjoyable so I'm fine with it.

I agree that it would have made great sense for Amy to break up with him in 8.1. But I don't think that she had the guts to do it back then. It takes courage to get out of a relationship that you have invested so much in. Add to that that it was not only her first relationship but also a serious one that she wanted to go long-term, and if you factor in her inexperience you get a sense how difficult it would be for her to break up with him at that point.

Anyway, she did tell him off about him not caring that she was there to help him, and later in the car she didn't hide that she was mad at him, but I think that him admitting that he didn't want to appear a failure in front of her swayed her to forgive him. Of course, that was about him not calling her and being insensitive after she tried to help him, not about the whole trip. I guess it was a combination of her understanding that he went through a lot to reach the point of suddenly living and her being too forgiving. I do think that it was resolved a bit too fast, don't get me wrong. I'll say though, Amy has a lot of patience when it comes to Sheldon and sometimes you just don't know how to stop and say "Ok, this is my limit".

We did get great things in season 8 and ultimately these were probably a result of Sheldon's trip. He did leave to escape from everything being too much and think, after all. The love declaration was the next step in their relationship (and they ended up having so much fun at the prom) and the Christmas ep had a very touching ending that IMO was a great lesson for Sheldon. Just in the next ep though, 8.12, we learn that Amy was worried that Sheldon would leave again - a callback to the train trip and proof that she was walking on egg shells around him as a result of that and that she might have forgiven him but she hasn't forgotten. IMO that's a warning sign - Amy has doubts about him.

I don't see 8.14 as relevant in this situation. We already knew that Amy wanted him, we just didn't know that she wrote fanfic about it. 8.17 was a great ep because we had Sheldon making a mistake and then trying to fix it and succeeding. It's one of the episodes that are used as examples of when Amy should have broken up with him but personally I don't think it was that big a deal, especially since it ended well for both of them. Maybe the practically non-existent chances of Sheldon actually going through with the trip if he were chosen adds to that, and I think that Amy was aware of that. It was the sentiment of Sheldon being willing to fix it that counted. Amy talked honestly about what she wanted out of the relationship, Sheldon understood and agreed that he wanted the same thing and then proceeded to fix his mistake (a mistake that can be attributed to Sheldon being delusional and in denial sometimes) - it was overall an ep with a satisfying ending.

8.20 was a lovely ep. They had a conversation about being left out, Sheldon talked a bit about his difficult childhood, Amy tried to help him feel better and Sheldon took some huge steps in their relationship (plus they had fun in the fort). I just have some reservations about it, but I don't know if anyone wants to hear about them so I'll leave it at that.

Then we have 8.24. IMO, things had been building up inside Amy for a long time, but Sheldon randomly asking her about a TV show right in the middle of them making out, just when Amy thought they were having a moment during their anniversary was the final blow. We know that intimacy (and the commitment that comes with it) was a sore spot for their relationship. Amy wanted - understandably - to feel wanted by Sheldon and that she was the only thing on his mind. Later we find out that she was already thinking about asking for a break/ breaking up with him (we only have Penny's words on this but my guess would be that she was thinking about asking for a break, which might/might not had led to a break-up), so we know she already had serious doubts and things just kept building up. She was willing to wait it out and be patient, but 8.24 was the final straw. Frankly, I thought her reaction was completely justifiable. Then she asked for a break (not a break-up) because she wanted space to think things through. Like she said, she was exhausted, she was probably confused as after Sheldon's trip good and bad things had happened in their relationship and I'd also say that she resorted to break the news to him through Skype because it hurt too much to do it face to face. This is reinforced in 9.2 (I think) when she said that this was a traumatic experience for her.

Then, after going through that and having to tell Sheldon to stay away and let her think, he just went on and insulted her. I know that he was confused and he couldn't understand, but he was also an asshole about it. IMO, if you factor in everything Amy had gone through up to that point, her reaction was understandable and relatable.

In general, I think the break-up was mostly a result of Sheldon's overall behaviour. That doesn't mean that Amy didn't make her own mistakes. I think though that it's possible for someone to have a reaction or behave in a way that is considered wrong but at the same time understandable. I also don't think that it's a competition between who hurt the most, who made the most mistakes, etc. Sheldon and Amy have their own faults each. They made mistakes at different points but they also did the best they could at difficult moments. A break-up is always a complicated situation and no interaction exists in a vacuum.

I agree that no matter what we think of the break up, good things came out of it! They have made great progress after the reconciliation in various ways and this progress has been layed out through the whole season with smaller moments in between.

My post is very long...sorry about that :icon_cheesygrin:. I didn't expect to write so much. I know that the break-up has been rehashed again and again but I wanted to get my thoughts out on it now that I have the chance. I'll leave this on a high note though: I find all the changes in the Shamy relationship as a result of the break-up extremelly positive and promising and I'm almost completely sure that this is going to be the case for the remaining episodes of this season.

Edited by Judith
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1 hour ago, Judith said:

I know, they didn't have to use a break-up to advance their relationship. It was a cliche and something that many people saw as taking away from their uniqueness. Personally, it didn't ruin their uniqueness for me. I could tell it was going to happen anyway. And I guess I'm willing to make way for a cliche or two - this is a TV sitcom afterall. Besides, marriage is also a cliche for couples on TV but I think we can safely say that most Shamy fans here want them to get married so, why discriminate? :icon_razz: Of course, it also matters how the cliche is portrayed and for me it was something enjoyable so I'm fine with it.

I agree that it would have made great sense for Amy to break up with him in 8.1. But I don't think that she had the guts to do it back then. It takes courage to get out of a relationship that you have invested so much in. Add to that that it was not only her first relationship but also a serious one that she wanted to go long-term, and if you factor in her inexperience you get a sense how difficult it would be for her to break up with him at that point.

Anyway, she did tell him off about him not caring that she was there to help him, and later in the car she didn't hide that she was mad at him, but I think that him admitting that he didn't want to appear a failure in front of her swayed her to forgive him. Of course, that was about him not calling her and being insensitive after she tried to help him, not about the whole trip. I guess it was a combination of her understanding that he went through a lot to reach the point of suddenly living and her being too forgiving. I do think that it was resolved a bit too fast, don't get me wrong. I'll say though, Amy has a lot of patience when it comes to Sheldon and sometimes you just don't know how to stop and say "Ok, this is my limit".

We did get great things in season 8 and ultimately these were probably a result of Sheldon's trip. He did leave to escape from everything being too much and think, after all. The love declaration was the next step in their relationship (and they ended up having so much fun at the prom) and the Christmas ep had a very touching ending that IMO was a great lesson for Sheldon. Just in the next ep though, 8.12, we learn that Amy was worried that Sheldon would leave again - a callback to the train trip and proof that she was walking on egg shells around him as a result of that and that she might have forgiven him but she hasn't forgotten. IMO that's a warning sign - Amy has doubts about him.

I don't see 8.14 as relevant in this situation. We already knew that Amy wanted him, we just didn't know that she wrote fanfic about it. 8.17 was a great ep because we had Sheldon making a mistake and then trying to fix it and succeeding. It's one of the episodes that are used as examples of when Amy should have broken up with him but personally I don't think it was that big a deal, especially since it ended well for both of them. Maybe the practically non-existent chances of Sheldon actually going through with the trip if he were chosen adds to that, and I think that Amy was aware of that. It was the sentiment of Sheldon being willing to fix it that counted. Amy talked honestly about what she wanted out of the relationship, Sheldon understood and agreed that he wanted the same thing and then proceeded to fix his mistake (a mistake that can be attributed to Sheldon being delusional and in denial sometimes) - it was overall an ep with a satisfying ending.

8.20 was a lovely ep. They had a conversation about being left out, Sheldon talked a bit about his difficult childhood, Amy tried to help him feel better and Sheldon took some huge steps in their relationship (plus they had fun in the fort). I just have some reservations about it, but I don't know if anyone wants to hear about them so I'll leave it at that.

Then we have 8.24. IMO, things had been building up inside Amy for a long time, but Sheldon randomly asking her about a TV show right in the middle of them making out, just when Amy thought they were having a moment during their anniversary was the final blow. We know that intimacy (and the commitment that comes with it) was a sore spot for their relationship. Amy wanted - understandably - to feel wanted by Sheldon and that she was the only thing on his mind. Later we find out that she was already thinking about breaking up with him, so we know she already had serious doubts and things kept building up. She was willing to wait it out and be patient, but 8.24 was the final straw. Frankly, I thought her reaction was completely justifiable. Then she asked for a break (not a break-up) because she wanted space to think things through. Like she said, she was exhausted, she was probably confused as after Sheldon's trip good and bad things had happened in their relationship and I'd also say that she resorted to break the news to him through Skype because it hurt too much to do it face to face. This is reinforced in 9.2 (I think) when she said that this was a traumatic experience for her.

Then, after going through that and having to tell Sheldon to stay away and let her think, he just went on and insulted her. I know that he was confused and he couldn't understand, but he was also an asshole about it. IMO, if you factor in everything Amy had gone through up to that point, her reaction was understandable and relatable.

In general, I think the break-up was mostly a result of Sheldon's overall behaviour. That doesn't mean that Amy didn't make her own mistakes. I think though that it's possible for someone to have a reaction or behave in a way that is considered wrong but at the same time understandable. I also don't think that it's a competition between who hurt the most, who made the most mistakes, etc. Sheldon and Amy have their own faults each. They made mistakes at different points but they also did the best they could at difficult moments. A break-up is always a complicated situation and no interaction exists in a vacuum.

I agree that no matter what we thing of the break up, good things came out of it! They have made great progress after the reconciliation in various ways and this progress is has been layed out through the whole season with smaller moments in between.

My post is very long...sorry about that :icon_cheesygrin:. I didn't expect to write so much. I know that the break-up has been rehashed again and again but I wanted to get my thoughts out on it now that I have the chance. I'll leave this on a high note though: I find all the changes in the Shamy relationship as a result of the break-up extremelly positive and promising and I'm almost completely sure that this is going to be the case for the remaining episodes of this season.

Haha it was a good read! It reminds me of some of our long debates and arguments a while ago now over it all in this thread! I could get passionate about my thoughts back then and had my share of disagreements. Now that Shamy seems somewhat "fixed" and in a good place it doesnt matter much in the end for me. Though I STILL dislike watching those episodes and change the channel when they are being televised!

I think theres quite a few of us who could pick up where we left off regarding those issues and debates about the break up that weve just shared lol. Like for example, the dreaded aquarium "im ready to be your gf again" solution without any resolution to the issues that brought us the break up in the first place (just had to sneak that in there!).

But really, Im glad we were all able to move on from the ickyness of the break up, whether we liked that arc or not. 

Edited by 2L344
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On 4/12/2016 at 3:40 PM, Jonny83 said:

Well she's happy at the moment and that's all that matters. She's such a strong willed, straight talking, honest character that if she believes she wants more then she will likely push for it. I think she knows how big a deal it was for Sheldon to make that commitment so she won't push for a good while. If she has to wait until her next birthday and she is happy with that then fair enough.

My prediction is that it will happen again before her next birthday either glaringly obviously so or by a subtle hint. They've done the big drama event, I actually would prefer if it's addressed again in a more casual, more normal everyday couple way of addressing it.

Push seems like she's begging and being manipulative. I don't believe she has to 'push' for anything anymore. I'm pretty sure that if she flat out expressed what she wanted, Sheldon would  gladly oblige. ;)

Edited by kelliluvtbbt
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8 hours ago, April said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think that might have been the first time that he actually felt rejected by Amy. And I don't mean those "oh Amy is mad at me" situations because they had plenty of those and it didn't bother him that much cause he took for granted that they'd patch things up and everything would be peachy. But now there's the suggestion that everything won't be peachy and it threatens the status quo and no matter if he understood the difference between "break up" and "taking a break" or not (and apparently he didn't) I think it still would've hurt him just as much. I mean, if we believe that one of his greatest fears is that Amy might think less of him this is certainly the first hint that she might. And I think the sting of rejection and the uncertainty was kind of driving him bonkers in 9x01. And it certainly doesn't help that he's lacking experience when it comes to relationships or properly dealing with conflict and his emotions, and neither does it help Lenny being far away in Vegas and not talking some sense into him or whatever. So yeah, I think there's where his overreaction is coming from. Does that make any sense?

As for the ring I think it was mainly a handy tool for the writers to show that his heart is in the right place and allow the audience to root for them even though what we saw from Sheldon in the first episodes was probably the most unpleasant we've seen him as for quite some time.

Very good points April. I think you're right : until 8.24 he'd been the boss, or thought he had. His hints and threats to frighten her that she'd be the one rejected were suddenly turned on him. That she would take charge of the relationship herself would never have occurred to him.  That she did not even want to discuss what he was going to say in the Skype conversation knocked him for six.

It took the breakup and his forced reflection on his loss, the examination of his feelings, and being made to go over in his mind what had happened, to make him realise how he'd brought the situation about. Whether he needed so much time is hard to say :  as early as 904, he did mention  ' Amy's wedding, when she's marrying someone better than me' among the rare special occasions to have dinner with Lenny in his imagined future. 

During the breakup Amy had a lot more encouragement from the gang - including all the men - who'd been there at the quarrel, plus Penny, to get her life back together and find someone else. There was no suggestion that she was going to lose any of them ('Not an Indian, we've got one of those' ) although they were Sheldon's friends initially and still were. Amy had for a long time had normal female longings to be treated as a desirable woman and cherished. She'd always had little hope of having that side of her fulfilled by Sheldon and eventually took the opportunity to seek it elsewhere. It took her a few months to realise that even if she found it, it wasn't going to be enough. Sheldon with all his quirks, even if he hadn't changed a bit, was much more suited to the rest of what she wanted. When she said she'd missed things like playing daft games she was rejecting the ordinariness of what she'd encountered on the dating round. 'Better' was boring.

After yet another six months we're seeing how much franker they are. Sheldon still throws out the odd putdown line that worried me some weeks ago but now I see that she doesn't let it bother her. She can ignore it or give as good as she gets without fear. If Sheldon had proposed a year ago, the maturing Amy of S8, unlike the Amy of earlier seasons, might well have asked for time to think and then said 'No' when she considered life over the next sixty years, but after all that's gone on this year I think she'll accept when he asks.

 

 

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20 minutes ago, joyceraye said:

Very good points April. I think you're right : until 8.24 he'd been the boss, or thought he had. His hints and threats to frighten her that she'd be the one rejected were suddenly turned on him. That she would take charge of the relationship herself would never have occurred to him.  That she did not even want to discuss what he was going to say in the Skype conversation knocked him for six.

It took the breakup and his forced reflection on his loss, the examination of his feelings, and being made to go over in his mind what had happened, to make him realise how he'd brought the situation about. Whether he needed so much time is hard to say :  as early as 904, he did mention  ' Amy's wedding, when she's marrying someone better than me' among the rare special occasions to have dinner with Lenny in his imagined future. 

During the breakup Amy had a lot more encouragement from the gang - including all the men - who'd been there at the quarrel, plus Penny, to get her life back together and find someone else. There was no suggestion that she was going to lose any of them ('Not an Indian, we've got one of those' ) although they were Sheldon's friends initially and still were. Amy had for a long time had normal female longings to be treated as a desirable woman and cherished. She'd always had little hope of having that side of her fulfilled by Sheldon and eventually took the opportunity to seek it elsewhere. It took her a few months to realise that even if she found it, it wasn't going to be enough. Sheldon with all his quirks, even if he hadn't changed a bit, was much more suited to the rest of what she wanted. When she said she'd missed things like playing daft games she was rejecting the ordinariness of what she'd encountered on the dating round. 'Better' was boring.

After yet another six months we're seeing how much franker they are. Sheldon still throws out the odd putdown line that worried me some weeks ago but now I see that she doesn't let it bother her. She can ignore it or give as good as she gets without fear. If Sheldon had proposed a year ago, the maturing Amy of S8, unlike the Amy of earlier seasons, might well have asked for time to think and then said 'No' when she considered life over the next sixty years, but after all that's gone on this year I think she'll accept when he asks.

 

 

This.

I still sometimes cringe and get a bit fearful when he throws out a line, for example in the most recent episode when he gave Amy a dictionary and told her to look up the word fun and get back to him. I know something as small as that shouldn't cause them problems but you just never know.

They do seem to be more frank with each other, when she got Sheldon the new laptop there were some zingers in terms of dialogue but Amy stood her ground as was proven right in the end. She stood up to Sheldon's beloved Meemaw which I don't think Sheldon 4 or 5 years ago would have tolerated that much. On a side note look at the fear in Sheldon's face when she says she was leaving during that Meemaw episode, I've seen it several times recently and he genuinely looks worried. The fun with flags valentine episode probably would have blown up if it happened earlier in their relationship but now it's so much stronger it didn't.

Sheldon has changed but I also think there is an element of fear of losing her again.

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Lol watching 7x4 and during the Shamy Skype scene, when he invites Amy over to ruin Little House on the Prarie, he mentions April 13 as that dark day when a curly fry got mixed in with his regular fries...Happy Anniversary of the curly fry incident!

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2 hours ago, Jonny83 said:

This.

I still sometimes cringe and get a bit fearful when he throws out a line, for example in the most recent episode when he gave Amy a dictionary and told her to look up the word fun and get back to him. I know something as small as that shouldn't cause them problems but you just never know.

They do seem to be more frank with each other, when she got Sheldon the new laptop there were some zingers in terms of dialogue but Amy stood her ground as was proven right in the end. She stood up to Sheldon's beloved Meemaw which I don't think Sheldon 4 or 5 years ago would have tolerated that much. On a side note look at the fear in Sheldon's face when she says she was leaving during that Meemaw episode, I've seen it several times recently and he genuinely looks worried. The fun with flags valentine episode probably would have blown up if it happened earlier in their relationship but now it's so much stronger it didn't.

Sheldon has changed but I also think there is an element of fear of losing her again.

What I like these days is they are more easy going and comfortable, there isnt that sense of "one upmanship" with Sheldon and Amy is a little less critical and picks her battles. Like in the cabin episode you mention, that laptop purchase of Amy's wouldve been an ugly fight in the past...but instead, Amy lets Sheldon vent a bit and after he gets his zingers out she puts an end to it. In turn Sheldon apologizes and acknowledges his appreciation.

 

And look how easily Sheldon agrees to go to the cabin! No arm twisting at all, Amy merely feigned manipulating him and he was on board. And he is having a glass of wine BEFORE the drinking game is proposed?? 

 

Ill admit that soon after 9.11 I was uneasy about what I saw as the two of them reverting back to the same old behavior--annoyed Amy and smartass insensitive Sheldon. But lately Ive noticed a level of comfort between the two that is more dismissive of the "little things" and they dont seem bothered as much about things. FWF couldve ended differently but was instead funny and cute. Sheldon reveals his dark secret to Amy regarding his hoarding issue. And they were pretty cute at karaoke too.

 

Im hoping things continue to be easier and Im looking forward to a time when there is a little more hand holding and "couples" moments between them. Maybe some PDA moments here and there!

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4 hours ago, 2L344 said:

What I like these days is they are more easy going and comfortable, there isnt that sense of "one upmanship" with Sheldon and Amy is a little less critical and picks her battles. Like in the cabin episode you mention, that laptop purchase of Amy's wouldve been an ugly fight in the past...but instead, Amy lets Sheldon vent a bit and after he gets his zingers out she puts an end to it. In turn Sheldon apologizes and acknowledges his appreciation.

 

And look how easily Sheldon agrees to go to the cabin! No arm twisting at all, Amy merely feigned manipulating him and he was on board. And he is having a glass of wine BEFORE the drinking game is proposed?? 

 

Ill admit that soon after 9.11 I was uneasy about what I saw as the two of them reverting back to the same old behavior--annoyed Amy and smartass insensitive Sheldon. But lately Ive noticed a level of comfort between the two that is more dismissive of the "little things" and they dont seem bothered as much about things. FWF couldve ended differently but was instead funny and cute. Sheldon reveals his dark secret to Amy regarding his hoarding issue. And they were pretty cute at karaoke too.

 

Im hoping things continue to be easier and Im looking forward to a time when there is a little more hand holding and "couples" moments between them. Maybe some PDA moments here and there!

What I like most of Shamy 2.0 is the way both of them are living everyday life as a couple. I mean, they can't change all in a sudden and become two completely different persons, there will always be moments for Amy to roll her eyes at some Sheldon's shenanigans and there will always be moments for Sheldon to complain that things are not done his way (i.e., the right way...) But they are facing those moments in a completely new way, you can see in both of them a willingfulness of compromising more and of accepting the other one POV. I don't mind the occasional fights or the zingers here and there, as long as both of them seem to be not affected by them. In the big stuff, they work as a team (Sheldon taking Amy's side with meemaw and Amy being very supporting in the hoarding episode), in the little things of everyday life they manage to come along and to take it easy...is not that how life should be for happy couples?

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7 hours ago, joyceraye said:

Very good points April. I think you're right : until 8.24 he'd been the boss, or thought he had. His hints and threats to frighten her that she'd be the one rejected were suddenly turned on him. That she would take charge of the relationship herself would never have occurred to him.  That she did not even want to discuss what he was going to say in the Skype conversation knocked him for six.

It took the breakup and his forced reflection on his loss, the examination of his feelings, and being made to go over in his mind what had happened, to make him realise how he'd brought the situation about. Whether he needed so much time is hard to say :  as early as 904, he did mention  ' Amy's wedding, when she's marrying someone better than me' among the rare special occasions to have dinner with Lenny in his imagined future. 

One of the things that bothered me the most about Shamy 1.0 was Sheldon's "there's no one else who'd put up with you" attitude - and as much as people are angry about Amy's "I'm his best shot!" at least she wasn't saying that to his face and only in a moment of anger. Sheldon however said this kind of stuff repeatedly to her face. I don't think it's an accident that this was basically what pushed Amy over the edge in 9x01 and again in 9x02. He needed to learn that he can't take her for granted and to appreciate her. And part of that was learning the hard way that if given the chance gentleman callers will line up at her door. 9x04 was the start of that in his imagined future scenarios but actually seeing it (as clichéd as it may be) as a real threat was probably needed to really drive this lesson home for him.

7 hours ago, joyceraye said:

It took her a few months to realise that even if she found it, it wasn't going to be enough. Sheldon with all his quirks, even if he hadn't changed a bit, was much more suited to the rest of what she wanted. When she said she'd missed things like playing daft games she was rejecting the ordinariness of what she'd encountered on the dating round. 'Better' was boring.

This. As much as she was jumping the gun with her proposal to take him back (and she really misjudged the situation) I do think it showed what she really valued about their relationship - the special bond of companionship and a unique rapport that she wouldn't find with anyone else. (Plus, it certainly helped that Sheldon was already showing a more pleasant side of himself.)

I also think that it helped to restore the relationship with a bit more balance cause as much as Sheldon's ego needed to be taken down a peg it shouldn't go over board with it either by having him crawl back to her and be frightened to say the wrong thing or whatever. So having Amy choose him as he is is already reassuring that she won't bolt because he isn't fulfilling some criteria on the "best boyfriend ever" list - but oh boy, is he trying anyway or what? I mean, I really can't understand the idea that there's no difference in their dynamic when Sheldon is the most lovey-dovey he's ever been. lol

7 hours ago, Jonny83 said:

I still sometimes cringe and get a bit fearful when he throws out a line, for example in the most recent episode when he gave Amy a dictionary and told her to look up the word fun and get back to him. I know something as small as that shouldn't cause them problems but you just never know.

[...]

Sheldon has changed but I also think there is an element of fear of losing her again.

This is actually why I'm not too bothered with their banter - I don't want Sheldon to be too frightened either and some of his zingers like that show that they have a healthy balance right now cause Amy is a lot more bold with hers as well. ("Whatch me!" lol) They can tease each other and it doesn't turn into a fight or anything. So we still get some humour out of that but IMHO it's by far not as mean spirited as some of the stuff we had in the past.

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51 minutes ago, nickelette424 said:

I am surprised that people found his dictionary comment mean.  I laughed at him being a smartass, but I just don't see the intent of being mean as a part of that.  Maybe it's because I enjoy people who are sarcastic and employee smartass humor.   I'm glad that Amy isn't really that sensitive, especially since she regularly dishes it out herself. 

I guess the breakup is still fresh in my mind and I don't want to see any trouble between the pair even though it's unlikely as they appear so much stronger now. I'm just being a bit oversensitive.

Amy dishes it out with the best of them, it's one of her endearing qualities.

Edited by Jonny83
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12 hours ago, vonmar said:

TBS tonight...The Zazzy Substitution......25 cats....early Shamy was so adorable.

That was an adorable and hilarious episode indeed!

For someone who claimed that Amy was just a friend and not his girlfriend, he spent a lot of time hugging and stroking Zazzles, after he ended his relationship with Amy.

Maybe its dark fur reminded him of Amy´s dark hair.

 

Edited by Desdemona
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2 hours ago, Jonny83 said:

I guess the breakup is still fresh in my mind and I don't want to see any trouble between the pair even though it's unlikely as they appear so much stronger now. I'm just being a bit oversensitive.

Amy dishes it out with the best of them, it's one of her endearing qualities.

I feel ya, I was the same way during the Amy Skype sessions (Sheldon not "getting" why Amy wished he was at the conference with her, Amy lying and staying at the conference and the subsequent lecture about empathy), some of the things Amy said during Meemaw, and even her registration of disappointment at the beginning of FWF when the "gift" of having her name on the title of the show wasn't exactly what she expected...

Personally I think I was expecting to see an immediate change in attitude with them both after reconciliation. No doubt that was a bit unrealistic, as others have pointed out. They both seemed so happy and grateful to get a second chance with the relationship that I expected to see two people catering to one another, and a Sheldon bending over backwards to make it right with Amy. The coitus episode was a step in that direction, but then episodes after that showed me that there were still some elements of the old characters there that I attributed to the bad stuff that led to the break up in the first place. We still get that even now (clueless Sheldon not getting the "birthday suit" comment from Amy for instance) and since we haven't even seen so much as a hug, handholding, or light peck on the cheek since 9.11 it's easy to fall into the trap of wondering just why....

I have to believe things will begin to move along a little soon, if not by the finale then into S10. I like what I've seen about how relaxed they seem nowadays, and there isn't that edge that used to surround some of the exchanges they had in the past. Amy isn't nearly bothered by some of his cracks, and though Sheldon can still say some dumb things and be clueless I really haven't noticed barbs directed at Amy personally, something he did routinely. The cabin episode was a sign that the couple does have their cute moments, and the hoarding episode shows the couple continue to open up to one another. All good signs.

So I guess I've relaxed a bit in the last few episodes and I'm gonna trust that things are gonna look even better in S10. The writers can always throw us a curve ball for sure, but until that happens I'm gonna kick back and enjoy the good stuff they've been giving Shamys lately! 

 

Edited by 2L344
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3 hours ago, nickelette424 said:

I am surprised that people found his dictionary comment mean.  I laughed at him being a smartass, but I just don't see the intent of being mean as a part of that.  Maybe it's because I enjoy people who are sarcastic and employee smartass humor.   I'm glad that Amy isn't really that sensitive, especially since she regularly dishes it out herself. 

It's part of the way some people banter when they have different tastes or disagree about aspects of what something means, e.g. 'culture', 'art', 'interesting'. 'Fun' would be one of those words.  Also, some people play games with dictionaries, which I suspect Sheldon and Amy  often do. I don't think she'd take it as anything more than a bit of fun.

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We can argue whether Shamy´s teases against each other are funny or not, or if they mean what they say or not, but the fact is, that this teasing is part of every sitcom. And trust me, once Amy moves into 4a I´m sure there will be more teasing and arguing, because their relationship will arrive to the next level. Even if they´ve always spent a lot of time together, their ways had splitted when they had gone home, each one in his own bed, back to their fort of peace and security. But when they move together, this barrier would disappear, there would be no more escape from each other because they would be together almost every minute, except the few hours they would work.

And I´m sure even if Amy slept in Leonard´s former bedroom first, she would want to share a bed with Sheldon one day or would want to cuddle while watching a film or even would want to change the look of the apartment and would leave her personal note all over 4a.

And I can´t wait to see all of that, and I´m praying almost everyday, that the writers will give us the chance to see how Shamy would manage their live together daily! :giveheart:

I want Sheldon to come home and scream histerically, while his face twitches uncontrollably because Amy has bought a new couch or a carpet or new curtains or all together. LOL (And I´m sure she will do that, remember when Amy changed Sheldon´s answering machine one day after they moved together for the first time :laugh:).

It will be challenging for both of them, even more for Sheldon because he hates changes and doesn´t want her to think less of him, but she will get to know all his bad sides, when they live together. But when they live together they will get to know each other even better and I´m sure that by the time, they will learn to read each other´s mimics and gestures and learn to read between the lines. And once they find out, I´m sure that Sheldon will get Amy´s sex hints and react to them.

Wouldn´t it be hilarious, if they had dinner with the gang and Shamy would have a sex talk in their own invented signs language? Or how about a mimic language? But with subtitles please. Or maybe not, so we could guess here  what they meant. :laugh:

But there are so many other things I would like to see them doing. Simple things, like cooking together, discussing about their work or some articles they´ve read, or finding out the perfect position to fall asleep in Sheldon´s bed, before they end up spooning, holding hands while they walk into the university, helping each other with their projects, going on holiday, Amy playing the harp for Sheldon or Sheldon reading aloud one of his comics for Amy, while her head rests on his lap, etc.

All this would be my personal Shamy paradise! luv_cloud_01.gif

Edited by Desdemona
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4 minutes ago, Desdemona said:

remember when Amy changed Sheldon´s answering machine one day after they moved together for the first time :laugh:.

Amy didn't move in. She just suggested it.

Also, she didn't change the answerphone message. She just wrote a new message, but they never got as far as recording it.

 

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25 minutes ago, Desdemona said:

We can argue whether Shamy´s teases against each other are funny or not, or if they mean what they say or not, but the fact is, that this teasing is part of every sitcom. And trust me, once Amy moves into 4a I´m sure there will be more teasing and arguing, because their relationship will arrive to the next level. Even if they´ve always spent a lot of time together, their ways had splitted when they had gone home, each one in his own bed, back to their fort of peace and security. But when they move together, this barrier would disappear, there would be no more escape from each other because they would be together almost every minute, except the few hours they would work.

 

And I can´t wait to see all of that, and I´m praying almost everyday, that the writers will give us the chance to see how Shamy would manage their lives together daily!

< SNIP >

Wouldn´t it be hilarious, if they had dinner with the gang and Shamy would have a sex talk in their own invented signs language? Or how about a mimic language? But with subtitles please. Or maybe not, so we could guess here  what they meant. :laugh:

But there are so many other things I would like to see them doing. Simple things, like cooking together, discussing about their work or some articles they´ve read, or finding out the perfect position to fall asleep in Sheldon´s bed, before they end up spooning, holding hands while they walk into the university, helping each other with their projects, going on holiday, Amy playing the harp for Sheldon or Sheldon reading aloud one of his comics for Amy, while her head rests on his lap, etc.

All this would be my personal Shamy paradise! luv_cloud_01.gif

They may well do many of those things already, especially at her place where there'd be fewer interruptions.

I don't think the other two couples shacked up together. They may have been sharing beds a lot but not actually moving in on a permanent basis before they were married, so far as I recall. It doesn't seem to be what the writers do with pairings. Amy has wanted to move in with Sheldon in the past and he tried to get her to be his flatmate during his meltdown, but I think if they do set up home together now they'll have their own house.

I agree Sheldon would certainly be a nightmare when it came to choosing things for the home. Amy would have to put her foot down and do a lot of 'wh' - ing to keep the peace. It could be very funny when they were in shops buying things they hadn't already got. Luckily Amy has enough things to start them off, even if  they leave some things behind with Lenny.

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