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[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

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4 minutes ago, April said:

Fingers crossed they get that deal done sooner rather than later! But I guess it's a good sign that Geller is still optimistic.

What is the guy going to say. He's not optimistic.

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8 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

What is the guy going to say. He's not optimistic.

Just wait and see. Cheers :shy:

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5 minutes ago, veejay said:

Just wait and see. Cheers :shy:

036.jpeg

That's the spirit,lol! Cheers! :)

Edited by spidergirl
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3 hours ago, Chrismo said:

The Sheldon Show? I see that. JP will never act on a TV series again. Too recognizable. Johnny and Kaley aren't. I don't think their career will be effected at all.

You are unfortunately right...I'd love to see him in more stuff,I think he's great!It's his comedic skills I don't like tbh and I know how crazy it sounds since he did get famous for a comedic role,but the only times I can appreciate his acting are the serious scenes.Only then I'm like "wow,he is good!".Imo the ones with an acting future  are easily Simon and Kunal,mainly the first.

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There is an art to writing differing styles of situation comedies.  The Big Bang Theory in the first half of its run was a program that was masterfully written.  (what I am about to say is entirely my opinion....).  For what is probably a slew of reasons, that began to change after season 6.  By that time TBBT had become a staple of syndicated television.  You could watch episodes back to back for nearly 3 hours most nights on TBS and re-live the first few seasons.  Another huge change was the appearance of the characters of first, Bernadette, then Amy.  Finally the change that not many speak about, but which matters a great deal regarding the writing, was the contractual requirement that each of the 7 main cast appear in each episode (remember in Episode 4.11 "The Justice League Recombination" Penny mentions Howard's "girlfriend"--not by name and Amy Farrah Fowler as possible wearers of the Wonder Woman costume---they did not appear).   That, to me, is what has "broken" the writers here.  The prime example of the tragedy of 7 characters needing something to do is the finale for season 8.  The bouncing back and forth between 3/4 story lines made everything seem rushed.  Pacing was off and trying to cram that much show (with extreme cliff-hangers being created) just did not flow and made that episode lacking.
It is difficult to fit full stories for that many cast members into a 18-21 minute time frame.  Seinfeld was able to do it with usually three connected stories meshing into one by the end of an episode, but here often the stories are not related other than things are happening to one close-knit group of people.   
I'm not sure how to "fix" this.  Are there any thoughts, comments, etc.?


I agree with this so much. Trying to fit multiple storylines into a 20 minute sitcom is ridiculous. It's not even the writers' fault. It's these damn actors wanting more for themselves. I feel like a good actor should think about the project as a whole and work towards what will make the show better. Instead, they demand more screen time and more pay (which may or may not be deserved depending on the character), and now the creators have to figure how to make it all happen.


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16 minutes ago, serenaded214 said:

I agree with this so much. Trying to fit multiple storylines into a 20 minute sitcom is ridiculous. It's not even the writers' fault. It's these damn actors wanting more for themselves. I feel like a good actor should think about the project as a whole and work towards what will make the show better. Instead, they demand more screen time and more pay (which may or may not be deserved depending on the character), and now the creators have to figure how to make it all happen.

This actually makes me curious: How do you think the creative process of this show works because... what???

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34 minutes ago, April said:

This actually makes me curious: How do you think the creative process of this show works because... what???

Chuck to Steve "How do we get Jim into every scene"?

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Well I agree too many characters. Not enough screen time. Writers struggling to accomodate everyone. And struggling to write for all characters. In this case relagating two of their stars too a supporting role. Hell a recurring at role at best lol.  Milking one character etc. Not rocket science tbh. Repeated Cannon. Or replacing Early Cannon with this new convoluted mess of a cannon They have done it with Sheldon. Who's now this over grown man child. Who treats everyone including Amy like his parents. Leonard lieing about some boat kiss for two years. Which was just fake drama for the sake of drama. Leonard susposed to be the hero of this story. And he still is.

But that was really feeding Leonard to the wolves. Penny worrying she's turning into Beverly. Which the absurdity of it on so many lvls is not even funny. Leonard clearly married Penny as she is the complete opposite of Bev.  Penny apparently thinking Leonard is taking her to granted. Apart from the fact for years Cannon was Penny takes Leonard for granted. It's just a typical tropey sitcom classic clichie. Of the wife feeling under appreciated. Problem is most of those sitcom marriages have been married for years. And have kids.

Seem the show skipped all the fun plots for Lenny. And don't get me started on how Ooc it is for Lenny to agree to a RA. I do like the idea of them following up from Luke Cage. Find a common interest. They don't need to create some conventional paradigm seen in many sitcoms before. They just need some isolated scenes, where they communicate. Be better if that was a starting point for conversation. Instead of getting Shamy involved. Imagine if Lenny got involved Shamys affairs? In any case creatively this show Maybe done. The Lenny tree sequence was the most creative thing they have done since season 7. But they used to write with a blend of character development and humor so well. Now I agree it's just syndicated. 

Edited by 3ku11
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1 minute ago, 3ku11 said:

Well I agree too many characters. Not enough screen time. Writers struggling to accomodate everything. Milking one character etc. Not rocket science tbh. 

There milking one character because of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. Though to me with a little creativity 25 millions viewers wouldn't be unrealistic.

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5 hours ago, Chrismo said:

The Sheldon Show? I see that. JP will never act on a TV series again. Too recognizable. Johnny and Kaley aren't. I don't think their career will be effected at all.

Yes, sort of what happened to Ed O'Neil who was Al Bundy from "Married with Children". It took him a long time to get any other work. Instead of seeing the character people would have seen Al Bundy as...

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This actually makes me curious: How do you think the creative process of this show works because... what???


I'm not sure what you mean. My point was that there's no need for every character to be in every episode. One day focus a storyline and with character A,B,&C. Next day focus on a Storyline with Characters B,C,D,&E. Etc. When actors demand to be in every single episode (assuming they're not a LEAD character, that is), it compromises the whole show because writers are now limited in that they HAVE to incorporate you into the 20 minute story somehow. So the audience gets ridiculous little snippets that they feel are unnecessary.

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2 minutes ago, serenaded214 said:

 

 


I'm not sure what you mean. My point was that there's no need for every character to be in every episode. One day focus a storyline and with character A,B,&C. Next day focus on a Storyline with Characters B,C,D,&E. Etc. When actors demand to be in every single episode (assuming they're not a LEAD character, that is), it compromises the whole show because writers are now limited in that they HAVE to incorporate you into the 20 minute story somehow. So the audience gets ridiculous little snippets that they feel are unnecessary.

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All their contracts state that they are to be in all episodes.

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1 hour ago, serenaded214 said:

 

 


I agree with this so much. Trying to fit multiple storylines into a 20 minute sitcom is ridiculous. It's not even the writers' fault. It's these damn actors wanting more for themselves. I feel like a good actor should think about the project as a whole and work towards what will make the show better. Instead, they demand more screen time and more pay (which may or may not be deserved depending on the character), and now the creators have to figure how to make it all happen.

First of all in the case of TBBT actors do not demand more screen time. I'm pretty sure you can see that Lenny's screen time is and has been greatly diminished for several seasons.

Secondly, can we really blame actors for asking for more money? If they get paid more money it is because whomever is paying is making even more, wouldn't you say? To excuse the writers in this fashion seems a little bit unfair. They have (IMO) been screwing it up since mid S7 all on their own.

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Their biggest mistake was 1. Lenny getting engaged, and having no plan. 2. Making Sheldon run away in S7 finalie.  3. Making the terribly short sighted decision of making Leonard "Cheat" and lie about it for two years. Which essentially was them creating unorganic drama for the sake of drama. Those seemed to the beginning of the decline we now see in TBBT. But hey its fun seeing the show crash and burn :D.  But in any case I agree, considering how diminished Leonard and Penny have been since since Season 7. I Think its clear Johnny and Kaley are not demanding for more screen time. Maybe they should lol. Because getting payed that amount of money per episode, for generally doing nothing. Is a bit stupid. The show ain't about quality or creativity no more, its about money.Hence why Sheldon needs to be in every scene, so they appease their advertisers. 

Edited by 3ku11
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8 minutes ago, serenaded214 said:

I'm not sure what you mean. My point was that there's no need for every character to be in every episode. One day focus a storyline and with character A,B,&C. Next day focus on a Storyline with Characters B,C,D,&E. Etc. When actors demand to be in every single episode (assuming they're not a LEAD character, that is), it compromises the whole show because writers are now limited in that they HAVE to incorporate you into the 20 minute story somehow. So the audience gets ridiculous little snippets that they feel are unnecessary.

That has nothing to do with the contracts or whatever the actors want. It's not like Mayim and Melissa showed up and demanded to be hired full time. They are there because the people in charge want them there. Every week. Same as the others.

The only contractual obligation is that they have to be in every episode - but not by how much. Nobody is counting any minutes or lines or whatever (except maybe some hardcore fans who catalogue everything). In fact the amount of screen time and dialogue varies massively between the single actors. Someone like Mayim can have as little as a one scene without even a line of dialogue to getting more screentime than anybody else. I mean, you could probably argue that the writers favour Jim because they just love sticking Sheldon into scenes but that's about it.

The distribution of storylines is all down to the writers. They don't need to write out anybody to fill the contractual obligation. When they mess up the pacing of an episode because the stuff too many storylines into it then that's on them and not the actors.

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First of all in the case of TBBT actors do not demand more screen time. I'm pretty sure you can see that Lenny's screen time is and has been greatly diminished for several seasons.
Secondly, can we really blame actors for asking for more money? If they get paid more money it is because whomever is paying is making even more, wouldn't you say? To excuse the writers in this fashion seems a little bit unfair. They have (IMO) been screwing it up since mid S7 all on their own.


That's the thing though. If the writers didn't have to include little snippets of supporting cast, maybe they'd have more time to dedicate to Lenny.

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Their biggest mistake was 1. Lenny getting engaged, and having no plan. 2. Making Sheldon run away in S7 finalie.  3. Making the terribly short sighted decision of making Leonard "Cheat" and lie about it for two years. Which essentially was them creating unorganic drama for the sake of drama. Those seemed to the beginning of the decline we now see in TBBT. But hey its fun seeing the show crash and burn :D.  But in any case I agree, considering how diminished Leonard and Penny have been since since Season 7. I Think its clear Johnny and Kaley are not demanding for more screen time. Maybe they should lol. Because getting payed that amount of money per episode, for generally doing nothing. Is a bit stupid. The show ain't about quality or creativity no more, its about money.Hence why Sheldon needs to be in every scene, so they appease their advertisers. 


I do wish Sheldon wasn't in every scene. It's a bit ridiculous at this point. From what I recall, Leonard was supposed to have the lead male role in the series, but Sheldon somehow managed to steal the spotlight. They need to reign it in and make Leaonard the focus again.

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I don't think it's the supporting characters stealing screen time from Lenny. They were there in S5 and 6 when Lenny had plenty of action.


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23 minutes ago, Itwasdestined said:

I don't think it's the supporting characters stealing screen time from Lenny. They were there in S5 and 6 when Lenny had plenty of action.


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Jumping in to this discussion to say I concur.  To me, it is the standard way TPTB see a show as having the most popularized character stand in the center and have the other characters pass by for their obligatory screen shot.  TBBT is not the first show to do this nor will it be the last most likely...

Edited by Kasey
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Sheldon Cooper....meet Arthur Fonzarelli!( to be fair Ron Howard/Richie Cunningham did leave the show although the Fonz was already dominating by then - and he started as a bit character in the first season)


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5 hours ago, serenaded214 said:

 


That's the thing though. If the writers didn't have to include little snippets of supporting cast, maybe they'd have more time to dedicate to Lenny.

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I do wish Sheldon wasn't in every scene. It's a bit ridiculous at this point. From what I recall, Leonard was supposed to have the lead male role in the series, but Sheldon somehow managed to steal the spotlight. They need to reign it in and make Leaonard the focus again.

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Leonard was not supposed to be the only male lead.  Both Sheldon and Leonard were the male leads from the very beginning . I think both Jim and Johnny were always considered for nominations and awards in the male lead category, so both kind of fit the male lead criteria.   And as early as season 2 and 3, there were plenty of Sheldon centric episodes. The focus was never exclusively on Leonard. The focus was mostly even between S and L. But last few seasons, certainly,  Sheldon and Shamy have become much more *of a focal point. 

Edited by serena_1995
*of , not if

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1 minute ago, Kasey said:

Jumping in to this discussion to say I concur.  To me, it is the standard way TPTB see a show as having the most popularized character stand in the center and have the other characters pass by for their obligatory screen shot.  TBBT is not the first show to do this nor will it be the last most likely...

Well yeah but the recent sitcom before TBBT. Friends yes I am bringing it up again LOL. Never made Rachel or Chandler stand tall. So while their shows have done this. I guess its up to the show runners to make that decision. Which they clearly did. Sheldon is the breakout star of the show. They don't care about balance or consistency, or quality anymore. Other characters stories don't matter anymore. Just their star attraction, and advertisers throwing revenue and money at it. 

1 minute ago, serena_1995 said:

Leonard was not supposed to be the only male lead. I think both Sheldon and Leonard were the male leads from the very beginning . I think both Jim and Johnny were always considered for nominations and awards in the male lead category, so both kind of fit the male lead criteria.   And as early as season 2 and 3, there were plenty of Sheldon centric episodes. The focus was never exclusively on Leonard. The focus was mostly even between S and L. But last few seasons, certainly,  Sheldon and Shamy have become much more if a focal point. 

The show originally was seen from Leonard's point of view. IMO it is now Sheldon's. 

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