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[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10


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9 hours ago, Tensor said:

I haven't been posting as I did not like last weeks episode, so I thought I'd take a break and see how this one went.  I didn't like this one either.  Last week I felt the dance was only there to distract everyone with eye candy, to hide the fact that Leonard and Penny really had nothing to do in the episode, except to counsel Amy and Sheldon.  

This weeks episode comes along, and there is a longer version of counseling Amy and Sheldon.  With an even smaller slice of Leonard and Penny doing nothing.  With the addition of Penny bitching about Leonard.   

And, why in the frigging world are Leonard and Penny so worried about Sheldon moving back?   If it happens, and they are so upset with that idea, they could just move the fuck out.  Leave Sheldon to fend for himself.  The comedy of them concerned about him moving back in eludes me.   As does the fact that all we are getting are the problems Sheldon and Amy have.   I guess Leonard and Penny had no problems when they first moved in with each other, oh, that's right, they hadn't lived by themselves, they had two apartments and an attached Sheldon.  

And next week we get the lovely specter of Shamy having throwing a brunch with others outside the circle of friends, something they've never had Lenny do, as a couple.  What we get is more than likely another half hour of "How in the hell did you get the hot girl" comments from fan boys with Penny answering, if the recent past is any guide, "He wore me down".  

Don't get me wrong, I loved the dance, I loved the moment at the beginning of this one.  But 30 second scenes, don't satisfy me when they could be delving into their concerns about living together, as they are doing with Amy and Sheldon.    And could be talking lovingly about each other, instead of the snark, at least some of the time.  


I'm now a "normal" viewer.  I am letting my DVR catch what comes out and I'll watch it when I have an idle moment. No rush, no thrill. And apparently they still have that obnoxious tall guy lording it over the others and stealing one bloke's wife's attention all the flaming time. He should go mow his own lawn. Stone the bloody crows.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
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Okay, so why did Amy bring the argument over to Lenny's?   Oh I know, because Shamy's arguments are funnier with an audience who can relate to what Amy is dealing with.  It also leads to Penny and Leonard becoming their relationship counselors.      So much for Lenny finishing their popcorn and movie.   Even in their own place, they don't get a break.  Which brings me back to the LA situation.   I have every reason to believe the temporary will become permanent because TPTB have shown that Sheldon can be just as much a part of Lenny's life, if not more so, living across the hall from them.   Except now, they have Amy to deal with as well.

It was Penny who talked Leonard into settling back in with Sheldon after they had terminated the Roommate Agreement.   Now Penny has done a turn about in reminding Leonard that Amy is their ticket to Sheldon not returning.   Changing door locks.    To me, they are not considering this as a temporary arrangement either.

I enjoy Amy and Leonard's interactions, but they both confuse me.   In one breath, Amy is defending herself with all her might about how difficult Sheldon is, and then in another downgrades the situation by calling Sheldon "high maintenance."   She wants to fight for her will in the relationship, but then wants to give in.   She takes a stand and then backs down.   Likewise, Leonard eggs Amy on by reinforcing the problems living with Sheldon but at the same time tells her not to give up.   At least he believes that if anyone can help alter Sheldon's behavior, it is Amy.    Then later, he gets jealous that Sheldon gave up the bathroom schedule for her.   Huh?

I loved Leonard pointing out all the ways Amy has helped Sheldon progress into a better person.  It reminded me of the time he opened Sheldon's laptop to show her that he had made her a part of his screensaver.   Sheldon's affections for Amy may be a mystery to her, but they are not blind to Leonard.

I enjoyed Sheldon and Penny's conversation in the car.   Apparently, Shamy have had some time to adjust to the sleeping arrangements, and Sheldon is close enough to her now for Amy to breathe on him.   I rather enjoyed his line about grabbing "Toto."   I especially appreciated Sheldon telling Penny that living with Amy is challenging, too.   Penny doesn't get it, after all, who can be more challenging to live with than Sheldon?   However, everyone seems to forget that Sheldon is also getting used to living in close proximity with someone of the opposite sex whom he has an emotional vested interest in.   Trying to find balance between having things your own way and making compromises is difficult for any two people coming together, especially when they are pretty much on par in terms self-arrogance and stubbornness.   The line about Amy having coitus one time and becoming Gloria Steinem cracked me up.   Well, Sheldon, I guess you gave her that little boost of confidence she lacked due to inexperience, didn't you?   After all of my recent discussions in this thread regarding Amy's arrogant streak, I felt vindicated by Sheldon's remark.   So, he's noticed, too!

The conversation about the SOs was not as bad as I thought it would be.   Who doesn't hear someone tell their side of things and then want to come back with an example of how they can relate to what the other person is going through?   It seemed like a normal conversation between friends to me.    Who can relate to the sound of a train whistle better than Sheldon?

I'm glad Penny saw through Sheldon's guise and helped him work through it to come to the right conclusion.   I hate that Penny knows something else about Sheldon that Amy doesn't, but I'm getting used to it.   To me, Penny witnessing and hearing all these confessions from Sheldon just proves to her how serious Sheldon really is about Amy.    I know I am in the minority, but I do believe Sheldon notices beautiful women, including Penny.   However, his remark was more of a dig at Penny rather than a compliment.  It seemed he was indirectly telling her that he was depriving her of the privilege of catching his eye, if he were interested in her in anything other than as a nanny.   Her loss, rather than his gain.   Maybe I read into it all wrong.

I hated that when Penny and Sheldon walked in, Penny had to announce that Sheldon had something he needed to tell Amy.    Can we please get past the "someone had to put Sheldon up to confession" bit?    Penny reasoned with Sheldon that he needed to stop hurting Amy now, but she didn't tell him what to do to make amends with Amy.   Unless a discussion occurred in the car on the way back, what was the purpose of Penny having to introduce Sheldon's next move?   Can't Sheldon have a discussion with Amy of his own initiative?

I liked the call back to the "flash" with Sheldon trying to get something important out of his mouth only to be distracted a few times doing so.  First he forgets to sit in his spot, and then when he realizes this and moves to continue his conversation, he notices someone has sat in his spot.   I enjoyed the homage to Amy's hot backside, while Amy turned her head away because she got it.   The fact these "realizations" did not occur immediately when Sheldon sat down and he didn't dwell on them tells me that apologizing to Amy was his priority.

The bathroom schedule, I get.   That needed to go.   The sharing of the toothbrush holder, perhaps that was pushing it.   After Sheldon's expression of total gross out at just the sound of Amy brushing her teeth and his dislike of germs, I understand where he is coming from here.   The fact that he caved in the end by not only giving up the schedule, which would have been more than enough, but also asking her to share the toothbrush holder with him..... Well, that is huge!!!

The hug....Oh, how long have I waited for Sheldon to hug her back in such a way.   I can finally get past the hug Sheldon gave Penny at his birthday party.   Now, Amy has one that is far superior and full of Sheldon's love.

In the end, I think Sheldon and Penny understand each other.   They are both bullies in their own right within their own relationships.  They both say and express themselves without thinking of the consequences or how their words may hurt the one they love.    Sheldon satisfies Penny's craving to crack the mystery that is him, while Penny helps Sheldon with the street and social smarts he lacks.   Sheldon needs an advisor, and Penny likes being the advisee.

Amy and Leonard have to put up with and adapt to the strong-wills of their partners, but what they have the most in common is their relationship with Sheldon.   They are more inclined to give in and take it rather than fight back, because they prefer peace.   Leonard understands his mistakes in not fighting back and wants Amy to not make the same ones he did.  Leonard understands Amy's desire for reassurance, because he craves it, too.    They both complain about Sheldon's behavior, but they both can't imagine life without him in it.  They both love him in spite of what Sheldon is and does.    They both want to simultaneously kill and empathize with him.

In the end, I think it boils down to Lenny being extreme Shamy shippers.   Leonard understands how much Amy cares for Sheldon and craves signs from Sheldon that he cares about her, too.   Penny gets Sheldon's feelings for Amy and his fears of disappointing her.   Lenny understands that both Sheldon and Amy are inexperienced.   I think Lenny's ultimate goal is to assist Shamy in working things out and making the LA permanent because they know they belong together.   Otherwise, it is awfully cruel to put two of their friends through this struggle, believing it will fail and lead to heartbreak in the end.     Getting Sheldon out of the apartment is just an added bonus they will continue to joke about.

I think Leonard got it right when he likened their situation to parents sending their kid off to college.   Sheldon and Amy are half-in and half-out, establishing some form of independence while at the same time still needing parental guidance to get them through the adaptation process.   Lenny are excited to see Sheldon go to have the house to themselves, but at the same time still want to cling on, knowing he has entered unfamiliar territory and will need help.

Like college kids, Shamy bring their dirty laundry over for Lenny to help them sort out before sending them on their way again out into their world of the unknown.    Sheldon will keep returning until he gets more comfortable with their situation, and then the visits will become less frequent.

Perhaps we will even see a "Fall Break" where Sheldon will have to come home for a short stint, but I'm hoping Shamy will forfeit taking the break and decide to take up permanent residence instead.

Edited by jenafan
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7 minutes ago, Kev0821 said:

Episode title! Please take this with a grain of salt, but per the Futon Critic, Nov. 3rd's episode is titled, "The Veracity Elasticity."


what a weird name.... I'm going to go google all the possibilities :)   thanks!

Ok... I googled: 

  1. conformity to facts; accuracy.
    "officials expressed doubts concerning the veracity of the story"
    synonyms: truthfulness, truth, accuracy, accurateness, correctness, exactness, precision,preciseness, realism, authenticity, faithfulness, fidelity; More
    • habitual truthfulness.
      "voters should be concerned about his veracity and character"

and elasticity... not conforming to facts all the time? HMMMMMM..... 

Edited by kelliluvtbbt
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28 minutes ago, jenafan said:

OMG!  Your single lines of sarcastic despondency crack me.   More so, because I get your side of things.  I really do.

The show IMO in the last couples episode has turned into Shamy living together overkill You mentioned something about Lenny giving advice on Living together. When have they showed them living together. A bed scene or two. We have not seen Lenny living together ever. Certainly not since being married. As to the Shenny and Lamy discussions. Sheldon bitched about Amy. Penny bitched about Leonard. Amy bitched about Sheldon. It would only be fair it seems to me if Leonard bitched about Penny. Why is that? Penny's not perfect. I think the Lamy storyline should of been more dominant than the Shenny since the Shenny pairing IMO has been beaten to death. As Leonard mentioned in the episode Amy has no experience living together like Sheldon. If anything Sheldon has more experience even with just living with Leonard. It just gets old when everyone just caters to Sheldon.

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To me when it comes to SP. Is not their scenes. But the saying "Milking a good thing". Comes to mind, once they realised the popularity of their scenes from casuals. They decided to milk it. To the point it's now over done, passé, over simplified, and forced. To the point they even force their scenes unnecessarily so. Like an example is 10x02. When Penny unloaded to Sheldon about Bernie. That to me felt forced and unnecessary. To me it would of fit better if she spoke to her husband about it. And while i had no problem with Sheldon confiding in Penny. It's not like he's gonna tell Amy that, he actually cares what she thinks. Another forced SP, unnecessary scene. It's tiresome. Time to move on Tptb. 

And while I get some are bummed about Penny's comments. It's just Penny lol. Why is it the other day we're talking about harmless snark. Yet it happens and it's suddenly a big issue? I saw it as Penny saying yeah I can relate. Leonard moaned too, they all did. I guess it's hard to understand why they all hang out, or like each other when their behaviour contradicts to the contrary. Guess I'm saying need better balance in the show. 

And while it's great, living arrangements moved forward. Lenny dance was great. I don't like all this focus on Sheldon. And his anxieties, and by an extension Shamy. So in depth, yet Lenny get kitchen island. Or Leonard going "do we even need to be here for this?". I feel you man. Great they are going to comic con for Penny's Serial Apist. But same time give them some solid material! They are married now, theirs tons of things they could do with them. Have them host a dinner party. And see them work as a team to host their guests. Opppsosed to bitching about each other to their friends. I'm a big Family Guy and American Dad fan. So it does not effect me lol, but still.

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Lenny haven't interceded in the past two episodes as relationship experts, or even experts on cohabiting with their partner. They have interceded as Sheldon experts. Which... I mean, don't Amy, Leonard and Penny already have PhDs in Cooperology, with extensive post-doctoral work? Yes, I admit that Penny and Leonard both have tenure in the department*, but this whole 'Leonard explains Sheldon to Amy by telling her stuff she likely can already guess and/or in several cases already knows' is a bit...oy vey.** I accept that Lenny know certain things about Sheldon that Amy doesn't, but equally Amy knows things about Sheldon that Lenny don't. Because they interact in different contexts and that is how, you know, knowledge works. Why the continual 'Lenny translate Sheldon to Amy' thing? Especially when they're so seldom telling her anything revelatory?

And - much more to the point - I am a little tired of the show's heavy loading on 'Sheldon is the problem everyone else has to negotiate'. Every single one of the PALS has issues. Every single one. It would be nice to showcase Leonard or Amy's weirdness, instead of miring poor Bialik and (much much more) Galecki in purely reactive modes. And it would make the show seem much less the saga of the Six Foot Tall Infant and His Exhausted Hostages.

Here's an example of some of the issues I mean. Leonard's been side-swiping about how impossible Sheldon is for some time now, and certainly that is almost entirely his schtick in the last two episodes. Look how tickled he looks at revealing that they've changed the locks. And, Galecki, I love your naughty-little-boy twinkle as much as the next girl, but lambkin? You had the option of moving aaaaaaannny time the last three seasons. For SURE after the Shamy reconciliation there was no need for you to be holding on to two separate apartments. especially not when at least one of you or your wife still has debt. Stop behaving as though you are in indentured servitude with no way out. Your way out is fifty feet across the frigging HALL. Lose the 'tude.

A much more interesting explanation for your reluctance to move is that YOU, personally, don't want to lose Sheldon from your life. We've seen your fits of jealousy with Amy over who gets to comfort Sheldon. We've seen the dreams where you give Sheldon innuendo and where you imagine him mauling your wife. We've seen how thrilled you are at the superior effectiveness of your sex-talk to Amy's, or your pouting over Amy getting a relaxation on the bathroom schedule using the simple expedient of REFUSING TO STAND FOR IT. As you yourself told her to do. An exotic option which, again, was probably available to you as well. The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks.

Less facetiously, the show has had an opportunity to show how LENNY would deal with their time alone. I, personally, would have welcomed a Lenny-heavy episode with this exploration, rather than the non-essential contrived drama we got with Shamy. But we haven't gotten one. Next episode seems to be another retread of 'How come Leonard got the hot girl?', and in any case seems to have little to do with Lenny cohabiting. As Jena points out, the show might decide that it's fine with having the PALS separate, now that it's figured out that Sheldon can burst in on Lenny with his dramas just as well from across the hall. (....which they already knew, didn't they?). So basically, Lenny and Shamy can separate without separating, and without dealing with Lenny's cohabitation issues. And Leonard (and to some extent Penny) can keep implying that Sheldon is the fount of all evil rather than acknowledging that he is an ambulant crutch.

*Geddit? Tenure? Because they live with him? Oh hush I like puns.

** At least last week's episode had Leonard telling Any about the flash photography thing which was later used to good comic effect. And -however tooth-grindingly infantile Leonard made Sheldon sound - at least some of the stuff he was telling her did directly have to do with sharing a living space with Sheldon. So there's THAT, I guess.

Edited by wowbagger
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That title makes me think it could have something to do with Raj, maybe we find out what happened with his relationships? It has been ages since he had his own storyline, he's well overdue.

Edited by Jonny
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3 minutes ago, Jonny said:

That title makes me think it could have something to do with Raj, maybe we find out what happened with his relationships? It's been ages since he had his own storyline, he's well overdue.

That would be nice. Raj s two girlfriends story needs closure and the character  deserves something for he looks for. 

Edited by spidergirl
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What was it that Raj said:

"It's by choice, well their choice but it's not ok". IIRC he also said he is back on the dating scene, though that could have been just a setup for the gag he then had with Stuart about both of them being lonely and in Howardette's hot tub so that little bit of dating he is doing clearly is not going that well.

I agree I wouldn't mind seeing some proper closure. I guess the most important question to ask is what if anything did Raj learn from it?

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42 minutes ago, FileXxX said:

No spoilers? Awesome, I like it. 

I, too, seek out Spoiler threads to express my glee that other people lack spoilers! I could avoid being spoilt personally by remaining in 'Spoiler Free' areas, but then I would find it difficult - nay, impossible - to rebuke other posters for having and expressing a reaction to information! And what is the point of feeling a certain way if you cannot implicitly police other people's feelings?


Seriously, though: nobody is obligated to feed us spoilers, although of course we're very grateful for the generosity of those who share. But...are we only meant to read spoilers, say 'thank you' and then have tense and silent debates about the information in the privacy of our own skulls? Or, better yet, forget what we heard? Instruct ourselves sternly not to let it make a difference to our opinions? Am I fundamentally misunderstanding the definition and use of the words 'spoiler', 'forum' and 'discussion'?

Edited by Tensor
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I agree with others that the lying will be a Raj storyline.  So, why didn't Raj tell Howardette he was single?   What really happened?  Did he suggest a threesome?  Did he get caught doing something he shouldn't have?   Did he call out Howard's name during sex? I wonder.   

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Have you tried to summarize an episode as if you were writing a taping report, and seen what you would include?  I think the TR in general try to be simply the facts, and leave out most of the opinions of the reporter.  And, you will always miss how the actors interpret the script.

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11 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

In fact, I can't think of a single episode where the finished product (or my opinion of it) was radically different from the impression I got in the TR. 

I can. Almost all the time.

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Personally, if I ever went to a taping I know that I'd be so awe-struck that I wouldn't be able to remember anything to report. It's true that there are overreactions and stuff but let's not confuse that with each person's different perceptions of the written word. 

Edited by Tensor
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