[Spoilers] Discussion Topic: Season 9

[Radar]

15 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Are you saying he didn't interrupt the they viewing of the stream of Lenny's wedding?  Or that he didn't interrupt the Girls playing twister for a boo boo he had?  That was as the whole point.  I don't hate Sheldon But I do feel, like other  obsevers(which was mentioned specifically in several reviews recently) that there has been too much Sheldon this year, to the detriment of the other characters.  if you like Sheldon fine, I prefer a more even distribution among the characters.  If you think that equates to a hate of Sheldon, so be it. 

 

Did I say any of that?

Again sorry, you got me wrong. I was never trying to persuade someone to like Sheldon or be okay with everything he does. It was just pretty clear that you are very frustrated about the way he acts (and yes, it comes across as if you really despise him). And apparently you get very upset when someone mentions that he/she is okay with what's going on. Since I don't want to upset anyone I retreat to the Shamy thread. Bye.

[Tensor]

23 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

It is one of her obligations, under Section 4 of the RA.  

LOL, yeah, there is that. 

[Tonstar17]

I know that life has been difficult for Penny and has been having a tough time with it. Shattered dreams, Leonard infidelity and hating her job. But still it's no way or excuse to treat the person you claim to love with total contempt. I'm sure Leonard sometimes feels for penny to be there for him, not to fix things or anything in particular but just to let him know he is cared for and supported. Not much to ask for. Is it.

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[nibbler747]

I don't get this villainification of Penny movement I see on here.  It's like Scarlet Letter levels.  

She sided with Sheldon on the RA.  I see that more of thinking of her own interests first instead of her and Leonard as a unit.  A bit self centered for sure but nothing contemptuous.  The other was at the Psychiatrist, not listing positive Leonard points.  That one bugged me more to be honest.

Otherwise I have not seen her acting out towards Leonard.   Her sense of humour leans to the sarcastic.  If you take teasing seriously then yes you may get upset.  I see that she joked this way all the way to Season 1.

Just last episode, her and Bernie seemed so proud of their guys and their new project.  I don't see that as an act of someone that hates their husband.

i do think she's unhappy with her career, and once she figured out what she really wants to do she'll be a lot happier.  That is fair.  She shouldn't be expected to be blissed out happy all of the time simply because she is married.

[wowbagger]

2 hours ago, djsurrey said:

If Leonard was an unintended surprise perhaps neither of his parents bonded with him well. Also going back a generation it was common for dads to not hug their kids much.

Okay, but that still sounds as though we're using cultural norms to justify a double standard: mothers' feet are held to the fire for coldness or hypercriticality, but fathers? Do we even have expectations of fathers?

I'm not saying you're doing that, but the show- and Leonard-on some level certainly seems to. Beverley is presented as a villain (albeit an entertaining and charismatic one) who looms large in Leonard's personal mythos, but from where I sit his father should get just as much stick, if not more.

[djsurrey]

38 minutes ago, Tonstar17 said:

...still it's no way or excuse to treat the person you claim to love with total contempt.

I think Penny shows love for Leonard. Total contempt, that would be more like Beverly's comments about Leonard's father.

"...being betrayed by a loathsome son of a bitch."

Penny is a peach in comparison.

Edited April 16, 2016 by djsurrey

[Tonstar17]

I don't get this villainification of Penny movement I see on here.  It's like Scarlet Letter levels.  

She sided with Sheldon on the RA.  I see that more of thinking of her own interests first instead of her and Leonard as a unit.  A bit self centered for sure but nothing contemptuous.  The other was at the Psychiatrist, not listing positive Leonard points.  That one bugged me more to be honest.

Otherwise I have not seen her acting out towards Leonard.   Her sense of humour leans to the sarcastic.  If you take teasing seriously then yes you may get upset.  I see that she joked this way all the way to Season 1.

Just last episode, her and Bernie seemed so proud of their guys and their new project.  I don't see that as an act of someone that hates their husband.

i do think she's unhappy with her career, and once she figured out what she really wants to do she'll be a lot happier.  That is fair.  She shouldn't be expected to be blissed out happy all of the time simply because she is married.

^^^^

Each for there own. I can tell the different between sarcasm, jokes and been damm rude and snarky. More of the latter this season. If that's how married couple behave and ppls justify it, I'm so glad I'm not married. No one is saying she should be happy 24/7 but her show of happiness is rear this days and that's what been pointed out. If you can't see it then well good luck with that.

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[Tensor]

2 hours ago, Radar said:

Did I say any of that?

Again sorry, you got me wrong. I was never trying to persuade someone to like Sheldon or be okay with everything he does. It was just pretty clear that you are very frustrated about the way he acts (and yes, it comes across as if you really despise him). And apparently you get very upset when someone mentions that he/she is okay with what's going on. Since I don't want to upset anyone I retreat to the Shamy thread. Bye.

The only comment I made about Sheldon was he would interrupt a wedding redo with a boo boo or sliver, things he's done before.   One thing I really don't like is how the writers overuse Sheldon (again, as has been said by sites that review shows), and how they have removed his innocence.  Without his innocence, some of the things he does come across as just downright mean.  That doesn't mean I hate Sheldon.  None of the characters are perfect, pointing out things they've done wrong, or where they have been written inconsistently are hardly signs of hate. 

[Tonstar17]

...still it's no way or excuse to treat the person you claim to love with total contempt.

I think Penny shows love for Leonard. Total contempt, that would be more like Beverly's comments about Leonard's father.

"...being betrayed by a loathsome son of a bitch."

Penny is a peach in comparison.

Well penny did say she mother's him. So acting like his mother and not showing compassion... well penny is not far off.

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[legacy99]

I think Leonard’s mom will tell penny she made a mistake marrying leonard and penny will want to take a break she'll then decide to move back to 4b and that will be the cliffhanger for lenny

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[Jonny]

They do love each other I don't think anyone can say they don't. Do they have issues? Yes but I don't think you will find any married couple that is in a perfect relationship.

I do think they have some deep insecurities though that have been there ever since they got involved way back, caused them to break up several times and are probably still there now and have never been addressed.

This whole 'What is Leonard doing with a girl like me' and 'What does Penny see in a guy like me' is still there imo under the surface. You would think that because they are now married maybe that will have been settled for good but I am not so sure.

[Tonstar17]

I think Leonard’s mom will tell penny she made a mistake marrying leonard and penny will want to take a break she'll then decide to move back to 4b and that will be the cliffhanger for lenny

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^^^

That's why i will be needing a large glass of wine for the final.

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[stardustmelody]

1 hour ago, Tensor said:

The only comment I made about Sheldon was he would interrupt a wedding redo with a boo boo or sliver, things he's done before.   One thing I really don't like is how the writers overuse Sheldon (again, as has been said by sites that review shows), and how they have removed his innocence.  Without his innocence, some of the things he does come across as just downright mean.  That doesn't mean I hate Sheldon.  None of the characters are perfect, pointing out things they've done wrong, or where they have been written inconsistently are hardly signs of hate. 

I think the tone from both Sheldon and Penny has been mean to be honest (not to each other but to others, especially Leonard and Amy).  The writers really need to pay attention and watch for that.  As some may see it as sarcasm...sarcasm can often turn to meanness if over the top and both have been over the top with their snark.   I blame the writers for that.  Snark isn't always funny and often can be off-putting.   It can turn a fan into a non-fan real quick if not reeled in.   The writers really need to get away from sarcasm and snark as it doesn't seem to be working well.

I agree they have overused Sheldon though.  I love his character a lot, but even I get my fill of him at times, especially when he is being mean to Leonard or Amy who don't deserve it.   But I also feel they have really written Penny poorly as well, especially in more recent seasons.   They need to bring back what made us love her and that was the girl that was sweet and fun-loving.  I am hoping with a career change (and please do NOT let it be something unrealistic like science related, but something more fitting to her personality), that we will see some of the sweet and fun-loving Penny return.   

I don't know if Sheldon lost innocence, because I still see him often very innocent, but I do think they flip-flop all the characters at times that we really have wondered if we are watching the same characters from time to time.   The writers' choice of ignoring history and consistency is probably one of my biggest bug-a-boos overall.  They can totally destroy everything they built in a story with one obnoxious change in history/consistency that blows everything.  It really is annoying.   Second to that would be their fear of moving forward to the point that they end up with the mean snark that we have seen between characters because they just don't know how to move them forward and keep them moving forward.   

When they married Lenny, they easily could have been creative and kept them entertaining, but instead they made Penny snarky as all get out to everyone but Sheldon, and they turned Lenny into "furniture" by having them stand behind the kitchen counter non-stop.   The most fun scene we had with Lenny all season was on V-day where they were dressed as cupids and while annoying in some regards, it still was fun to see them laughing and enjoying each other.   There is no reason they could not have addressed some of Penny's unhappiness at work in a more positive way this season and moved them forward.  I really hope next season we see her career move be a positive impact on their marriage. 

Overall, I think the writers need to take a leap of faith in their own abilities more and move these characters forward instead of hanging on to the past too much, and they need to learn consistency and to look at what made fans fall in love with the characters from the beginning.   

I also believe the show needs to get back to situational comedy versus focus so much on relationship.  Let the relationships move forward, but let their jobs, experiments, hobbies, and even family bring on situations that can introduce some slap-stick fun again.   I mean who didn't love the episode where we learned how the elevator exploded, or the episode where the boys made their robot to race against Kripke,  or the Penny Blossoms episode where she wanted to start her business, etc. ?  Good situational comedy!   

As a Shamy fan, one of the dreams that I think many share with me, is for Sheldon and Amy to be assigned a project together at Cal Tech.  It would be hilarious to see them not only working together but perhaps introducing some of her monkeys back into the mix to bring on some great situational comedy.   Maybe add Howard into the experiment they are working on and he brings in some robotic element to it.   Overall it could be loads of fun to watch if they would just write some situational comedy again.

 

P.S.  Oh and for those who are familiar with Modern Family who has done well in the awards arena - they focus much more on situational comedy and move relationships within the situations rather than focus on snark and drama to move them forward.   I really wish BBT would learn that you can move relationships forward within the comedic situations you create instead of constantly introducing drama and snarky meanness as a way to go week after week.

 

Edited April 16, 2016 by stardustmelody

[2L344]

11 minutes ago, stardustmelody said:

 

I also believe the show needs to get back to situational comedy versus focus so much on relationship.  Let the relationships move forward, but let their jobs, experiments, hobbies, and even family bring on situations that can introduce some slap-stick fun again.   I mean who didn't love the episode where we learned how the elevator exploded, or the episode where the boys made their robot to race against Kripke,  or the Penny Blossoms episode where she wanted to start her business, etc. ?  Good situational comedy!   

As a Shamy fan, one of the dreams that I think many share with me, is for Sheldon and Amy to be assigned a project together at Cal Tech.  It would be hilarious to see them not only working together but perhaps introducing some of her monkeys back into the mix to bring on some great situational comedy.   Maybe add Howard into the experiment they are working on and he brings in some robotic element to it.   Overall it could be loads of fun to watch if they would just write some situational comedy again.

 

The bold for me. I said a similar thing during nine episodes of Shamy angst at the beginning of this season. Im not suggesting there wont be drama with the couples now and then, uts probably a healthy thing that the writers shake things up here and there on such a long running sitcom to keep it from being miopic and stale and to advance character development.

But lately it just feels like just too much, and its with every character-- Howardette with Howard being lazy and not earning his keep, Raj and his gf issues, and of course the Lenny stuff. Yeah Shamy is in a better place but it took a long break up arc to get there.

While I enjoy the couples stuff and cute moments, I would like to see more of the things that make this ensemble so cool--geeky group games, weighing in the latest thing happening in real life, the gang sitting down to take out and coming ip with an event to participate in...

Its a sitcom and Id like to relax and laugh at the situations and character interactions without worrying about innuendo and what kind of relationship drama is about to unfold. I realize that the causual viewer of the show doesnt worry much about such things, but those of us that are fans dont have it so lucky lol...

[Tonstar17]

On April 16, 2016 at 4:19 PM, Jonny83 said:

They do love each other I don't think anyone can say they don't. Do they have issues? Yes but I don't think you will find any married couple that is in a perfect relationship.

I do think they have some deep insecurities though that have been there ever since they got involved way back, caused them to break up several times and are probably still there now and have never been addressed.

 

This whole 'What is Leonard doing with a girl like me' and 'What does Penny see in a guy like me' is still there imo under the surface. You would think that because they are now married maybe that will have been settled for good but I am not so sure.

 

[/quote

 

^^^^

 

What is love? I just don't think love lives in Pennys heart anymore for leonard. Maybe as a friend but not true love. Its beyond me how ppls could believe that tptb are truly showing them as happily married when they are not willing to tackle their issues but sweep it away like it doesn't exist and just creating more drama disguised as comedy and expect a few lennys not to see the damage they are doing to Lenny. I bet there are more Shenny fans out there than is lenny now. Just look at social media and the Internet. The last time there was any buzz or talk about lenny was when they got married and even ppls were disappointed. It hasnt got better and I honestly don't think it will. I remember when penny said it will only be awhile living in 4a and i got crucified for suggesting, I wouldnt be surprised if they are still living in 4a come end of s9 beyond s10. Looks like I could be right.

 

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[phantagrae]

3 hours ago, stardustmelody said:

I think the tone from both Sheldon and Penny has been mean to be honest (not to each other but to others, especially Leonard and Amy).  The writers really need to pay attention and watch for that.  As some may see it as sarcasm...sarcasm can often turn to meanness if over the top and both have been over the top with their snark.   I blame the writers for that.  Snark isn't always funny and often can be off-putting.   It can turn a fan into a non-fan real quick if not reeled in.   The writers really need to get away from sarcasm and snark as it doesn't seem to be working well.

I agree they have overused Sheldon though.  I love his character a lot, but even I get my fill of him at times, especially when he is being mean to Leonard or Amy who don't deserve it.   But I also feel they have really written Penny poorly as well, especially in more recent seasons.   They need to bring back what made us love her and that was the girl that was sweet and fun-loving.  I am hoping with a career change (and please do NOT let it be something unrealistic like science related, but something more fitting to her personality), that we will see some of the sweet and fun-loving Penny return.   

I don't know if Sheldon lost innocence, because I still see him often very innocent, but I do think they flip-flop all the characters at times that we really have wondered if we are watching the same characters from time to time.   The writers' choice of ignoring history and consistency is probably one of my biggest bug-a-boos overall.  They can totally destroy everything they built in a story with one obnoxious change in history/consistency that blows everything.  It really is annoying.   Second to that would be their fear of moving forward to the point that they end up with the mean snark that we have seen between characters because they just don't know how to move them forward and keep them moving forward.   

When they married Lenny, they easily could have been creative and kept them entertaining, but instead they made Penny snarky as all get out to everyone but Sheldon, and they turned Lenny into "furniture" by having them stand behind the kitchen counter non-stop.   The most fun scene we had with Lenny all season was on V-day where they were dressed as cupids and while annoying in some regards, it still was fun to see them laughing and enjoying each other.   There is no reason they could not have addressed some of Penny's unhappiness at work in a more positive way this season and moved them forward.  I really hope next season we see her career move be a positive impact on their marriage. 

Overall, I think the writers need to take a leap of faith in their own abilities more and move these characters forward instead of hanging on to the past too much, and they need to learn consistency and to look at what made fans fall in love with the characters from the beginning.   

I also believe the show needs to get back to situational comedy versus focus so much on relationship.  Let the relationships move forward, but let their jobs, experiments, hobbies, and even family bring on situations that can introduce some slap-stick fun again.   I mean who didn't love the episode where we learned how the elevator exploded, or the episode where the boys made their robot to race against Kripke,  or the Penny Blossoms episode where she wanted to start her business, etc. ?  Good situational comedy!   

As a Shamy fan, one of the dreams that I think many share with me, is for Sheldon and Amy to be assigned a project together at Cal Tech.  It would be hilarious to see them not only working together but perhaps introducing some of her monkeys back into the mix to bring on some great situational comedy.   Maybe add Howard into the experiment they are working on and he brings in some robotic element to it.   Overall it could be loads of fun to watch if they would just write some situational comedy again.

 

P.S.  Oh and for those who are familiar with Modern Family who has done well in the awards arena - they focus much more on situational comedy and move relationships within the situations rather than focus on snark and drama to move them forward.   I really wish BBT would learn that you can move relationships forward within the comedic situations you create instead of constantly introducing drama and snarky meanness as a way to go week after week.

 

I think that sometimes people are nostalgic for some things that were very funny at the time and want to see more of it, but then on the other hand, there are complaints that the show is simply rehashing old ground or whatever.

I don't think that "sitcom" means that they have to have stories that are not related to the relationships at play.  Sitcoms play off of all kinds of "situations", which may arise from the nature of relationships, work situations, extended family, or whatever.  The key is that it's a "situation" that arises, no matter what causes it to arise.  If the situation happens to be a couple breaking up--like when Leonard and Penny broke up--then that's the situation and there can still be a degree of comedy.  When L/P fought at the bowling alley, there was still humor from the rest of the gang and Sheldon's feud with Wil Wheaton, etc..

So to me, whatever the situation is, whether it's romantic relationships or work related activities or hobbies or parents, there has always been comedy.  And if it's a more serious turn, there's always comedy to pop that serious bubble.

As for the P.S. about Modern Family--that show is FULL of snark!  The times when the characters address the camera are almost always used for one person to complain about the other.  There's a lot of eye-rolling or looking knowingly at the camera behind someone's back to confirm what's been said in those moments.  I don't think that sarcasm, or even what some perceive as "meanness", is disliked by the awards folks.

I don't think that the relationships on the show are "moved forward" through drama, sarcasm or snarky meanness.  I think that the tone of the show has almost always been about snark, teasing, sarcasm, etc..  And I would bet that you would find the same kind of humor in almost every sitcom on TV unless you're watching The Brady Bunch or something.

We may not all have the same taste in humor or the same idea of what we want to see in the characters or the movement of the relationships or storylines, but, again, we're not the storytellers.

I think that if the writing was really as bad as some make it out to be, the show wouldn't be in it's ninth season and still coming out in the double digit millions in the ratings.  I'm not saying that everything they do on the show is perfect, but I think that some are constantly wanting some other version of the show and some other version of the characters.

[Carlos]

On ‎4‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 1:14 AM, phantagrae said:

Wouldn't it be funny if Leonard's dad is attracted to Mary Cooper (warm and kind, as opposed to his harsh, cold ex-wife...)?

And they marry and Leonard's father becomes Sheldon's stepdad, and Mary Leonard's step mom? Wait wouldn't that make Leonard and Sheldon step brothers? Hahahaha. But nah, requires too long of an arc.

On ‎4‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 11:40 AM, djsurrey said:

Wonder how they will explain that Leonard's father has never dropped in before now in the last nine years? Perhaps he does not often travel.

Fear of airplanes? Always away at an archeological dig?

On ‎4‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 6:23 PM, wowbagger said:

Leonard's dad can't be presented as admirable, surely? If we think of Beverley as having ruined Leonard's life (and I, personally, don't) then, at the very least, the man stood by and let it happen. At worst, he's a philanderer who's paid sod-all attention to his son. Beverley may be bone-chillingly clinical, but at the very least she was present. If Leonard's dad shows up, says a few kind words to Leonard and is presented as some sort of avenging figure (with the bonus of nookie with Mary as his little Man Prize, perhaps?), my God, I will be pissed. It would be a nice reversal if Leonard saw his father as a clinging, adulterous shitheel and said to his mother 'you know, Mom, you shouldn't have put up with him for so long. I'm judging you, kinda'. Who knows, a little critical analysis would be the way to Mummy's heart. Give it a try anyway, little Oedipus*.

*Well, I mean, there is one obvious Oedipus complex already on the show, but at least with Howard that's basically canon. Leonard's Oedipal issues are slightly subtler- though the show actually did reflect them in the episode where Penny comes across Beverley's book and Leonard uses his tales of neglect to score sex points.

I usually agree with you but I don't know why you are so willing to give Beverly a pass as to why she has been such a POS mother to Leonard. BY what we've seen in the show she has been nothing if not cruel, cold, demeaning, and as I mentioned an all around POS mother to Leonard. Whatever problems she and her then husband had have no bearing on being a bad mother, specially since she appears praising Leonard's brother (also her son) and I don't remember but I think her sister too.

[Thyanic]

Even though I'm not a lenny fan, lately, and given the fact that shamy has been ruined for me, i've tried to enjoy the show and i decided focus my attention on other couples, in this case Lenny, and this is my opinion sorry if i'm wrong, but it's what i see, it's really sad the way Penny treats leonard, it seems that she is trying to blame him for all the negative things in their relationship even for her own unhappiness, she treats him sometimes like she can't stand him, like she doesn't even like him much less love him, I'm sorry but if penny is so unhappy with her job it's because her decision to take that job, she wasn't obligated to do it, flirting with her clients in order to get her sell goals is the way she choose or the ability she has to do her job not because was something that leonard suggested her to do, i know that she thinks she's being mature and she's trying to prove it to leonard because she knows how important is to him, but she is in her thirties, she can make her own decisions and take the responsibility for that, she is free to decide to be happy and do whatever makes her happy. She married leonard for a reason she can't even explain, they're still living with sheldon because she decided to be more sympathetic with her friend-brother-son than with her own husband and not giving the priority to her marriage, she doesn't remember her husband birthday but she was so excited planning Sheldon's birthday and taking the time to comfort him during his panic attack but leonard's childhood problems or daily concerns are always minimizing because you know it's funny, because he deserved it or because it's not important enough to get her attention, but when leonard makes mistakes (kiss a girl 2 years ago, or have his emergency bank account) the writers work so hard on those mistakes to make them "the big ones" that is penny always who seems the victim and the one to feel sorry for; she is always trying to sabotage her marriage and find a excuse to be mad at leonard and it's leonard who ends up apologizing, i'm afraid one day we'll see leonard and amy apologizing for exist, I bet leonard's father will love penny (like all the guest characters do... and he will dislike amy like all the characters do haha sorry just kidding!) and i just hope this will be a good storyline for lenny, they deserve to get their own story where can solve their problems, far far away from sheldon..

[Chrismo]

1 hour ago, phantagrae said:

 

I think that if the writing was really as bad as some make it out to be, the show wouldn't be in it's ninth season and still coming out in the double digit millions in the ratings.  I'm not saying that everything they do on the show is perfect, but I think that some are constantly wanting some other version of the show and some other version of the characters.

 Have two comments about the writing and ratings on the show.

1. Could it be the writing be worse on shows? Is that why the ratings are"high".

2. People point out that ratings in general are down. They bring up MF for example. The ratings are lower. To me though TBBT is like a pro golfer. You can only really compete with yourself. Pointing out the show is in 9th season is making an excuse IMO. Could it be the writing? all I know is the show's ratings are down.

[JE7]

 

It seems strange to me that as people start to call Penny on her increasingly cold and indifferent (sheldonish) behavior that many Sheldon fans jump to her defense. The show has gotten meaner of that there is little argument but that's OK because it makes Sheldon look more normal is the only reason I can see for this phenomena. Or alternatively we get male bashing and cries of misogynist and other buzz words designed to make her bad behavior the fault if others mainly Leonard.

Sheldon's behavior is not normal and Penny's problems are of her own making. They both need to grow up and accept the hard truth life isn't fair, we do have to do things we don't want to get by and the world neither centers around us as individuals nor owes us a damn thing. 

On April 16, 2016 at 4:19 PM, Jonny83 said:

They do love each other I don't think anyone can say they don't. Do they have issues? Yes but I don't think you will find any married couple that is in a perfect relationship.

I do think they have some deep insecurities though that have been there ever since they got involved way back, caused them to break up several times and are probably still there now and have never been addressed.

This whole 'What is Leonard doing with a girl like me' and 'What does Penny see in a guy like me' is still there imo under the surface. You would think that because they are now married maybe that will have been settled for good but I am not so sure.

They broke up one time, once that's all. Your using bogus internet "facts" to build your hypothesis on there for the whole thing is simply wrong from the start

[Tensor]

 

1 hour ago, Chrismo said:

 Have two comments about the writing and ratings on the show.

1. Could it be the writing be worse on shows? Is that why the ratings are"high".

2. People point out that ratings in general are down. They bring up MF for example. The ratings are lower. To me though TBBT is like a pro golfer. You can only really compete with yourself. Pointing out the show is in 9th season is making an excuse IMO. Could it be the writing? all I know is the show's ratings are down.

You're oversimplifying the ratings and the loss.  Even back in the nineties, shows could pull in 30 million (Johnny explained that cast and crew of Roseanne were disappointed if they didn't get 30 million viewers.   TBBT never got those kind of raw numbers, even in it's best season, simply because the number of viewers has been falling since the nineties.

The live + same day viewers and the 18-49 demo is down.   We also know that since 2010, broadcast television has lost almost half of it's audience, in the 18-49 demo, and TBBT is a broadcast show.   The 18-49 demo are moving to the variety of cable channels, and in the case of the 18-34 demo many have moved to viewing on computers, and/or  streaming content.  These are all things Nielsen doesn't pick up.   

During this time, the shows viewers have remained pretty much steady for the Live + 7.  (the last four years, in millions,  were 20.34, 23.24, 21.42 and this year it's 21.07.   Four years ago, the average Live + 7 increase was around 3.75 million.  Three years ago it was 5.27, last year it was 5.55 and this year, its 5.52.  

This means the shows average viewer has gotten older.  Older viewers tend to watch on the night it airs, at the time it airs.  The upper half of the 18-49 demo does the most time shift viewing(DVR it and watch at a different time and day) hence why the Live + 7 have stayed pretty much the same. While the lower half of the 18-49 are moving toward streaming when they want it, which explains the loss of some of the Live +  7.  

Despite what you think about being a pro golfer, you can compare shows.   Friends is used as an example of how a long running show did well in it's final years.   During it's ninth season, it had 21.8 million viewers and finished third among entertainment programs.  This year, TBBT is on pace to average 19 million viewers and is on pace to finish second among entertainment programs.  It's final season, Friends had a 12.8 demo.  It's best year, TBBT had just over a 7.0.  Do you really think that the loss of broadcast television viewers has nothing to do with the reduction of TBBT viewers?   

 

 

 

[vonmar]

Preview of "The Viewer Party Combustion" from The Big Bang Theory You Tube Channel

 

[stardustmelody]

In all honesty, there are lots of things, as Tensor said above, that affect ratings and the climate for shows in the 1990's compared to now was different.  Digital streaming media was not available, nor was cable that affordable and penetrated in the market.   Since then both have entered the playing field and take away some of the network viewers overall.  

But the other thing to consider is that it takes shows a LONG time to reflect in ratings dissatisfaction with a show that had been a "hit" show and been on multiple seasons.  By the 9th season of a show, viewers are pretty invested and want to ride it out and see how it will end.   So many stick with it even if they are not happy with the writing.   

I do hope that the writers are having some of their interns look at message boards to get a heartbeat of what viewers are saying.  Even if they seem all over the map, they can generally tell the tone and the consistent remarks that they see and I do think some of that has already been reflected as happening with how they realized that the Shamy breakup story was getting old and suddenly resolved that, then they realized that fans wanted to see more full cast and they suddenly gave us that.   I have to believe they are watching and have a sense of what the fan base is posting and we are seeing some changes made to help improve things.  

But the writing has been of a much meaner tone and then need to scale that back.   You see it posted a lot of places that both Sheldon and Penny are mean and Penny especially is getting beat up on many message boards because of her dialog tone.   So hopefully these next two episodes are setting the stage to change things and we can see some improvements in S10.

 

Edited April 17, 2016 by stardustmelody

[BigBang15]

To all those who suggested: I seriously doubt Penny will be taking a "break" as a cliffhanger. You know, because it's the Sheldon Show. (AHs)

[mirs1]

58 minutes ago, stardustmelody said:

 

I do hope that the writers are having some of their interns look at message boards to get a heartbeat of what viewers are saying.  Even if they seem all over the map, they can generally tell the tone and the consistent remarks that they see and I do think some of that has already been reflected as happening with how they realized that the Shamy breakup story was getting old and suddenly resolved that, then they realized that fans wanted to see more full cast and they suddenly gave us that.   I have to believe they are watching and have a sense of what the fan base is posting and we are seeing some changes made to help improve things.  

 

 TPTB have said on more than one occasion that Shamy coitus was scheduled for TFA premiere since the beginning on the season, so actually I think they milked the break up as much as they could...As for the full cast scenes, there haven't been so much of those this year, the first meal all together was if I remember correctly in 9.22 and there have been very few full group episodes either. Those were concentrated in the last third of the season and were due, IMO, more to a general idea of slowing things down after Bernie pregnancy and not focusing on the other "elephants in the room" that have to be addressed than to some complaints of fans. I do think that TPTB in every show have a look to what fans say, but it's pretty difficult to make changes in a show according to them. The opinions are so different (even in this board, if you notice) and any change to please a part of the fandom is going to displease somebody else.