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[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

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54 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

It is hardly predictable. I would never have expected Ramona to reappear.

But doesn't she resemble, in a general sense, Mandy? Just as Mandy appeared from the deep dark past, so did Ramona, though in the flesh. Different presentation - similar plot device. IMVHO

Goes to the basic premise of the Billy Graham rule. Men can't be trusted to keep their hands off.

In this version Sheldon won't do anything ill because it is in real time and we are watching. For Leonard they (badly) stuck qualifiers all over it to try to pass it off and they still had to retconn it into existence. Because who would have bought it in real time after seeing him and Penny (and Sheldon) say their tender goodbyes.

And we know Sheldon is good with shedding gametes once annually, so where is the risk anyway? He's emptied his locker. So not a bold move like s4.24. But still a move they pulled before, one could say. :) 

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17 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

And we know Sheldon is good with shedding gametes once annually, so where is the risk anyway? He's emptied his locker. So not a bold move like s4.24. But still a move they pulled before, one could say. :) 

Sheldon no longer adheres to yearly sex. He broke the rule in 10.23.

Edited by serena_1995
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5 hours ago, ajond said:

I miss sleazy creepy Howard. They emasculated him and now he is just making up the numbers.

Me too!!!!!!!!!!!!! I loved sleazy creepy Howard, because while he was indeed sleazy and creepy he was never a douchebag. He always came across as good hearted nonetheless.

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1 hour ago, Nogravitasatall said:
2 hours ago, djsurrey said:

It is hardly predictable. I would never have expected Ramona to reappear.

But doesn't she resemble, in a general sense, Mandy? Just as Mandy appeared from the deep dark past, so did Ramona, though in the flesh. Different presentation - similar plot device. IMVHO

No. She does not resemble Mandy in a general sense. There is no similar plot device either. I don't think anyone on here watched 8.24 and said this means Ramona is coming back and that will result in a proposal from Sheldon. Most just said this retroactive kiss is dumb crap.

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31 minutes ago, Carlos said:

Me too!!!!!!!!!!!!! I loved sleazy creepy Howard, because while he was indeed sleazy and creepy he was never a douchebag. He always came across as good hearted nonetheless.

I actually loved sleazy Howard too for the same reason. He genuinely thought that's how he would land someone and he didn't know that just being a good guy was enough. He thought he had to put on an act. IMO that's what that whole episode with Penny was about. I never hated Sheldon back then either because he didn't know any better just like Howard didn't. 

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26 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

No. She does not resemble Mandy in a general sense. There is no similar plot device either. I don't think anyone on here watched 8.24 and said this means Ramona is coming back and that will result in a proposal from Sheldon. Most just said this retroactive kiss is dumb crap.

IT resembles Mandy in the sense. Well Ramona has the same plot device. IN that both Amy and Penny both deal with the fallout of the information Leonard and Sheldon gave to them. Just like Penny. If Sheldon tells Amy he kissed another woman. It may impact her decision in accepting Sheldons proposal. So it is very similar. 

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2 hours ago, serena_1995 said:

 

agree. I think Kaley has a wonderful range of acting.  I recall the Lenny Lime kiss and the ILY scene in 43 Peculiarity , she was amazing in those. and I thought Kaley had natural comic timing and chemistry with Jim, in Adhesive Duck Deficiency, particularly the ER scene and the soft kitty, duet in the end.   Penny taking Sheldon to a courthouse and their banter while doing a "skit"  about talking to a judge was quite witty too.  The first episode of TBBT I watched was The Barbarian Sublimation in 2009 , and I thought she was very funny when Penny got addicted to online gaming.

There have been episodes where Kaley got to show many different aspects of Penny's personality. Like Penny and Leonard one-upping each other at Professor Proton's funeral with proposals,  Penny teaching the guys about fish guts ,Penny going to war with Sheldon over onion rings in Panty Pinata,  Penny defending Sheldon from a bully, Penny starting her own Flower Barrette business, Penny playing Blanche on stage, the girls discussing Comic books....i could go on. Those episodes have different themes from each other so thats why I think Kaley can pull off both drama and comedy.

some long running popular gags like Sheldon's triple knocks and Soft  Kitty started with her too, and I always felt she was integral in making those scenes funny.Perhaps, the writers don't give Penny  as much variety of plots in season 8-10 as they did in older seasons  ? I could be wrong , but they seem to be stuck in a rut. sorry for the long winded post . I'm just saying she is talented too.

Thank you for this sensitive yet recognizable recollection. :shy:

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52 minutes ago, 3ku11 said:

IT resembles Mandy in the sense. Well Ramona has the same plot device. IN that both Amy and Penny both deal with the fallout of the information Leonard and Sheldon gave to them. Just like Penny. If Sheldon tells Amy he kissed another woman. It may impact her decision in accepting Sheldons proposal. So it is very similar. 

I don't see dealing with fallout of information as a plot device.

Sheldon did not kiss Ramona anymore than he kissed Beverly. Sheldon is the least likely person to kiss another women.

Edited by djsurrey
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1 hour ago, djsurrey said:

No. She does not resemble Mandy in a general sense. There is no similar plot device either. I don't think anyone on here watched 8.24 and said this means Ramona is coming back and that will result in a proposal from Sheldon. Most just said this retroactive kiss is dumb crap.

Thanks. That's a point, but I wasn't thinking of 8.24 as being predictive.  In 10.24 they again drove a cliffhanger with the idea of another woman as a threat to a relationship. Isn't that generally similar? It struck me they are repeating the same trick. Not a novelty - so more predictable, based on past performance.

And a less plausible threat too, because Sheldon.

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2 hours ago, 3ku11 said:

IT resembles Mandy in the sense. Well Ramona has the same plot device. IN that both Amy and Penny both deal with the fallout of the information Leonard and Sheldon gave to them. Just like Penny. If Sheldon tells Amy he kissed another woman. It may impact her decision in accepting Sheldons proposal. So it is very similar. 

He didn't kiss her, she kissed him and he immediately got the fuck out of there after she did it. And he did stress he wasn't interested in her at all before she did it.

I don't see how at all they are comparable situations here. I mean Leonard actually described features of Mandy from the kiss and it wasn't very good right? Suggests to me he actually kissed back (even if it was for a few seconds) if she had planted a drunken kiss on him during a party on the boat.

Edited by Jonny
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7 minutes ago, Jonny said:

He didn't kiss her, she kissed him and he immediately got the fuck out of there after she did it. And he did stress he wasn't interested in her at all before she did it.

I don't see how at all they are comparable situations here. I mean Leonard actually described features of Mandy from the kiss, the chipped tooth and it wasn't very good right? Suggests to me he actually kissed back (even if it was for a few seconds) if she had planted a drunken kiss on him during a party on the boat.

I agree Sheldon didn't kiss Ramona, Leonard we don't know (and pleaseeee let's not get into that again) but it is similar. Not the same, similar. Another woman kissing a man and it is presented as a threat to his relationship and a potential obstacle to moving it forward. I certainly don't believe it's true in Sheldon's case but this is how they are trying to present it, it feels like they are trying to force us to worry when there is nothing to worry about.

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8 minutes ago, bfm said:

I agree Sheldon didn't kiss Ramona, Leonard we don't know (and pleaseeee let's not get into that again) but it is similar. Not the same, similar. Another woman kissing a man and it is presented as a threat to his relationship and a potential obstacle to moving it forward. I certainly don't believe it's true in Sheldon's case but this is how they are trying to present it, it feels like they are trying to force us to worry when there is nothing to worry about.

The only way I see them as comparable is if 11.1 has drama because of a kiss like 9.1 had. And even though I think the writers would have a hard time trying to paint a dramatic story from this Ramona thing (because everything I have been told kiss wise Sheldon did nothing wrong, he may get some heat from allowing her to get as close to him as she did) I can't rule them out trying.

I didn't bring up the comparison argument in the first place.

Edited by Jonny
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8 minutes ago, Jonny said:

The only way I see them as comparable is if 11.1 has drama because of a kiss like 9.1 had. And even though I think the writers would have a hard time trying to paint a dramatic story from this Ramona thing (because everything I have been told kiss wise Sheldon did nothing wrong, he may get some heat from allowing her to get as close to him as she did) I can't rule them out trying.

I don't think they'll create drama based on the kiss itself, I think if anything they'll create drama because Amy might think Sheldon only proposed because of the kiss, which IMO would be stupid since he had the ring for a while now.

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32 minutes ago, spidergirl said:

Happy Season Finale day, everyone! :)

Yes, I’m happy about the final episode today. It’s about time everyone take a deep breath to blow a fresh breeze into someone's confused head. :icon_rolleyes:

popcorn6.gif.3f15e66cb1acb90979169b7b245bee87.gif

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4 minutes ago, veejay said:

Yes, I’m happy about the final episode today. It’s about time everyone take a deep breath to blow a fresh breeze into someone's confused head. :icon_rolleyes:

popcorn6.gif.3f15e66cb1acb90979169b7b245bee87.gif

And having a nice hiatus time as we all may talk about lots of stuff show related in a nice way. Aside our love for the show might be expressed in diferent ways among us and shipper feelings, we all have a good time around here, don't we?  This forum makes part of our daily routine, it is nice to check the news and have nice chats about that while we wait for next season. :)

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On 11.5.2017 at 10:54 AM, spidergirl said:

And having a nice hiatus time as we all may talk about lots of stuff show related in a nice way. Aside our love for the show might be expressed in diferent ways among us and shipper feelings, we all have a good time around here, don't we?  This forum makes part of our daily routine, it is nice to check the news and have nice chats about that while we wait for next season. :)

Yes, sometimes it feels like coming home again. :shy:

 

Edited by veejay
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3 minutes ago, Jonny said:

The only way I see them as comparable is if 11.1 has drama because of a kiss like 9.1 had. And even though I think the writers would have a hard time trying to paint a dramatic story from this Ramona thing (because everything I have been told kiss wise Sheldon did nothing wrong, he may get some heat from allowing her to get as close to him as she did) I can't rule them out trying.

I didn't bring up the comparison argument in the first place.

@ Jonny,  I was one of those who brought it up. For my part I think it points to an absence of novelty - they are mining their own history for stories as well as recycling situations.

My further thought is that for novel and ground-breaking story, one has to look back at S1-3 where they didn't have Sheldon being a quirky but nonetheless at core conventional heterosexual love interest.  From s4 they  have reversed some stereotypes with Shamy so the girl chases the un-horny boy,  inverting the cliche. Important stuff, true, driven by great performance and charm, and a righteous addition to the diversity of couples portrayed in the mainstream, but not as novel as story as that which they had with the guy who looked down on Dennis Kim.

From what we have seen with L/P, generating novelty going on will be harder. The premise has done a lot of work and the show has been a juggernaut, but it's creaky at s10. S11 & 12 may be creakier. 

As an aside - the limited time available means growing Shamy is at the expense of L/P. That may only bother the nerd and bleached blonde fanciers but it's a real effect. It's a zero sum game. The pie doesn't get bigger.

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20 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

@ Jonny,  I was one of those who brought it up. For my part I think it points to an absence of novelty - they are mining their own history for stories as well as recycling situations.

My further thought is that for novel and ground-breaking story, one has to look back at S1-3 where they didn't have Sheldon being a quirky but nonetheless at core conventional heterosexual love interest.  From s4 they  have reversed some stereotypes with Shamy so the girl chases the un-horny boy,  inverting the cliche. Important stuff, true, driven by great performance and charm, and a righteous addition to the diversity of couples portrayed in the mainstream, but not as novel as story as that which they had with the guy who looked down on Dennis Kim.

But "novelty" is 1) relative and 2) it wears off pretty fast. Sure, S1-3 may have been the golden age for many fans but for me it was filled with a ton of terrible clichés I personally dislike that make it almost unwatchable if it weren't for the odd episode I actually can enjoy. And even for fans who love S1-3 how much would you still love the same setup 7 seasons later? You complain about getting repetitive plot ideas but without adjusting the characters that would be even worse today. TBBT is not the first long running show / sitcom and to my personal experience those shows  that try the hardest to preserve a certain status quo also fail the hardest when it comes to inventive storylines for their characters. So basically, be careful what you wish for with these kinds of things.

20 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

From what we have seen with L/P, generating novelty going on will be harder. The premise has done a lot of work and the show has been a juggernaut, but it's creaky at s10. S11 & 12 may be creakier. 

As an aside - the limited time available means growing Shamy is at the expense of L/P. That may only bother the nerd and bleached blonde fanciers but it's a real effect. It's a zero sum game. The pie doesn't get bigger.

It's not entirely a zero sum game because of "the limited time available" as you say. Lenny did get scenes together this season, they even had the occasional plot to themselves. The issue is not that they didn't get any screen time but rather that the little screen time they had was used for plots that were rather unsatisfying and the bit that kinda sorta resembled a story arc for them went nowhere in the end. If Lenny had the same screen time this season and instead all of it were actually used for plots that develop the characters and push their relationship forward y'all would be more than happy about it.

So if it's a zero sum game it has nothing to do with time but rather all their creative energy being invested in Shamy and Howardette right now instead of Lenny and Raj.

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I'm waiting for a surprise not taped before the audience. What we know right now is the teeniest of a  cliffhanger. I'm expecting something additional....

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1 hour ago, No Regrets said:

I don't think they'll create drama based on the kiss itself, I think if anything they'll create drama because Amy might think Sheldon only proposed because of the kiss, which IMO would be stupid since he had the ring for a while now.

I would agree, I think that is the more likely and more feasible drama angle should they wish to use it. I agree it would be stupid, I've seen enough to know he has been thinking about it for some time. 10.23 really hit it home to me he is ready to make that step.

Edited by Jonny
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