[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

[Jonny]

I've watched it a few times since it actually aired and each time i do i find the whole season opener more and more underwhelming/borderline boring truth be told.

A lot of guest star power used up in a storyline that never really sucked me in. It felt like they had an opportunity to get some big stars in and that was all that mattered and not the actual storyline in this one. Not the first time and it won't be the last.

If I remember at the time my concern was the damage a potential hook-up might have caused in terms of friendships on the show during the hiatus and not actual real interest in whether Alfred and Mary hooked up or not.

For a season opener I thought it was very meh. But that's just my opinion.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Jonny

[wowbagger]

44 minutes ago, Jonny said:

I've watched it a few times since it actually aired and each time i do i find the whole season opener more and more underwhelming/borderline boring truth be told.

A lot of guest star power used up in a storyline that never really sucked me in. It felt like they had an opportunity to get some big stars in and that was all that mattered and not the actual storyline in this one. Not the first time and it won't be the last.

If I remember at the time my concern was the damage a potential hook-up might have caused in terms of friendships on the show during the hiatus and not actual real interest in whether Alfred and Mary hooked up or not.

For a season opener I thought it was very meh. But that's just my opinion.

Yeah, it was pretty mystifying who the audience was meant to be for that whole caper. How does one recurring character feel about another recurring character hooking up with another character introduced for the first time this episode? Tune in next season to find out! What effect will the possible liaison between their parents have on two characters who live together and already refer to each other as brothers? Tune in next season to find out!

I mean, I might even have somewhat forgiven the show if it were going with the story of the Thawing of Ice Princess Beverley Hofstadter (only somewhat, though). But - um - not so much, eh? 

I mean, honestly, is there a viewer - regular or casual - who is so invested in the sexual shenanigans of the extended families of the show's main characters? Or is there a thriving community of Judd Hirsch/Laurie Metcalfe 'shippers out there? There may be, for all I know. And I guess they got their itches kinda sorta not-really scratched?

Edited March 19, 2017 by wowbagger
Corrected spelling

[April]

9 minutes ago, Jonny said:

I've watched it a few times since it actually aired and each time i do i find the whole season opener more and more underwhelming/borderline boring truth be told.

A lot of guest star power used up in a storyline that never really sucked me in. It felt like they had an opportunity to get some big stars in and that was all that mattered and not the actual storyline in this one. Not the first time and it won't be the last.

If I remember at the time my concern was the damage a potential hook-up might have caused in terms of friendships on the show during the hiatus and not actual real interest in whether Alfred and Mary hooked up or not.

For a season opener I thought it was very meh. But that's just my opinion.

What bugs me about all of this is also that nothing really came out of it in terms of storylines. The May/Alfred thing hasn't been mentioned again, and neither did we see Penny's family (save for one mention of Randall), nor does there seem to be much of an improvement in Leonard's relationship with Beverly. So all in all it really seems just wedged into the S9 finale/S10 opener because they could get some guest stars but not because they actually had something interesting to do with this plot.

[Stephen Hawking]

48 minutes ago, Tensor said:

To which Raj refuted the metaphors were clumsy(screw you those were beautiful penis metaphors) but never refuted Leonard's contention he knew she was leaving.

Once dragged off topic, the previous discussion is often forgotten about, especially if the new discussion is controversial or heated.

48 minutes ago, Tensor said:

But that night, she didn't know, all she knew would have known was that Priya was leaving.

Is it really Raj's business, what is happening between his sister and her boyfriend?

We saw how Priya reacted, when Raj tried to tell their parents about her and Leonard.

I doubt he'd want another leg full of nails, or another broken toe.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Stephen Hawking

[Tensor]

Just now, Stephen Hawking said:

Once dragged off topic, the previous discussion is often forgotten about, especially if the new discussion is controversial or heated.

Or, it is remembered and getting dragged off topic offers an opportunity to not have to answer an embarrassing questioned. Especially as right after that, Leonard said something about bagging it, because he wasn't in the mood, bringing the topic back. 

[Stephen Hawking]

46 minutes ago, Tensor said:

And even Leonard, that night, thought he and Priya were breaking up, because she was leaving

Presumably they'd have sorted out how they were going to continue (ie. the long distance relationship), before the night was out.

[Jonny]

I also found the Christopher Lloyd guest appearance a little bit underwhelming, though that one probably had more relevance to the context of the storyline and some actual outcome from it pointing out that Shelnard were fighting because they love each other in a bromance kind of way and the transition from living together after all these years isn't/wasn't easy for them.

Tricky balance for the powers that be I guess, you can have a big name/s on the show but you also need the right storyline to go with it. But then you have added factors like this guest star is perhaps only available for that short window due to other projects so you sometimes have to come up with something quick etc.

[mirs1]

30 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

Yeah, it was pretty mystifying who the audience was meant to be for that whole caper. How does one recurring character feels about another recurring character hooking up with another character introduced for the first time this episode? Tune in next season to find out! What effect will the possible liaison between their parents have on two characters who live together and already refer to each other as brothers? Tune in next season to find out!

I mean, I might even have somewhat forgiven the show if it were going with the story of the Thawing of Ice Princess Beverley Hofstadter (only somewhat, though). But - um - not so much, eh? 

I mean, honestly, is there a viewer - regular or casual - who is so invested in the sexual shenanigans of the extended families of the show's main characters? Or is there a thriving community of Judd Hirsch/Laurie Metcalfe 'shippers out there? There may be, for all I know. And I guess they got their itches kinda sorta not-really scratched?

Yeah, probably if the plot had been more focused on Beverly's feelings towards Alfred and how his dalliance with Mary bothered her, and no just out of spite, the whole thing could have been more interesting. But as it is, there was no twist whatsoever in the story and everything turned out very unemotional. There wasn't even that much "heart" in Mary and Alfred deciding to deepen their acquaintance, all of it really looked like as an excuse to have a bunch of guest stars in the show.

Edited March 19, 2017 by mirs1

[Stephen Hawking]

19 minutes ago, April said:

The May/Alfred thing hasn't been mentioned again

Doesn't Mary Cooper already have a romantic partner?

[Tensor]

15 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Presumably they'd have sorted out how they were going to continue (ie. the long distance relationship), before the night was out.

  Based on what?  His comment to his mother being about  Priya moving back to India, and his feeling confused and alone seems to indicate they didn't talk about it that night. 

 

[wowbagger]

1 minute ago, mirs1 said:

Yeah, probably if the plot would have been more focused on Beverly's feelings towards Alfred and how his dalliance with Mary bothered her, and no just out of spite, the whole thing could have been more interesting. But as it is, there was no twist whatsoever in the story and everything turned out very unemotional. There wasn't even that much "heart" in Mary and Alfred deciding to deepen their acquaintance, all of it really looked like as an excuse to have a bunch of guest stars in the show.

I think for the story to have any sort of bite, we'd have had to see Beverley and Alfred interact, and we would have had to have a clear and sustained idea of Beverley nursing hurt beneath her clinical indifference. And even then, honestly why would we care all that much? I yield to no woman in my love of Christine Baranski, but in the context of the show I'm basically interested in what is going on with Beverley and Alfred only insofar as it affects Leonard (and by extension Penny). It's even harder to care when I have literally only met Alfred for the first time in the S9 finale, and the show hasn't done anything with Beverley and Alfred's interactions to suggest anything other than irritation - not in a passion-charged 'I hate you' way, but in an exhausted 'Oh here we fucking go' way. 

And, as you say, they didn't even do anything with the Mary/Alfred thing. The whole thing was a storm in a teacup. A cup with cold tea. That nobody actually ordered and nobody wanted to drink. 

[Tensor]

18 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Is it really Raj's business, what is happening between his sister and her boyfriend?

We saw how Priya reacted, when Raj tried to tell their parents about her and Leonard.

I doubt he'd want another leg full of nails, or another broken toe.

Which has nothing to do with the original question of "... what interest is it of Penny's.". If you want to change the discussion to "What interest is it of Raj's, let me know. 

[BigBang15]

Although Raj sort of rejects Indian tradition, he is still Priya's brother and is tasked by his parents to look after her in the US. ANYTHING Priya does is his business. AND if you go back, the fact that Leonard, who promised at some point in the past that he (and Howard) considered Priya off-limits, was in fact banging his sister, in his own house, Raj may have been a little pissed off at Leonard consciously or subconsciously.

[April]

13 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

I think for the story to have any sort of bite, we'd have had to see Beverley and Alfred interact, and we would have had to have a clear and sustained idea of Beverley nursing hurt beneath her clinical indifference. And even then, honestly why would we care all that much? I yield to no woman in my love of Christine Baranski, but in the context of the show I'm basically interested in what is going on with Beverley and Alfred only insofar as it affects Leonard (and by extension Penny). It's even harder to care when I have literally only met Alfred for the first time in the S9 finale, and the show hasn't done anything with Beverley and Alfred's interactions to suggest anything other than irritation - not in a passion-charged 'I hate you' way, but in an exhausted 'Oh here we fucking go' way. 

Indeed. I thought getting a glimpse behind Beverly's usual ice queen composure was one of the more interesting things of this 3-episode story and her interaction with Alfred could have led to something interesting for Lenny with them reflecting on their marriage and how they want to go forward with that. And it could end up being thematically relevant for the LA change or even the issues they seem to have now. But nothing of the like happened.

13 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

And, as you say, they didn't even do anything with the Mary/Alfred thing. The whole thing was a storm in a teacup. A cup with cold tea. That nobody actually ordered and nobody wanted to drink. 

Seriously, we could have at least gotten an update when Shamy visited Mary on Christmas. A little "How's Alfred doing?" smalltalk would have gone a long way to not make this thing feel like a complete waste of time.

[Stephen Hawking]

22 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Which has nothing to do with the original question of "... what interest is it of Penny's.". If you want to change the discussion to "What interest is it of Raj's, let me know. 

It's all interrelated.

Even if he knew (which hasn't been established), should Raj have told Penny (or even Leonard), that his sister was going back to India?

I don't believe he should.

What happens between two people, in a relationship, is their business, and it would be wrong for a sibling to poke their nose into it.

I know I'd be very angry, if one of my siblings stuck their nose into my romantic relationships.

[Tensor]

 

7 minutes ago, BigBang15 said:

Although Raj sort of rejects Indian tradition, he is still Priya's brother and is tasked by his parents to look after her in the US. ANYTHING Priya does is his business. AND if you go back, the fact that Leonard, who promised at some point in the past that he (and Howard) considered Priya off-limits, was in fact banging his sister, in his own house, Raj may have been a little pissed off at Leonard consciously or subconsciously.

Then why didn't he tell his parents?  Raj could have ended the entire Priya-Leonard thing with onc phone call.  He didn't, which indicates a tacit approval of their relationship. 

 

 

[joyceraye]

40 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Doesn't Mary Cooper already have a romantic partner?

A chap from her Bible Study group, she said. Going on her belief that once a couple 'lie together they are married in the eyes of The Lord' I'd have thought she'd have had a nice wedding for Shamy to go to by now. I was ready to write a mini fanfic with the tiara as 'something borrowed' and a conversation with Meemaw.

[Tensor]

4 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

It's all interrelated.

No it's not. Why Penny would be interested is a seperate issue from whether Raj should tell her.   

4 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Even if he knew (which hasn't been established), should Raj have told Penny (or even Leonard), that his sister was going back to India?

it also hasn't been established he didn't know.  Why shouldn't he?

4 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

I don't believe he should.

What happens between two people, in a relationship, is their business, and it would be wrong for a sibling to poke their nose into it.

So, if Raj had evidence Priya was cheating on Leonard 

 or Leonard was Cheating on Priya, he shouldn't say anything?

4 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

I know I'd be very angry, if one of my siblings stuck their nose into my romantic relationships.

Depends on the issue. 

[Stephen Hawking]

14 minutes ago, BigBang15 said:

ANYTHING Priya does is his business.

Not according to Priya:-

Raj: Oh, my God, I think you broke my toe!

Priya: Well you should have kept your mouth shut.

Indian tradition (or their parent's wishes) on not, Priya clearly does appreciate Raj interfering in her private life.

What she gets up to as an adult (provided it's not illegal), is really nobody else's business.

[Capt. Hilts]

8 minutes ago, joyceraye said:

A chap from her Bible Study group, she said. Going on her belief that once a couple 'lie together they are married in the eyes of The Lord' I'd have thought she'd have had a nice wedding for Shamy to go to by now. I was ready to write a mini fanfic with the tiara as 'something borrowed' and a conversation with Meemaw.

At this point, I don't think being married makes Sheldon a flight risk, but, I think, putting him through a traditional wedding sure does.  One aspect of his character that falls within the range of 'normal'.  

[Jonny]

8 minutes ago, Tensor said:

 

Then why didn't he tell his parents?  Raj could have ended the entire Priya-Leonard thing with onc phone call.  He didn't, which indicates a tacit approval of their relationship. 

 

 

Perhaps he didn't think it was going to last long term? (he knows his sister, maybe she had a number of short-term relationships and thought this would be another). He cares for his sister, perhaps it would have destroyed his relationship with her if he did? Maybe telling his parents would have created more trouble for him, parents could have had a go at him for letting something like this happen etc.

Raj clearly wasn't happy about their relationship, well I never thought he accepted it for a moment. I don't know specifically why but it's a common thing a lot of guys don't like their friends dating their sisters. Something just feels wrong about it in a lot of people's minds.

[Stephen Hawking]

1 minute ago, Tensor said:

So, if Raj had evidence Priya was cheating on Leonard, or Leonard was Cheating on Priya, he shouldn't say anything?

I'd say no.

If he wanted to do anything, he should've confronted the person doing the cheating, and told them they should either stop cheating, or break up with the person they're cheating on.

Being the bringer of that kind of bad news (even if the person receiving it believes you - love is blind and all that), is often not appreciated, by the receiver of said news.

[veejay]

7 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Not according to Priya:-

Raj: Oh, my God, I think you broke my toe!

Priya: Well you should have kept your mouth shut.

Indian tradition (or their parent's wishes) on not, Priya clearly does appreciate Raj interfering in her private life.

What she gets up to as an adult (provided it's not illegal), is really nobody else's business.

To quote Raj: Some of it makes sense, some of it's crazy.
S4 - The Cohabitation Formulation

[Stephen Hawking]

8 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Depends on the issue. 

Not to me it doesn't.

Neither my siblings, nor my parents, have ever interfered in any of my relationships, and I wouldn't have appreciated it, if they had.

[Tensor]

Just now, Stephen Hawking said:

I'd say no.

If he wanted to do anything, he should've confronted the person doing the cheating, and told them they should either stop cheating, or break up with the person they're cheating on.

Being the bringer of that kind of bad news (even if the person receiving it believes you - love is blind and all that), is often not appreciated, by the receiver of said news.

See I guess that's where we differ.  If a person keeps information from me, that majorly would affect my life, I would be majorly pissed. 

1 minute ago, Stephen Hawking said:

Not to me it doesn't.

Neither my siblings, nor my parents, have ever interfered in any of my relationships, and I wouldn't have appreciated it, if they had.

As I said, depending on the issue, I would consider it an act of betrayal.