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Sheldon was one of the most unique character in USA TV history. He was created to completely defy the conventions of a sitcom male. He was not only a 20-something who had no interest in having sex with anyone (man or women), he was not interested in even having a equalized non-sexual relationship. People were put on this earth to do his bidding or admire him. He would not compromise that position even if it meant hurting others feeling.

Jim Parson's portrayal was downright brilliant. He made you believe that he was not moved sexual by anyone, especially women. Maybe Jim had a built in advantage in that regard.:shy:.

At the end of season three they decided to see how they could build a woman friend for Sheldon out of the template of Dr. Beverly Hofstadler and it was fun for a while but as you said 3ku11, after 5 seasons they are in a hole that they can't get out of. If Sheldon becomes even acceptable boyfriend material he is no longer Sheldon. The writers can not figure out how to make this transition work and be true to their master creation.

I can't see how it can be done.

That is my issue with Sheldon in a relationship. Balance. Some how maintaining the core of Sheldon's character, but making him normal enough to function in an healthy relationship. I agree after 4-5 seasons, Sheldon and the writers have struggle ammensly. I don't see how they are any closer. I guess Amy was like the female version of Sheldon, but look at her now. So they changed her completely, with Sheldon though it is different.

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Lenny got screwed, not just with the wedding, but with the events leading up to and the aftermath. I don't think that it is a terrible idea in theory for Leonard to have slipped, feel terrible about i

I know this might be a ca-ray-zeee idea but can we like not have a Shenny panic attack every time Sheldon and Penny have a scene together or Jim dares to say that he likes -gasp!- working with Kaley!?

Sheldon does depend too much on Lenny as parental figures, but the ironic thing is that I think Lenny also depend a great deal on Sheldon. They kind of use him to not have to deal with issues in their

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Sheldon was one of the most unique characters in  TV history. He was created to completely defy the conventions of an American sitcom male. He was not only a 20-something who had no interest in having sex with anyone (man or woman), he was not interested in even having a equalized non-sexual relationship. People were put on this earth to do his bidding or admire him. He would not compromise that position even if it meant hurting others feelings.

Jim Parson's portrayal was downright brilliant. He made you believe that he was not moved sexual by anyone, especially women. Maybe Jim had a built in advantage in that regard.:shy:.

At the end of season three they decided to see how they could build a woman friend for Sheldon out of the template of Dr. Beverly Hofstadler and it was fun for a while but as you said 3ku11, after 5 seasons they are still in a hole that they can't get out of. If Sheldon becomes even acceptable boyfriend material he is no longer Sheldon. The writers can not figure out how to make this transition work and be true to their master creation.

I can't see how it can be done.

I think this is both right and wrong.

First of all, I don't know that Sheldon was ever created to "defy the conventions of an American sitcom male."  I don't think that it was about Sheldon's disinterest in sex, and not even really about not having equalized non-sexual relationships.

I think he, like the other guys, was simply a unique individual whose personal genius and quirks shaped him into the person we see.  He was a child prodigy, an isolated person, due to skipping through school, growing up in his particular family with his particular parents and siblings.  His natural OCD tendencies combined with his social isolation and his genius and made him into the strange, formidable, but physically timid character.  I don't think the writers were trying to make any kind of statement and that the lack of interest in sex was shaped over the course of the first season.  In the pilot and the first few episodes, in fact, Sheldon was slightly flirty when it came to Penny--not the same way Leonard and Howard were, but he wasn't as disdainful as he came to be.  In the pilot, he was interested in impressing her with his whiteboard and in the second episode, when she comes to ask Leonard to help with her furniture, the guys all come out to see her and Sheldon seems to be as interested in talking to her as the other guys.

I think that they developed Sheldon's approach to women over that first season, so I don't think he was created to be so.

At any rate, I think that, as Jim said in an early interview, it was likely that they would give Sheldon a girlfriend because it was kind of an irresistible development--how would a person like Sheldon react to meeting a woman who would appeal to him.  I think they played it perfectly in how she would appeal to him intellectually, rather than physically, and yet, over the time they spent together, he began to be attracted to her physically in a slowly increasing way.

I think that they're not stuck, they're just moving at a MUCH SLOWER pace than most viewers are accustomed to.  Usually, TV couples move more along the lines of L/P or H/B, making the progress to sex in a matter of a few episodes at most.

And I think that the logic behind the difference in Amy's position and Sheldon's has been explained well--they both grew up with few if any friends and when they finally met those friends, Amy jumped in with both feet, eager to experience the social life she'd never had, while Sheldon just managed to tolerate (at least outwardly) the involvement of other people in his life.

So, it's not surprising that their relationship has been uneven as Sheldon learns to navigate the areas of his heart he's never dealt with before.  I don't think Amy is wrong to want what she wants--and she wants more than just sex from Sheldon--and I think that she now knows that it's Sheldon she wants.  But Sheldon is also not wrong to want to take his time.  He has told L/P that he's "working on it" when it comes to intimacy with Amy, and he has told Amy that he "has not ruled it out", but more importantly, that he considered their relationship very intimate.  Since the way to Sheldon's heart is through his brain, and allowing anyone inside his emotional circle is a big deal, having Amy as his girlfriend is not something undertaken lightly.  He has a closer relationship with her than he has with anyone.  Even if he's good friends with Penny, he obviously thinks of her as a sister, while he shares his intellectual pleasures--and he's all about intellectual pleasures--with Amy.

So the physical intimacy also progressed slowly, from holding hands and the occasional Amy-initiated pecks, to the occasional hug, to regular date-night kissing.  While Amy still feels that Sheldon doesn't look at the relationship the way she would like him to--not in a traditional romantic way, not tightly focused on their togetherness--the audience has seen glimpses of how he really feels.  We know--and Amy knows--that he actually loves her and was able to say so, which doesn't seem to be something that was easy for him to admit, or at least, to discern.  We know he's capable of loving his mother and his Meemaw, and even Leonard, but his love for Amy is very different.

I think the writers are making a very good transition of Sheldon from being the isolated person he was to being a person who can relate to someone of the opposite sex on more than just an intellectual basis, as he did with Beverly or even Amy when they first met.

I think that it's simply a matter of the perception or expectation of others.  As has been pointed out, people expect characters to just jump in the sack and get that itch scratched, regardless of love or commitment or anything else.  Just get the sex done and everything will fall into place.

But because Sheldon and Amy were never a conventional couple, they never progressed that way.  And I like that they said their ILYs BEFORE they've gotten around to sex.  And I do hope that Sheldon gets around to proposing BEFORE they get around to sex.  I even hope they get married BEFORE they have sex.

I do think that people keep wanting Sheldon to behave the way the other guys have, or to behave the way people seem to think men should behave when it comes to wanting/having sex with girlfriends.

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But then, I remember precisely that maybe it's because the show assumes a lot of things, and the first and most important one is that yes, Sheldon is wrong.

What a strange way of watching television. You are writing this as if Sheldon and Amy are real people, and "the show" is some sort of reality show.

But really, why is this not in the Shamy thread?

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I do think that people keep wanting Sheldon to behave the way the other guys have, or to behave the way people seem to think men should behave when it comes to wanting/having sex with girlfriends. ^^^^^^ @Phan. Really. Now you are speaking for all men. FYI. Sex is a big factor for 99 .5% of hertorsexual men in relationships. We cant help it. It's in our genes. Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk

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I do think that people keep wanting Sheldon to behave the way the other guys have, or to behave the way people seem to think men should behave when it comes to wanting/having sex with girlfriends. ^^^^^^ @Phan. Really. Now you are speaking for all men. FYI. Sex is a big factor for 99 .5% of hertorsexual men in relationships. We cant help it. It's in our genes. Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk

That doesn't mean that's how Sheldon thinks.  He's not 99.5% of the heterosexual male population.

You (collective you) may not be able to help it, but we've seen again and again that Sheldon is capable of helping it.  It's not the first place his mind goes, as it is for Howard, Leonard and Raj.  That's why he often doesn't get sexual references, even when he accidentally makes them himself.

In many ways, he's like a kid.  You can say "balls" in front of a child and they will think of a toy, but you say it in front of older people (teenagers and up) and most people will at least think of the sexual reference.  But for Sheldon, he's more likely to take the innocent reference.

The way the writers have created him and the way they usually write him is in that innocent mode, most of the time.  Or else he naively overreacts to what he assumes are sexual references.  He misinterprets signals all the time.

Much of the humor with Sheldon and Amy comes from his difficulty discerning the signals and the dichotomy between them (or between him and others) when it comes to sexual references.  The audience gets the reference, but Sheldon does not.

Just because he has a girlfriend whom he has learned to enjoy kissing doesn't mean he's eager for sex, no matter what others may think about how they think he should feel.

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That doesn't mean that's how Sheldon thinks.  He's not 99.5% of the heterosexual male population.

You (collective you) may not be able to help it, but we've seen again and again that Sheldon is capable of helping it.  It's not the first place his mind goes, as it is for Howard, Leonard and Raj.  That's why he often doesn't get sexual references, even when he accidentally makes them himself.

In many ways, he's like a kid.  You can say "balls" in front of a child and they will think of a toy, but you say it in front of older people (teenagers and up) and most people will at least think of the sexual reference.  But for Sheldon, he's more likely to take the innocent reference.

The way the writers have created him and the way they usually write him is in that innocent mode, most of the time.  Or else he naively overreacts to what he assumes are sexual references.  He misinterprets signals all the time.

Much of the humor with Sheldon and Amy comes from his difficulty discerning the signals and the dichotomy between them (or between him and others) when it comes to sexual references.  The audience gets the reference, but Sheldon does not.

Just because he has a girlfriend whom he has learned to enjoy kissing doesn't mean he's eager for sex, no matter what others may think about how they think he should feel.

So all the sex references he makes. He just says that but doesn't know what he is saying. I find that hard to believe. Sorry, again you are making excuses for Sheldon. S1 to maybe 4 I would agree with you but he knows the signs. He makes more sexual references than amy. He just doesn't have a sex drive. Yet. Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk
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Sheldon was one of the most unique characters in  TV history. He was created to completely defy the conventions of an American sitcom male. He was not only a 20-something who had no interest in having sex with anyone (man or woman), he was not interested in even having a equalized non-sexual relationship. People were put on this earth to do his bidding or admire him. He would not compromise that position even if it meant hurting others feelings.

Jim Parson's portrayal was downright brilliant. He made you believe that he was not moved sexual by anyone, especially women. Maybe Jim had a built in advantage in that regard.:shy:.

At the end of season three they decided to see how they could build a woman friend for Sheldon out of the template of Dr. Beverly Hofstadler and it was fun for a while but as you said 3ku11, after 5 seasons they are still in a hole that they can't get out of. If Sheldon becomes even acceptable boyfriend material he is no longer Sheldon. The writers can not figure out how to make this transition work and be true to their master creation.

I can't see how it can be done.

I don't know that they have to make him boyfriend material. They can wave the promise around until the end, then leave it unresolved or resolve it with a no. It won't make a difference to the show - they could even drop a piano on him at the end and still make budget.. It's just about the, um... journey, not the climax.

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Yeah, the "he doesn't get the references" went out the window with "...he could be having the time of his life, while she thinks she's a chicken pecking for corn."  Then him bobbing his head.

 

I think about that season 6 scene every time I see early "innocent" Sheldon. That "pecking corn" comment is pretty hard core and it ended all thought that Sheldon did not understand sex references. It just confirmed that the writers either:

- could not resist such a good sex joke and decided to give it to Sheldon

- confirmed that Sheldon understood sexual innuendo and just had little interest in sex.

I think its the latter.

 

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I think about that season 6 scene every time I see early "innocent" Sheldon. That "pecking corn" comment is pretty hard core and it ended all thought that Sheldon did not understand sex references. It just confirmed that the writers either:

- could not resist such a good sex joke and decided to give it to Sheldon

- confirmed that Sheldon understood sexual innuendo and just had little interest in sex.

I think its the latter.

 

Just like Sheldon told Leonard that he sees how people roll their eyes at him, I agree with you.    I think Sheldon understands a lot more than he lets on.  He just has no interest in regards to himself, at least until recently.

Other examples:

He put the sex safety kit together for Leonard before he slept with Mrs. Latham, and he had the sex talk with is mother.

I think he knew what Howard's Whip app in the comic book store meant, and he played it off about being smart as a whip on purpose.

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I think there are differences in the way they have Sheldon getting or not getting sexual references.  He certainly knows about biology and how people have sex.  And he's read the book L/P gave him.

But it's still not where his mind goes first in most situations--like in the episode about the actress who moves in upstairs.  When the bed starts creaking upstairs, he sincerely interprets the sound as her jumping on the bed, even though the others have just been talking about her having an affair with someone from the show.

He makes certain references on purpose, but I sincerely believe that many times he's just not in that "carnal mode" and doesn't get it.  Granted, it happens less often now, but the point of it is to let the audience laugh at the juxtaposition of the obvious double entendre with Sheldon not realizing the meaning, even if he says it himself.

I'm convinced that he didn't realize what he was saying when he said that everything Amy did could be done by his right hand.  I don't think it was a masturbation reference (has Sheldon EVER talked about masturbation or other overtly sexual activities?), but simply a poor choice of words, like Raj talking about he and Stuart "filling each other's holes" and so forth.  I think that people are eager to turn them into sexual references because it fuels a certain desire or fantasy in regard to Sheldon and how he may think about Amy, but lines like that are written for the benefit of the audience, not necessarily as actual sexual lines coming from Sheldon's mind.

Now, they might be classified as Freudian slips or the product of his subconscious, but I don't think the says something like that on purpose.

I know it's not a popular opinion, but that's the way I read those scenes.

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  I don't think it was a masturbation reference (has Sheldon EVER talked about masturbation or other overtly sexual activities?), but simply a poor choice of words, like Raj talking about he and Stuart "filling each other's holes" and so forth. 

Not for himself (unless you count the pilot, which I don't), but he has made  references to Leonard's activities.   Mentioning Leonard's pointless self-abuse when trying to get Leonard to have sex with Mrs Latham, for instance.  I happen to agree with you on the right hand comment, though.  

Edited by Tensor

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Just like Sheldon told Leonard that he sees how people roll their eyes at him, I agree with you.    I think Sheldon understands a lot more than he lets on.  He just has no interest in regards to himself, at least until recently.

Other examples:

He put the sex safety kit together for Leonard before he slept with Mrs. Latham, and he had the sex talk with is mother.

I think he knew what Howard's Whip app in the comic book store meant, and he played it off about being smart as a whip on purpose.

I think him understanding sexual innuendos is up there with him understanding sarcasm.  He doesn't always pick up on it, but he is capable of understanding it, even if he doesn't understand it EVERY TIME.

Edited by meka3000
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SEASON 6 he told Lenny he hasent ruled out having coitus with Amy. So he definatley knows more then he lets on. So logically he has no interest in pursuing his desires. As i think he selectively chooses not too. He obviousley is getting sarcasim, and innuendos. At this point Leonard and Penny, Howard, Raj too. Have all helped him develop his social and cognitive functions. Hes 35, has a phd. Hes educated enough on sex, to know hes not naive of what Amy needs. At some point hes going to have to take the plunge. But that would contradict everything Sheldon stands for, so i dont know. 

Edited by 3ku11
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What a strange way of watching television. You are writing this as if Sheldon and Amy are real people, and "the show" is some sort of reality show.

But really, why is this not in the Shamy thread?

More strange than that is your post. I have no idea what in Sarah7's post gave you the idea she speaks about Sheldon and Amy as if they are real people , and the show as a reality show. For the life of me I don't know how on Earth you came to these conclusions.

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The Big Bang Theory (and forgive me, but biology was 35 years ago for me)  addresses the theory that the universe was created from a singular explosion, and from that the galaxies and our own Mother Earth was created, and through evolution life and eventually man came into being. Now if we look at our beloved characters on the show, they all have "evolved" over the course of several seasons (good or bad). I mean, who would've predicted that the obnoxious Wolowitz would ever settle down and marry? He's a pretty stable guy now, still funny but not half the cad he used to be. That speech he made to Penny at Bernadettes door when he thought Bernie was leaving him wrapped up in a nice way how he changed because of her.

 

Penny and Leonard are not the same individuals they were either. Penny has become more confident and self assured as a businesswoman. Leonard has the gal of his dreams and is more mature at handling his differences with Penny compared to his clingy "don't leave me" persona back in the day. Amy certainly morphed into a more confident and outgoing individual compared to season 4 when she would do anything to stay in penny's good graces, and Sheldon's too. 

 

It it makes sense that the writers are working on Sheldon's "evolution" so to speak, but it's been a lot longer process. He is, after all, the most challenging to deal with because of the way in which he interacts with people. Yes, by having Sheldon "grow" is fundamentally changing what makes him very unique, but it's in keeping with the Big Bang mantra in my opinion, which is all about evolving (aka maturing, growing, expanding)....

Edited by 2L344
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More strange than that is your post. I have no idea what in Sarah7's post gave you the idea she speaks about Sheldon and Amy as if they are real people , and the show as a reality show. For the life of me I don't know how on Earth you came to these conclusions.

I also don't know what made me reply to that post particularly (sp), and I am not going back to look it up, sorry. You figure it out .

On a more positive note, I learned that the first episode of this season will be on my television screen in three weeks time. ¡Giddy up!

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If you can access E4 catchup, the first couple of episodes are available to view, right now.

Thanks, Steve. I think that is British, and I am not. But it's no problem, sometimes I think maybe just wait for the DVD (but I still can not buy season 8, so I might even expire before season 9 reaches me).

I have seen mangled versions of this season episodes, it appears episode 1 and 2 are good and then not so good.

Cheers.

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I think Squonk means, these characters are fictional characters. SOme of you do discuss them like they are close family members haha, a bit of over analysis is all.

I have worried about this, but I now think that it's fine. Just don't love the characters when they're good and make you happy and hate the writers when the characters are being bad and tick you off. My very poor analogy is that that is like blaming the "devil" for your loved one's bad acts when really they are competent adults making poor decisions. If you want to believe, believe... but don't hedge. And as a back stop, remember, like with other real people that you aren't responsible for, you are not obligated to fret about them. They are presumed to be competent adults. That too is a decision the viewer as a competent adult can make.

meanwhile... why the frak doesn't Leonard just lock the door on Sheldon or move away! (hehehe) what's wrong with him!!!!!

 

Edited by Nogravitasatall
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Bernadette and/or Howard should really have told Penny about Leonard kiss with Mandy but then again this is a group of friends that appears to hide things a lot from various members

Sorry but that wasent their secret that tell, and if they had Leonard would have been perfectly justified in ending the friendship.

Venting to your friend is a safty valve aa way to bounce ideas around and deal with a issue, you cant do that if they run And tell what you say to others

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