episodes 923 'The Line Substitution Solution' (May 5)

[Judith]

2 hours ago, JohnPhD said:

Do I need to spell this out: in the scene I referred to, Penny was trying to bond withBeverly, but Beverly showed more intrest in Amy and Bernadette. Bernadette kept trying to bring Beverly's attention to Penny (showing she was Penny's friend) whereas Amy just lapped it up (showing she wasn't).

It was established long ago that that hideous painting was more an act of aggression than of real friendship.

Penny was preoccupied with her Beverly problems and Amy was preoccupied with her Sheldon problems. None of the two showed any particular caring for the other's problems in that scene. Bernadette gave her sympathy to Penny and Beverly to Amy. Of course, you hating Amy to such a degree makes you see everything Penny-centered.

I mean, Amy was frustrated by Sheldon's behaviour and she really found some understanding in Beverly (which I'm sure she hasn't gotten from Penny or Bernie up until now because they just don't get it like Beverly does) and all you got was that nasty!Amy didn't rush to Penny's side but instead dared to accept some hard-found sympathy which of course must mean that she's not Penny's friend?

 

[Jonny]

3 hours ago, JohnPhD said:

Do I need to spell this out: in the scene I referred to, Penny was trying to bond withBeverly, but Beverly showed more intrest in Amy and Bernadette. Bernadette kept trying to bring Beverly's attention to Penny (showing she was Penny's friend) whereas Amy just lapped it up (showing she wasn't).

It was established long ago that that hideous painting was more an act of aggression than of real friendship.

John I would say that that was Beverly's fault not Amy's. Amy was preoccupied with the rubbish Sheldon drama plot so I could understand why she didn't notice. But Beverly must have noticed that a) Penny was trying to get her attention and b- that Bernadette was trying to change the conversation so that Beverly gave more attention to Penny. So it was Beverly's fault she didn't.

[Tonstar17]

48 minutes ago, Jonny83 said:

John I would say that that was Beverly's fault not Amy's. Amy was preoccupied with the rubbish Sheldon drama plot so I could understand why she didn't notice. But Beverly must have noticed that a) Penny was trying to get her attention and b- that Bernadette was trying to change the conversation so that Beverly gave more attention to Penny. So it was Beverly's fault she didn't.

But just like Sheldon. Beverly doesn't get it. Making excuses just like ppls do for Sheldon 

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[Kathy2611]

4 hours ago, JohnPhD said:

It was established long ago that that hideous painting was more an act of aggression than of real friendship.

You can't possibly be serious!!  Here's the transcript from that very episode that blows a giant hole through your interpretation....

Amy:  I got you a little something.

Penny: A little something? Oh, it… what, this is huge.

Amy: What’s huge is what you’ve done for me.

Penny: Oh, no, Amy, I haven’t done anything.

Amy: No, no, before I met you, I was a mousy wallflower.  But look at me now.   I'm like some kind of downtown hipster party girl.  With a posse, a boyfriend and a new lace bra that hooks in the front, of all things. Open it. Open it.

Penny: Okay. (Opens parcel to find a huge and not at all flattering painting of Penny and Amy)

Amy: I wanted to get you something you didn’t have.

Penny: Wow. I-I don’t know what to s… Wow.

Amy CLEARLY credits Penny for her life the way it is now and she wanted to show her appreciation.  Where in the hell do you see where it's an act of aggression??!!

[vonmar]

I don't get character hate.  I have my favorites.  I talk about them, speculate and hope for the very best for them.  I have other characters that don't mean very much to me, but I never trash them or blame them for the things that the writers have written for them.  But that does happen here very often.  And to me, that's a little sad.  Love your favorites, accept the others for how they are written and embrace the chaos.

[Jonny]

Another excellent vonmar post as usual.

That's the mentality I try to take though Season 9 Raj is making it a bit difficult right now truth be told. I don't hate any characters whatsoever, I prefer some over others and root for them more but that's it. First and foremost I am a fan of the show, then I am a fan of certain characters second.

[Stephen Hawking]

On 7/21/2016 at 10:31 PM, Judith said:

Amy didn't rush to Penny's side

Unlike in The Cohabitation Formulation, where she rushed over to Penny's apartment, "to pick up the pieces of your broken heart."

I don't recall it happening the other way round.

On 7/21/2016 at 11:49 PM, Tonstar17 said:

But just like Sheldon. Beverly doesn't get it.

What I've never understood is, how can Beverly, a trained psychologist and world-renowned expert in parenting and child development, not "get it"?

[Tensor]

4 hours ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Unlike in The Cohabitation Formulation, where she rushed over to Penny's apartment, "to pick up the pieces of your broken heart."

I don't recall it happening the other way round.

Amy had an ulterior motive, to get her brain wave pattens.  

[Stephen Hawking]

28 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Amy had an ulterior motive, to get her brain wave pattens.  

You think that was her only motive?

You can do things for more than one reason.

[Tensor]

5 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

You think that was her only motive?

You can do things for more than one reason.

Usually helping someone pick up the pieces of their broken heart doesn't include listing the reasons why the other person is so much better, and listing the reasons why the one you're trying to help is so much worse.  Not to mention pulling out the leads as soon as Amy got there.  She was trying to get Penny to cry, she succeeded.  That doesn't indicate to me she was trying to help her, it indicates, to me, that she was trying to get the information she needed for her experiment.  We know Amy has no shame in using Penny as a test subject.  

[Kathy2611]

37 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Usually helping someone pick up the pieces of their broken heart doesn't include listing the reasons why the other person is so much better, and listing the reasons why the one you're trying to help is so much worse.  Not to mention pulling out the leads as soon as Amy got there.  She was trying to get Penny to cry, she succeeded.  That doesn't indicate to me she was trying to help her, it indicates, to me, that she was trying to get the information she needed for her experiment.  We know Amy has no shame in using Penny as a test subject.  

All of what you said is true but what's also true is the way Amy feels about Penny.  Or at least during the early years.  Maybe not as much now.  But definately back then, she literally worshipped the ground Penny walked on. 

From The Skank Reflex

 

Penny:  I know, right? Maybe I should just move back to Nebraska.

Amy: No, I can’t let you do that.

Penny: Why not? (There is a knock on the door)

Amy: For the first time ever, I have a thriving social life. And no pressure, but it kind of lives and dies with you.

Amy credits Penny for how much better her life is now.  

 

Also, 

From The Infestation

Penny: My God, Amy, that’s really crappy of you.

Amy: It is?  (She clearly doesn't understand what she did wrong until Penny explains it to her....)

Penny: Yeah! Letting Sheldon use you to manipulate me? I thought you were my friend.

Amy: No, I am your friend. Please don’t be mad at me.

 

 

 

 

[Tensor]

40 minutes ago, Kathy2611 said:

All of what you said is true but what's also true is the way Amy feels about Penny.  Or at least during the early years.  Maybe not as much now.  But definately back then, she literally worshipped the ground Penny walked on. 

I don't disagree with you Kathy, or Steven for that matter, generally.  I was referring to that one specific instance.

[Tensor]

Thread locked, posts hidden. We will review posts, discuss, and take action.   Look, you see a post you think is a personal attack, report it, don't try to answer it as that is only going to get you in trouble also. This started two hours after I went to bed, and ended to hours befor I wroke up.   Now we have to go through and try to find the pieces that are against our rules, then try figure out if any of the posts are worth saving.  It may be simpler to leave things hidden.  Don't take this to other threads

[Tensor]

Thread reopened.  The discussion of who likes or dislikes the various characters and why, was moved to the  Shipping Lanes Thread   DO NOT COMMENT ABOUT OTHER POSTERS, discuss the topic.   If you don't like their posts, refute them, or make your own point ABOUT THE SHOW.   If you think there are posts that are personal attacks, report them.  Refuting your points is not a personal attack.  

[3ku11]

I don't think I ever commented on this episode, reading the post glad I diddn't LOL. Have to say Keven/Stuart was hilarous. When he was in the car with Amy. And he is like Look Lady I just work here . Then when he raged at Sheldon, pretending to be Amy classic. They need to utilize Stuart more. He is so pathetic, it is just comedy gold. I don't think Amy is agressive towards Penny, well not anymore anyway. I Think she used to be a bit creepy towards Penny But she is over that now, I Think. OBviousley Bev seemed to like A and B more then Penny. But she might have more in common with them. And maybe just like Penny, Bev beleive it or not is intimidated by Penny. OF course she said Leonard has never been happier. Funny episode. 

[Judith]

On 7/5/2016 at 7:57 AM, stardustmelody said:

Yes...this season in particular.   But yes....this is the reason that when you see Sheldon and Penny acting domestic and enjoying playing games together and sitting around in their PJs together...it just comes across as a way to glaringly point to the fact that they are not doing this with their SO's, but instead snark at their SO's or in Sheldon's case often disregard Amy's feelings.   Yes...this is the problem.  No problem seeing them play games together IF they were showing us that these couples were super happy and united most of the time.  An occasional spat is realistic.   But that has not happened.  Instead we see the opposite on screen most of the time...where Sheldon and Penny are happiest with each other than they are with their SO's.   That was the point of the comment.

So -

Sheldon and Amy were very happy with each other in Earworm, Opening Night, Sales Call, Valentino, Big Bear and even played a game in Platonic when they weren't together yet...but Sheldon and Penny playing a game in Line Substitution means to you that Sheldon spent most of season 9 being happier with Penny than Amy...I see.

Seeing Sheldon and Penny playing a game in their pjs makes me think that they're two friends, living and having fun together...not that the big bad ptb are rubbing it in everyone's faces that they're not doing this with their sos...Because then by the same token, when we saw Shamy in their pjs about to have sex, they were rubbing it in Shenny shippers' faces that Sheldon and Penny will never have sex. Nah, probably not. Only the Shenny scenes are supposed to have a special meaning

Shamy had a lot of scenes together in s9...some of them happy, others sad, others serious. Shenny had very few scenes where they were alone, and only one where they were happy (the game one). So the maths don't agree with your conclusion.

PS: I'm aware the quoted post is a year old.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Judith

[TLW]

Penny got fed up how Beverly was treating her in this episode. I feel like she was getting a taste of what it was like for Leonard all the time with his mother.

[Mario D.]

8 minutes ago, TLW said:

Penny got fed up how Beverly was treating her in this episode. I feel like she was getting a taste of what it was like for Leonard all the time with his mother.

Beverly was ticked that she did not get an invitation to P&L wedding but she failed to tell them about her 60th birthday party  in which Sheldon attended with Leonard's brother and sister and he kept that secret when it is impossible for him to keep one! When Beverly admits she was wrong about their relationship and says she had never seen Leonard so happy, Penny is the bigger person by suggesting another wedding ceremony. I think season 9 & 10 became the Sheldon/Shamy show.

[chucky]

4 hours ago, Mario D. said:

Beverly was ticked that she did not get an invitation to P&L wedding but she failed to tell them about her 60th birthday party  in which Sheldon attended with Leonard's brother and sister and he kept that secret when it is impossible for him to keep one! When Beverly admits she was wrong about their relationship and says she had never seen Leonard so happy, Penny is the bigger person by suggesting another wedding ceremony. I think season 9 & 10 became the Sheldon/Shamy show.

9 & 10 is when it started. The real knife in the back for Leonard was the writers having Amy get the Nobel with Sheldon. She wasn't even a Physicist. 

[Mario D.]

1 hour ago, chucky said:

9 & 10 is when it started. The real knife in the back for Leonard was the writers having Amy get the Nobel with Sheldon. She wasn't even a Physicist. 

This is true but I think Leonard was totally ok with it because Penny was pregnant and he would be a father and couldn't be more happy about it at the time.

[chucky]

1 hour ago, Mario D. said:

This is true but I think Leonard was totally ok with it because Penny was pregnant and he would be a father and couldn't be more happy about it at the time.

You're right. The writers gave him  a bone with her pregnancy. But,  I feel that if Amy gets a Nobel it should be I'm her field. With all the suffering Leonard went through as Sheldon's friend, it would have been nice if he shared the Nobel. 

[TLW]

On 2/1/2023 at 3:45 PM, chucky said:

You're right. The writers gave him  a bone with her pregnancy. But,  I feel that if Amy gets a Nobel it should be I'm her field. With all the suffering Leonard went through as Sheldon's friend, it would have been nice if he shared the Nobel. 

If Leonard could have defined the experiment to confirm their theory, that would have been great. Rather than have those 2 from FermiLab who stumbled on it by accident.

[chucky]

1 hour ago, TLW said:

If Leonard could have defined the experiment to confirm their theory, that would have been great. Rather than have those 2 from FermiLab who stumbled on it by accident.

True. But, that wouldn't have been as funny. At least that's my opinion of what the writers were thinking. I really thought those episodes with the two scientists from Fermilab were ridiculous and not needed.

[HeWolf]

7 hours ago, chucky said:

True. But, that wouldn't have been as funny. At least that's my opinion of what the writers were thinking. I really thought those episodes with the two scientists from Fermilab were ridiculous and not needed.

Truer words have never been spoken. That subplot was unnecessary and a complete waste of precious episode time.

[Mario D.]

1 hour ago, HeWolf said:

Truer words have never been spoken. That subplot was unnecessary and a complete waste of precious episode time.

So true. Especially since it was the last season when they could have made better stories that involved Penny, Leonard & Raj. The Shamy quest for the Nobel just dominated almost every episode in the twelfth season.