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Star Wars: The Force Awakens (spoilers allowed)

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I saw Star Wars: The Force Awakens just a few hours ago and thought it would be nice to have a thread for those who have seen the movie and would like to discuss anything about it. With that in mind spoilers and speculation are okay.

  • Who is Rey? (She learns a lot faster than Luke)

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I watched it on Saturday.

I really didn't expect them to kill Han Solo. Why, tell me why? On the other hand, I might have sacrificed him for the dramatic effect, but then I would have liked their story more explained beforehand. The father-son-issue was too short to really intrigue me. What a loss.

Rey: Hm. First I thought Leia's and Han Solo's daughter, but why would they had left her at that planet and never mention her. On the other hand, why then that similarities to Han Solo? Another explanation is Luke's daughter, after a forbidden night of Luke with a unknown woman. I'm curious.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Bavarian ShamyShipper Girl said:

I watched it on Saturday.

I really didn't expect them to kill Han Solo. Why, tell me why? On the other hand, I might have sacrificed him for the dramatic effect, but then I would have liked their story more explained beforehand. The father-son-issue was too short to really intrigue me. What a loss.

Rey: Hm. First I thought Leia's and Han Solo's daughter, but why would they had left her at that planet and never mention her. On the other hand, why then that similarities to Han Solo? Another explanation is Luke's daughter, after a forbidden night of Luke with a unknown woman. I'm curious.

 

 

My guess is they killed Han because Harrison Ford would only agree to be in one more SW film. He is 73 and they offered him the moon for his role in this movie.

http://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/dec/21/harrison-ford-star-wars-the-force-awakens-34m-payday

I think the question of "who is Rey really", is the biggest hook into the next movie. Rey is a fascinating character who seems to be able to pick up much as soon as she is exposed to an ability. Ren also has abilities we have not really seen before in star wars. At least not to this extent. It is like Star Wars has absorbed a little of Harry Potter and Legilimency. or perhaps Star Trek Mind Meld.

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If Rey isn't Luke's daughter then I'll eat someone else's hat! (cus I don't have one)

The other half saw it before me and told me "you'll laugh and cry!" so I guessed either Han or Chewy died and it totally ruined the movie for me! :crying:

I thought Kylo Ren was the least scary thing that has ever graced a movie screen, even with strong force power he wasn't even remotely powerful imo.

I would love the online rumour that Finn is Lando Calrissian's lost son to be true too so that it is Han, Leia, Luke and Lando's children continuing the story!

Even though the twist was kinda spoiled for me and I found the bad guy(s) laughable I really liked it and am looking forward to the next movies :) 

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40 minutes ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

If Rey isn't Luke's daughter then I'll eat someone else's hat! (cus I don't have one)

The other half saw it before me and told me "you'll laugh and cry!" so I guessed either Han or Chewy died and it totally ruined the movie for me! :crying:

I thought Kylo Ren was the least scary thing that has ever graced a movie screen, even with strong force power he wasn't even remotely powerful imo.

I would love the online rumour that Finn is Lando Calrissian's lost son to be true too so that it is Han, Leia, Luke and Lando's children continuing the story!

Even though the twist was kinda spoiled for me and I found the bad guy(s) laughable I really liked it and am looking forward to the next movies :) 

If Rey is his Daughter he has a lot of explaining to do. Luke was left with family and had Ben lurking about in case of trouble. Rey seemed to have no one at all. Luke also has his force ghost advisers.

Perhaps Anakin should have been haunting Ren. Anakin was redeemed after all.

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47 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

If Rey is his Daughter he has a lot of explaining to do. Luke was left with family and had Ben lurking about in case of trouble. Rey seemed to have no one at all. Luke also has his force ghost advisers.

Perhaps Anakin should have been haunting Ren. Anakin was redeemed after all.

We don't know that nobody was secretly watching out for her though! OR that (if Luke is her Dad) that he was the one who left her? Her mother could have  left her after Luke went into hiding, Luke thinking that she was safe and protected. - there is a theory doing the rounds that Luke wiped her memory and left her there.

Luke didn't have his force ghost advisors, as you put it, until after his training with Yoda though did he? - am I remembering that right it's been a while since I watched the original trilogy - and she is untrained, they could be there and she hasn't learnt how to see them as Luke did, she is just starting to let, as Maz says, the 'light' guide her.

The Skywalker lightsaber called to Rey, she hears the voice of Obi-Wan and flashes of where Luke fought Vader, she see's the Knights of Ren and later the lightsaber goes to her instead of Kylo Ren - could maybe be cus the force is stronger in her? but it seemed to me that it chose her over him.

R2D2 was put into some sort of droid coma by Luke with the map inside him and only woke up when Rey is on the planet, BB8 talks to him and presumably says "have you got the rest of the map to Luke?" earlier in the movie but R2 doesn't budge until Rey lands.

They have left her story open enough in this movie that it could go a number of ways in the next movie.

I'm sure Luke recognised her on the cliff though! and the way Leia smiled and hugged her, there was something of a recognition there! 

I can see the "I am your father" line being used again and the "I am a Jedi, like my father (and grandfather) before me" and I will squee with happiness :rofl: 

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Just saw it tonight (work prevented my seeing it sooner). I'm definitely leaning towards Rey being Luke's daughter.

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I've only seen it twice but sitting here thinking about it and reading stuff online I am becoming more and more 'into' it!

... *sighs* I don;t have time to be obsessed with another movie right now :rofl: I have far too much work to do! 

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5 hours ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

We don't know that nobody was secretly watching out for her though! OR that (if Luke is her Dad) that he was the one who left her? Her mother could have  left her after Luke went into hiding, Luke thinking that she was safe and protected. - there is a theory doing the rounds that Luke wiped her memory and left her there.

Luke didn't have his force ghost advisors, as you put it, until after his training with Yoda though did he? - am I remembering that right it's been a while since I watched the original trilogy - and she is untrained, they could be there and she hasn't learnt how to see them as Luke did, she is just starting to let, as Maz says, the 'light' guide her.

The Skywalker lightsaber called to Rey, she hears the voice of Obi-Wan and flashes of where Luke fought Vader, she see's the Knights of Ren and later the lightsaber goes to her instead of Kylo Ren - could maybe be cus the force is stronger in her? but it seemed to me that it chose her over him.

R2D2 was put into some sort of droid coma by Luke with the map inside him and only woke up when Rey is on the planet, BB8 talks to him and presumably says "have you got the rest of the map to Luke?" earlier in the movie but R2 doesn't budge until Rey lands.

They have left her story open enough in this movie that it could go a number of ways in the next movie.

I'm sure Luke recognised her on the cliff though! and the way Leia smiled and hugged her, there was something of a recognition there! 

I can see the "I am your father" line being used again and the "I am a Jedi, like my father (and grandfather) before me" and I will squee with happiness :rofl: 

I was not very clear.

It is hard to imagine she could be sitting on that planet lonely, just waiting for her family to return if Luke is her father. Unless he did not even know about her. I guess Anakin did not know about Luke before they met.

I doubt the lightsaber was calling her. Perhaps the force was calling her to the object. The force can show past and future events. I thought it interesting that she said she had never seen so much green before when she was flying low over the planet.

Quote

Yoda: Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship. 

So why did the lightsaber fly to her. She saw Ren attempting to retrieve it and imedietly understood what he was trying to do. She then also reached out for it and I'm guessing that part of the forest was stronger in the light side of the force than the dark.

Quote

Luke: "There's something not right here. I feel cold... death."

Yoda: "That place is strong with the dark side of the Force. A domain of evil it is. In you must go."

...or perhaps Rey was getting unseen help.

Edited by djsurrey

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6 hours ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

If Rey isn't Luke's daughter then I'll eat someone else's hat! (cus I don't have one)

The other half saw it before me and told me "you'll laugh and cry!" so I guessed either Han or Chewy died and it totally ruined the movie for me! :crying:

I thought Kylo Ren was the least scary thing that has ever graced a movie screen, even with strong force power he wasn't even remotely powerful imo.

I would love the online rumour that Finn is Lando Calrissian's lost son to be true too so that it is Han, Leia, Luke and Lando's children continuing the story!

Even though the twist was kinda spoiled for me and I found the bad guy(s) laughable I really liked it and am looking forward to the next movies :) 

The bold part, so true. When he and Han Solo met and Han offered him to come back to the familiy and expected Ben (Kylo Ren) to agree and thought to myself "what a douche". By killing his father, he surprised me, so to say, positively. Thank godness I wasn't spoiled in any way.

In the scene where Kylo Ren destroyed that room with his light saber in anger, I had to think at my son, who tends to have angry outbursts where he rampages in his child's room.

The other bad guy (the big one, don't know his English name because I saw the movie in German) reminded me of gollum and I thought "Really?". Btw., isn't the gollum actor also the actor of 3PO, Andy Serkins?

The part I hated most is the one with the "turtle woman with the big glasses" (in the Mos Isley cantina part two). A very big "Really??!" in my mind. To me the Jar Jar Binks of the movie, so unnecessary.

I wasn't as euphoric with the movie Lennard, Howard and Raj were. I like the story in general, and I'm really happy with the beloved original characters introducing interesting new characters, but I think it could had been done better. It wasn't magical, it didn't blow me away. But I'm still very happy about them continuing the story, and it's huge that the had the original main characters, I love that. That's indeed magical, because it's been over 30 years. I was about 16 years old when I saw "the empire strikes back" (my favourite one) for the first time, on a tiny black and white (monochrome?) TV in my room. There, they really got me.

Didn't expect Han Solo to have such a big part.

Whatever, I'm totally looking forward to Dec, 16th, 2016, when "Rogue one" will start in Germany.

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21 minutes ago, Bavarian ShamyShipper Girl said:

The bold part, so true. When he and Han Solo met and Han offered him to come back to the familiy and expected Ben (Kylo Ren) to agree and thought to myself "what a douche". By killing his father, he surprised me, so to say, positively. Thank godness I wasn't spoiled in any way.

In the scene where Kylo Ren destroyed that room with his light saber in anger, I had to think at my son, who tends to have angry outbursts where he rampages in his child's room.

The other bad guy (the big one, don't know his English name because I saw the movie in German) reminded me of gollum and I thought "Really?". Btw., isn't the gollum actor also the actor of 3PO, Andy Serkins?

The part I hated most is the one with the "turtle woman with the big glasses" (in the Mos Isley cantina part two). A very big "Really??!" in my mind. To me the Jar Jar Binks of the movie, so unnecessary.

I wasn't as euphoric with the movie Lennard, Howard and Raj were. I like the story in general, and I'm really happy with the beloved original characters introducing interesting new characters, but I think it could had been done better. It wasn't magical, it didn't blow me away. But I'm still very happy about them continuing the story, and it's huge that the had the original main characters, I love that. That's indeed magical, because it's been over 30 years. I was about 16 years old when I saw "the empire strikes back" (my favourite one) for the first time, on a tiny black and white (monochrome?) TV in my room. There, they really got me.

Didn't expect Han Solo to have such a big part.

Whatever, I'm totally looking forward to Dec, 16th, 2016, when "Rogue one" will start in Germany.

I saw him killing his father to be exactly the same as those little idiots who start smoking so that the big kids will think they are cool, "look at me, killed my Dad! total SITH!!!" :icon_rolleyes: wasn't a fan at all and that was a shame cus he looks really cool!

Andy Serkis (Gollum/Smeagol) played Snoke (the big guy in the chair) not C3P0 :) 

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Anthony Daniels has played C3PO in every SW movie.

I'm reading the novelization right now and I'm hoping it gives more insight into Rey's parentage, among other things.

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38 minutes ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

I saw him killing his father to be exactly the same as those little idiots who start smoking so that the big kids will think they are cool, "look at me, killed my Dad! total SITH!!!" :icon_rolleyes: wasn't a fan at all and that was a shame cus he looks really cool!

Andy Serkis (Gollum/Smeagol) played Snoke (the big guy in the chair) not C3P0 :) 

Ah, I didn't know that. That's the reason why Snoke looks like Gollum after a bad accident. Well, that's really not good done.


About the other (not bold) part: The whole father-son-thing is a missed chance to me. I don't really understand that conflict or the motivation. O.k., I know Kylo Ren is on the dark side, Han Solo is on the good side and therefore another enemy who should be killed. Especially because Kylo Ren feels a pull from the good side which he wants to get rid of, and therefore killing his father not only decreases the pull but makes him more evil and strengthens the dark side in him by passing kind of the point of no return.
I know that when I think about it, but I don't feel it, I don't "grok" it (is that a suitable phrase?).

That was better done in episode 2 and 3, IMO. There you could better understand Anakins way to the dark side, which was a way into madness, so that he even strangles the person he loves the most while she carries his baby.

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My 20 year old son and I have been arguing about who are Rey's parents since we saw it on Saturday night. Abrams has got us hooked just like Lucas before him. I am leaning towards Luke by the way!

Edited by 4everlenny
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4 hours ago, 4everlenny said:

My 20 year old son and I have been arguing about who are Rey's parents since we saw it on Saturday night. Abrams has got us hooked just like Lucas before him. I am leaning towards Luke by the way!

Who does your Son think her parents are?

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15 hours ago, Bavarian ShamyShipper Girl said:

The bold part, so true. When he and Han Solo met and Han offered him to come back to the familiy and expected Ben (Kylo Ren) to agree and thought to myself "what a douche". By killing his father, he surprised me, so to say, positively. Thank godness I wasn't spoiled in any way.

In the scene where Kylo Ren destroyed that room with his light saber in anger, I had to think at my son, who tends to have angry outbursts where he rampages in his child's room.

The other bad guy (the big one, don't know his English name because I saw the movie in German) reminded me of gollum and I thought "Really?". Btw., isn't the gollum actor also the actor of 3PO, Andy Serkins?

The part I hated most is the one with the "turtle woman with the big glasses" (in the Mos Isley cantina part two). A very big "Really??!" in my mind. To me the Jar Jar Binks of the movie, so unnecessary.

I wasn't as euphoric with the movie Lennard, Howard and Raj were. I like the story in general, and I'm really happy with the beloved original characters introducing interesting new characters, but I think it could had been done better. It wasn't magical, it didn't blow me away. But I'm still very happy about them continuing the story, and it's huge that the had the original main characters, I love that. That's indeed magical, because it's been over 30 years. I was about 16 years old when I saw "the empire strikes back" (my favourite one) for the first time, on a tiny black and white (monochrome?) TV in my room. There, they really got me.

Didn't expect Han Solo to have such a big part.

Whatever, I'm totally looking forward to Dec, 16th, 2016, when "Rogue one" will start in Germany.

Well I actually was more like Leonard and the guys at the end of the movie. It was waking up the next morning the biggest flaw hit me and it is nothing anyone here has mentioned yet. Seeing the original characters 35ish years later is really really neat. Considering what crap the first Star Trek movie was with the old original series cast I think this Star Wars movie hit it out of the park.

Kylo Ren is no Darth Vader, not yet. On the other hand he was able to get more out of Rey's mind than Vader could get out of Leia. He is not yet so evil yet he has power Anakin did not have. It is good he is different. Presumably killing his own father was the moment of Ren's complete turning like When Anakin disarmed Windu. There will be no turning back. Of coarse the next thing Anakin/Vader did was personally slaughter the jedi younglings  as part if the jeti genocide. It was a close up butchering of kids who trusted him. Ren is not yet the same embodiment of evil.

I don't see Maz as some new Jar Jar. She is/was a force sensitive but untrained alien that attempts a little mentorship. My guess there is/was more to her than we saw.  Imagine is one only saw the first couple of minutes of Yoda.

Snoke was only seen in big holograms. Hard to say what he is rally like. To me he looked like a lich from D&D. That is an undead magic user who is keeping himself from dying with magic but is not truly alive either (something like Voltmort before the graveyard enfleshment). As wild speculation that could make him the partial resurrection of the Emperor who appeared to be killed by Vader.

Edited by djsurrey
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17 hours ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

Who does your Son think her parents are?

Han and Leia, our disscussion was basically what's been discussed here. I would think that Leia would know she had a daughter. Lol. I could see Han not knowing if she got pregnant right before they split over Ben turning evil. She might then hide this from Han. Why Rey was abandoned is a mystery no matter who her parents are?

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On 22 December 2015 at 7:33 AM, djsurrey said:

I was not very clear.

It is hard to imagine she could be sitting on that planet lonely, just waiting for her family to return if Luke is her father. Unless he did not even know about her. I guess Anakin did not know about Luke before they met.

The prevailing theory seems to be that Luke (if he is the Dad) wiped her memory for her own protection.

Quote

I doubt the lightsaber was calling her. Perhaps the force was calling her to the object. The force can show past and future events. I thought it interesting that she said she had never seen so much green before when she was flying low over the planet.

That is what I meant yeah :) 

 

 

On 22 December 2015 at 11:46 PM, djsurrey said:

Kylo Ren is no Darth Vader, not yet. On the other hand he was able to get more out of Rey's mind than Vader could get out of Leia. He is not yet so evil yet he has power Anakin did not have. It is good he is different. Presumably killing his own father was the moment of Ren's complete turning like When Anakin disarmed Windu. There will be no turning back. Of coarse the next thing Anakin/Vader did was personally slaughter the jedi younglings  as part if the jeti genocide. It was a close up butchering of kids who trusted him. Ren is not yet the same embodiment of evil.

What powers does Ren have that Vader did not?

And he did do that bold part, he and the knights of Ren destroyed Luke's new Jedi order Luke is the last, they killed all the others. 

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57 minutes ago, Einstein Von Brainstorm said:

What powers does Ren have that Vader did not?

And he did do that bold part, he and the knights of Ren destroyed Luke's new Jedi order Luke is the last, they killed all the others. 

Vader could not extract information from peoples minds. 

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6 hours ago, DrWackaDoodle said:

Just got back from seeing it. it felt very "Disney-fied" IMO. Definitely not the best SW but not the worst either (we all remember Jar Jar!) 

I believe that Lucas first pitched the original Star Wars to Universal, then Disney and it was rejected by both.

20th Century Fox made the deal to distribute it. Funny how things go. Star Wars was made for 11 million and actually made 775.4 million world wide. So how much was Hollywood and Disney Lucas-fied before Lucas Film and Star Wars was sold to Disney? 

see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_(film)#Cinematic_influence

Quote

Film critic Roger Ebert wrote in his book The Great Movies, "Like The Birth of a Nation and Citizen Kane, Star Wars was a technical watershed that influenced many of the movies that came after."[193] It began a new generation of special effects and high-energy motion pictures. The film was one of the first films to link genres together to invent a new, high-conceptgenre for filmmakers to build upon.[193][54] Finally, along with Steven Spielberg's Jaws, it shifted the film industry's focus away from personal filmmaking of the 1970s and towards fast-paced, big-budget blockbusters for younger audiences.[193][11][194]

Filmmakers who have said to have been influenced by Star Wars include James Cameron, Dean Devlin, Gareth Edwards,[195] Roland Emmerich, John Lasseter,[196] David Fincher, Peter Jackson, Joss Whedon, Christopher Nolan, Ridley Scott, John Singleton, and Kevin Smith.[54] 

and from http://www.filmsite.org/serialfilms.html

Quote

In modern times, Hollywood studios have borrowed the lucrative idea of using cliffhangers and serialized installment plans or multi-part stories for their largely self-contained epics, e.g., The Matrix trilogy, The Lord of the Rings trilogy, the  Star Wars (1977) sequels and prequels, Spielberg's Indiana Jones and Jurassic Park flicks, the Kill Bill volumes, and the Back to the Future trio. These are not pure serials, but stand-alone, full-length movies with many chapters, volumes, or parts, and exciting serial-like sequences. Many modern-day soap operas and well-known TV series, such as Lost in Space and the soapish Dallas, have used the cliffhanger ending as enticement to tune in again.

 

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