[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

[djsurrey]

4 hours ago, joyceraye said:

So THAT'S a minivan ? That great big estate car ? Now I get it. I couldn't imagine before why anybody would put a baby in a small vehicle with no windows at the side and that one hires for small removals. LOL. 

Kudos to the man who said Britain and America were two nations separated by a common language.

Yes, because a full sized passenger van in North America can hold 12 to 15 people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-size_van

When I was a teenager in the 70's passenger vans were used as shuttle busses by hotels and people movers by Hutterite communities. (at the time I was living in a small city surrounded by farmland in southern Alberta).

Minivans can typically hold 7 or 8 people.

It seemed to me the minivans in the 90s were smaller than those after 2000. This page seems to confirm the wheelbase got longer.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodge_Caravan

Perhaps that was due to competition from the emerging SUVs which seemed to get smaller. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport_utility_vehicle

Edited October 28, 2016 by djsurrey

[wowbagger]

I agree Penny's never had a realistic idea of her chances of success in a brutal profession. And she always spoke in terms of being a star, rather than what she loved about acting. 

But still. She's surrounded by people who love what they do, work hard at it, and are not only gifted but also lucky enough to be doing it at world-beating institutions - or, at the very least, as in Bernie's case, be paid well to undertake challenging and interesting work. If we know anything about graduate school, surely we know that the odds of those planets lining up? Are not fantastic. The competition for top-tier academic jobs is not as hideous as in the performing arts, perhaps, but it's not pretty.

And so yes, I fully accept that Penny's career woes are largely her own doing, but still - it is sad for Penny to be surrounded by people who are fulfilled in work and love, and to only have one of those things. And it would be fine if Penny just didn't give a shit about career satisfaction, but she clearly does. Let her find it! 

[3ku11]

 

The idea of Penny finding her career is a compelling one. But they waited too long to quit her as a waitress. They wore her down so much over the years. It seems her only passion seems to be Leonard. Your all right, every one around her is so succesful in their choosen fields. Even universally respected. No wonder she has a lack of self worth when it comes to her career and job prospects. Maybe it would give her more perspective, if she gets friends more like her. To give her life balance. That is why it would be great if they casted, some I don't know more like her Friends. That would be interesting. But in reality, like Rachel in Friends, they should of made her quit in Season 3. Then that gave them alot of time, to find her job. As it was she quit in Season 7, to focus on Acting. That was stupid. Acting was over for her in the Barbarian Sublimation, when they told her she was to much of a type. She was type casted then. She came to Pasadena, with no real calling card. At the time the advice from Sheldon and Leonard was conflicting, it turns out Leonard's advice in the long run was really coming from a place of love. And his advice really helped her in the long run. As were comparing Penny to Rachel atm lol, Rachel ended up finding a passion in Fashion. She quit at S3, found that around S7. It is Season 10, and I don't think the writers have any idea. That is unfortunate. 

Edited October 28, 2016 by 3ku11

[Nogravitasatall]

5 hours ago, nickelette424 said:

There are some people who would disagree.

But if Penny has forgiven Leonard, as she says she has, then why not let that one go? She is standing with her partner. She married him straight afterwards, then again, so effectively twice. She knows who he is and still wants and loves him - and has administered no retaliation - she hasn't inflicted any more suffering on Leonard than she normally would. I believe she has forgiven him and I think others could so choose too. In this regard I think she has shown a good deal of grace. And she is the injured party, so it is her call.

(Of course they could have written out Leonard on this basis, but "as if...". It is good for traffic, however)

 

 

 

Edited October 28, 2016 by Nogravitasatall

[Jonny]

I think the writers missed a trick here, the scenes at the comic con could have been very sweet and given Penny a nice ego boost but instead they went with cheap comedy and made Leonard the focus instead.

It was like Leonard was the self proclaimed 'King of Nerds' again and holding counsel teaching the young nerdlings about life and a kind of 'if I can do it so can you, so don't give up'. Blah, it's not the first time Leonard has bragged about landing Penny, the North Sea expedition he looked one smug git when he was showing all them on the boat the topless scenes from Serial Apeist. He's actually a pretty arrogant and smug guy at times so it should not surprise me.

Penny was never going to go back to acting but one last and final compliment from a kind of a past life (her acting career) could have provided a nice ego boost. It could have made her realize all those years struggling to get parts in a very 'dog eat dog' industry at least produced something worthwhile from it but instead they blew it.

Maybe I am being overly critical here but I didn't like those scenes at all. If I am please point it out.

The wore me down gags and snark didn't bother me neither did some of Leonard's snark as well, that's just the way they are as a couple, making sarcastic comments towards each other as they like it and it's a term of endearment. That was there when they first met, started courting and then eventually after some bumps along the way finally got married. Removing it would have been OOC.

Loved the brunch scenes and Sheldon going to all that effort, it was inevitable someone could get offended especially with booze involved but he and Sturt made up. The Howardette scenes, oh I love them and this storyline. Melissa and Simon are acting as great as anyone on the show right now and are clearly relishing and embracing their new storylines.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Jonny

[Chrismo]

3 hours ago, Jonny said:

I think the writers missed a trick here, the scenes at the comic con could have been very sweet and given Penny a nice ego boost but instead they went with cheap comedy and made Leonard the focus instead.

It was like Leonard was the self proclaimed 'King of Nerds' again and holding counsel teaching the young nerdlings about life and a kind of 'if I can do it so can you, so don't give up'. Blah, it's not the first time Leonard has bragged about landing Penny, the North Sea expedition he looked one smug git when he was showing all them on the boat the topless scenes from Serial Apeist. He's actually a pretty arrogant and smug guy at times so it should not surprise me.

Penny was never going to go back to acting but one last and final compliment from a kind of a past life (her acting career) could have provided a nice ego boost. It could have made her realize all those years struggling to get parts in a very 'dog eat dog' industry at least produced something worthwhile from it but instead they blew it.

Maybe I am being overly critical here but I didn't like those scenes at all. If I am please point it out.

The wore me down gags and snark didn't bother me neither did some of Leonard's snark as well, that's just the way they are as a couple, making sarcastic comments towards each other as they like it and it's a term of endearment. That was there when they first met, started courting and then eventually after some bumps along the way finally got married. Removing it would have been OOC.

 

I disagree. I think in a way the Lenny storyline wrapped up her acting. If she had gotten praise it would have put in her head that maybe she should try acting again one more time. In a way it would of made things worse. I understand now she doesn't like her job and maybe she should find something else to do but at this point I don't think acting is it. I want her be happy. She has always been my favorite character on the show.

 

 

 

Edited October 28, 2016 by Chrismo

[Jonny]

12 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

I disagree. I think in a way the Lenny storyline wrapped up your acting. If she had gotten praise it would have put in her head that maybe she should try acting again one more time. In a way it would of made things worse. I understand now she doesn't like her job and maybe she should find something else to do but at this point I don't think acting is it. I want her be happy. She has always been my favorite character on the show.

Sometimes you watch a tv show or movie and something irritates you but nobody else well that could be very much the case here and I accept that.

I don't think a return to acting was on the cards at all to be honest, I think Penny knows that with her acting career she didn't get out what she put in and that it not only caused her great stress and heartbreak at times but also to those close to her i.e. her partner and her friends.

I guess if this was the plan all along by the writers to highlight that going back acting wasn't an option then they certainly succeeded, I am not sure I would done it in the way they did. I think Penny could have got praise for a b movie cult classic and still realized that a return to acting was a waste of time and effort.

Like I said in my post earlier it could have been set up as a nice closing chapter on that part of her life, I guess we got that but without the niceness.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Jonny

[joyceraye]

8 hours ago, brilliantfool said:

100% agree with this!! (except for cheating, but that doesn't really matter )

I know it's a comedy, but if I stop for a moment and try to think of all of them in a more realistic way, I feel so bad for Penny, because I think she has the worst life of all 6 of them. The guys and Bernie and Amy have their dream jobs and a better social life that they could ever hope for. 

But Penny has a job she doesn't like, friends who she loves but DOESN'T have a lot in common with (both the guys AND the girls ), and just in general aside from her teaching Sheldon about the Kardashians and Leonard saying she watched The Bachelor a lot, I don't remember any mentions last season of the things SHE used to care about

I would be so much happier if Penny instead of just being friends with the gang had other friends as well, the ones she can relate to, watch sports with, go to bars, discuss celebrities etco

She probably doesn't want to do her old stuff any more. In Solder Excursion Howard pointed out to Leonard how Penny's interests had changed. She was amazed herself that she was in a lab, making something. Leonard said he was going to get her into  coin collecting next year. Her old friends have probably moved on just as she has. Where do all the 30-something weekend car-washers, Orange Wednesday cinema - goers, DIY enthusiasts and supermarket shoppers come from ? From the ranks of people who ten years ago were doing what 20 - somethings do, that's where.

Penny can still find an enthusiasm of her own if she wants to, and take Leonard along. She's good at dancing, has taste when it comes to furnishings, is better at handicrafts than she pretends to be and would be an asset to a pub quiz team when it came to plays and popular culture. She learned what she needed to know about pharmaceuticals, not a million miles away from chemistry. We know she was capable of study when it was a way out of the dole queue.

[joyceraye]

6 hours ago, djsurrey said:

Yes, because a full sized passenger van in North America can hold 12 to 15 people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full-size_van

When I was a teenager in the 70's passenger vans were used as shuttle busses by hotels and people movers by Hutterite communities. (at the time I was living in a small city surrounded by farmland in southern Alberta).

Minivans can typically hold 7 or 8 people.

It seemed to me the minivans in the 90s were smaller than those after 2000. This page seems to confirm the wheelbase got longer.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodge_Caravan

Perhaps that was due to competition from the emerging SUVs which seemed to get smaller. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport_utility_vehicle

Thanks, djsurrey. That's very interesting. American tourists must be very disappointed if they arrive in England or Wales having booked a 'van' in advance to drive around sightseeing in.

[JE7]

1 hour ago, Jonny said:

Sometimes you watch a tv show or movie and something irritates you but nobody else well that could be very much the case here and I accept that.

I don't think a return to acting was on the cards at all to be honest, I think Penny knows that with her acting career she didn't get out what she put in and that it not only caused her great stress and heartbreak at times but also to those close to her i.e. her partner and her friends.

I guess if this was the plan all along by the writers to highlight that going back acting wasn't an option then they certainly succeeded, I am not sure I would done it in the way they did. I think Penny could have got praise for a b movie cult classic and still realized that a return to acting was a waste of time and effort.

Like I said in my post earlier it could have been set up as a nice closing chapter on that part of her life, I guess we got that but without the niceness.

I think It did purposely put the last nail in the coffin of Penny's acting I think and I for one am glad to see it, although I don't think some will ever let it go for nostalgia if nothing else.

Also like you I think it could have been, and would have liked to see it with a less embarrassed penny getting some ego boost out of it maybe just the fans not being jerk would have helped. But they would have had to put some thought and screen time into that and Lenny always gets the cheap, quick and easy plots so far this season.....  still it's a much improved Lenny compared to seasons 8/9

To quote penny "so, dreams do come true"

 

[nickelette424]

6 hours ago, Nogravitasatall said:

But if Penny has forgiven Leonard, as she says she has, then why not let that one go? She is standing with her partner. She married him straight afterwards, then again, so effectively twice. She knows who he is and still wants and loves him - and has administered no retaliation - she hasn't inflicted any more suffering on Leonard than she normally would. I believe she has forgiven him and I think others could so choose too. In this regard I think she has shown a good deal of grace. And she is the injured party, so it is her call.

(Of course they could have written out Leonard on this basis, but "as if...". It is good for traffic, however)

 

 

 

And that's all well and good, but correct me if I'm wrong,  but she considered it a form of cheating did she not?  I didn't make a statement on whether or not she forgave him out of she should or shouldn't.  I responded to the comment that the kiss  wasn't cheating.  Her forgiveness doesn't mean she didn't feel like he cheated or it wasn't a big deal.  It just means that she was able to move on from it. 

[Swedish Chef]

7 hours ago, 3ku11 said:

 

The idea of Penny finding her career is a compelling one. But they waited too long to quit her as a waitress. They wore her down so much over the years. It seems her only passion seems to be Leonard. Your all right, every one around her is so succesful in their choosen fields. Even universally respected. No wonder she has a lack of self worth when it comes to her career and job prospects. Maybe it would give her more perspective, if she gets friends more like her. To give her life balance. That is why it would be great if they casted, some I don't know more like her Friends. That would be interesting. But in reality, like Rachel in Friends, they should of made her quit in Season 3. Then that gave them alot of time, to find her job. As it was she quit in Season 7, to focus on Acting. That was stupid. Acting was over for her in the Barbarian Sublimation, when they told her she was to much of a type. She was type casted then. She came to Pasadena, with no real calling card. At the time the advice from Sheldon and Leonard was conflicting, it turns out Leonard's advice in the long run was really coming from a place of love. And his advice really helped her in the long run. As were comparing Penny to Rachel atm lol, Rachel ended up finding a passion in Fashion. She quit at S3, found that around S7. It is Season 10, and I don't think the writers have any idea. That is unfortunate. 

To be honest, I don't think the writers care anymore about Penny's work. 

[veejay]

58 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

To be honest, I don't think the writers care anymore about Penny's work. 

[Swedish Chef]

One thing I have noticed on the show, Howard and Raj doesn't spend time with Leonard and Sheldon after work anymore.

This split with Lenny and Shamy on one side and Howardette and Raj on the other side is starting to get a little bit boring. 

[veejay]

17 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

One thing I have noticed on the show, Howard and Raj doesn't spend time with Leonard and Sheldon after work anymore.

This split with Lenny and Shamy on one side and Howardette and Raj on the other side is starting to get a little bit boring. 

Agreed. I liked the new episode and found it funny but I’m tired of the baby stories week after week. I am definitely ready for the gang to get together though. They've been apart too long and the episodes do feel really fragmented.

[April]

1 minute ago, veejay said:

Agreed. I liked the new episode and found it funny but I’m tired of the baby stories week after week. I am definitely ready for the gang to get together though. They've been apart too long and the episodes do feel really fragmented.

Next week we get FWF feat. Footprints on the Moon, and the guys at Caltech cafeteria and the comic book store.

[Swedish Chef]

2 minutes ago, veejay said:

Agreed. I liked the new episode and found it funny but I’m tired of the baby stories week after week. I am definitely ready for the gang to get together though. They've been apart too long and the episodes do feel really fragmented.

I get it that Bernadette now when she is pregnant could have trouble with the stairs up to Lenny's and Shamy's apartments, but what's the problem for Lenny or/and Shamy to go to Howardette's house.

Have they all of a sudden forgotten where they live ?

[veejay]

23 minutes ago, April said:

Next week we get FWF feat. Footprints on the Moon, and the guys at Caltech cafeteria and the comic book store.

 

18 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

I get it that Bernadette now when she is pregnant could have trouble with the stairs up to Lenny's and Shamy's apartments, but what's the problem for Lenny or/and Shamy to go to Howardette's house.

Have they all of a sudden forgotten where they live ?

…and also a new Sheldon comes to life.

LOL

[2L344]

I enjoyed 10.6! Lots to be happy about and you don't need to be a Shamy shipper to appreciate the episode! My thoughts:

- It would've been a cool opportunity to work in a Wil Wheaton appearance at the comic con. He was in Serial Apeist 2 after all, and conventions are probably in his wheelhouse. I'm sure the writers could've wiggled in a brief appearance without taking away from the Lenny plot. Missed opportunity!

- I enjoyed the focus switching to Leonard and how he secured Penny as his wife. Yeah this theme has been repeated before but I can forgive this rehash- they are after all at a comic convention full of nerds (using Leonard's words) and it makes sense. The attendees could've been nicer to Penny though. I would've liked Penny to have enjoyed some fandom admiration for a campy movie and her role in it, rather than being obsessed with her shower scene. Oh well...

- I liked that Penny went into the event level headed, even saying to Leonard that it would be a miracle if one person asked for an autograph. She had low expectations (unlike Leonard) and her negative experience there wasn't a disappointment to her. Made it easier for her to kick back and watch the Leonard show, and she even let him stretch the truth about turning her proposal down to make her want him more while reminding him that snark would cost him later. I loved Penny in that scene.

- Leonard's fascination with the change maker lol! And his disappointment in not being able to use it for the fella who said "keep the change"! Reminded me of a time as a kid when my mom had one for a garage sale and we thought it was the best gadget ever!

- Howardette's bed scene lol. Seems Howard continues to have his freak out moments. I like how Bernie is the level headed one. Her kick to Howard after warning him she would be the next person to kick him--she's gonna make a good mom, stern and consistent! " I warned you, and I did it"...bahahaha!

- I absolutely enjoyed the minivan sales pitch by Howard and totally reminded me of my own attempt to sell my wife on a Honda Odyssey when our second child was born! Everything about that plot was real, from the way he pitched the features (auto sliding door, foot activated rear door, roominess, and AWARD WINNING! model) to the skepticism Bernie had. My own wife had the same Bernie outlook, even stating it was such a "soccer mom" kind of purchase. Loved it! And yes, like Howard, I got my van....

- Ah, the return of the Howard/Raj coupling jokes lol. The exchange at the van's rear door was funny though..

- Loved all the Shamy moments. I like how Sheldon, when Stuart is direct about his feelings concerning being a third wheel is addressed, steps up with a genuine apology and lays it out there about how wrong he was. Sheldon still struggles with human interaction and nuance, and I like how he tries to initially hand off the awkward discussion between him and Stuart to Amy--but when you're direct, he gets it. Amy should learn from this, since she apparently falls back on lying to him in the next episode. Domesticated Shamy is cute and very welcome!

- Stuart finally has enough of being the gang's punching bag and stands up for himself! While I hate to say I laughed every time he was used in that role, part of me was always a bit sad for the guy and disappointed that a group of guys who lament being picked upon themselves found humor in torturing Stuart. Glad Sheldon stepped up. Stuart's a good guy and deserves better.

All in all I think this was a solid episode with something for everyone (Unless you're a huge Raj fan).

 

Edited October 28, 2016 by 2L344

[Jonny]

48 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

One thing I have noticed on the show, Howard and Raj doesn't spend time with Leonard and Sheldon after work anymore.

This split with Lenny and Shamy on one side and Howardette and Raj on the other side is starting to get a little bit boring. 

I think we need a group episode badly, might not happen until after the birth though. We could still have Shamy or Lenny going to check on Bernadette or Howardette and actually see it, I assume they probably do but it's just off screen.

[Radar]

18 minutes ago, April said:

Next week we get FWF feat. Footprints on the Moon, and the guys at Caltech cafeteria and the comic book store.

Agree, looking forward to next week! 

All in all I really loved yesterday's episode, although I enjoyed the Lenny Serial Apeist convention plot less than I thought I would. That one comment from the guy asking Penny if she was acting to be a bad actress or if she was really that bad...it bothered me! I wanted to scream at the guy: "Hey, you should have seen her on stage in that little theater - she IS good! Okay, maybe she is not Meryl Streep, but so what, she is our Penny and I don't want you to insult her!" 

[April]

10 minutes ago, veejay said:

 

…and also a new Sheldon comes to life.

LOL

[Chrismo]

FWF. They need to end that. I rather see baby stories than that.

[veejay]

7 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

FWF. They need to end that. I rather see baby stories than that.

8 minutes ago, April said:

...oh, please...

Edited October 28, 2016 by veejay
I hate merged content.

[April]

14 minutes ago, veejay said:

...oh, please...

Words would be helpful you know...