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[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10


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16 hours ago, bfm said:

IMO he meets the criteria (the only thing that doesn't fit so much is repetitive motor behaviors and that is not mandatory since he fits 3 if the 4 subsection in criteria B). Interpretation is important, while I am not (yet) certified to diagnose ASD I do have an understanding of some of the symptoms described (e.g., Restricted interests) that goes beyond the description, which makes me find it hard to believe that if he wouldn't have ASD if he were real. 

BTW I think we are suppose to believe that he did show symptoms since he was very young (e.g., calling his mom Mrs. Cooper, documenting aspects of his waste, dropping play time to do science and also his unsual play and interest in trains that I think Mary said was present when he was 3).

I can't answer if Sheldon is Autistic. But for this, I'm assuming he's not. He, even as a child was very smart and because of that was distanced from other kids his age (actually antagonistic kids). He did grow up sheltered from others his age, so he probably did NOT learn a lot of social cues and rules. So he focused on education. When he got older, he was "set in his ways" and it was the norm for him to be right all the time.

Growing up, in contrast to "restricted interests", Sheldon knows a LOT about A LOT of different subject, albeit, most of the subjects are what interest him. But it is diverse. Besides String Particle Physics, which some people devote their whole undivided lifetimes to, he knows about comic books, movies, bowling, engineering, ... the list goes on. If your subject doesn't interest him, he will either change the subject or move on to someone else. This could be just more extremely  self-centered than Autistic. If something new comes along and it interests him (or he feels he needs to know), he will learn it.

4 minutes ago, legacy99 said:


That kind of tells me what he thinks of his friends. It really doesn't make him sound like much of a friend either

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I believe when they were robbed as for Leonard, "it (was) still too early to discount the possibilty of this being an inside job"

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37 minutes ago, BigBang15 said:

I can't answer if Sheldon is Autistic. But for this, I'm assuming he's not. He, even as a child was very smart and because of that was distanced from other kids his age (actually antagonistic kids). He did grow up sheltered from others his age, so he probably did NOT learn a lot of social cues and rules. So he focused on education. When he got older, he was "set in his ways" and it was the norm for him to be right all the time.

Growing up, in contrast to "restricted interests", Sheldon knows a LOT about A LOT of different subject, albeit, most of the subjects are what interest him. But it is diverse. Besides String Particle Physics, which some people devote their whole undivided lifetimes to, he knows about comic books, movies, bowling, engineering, ... the list goes on. If your subject doesn't interest him, he will either change the subject or move on to someone else. This could be just more extremely  self-centered than Autistic. If something new comes along and it interests him (or he feels he needs to know), he will learn it.

I believe when they were robbed as for Leonard, "it (was) still too early to discount the possibilty of this being an inside job"

Being a genius doesn't necessarily make you distanced from everybody else except your close family. And even if his childhood was different than most kids' he could have learned a lot of the things he is struggling with in other contexts and periods of his development. You can see that he usually behaves like he is better than most people and like the things he struggles with are unimportant but at times he admits he has difficulties and would like to overcome them (e.g., "The Intimacy Accelaration", "The Emotion Detection Automation").

In the last 3 pages I wrote a lot about the symptoms Sheldon shows, especially "restricted interests" which is a vague term that many misinterpret. It doesn't mean he cannot be interested in more than 3 things. It is more about the intensity of the preoccupation and it's impact. People with ASD also differ in the prominence of their symptoms and their manifestations. Some (not Sheldon, though) may not have this symptom because it is not mandatory for the diagnosis (you only need 2 subsections in criteria B . My sister barely has those and yet she has ASD.

 

BTW, My reaserch guide (not sure what is the english term) is a licensed clinical psychology who is certified and experienced in diagnosing ASD and he thinks Sheldon certainly has it...

Edited by bfm
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15 minutes ago, bfm said:

You guys we are almost at page 500! Wonder who will be the lucky poster to get us there :)

Maybe the generous lucky who might go to the tonight's taping as share the report with us? It would be a great way of celebrating , wouldn't be? And we would show how grateful we were :)

Edited by spidergirl
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1 hour ago, BigBang15 said:

 

I believe when they were robbed as for Leonard, "it (was) still too early to discount the possibilty of this being an inside job"

Considering they found the break in together. Also where would Leonard take his stuff. In the end he got his when he had his stuff stolen in Bozeman.

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23 hours ago, Lagernisse said:

Also I highly doubt that it is legal to tape people in their home without their consent 

Here in the UK, you can legally tape people on/in your property, without their consent.

22 hours ago, Tonstar17 said:

Until tptb diagnose his disorder

They've admitted he has OCD.

22 hours ago, Cloud Strife said:

Considering Sheldon's past and his general disinterest in anything sexual

Plus, the book giving him nightmares. :) 

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22 hours ago, Cloud Strife said:

Yeah, Sheldon is also a burglar because he cleaned Penny's apartment. He's Pasadena's most wanted criminal.

I doubt cleaning up qualifies as burglary.

He's possibly guilty of illegal entry (although that is also questionable, since Penny didn't specify the circumstances when he could enter her apartment, and, as Priya pointed out, the legal principle is ambiguity in a contract benefits the party that did not draft it), but not burglary.

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14 minutes ago, Tonstar17 said:

Taping night. I'm ready!!
Chicken wings ✅
Cocktail sausages ✅
Big bag of crisps ✅
Sweets ✅
Pepsi ✅
Various alcoholic drinks ✅✅
Netflix  ✅
BRING IT ON

o_00160.gif.e217b181e4ad7040ef832239dce102c9.gif

Possibly, probably.  :shy:

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15 hours ago, Tensor said:

Deleted. I wanted to answer someone else. Is the quote function stupid or is it me ?

Thank you, bfm, for the explanations and the updates. Your posts co-incided with some reading I'd been doing after I posted. I can hardly believe how quickly the thinking on this subject changes, and how the balance of psychologists' opinion has swung even in the last two years. I'm one of the people who listen to this stuff, not speak on it, and it seems to go out of date in months.  It stands to reason that someone with a personality disorder is more likely to encounter situations that can led to mental illness such as depression or anxiety, not to mention how their view of the world affects them, so I'm glad you say that vulnerability is recognised now. The classification is changing all the time. It's not long ago that people with personality disorders couldn't even get into hospital because they were deemed untreatable and it wasn't seen as a health issue in itself.

As for autism,I was trained as a teacher before it was accepted and taught that there even was a spectrum. Most members of the public had never even heard the word. They thought we were saying 'artistic'. Ours was the only college where it was included in the basic training.  Autism in those days used to be recognised only in children who in most ways were totally unaware of the world around them. It was in the late nineteen-sixties that I began to wonder whether a teenager who worked with my mother could be autistic although she could talk and write, and had got herself a job, however badly she did it. It struck me that there might be degrees of autism beyond the extent that was generally believed at the time.  In 1972 I had a ten-year-old in my class who, were he not so highly academically able, I again would have thought might be autistic. His parents and I between us couldn't get a psychologist to find anything wrong and there was no psychiatrist he could go to. Research of this aspect of the condition had yet then to be published. We didn't even hear of Dr Asperger and his work for at least another ten years. When we first heard of Asperger's Syndrome it was regarded as a manifestation of autism. They classify Asperger's as something else now, I gather.  The idea of there being a spectrum was the basis of the doctoral research of the headmaster I told you about. The terminology has changed a lot : from what you say, being on the spectrum means something else now and they'd put it another way. It's marvellous how this field of study has opened up. You must be fascinated. 

 In so many ways that boy from 1972 was so like Sheldon it's as if he crossed the Atlantic and joined the TBBT writing team to invent the character.  He'll be 55 now. Is your grandad much older ?

Fast forward a few decades to when they knew more than anecdotally that autism is found at all levels of intelligence :

Some years ago I read an article  in The Spectator that suggested increases in diagnoses of autism among children, noted especially in the USA where numbers were exploding, were due to more than improved capability of diagnosis and of parental awareness. The article suggested that with more women entering scientific fields ( where a lot of the new patients are coming from ) for a living, more male scientists can find like-minded wives and so the gene pool for autism has been strengthened. More recessive genes meeting each other, perhaps. When Shamy became more than just good friends, I was reminded of the article and I'm intrigued to see what their offspring will be like. I hope the next two seasons will show us.

 

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I doubt cleaning up qualifies as burglary.
He's possibly guilty of illegal entry (although that is also questionable, since Penny didn't specify the circumstances when he could enter her apartment, and, as Priya pointed out, the legal principle is ambiguity in a contract benefits the party that did not draft it), but not burglary.

I don't know why your trying to justify what sheldon did but penny gave the key to leonard not leonard and sheldon. She didnt give either of them the ok to go in and out as they pleased. What he did may not be illegal but it was sure morally wrong

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I don't know why your trying to justify what sheldon did but penny gave the key to leonard not leonard and sheldon. She didnt give either of them the ok to go in and out as they pleased. What he did may not be illegal but it was sure morally wrong

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It is illegal. Breaking and entry. Like you said, the keys were given to leonard not sheldon, he took the keys without leonard or penny consent.
Breaking and entering a residence or someone's property through the slightest amount of force or using the person keys without authorization can be seen as a crime. It can also end up with been charged with burglary, even if that wasn't the intent.

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47 minutes ago, joyceraye said:

Thank you, bfm, for the explanations and the updates. Your posts co-incided with some reading I'd been doing after I posted. I can hardly believe how quickly the thinking on this subject changes, and how the balance of psychologists' opinion has swung even in the last two years. I'm one of the people who listen to this stuff, not speak on it, and it seems to go out of date in months.  It stands to reason that someone with a personality disorder is more likely to encounter situations that can led to mental illness such as depression or anxiety, not to mention how their view of the world affects them, so I'm glad you say that vulnerability is recognised now. The classification is changing all the time. It's not long ago that people with personality disorders couldn't even get into hospital because they were deemed untreatable and it wasn't seen as a health issue in itself.

As for autism,I was trained as a teacher before it was accepted and taught that there even was a spectrum. Most members of the public had never even heard the word. They thought we were saying 'artistic'. Ours was the only college where it was included in the basic training.  Autism in those days used to be recognised only in children who in most ways were totally unaware of the world around them. It was in the late nineteen-sixties that I began to wonder whether a teenager who worked with my mother could be autistic although she could talk and write, and had got herself a job, however badly she did it. It struck me that there might be degrees of autism beyond the extent that was generally believed at the time.  In 1972 I had a ten-year-old in my class who, were he not so highly academically able, I again would have thought might be autistic. His parents and I between us couldn't get a psychologist to find anything wrong and there was no psychiatrist he could go to. Research of this aspect of the condition had yet then to be published. We didn't even hear of Dr Asperger and his work for at least another ten years. When we first heard of Asperger's Syndrome it was regarded as a manifestation of autism. They classify Asperger's as something else now, I gather.  The idea of there being a spectrum was the basis of the doctoral research of the headmaster I told you about. The terminology has changed a lot : from what you say, being on the spectrum means something else now and they'd put it another way. It's marvellous how this field of study has opened up. You must be fascinated. 

 In so many ways that boy from 1972 was so like Sheldon it's as if he crossed the Atlantic and joined the TBBT writing team to invent the character.  He'll be 55 now. Is your grandad much older ?

Fast forward a few decades to when they knew more than anecdotally that autism is found at all levels of intelligence :

Some years ago I read an article  in The Spectator that suggested increases in diagnoses of autism among children, noted especially in the USA where numbers were exploding, were due to more than improved capability of diagnosis and of parental awareness. The article suggested that with more women entering scientific fields ( where a lot of the new patients are coming from ) for a living, more male scientists can find like-minded wives and so the gene pool for autism has been strengthened. More recessive genes meeting each other, perhaps. When Shamy became more than just good friends, I was reminded of the article and I'm intrigued to see what their offspring will be like. I hope the next two seasons will show us.

 

 

Thank you for the historical perspective, it is very interesting!

The field has certainly undergone inmense advancement.

A few clarifications:

*In the DSM-4-TR (the previous version) there were different categories that the spectrum was consisted of, including Asperger's. In the current version (5) this classification no longer exists and there is a general diagnosis of Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD). There is also a new diagnosis called Social (pragmatic) Communication Disorder to include some that were previously classified as having PDD-NOS who have social deficits but not repetitve and restricted interests and behaviors (RRBs). The main difference between Aperger's and what some refer to as "autsim strictly defined" (Autistic Disorder in the DSM-4-TR) was the an unimpaired linguistic ability. PDD-NOS could have difficulties in verbal communication and RRBs or difficulties in verbal and social communication and interaction. Autistic Disorder required all three. Today verbal communication is considered part of social communication. Sheldon's diagnosis would have been Asperger's if he was diagnosed before 2013. Now it is ASD (probably severity level 1, meaning high functioning). My sister was diagnosed with PDD-NOS 15 years ago and now had her diagnosis validated to ASD (the validation is not mandatory but she needed a more recent psychiatric evaluation for certain beurocratic matters), the psychiatrist didn't set severity level but she is 1 (although classifying levels raises it's own issues). 

*Not only people with personality disorders are more likely to have more psychiatric diagnoses but also people with other psychiatric diagnoses, includng neurodevelopmental ones like ASD. As I said earlier, in this field commorbidity is the rule rather than the exception, there are various reasons for that. Speaking of personality disorders, these diagnoses are more problematic. The categories are not well defined and there is a lot of overlap.

 

There is a rise in diagnosis, due to various factors, including more awareness and developments in the field. There is certainly a genetic factor but it is not like eye color. There are many genes involved and current assumptions are that it is an interaction between genetic liability and prenatal environment (my sister for example was born in a difficult labour and as I said my grandpa might be undiagnosed so the genetic component is there). Shamy have much greater odds to have a child that meets criteria for ASD or at least has many autistic features but it is not a certianty. Amy has social difficulties but she doesn't have ASD.

 

My grandpa by the way is 84. When he was young here in Israel the health and education systems weren't very developed and I guess a tiny number of people were diagnosed with ASD.  

 

ETA: Would you look at that, I turned out to be the first poster on the 500 page. Sorry @spidergirl for it not being a TR :icon_redface: and congratulations to all of us!

Edited by bfm
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13 minutes ago, bfm said:

 

Thank you for the historical perspective, it is very interesting!

The field has certainly undergone inmense advancement.

A few clarifications:

*In the DSM-4-TR (the previous version) there were different categories that the spectrum was consisted of, including Asperger's. In the current version (5) this classification no longer exists and there is a general diagnosis of Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD). There is also a new diagnosis called Social (pragmatic) Communication Disorder to include some that were previously classified as having PDD-NOS who have social deficits but not repetitve and restricted interests and behaviors (RRBs). The main difference between Aperger's and what some refer to as "autsim strictly defined" (Autistic Disorder in the DSM-4-TR) was the an unimpaired linguistic ability. PDD-NOS could have difficulties in verbal communication and RRBs or difficulties in verbal and social communication and interaction. Autistic Disorder required all three. Today verbal communication is considered part of social communication. Sheldon's diagnosis would have been Asperger's if he was diagnosed before 2013. Now it is ASD (probably severity level 1, meaning high functioning). My sister was diagnosed with PDD-NOS 15 years ago and now had her diagnosis validated to ASD (the validation is not mandatory but she needed a more recent psychiatric evaluation for certain beurocratic matters), the psychiatrist didn't set severity level but she is 1 (although classifying levels raises it's own issues). 

*Not only people with personality disorders are more likely to have more psychiatric diagnoses but also people with other psychiatric diagnoses, includng neurodevelopmental ones like ASD. As I said earlier, in this field commorbidity is the rule rather than the exception, there are various reasons for that. Speaking of personality disorders, these diagnoses are more problematic. The categories are not well defined and there is a lot of overlap.

 

There is a rise in diagnosis, due to various factors, including more awareness and developments in the field. There is certainly a genetic factor but it is not like eye color. There are many genes involved and current assumptions are that it is an interaction between genetic liability and prenatal environment (my sister for example was born in a difficult labour and as I said my grandpa might be undiagnosed so the genetic component is there). Shamy have much greater odds to have a child that meets criteria for ASD or at least has many autistic features but it is not a certianty. Amy has social difficulties but she doesn't have ASD.

 

My grandpa by the way is 84. When he was young here in Israel the health and education systems weren't very developed and I guess a tiny number of people were diagnosed with ASD.  

 

ETA: Would you look at that, I turned out to be the first poster on the 500 page. Sorry @spidergirl for it not being a TR :icon_redface: and congratulations to all of us!

Oh dont be, my friend. Your post was a great one to celebrate it as it has so much precious info. :)

Congratulations to all of us! :icon_cheesygrin:

 

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y3PWaHz.gif.29ea79df61a1e114b29cf2b951fbe150.gif

What's wrong with Pepsi? I was going to put coke but didn't want ppls getting the wrong idea, thinking I'm talking of the powered variety.

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What's wrong with Pepsi? I was going to put coke but didn't want ppls getting the wrong idea, thinking I'm talking of the powdered variety.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk




Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

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