[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

[djsurrey]

53 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

If he kissed or got kissed doesn't matter in this case , when the writers wants to show us that Shamy is so much better than Lenny. 

Of course it matters. The writers went out of their way to ensure the audience know Sheldon was essentially innocent with regard to Ramona. That is not because Sheldon is better than anyone else but because he has a child like innocence with regard to women; like Spongebob. Sheldon was not even tempted as far as I could tell. He barely noticed Ramona was female.

Edited May 14, 2017 by djsurrey

[Carlos]

16 hours ago, rachelshamyfan said:

I'd like to see them get married and some of the wedding planning like they did for Howardettes wedding 

I would like Shamy to have as much wedding planning as Lenny did, and then I would like for their wedding to be interrupted by Leonard being obnoxious, but I know that won't happen, first of all because the writers care more about Shamy and write it better these days and because Leonard is a much better friend to Sheldon than Sheldon is to Leonard.

Edited May 14, 2017 by Carlos

[jenafan]

2 hours ago, serena_1995 said:

why ? Sheldon's job at Caltech is just as important as Amy's job at Princeton. I don't think he should leave his job on a whim to stay in Princeton, just like I don't think Amy should leave her fellowship and come back to Pasadena . I think Sheldon should go back to Caltech, and in the early episodes of season 11, they can have him learn to live alone and interact more with Raj and Bernie. Lenny should be the ones to have their own plots in 4A. Perhaps some focus on Amy's work would be nice, via skype too. That is, if they intend on extending Amy's stay in Princeton for more episodes than just one .

Your scenario is just as reasonable. 

I just thought Sheldon might want to stay in NJ with Amy for the summer, and perhaps she may want him to.   I never stated his job wasn't as important as Amy's or that Amy should return to Pasadena.  It is something different, that is all.

[vonmar]

6 minutes ago, Carlos said:

I would like Shamy to have as much wedding planning as Lenny did, and they I would like for their wedding to be interrupted by Leonard being obnoxious, but I know that won't happen, first of all because the writers care more about Shamy and write it better these days and because Leonard is a much better friend to Sheldon than Sheldon is to Leonard.

Revenge?  No. I can't imagine that Leonard in my wildest dreams. Not in a million years, that's what separates Leonard from Sheldon. Awareness, compassion. That is not going to happen.

[djsurrey]

26 minutes ago, Carlos said:

I would like Shamy to have as much wedding planning as Lenny did, and they I would like for their wedding to be interrupted by Leonard being obnoxious, but I know that won't happen, first of all because the writers care more about Shamy and write it better these days and because Leonard is a much better friend to Sheldon than Sheldon is to Leonard.

Sheldon is self absorbed and Leonard is very aware of the people around him.

Still in staircase Sheldon puts himself at risk to save Leonard.

Sheldon does the math for the other guys. They are different people. They are each friends in the way they are capable of friendship.

[joyceraye]

4 hours ago, djsurrey said:

I'm not interested in watching wedding planning, ugg; TBBT typically avoids doing anything the conveniently. I'd be happy if there is a time jump and the next season starts after a time jump where they are married already. Perhaps they could flash back to a simple justice of the piece ceremony in the Princeton on campus chapel (just guessing there is one).

I'd imagine Mary would be happy to see Sheldon married. 

I too would like to see a simple let's-get-it-over-with marriage ceremony in a courthouse or a college chapel followed by later celebrations with all the trimmings organised by Raj and Bernie. Considering there'll be elderly relatives they might need one in Texas and one in Pasadena. Raj could meet a brainy female relative of one of them ( or a florist or cake-decorator ) and hit it off. Imagine Beverly meeting Meemaw in Texas.

 In New Jersey it takes three working days from getting a licence to being able to marry, which would give Shamy time to round up Beverly and anyone else they know in the vicinity of Princeton. It would give Sheldon time to buy some clothes, including a suit that makes him look like The Flash getting married which he said he looked like when hiring one for Howard's wedding.  I'd love it if Dave and/or Alex were there.

[3ku11]

3 hours ago, Jonny said:

1. He didn't kiss her, he was kissed. I didn't see anything in that scene that implied or apparent that he was getting into the kiss or reciprocating the gesture.

2. He might not tell her about the kiss. But I think the chances are higher that he will because Amy knows about Ramona, she knows she was trying to get close to him and will have witnesses in the rest of the gang. I would be shocked if she doesn't ask about Ramona.

A kiss is a kiss man, sigh anyway. Moloro pretty much confirmed in that interview. Transparency was the point. They intended to make Leonard look bad. And they intended to make Sheldon look like his words "An innocent bystander"

 

Anyway just curious. When do they start shooting S11? Anyone know. I know last year it was September I Think. 

[vonmar]

3 minutes ago, 3ku11 said:

A kiss is a kiss man, sigh anyway. Moloro pretty much confirmed in that interview. Transparency was the point. They intended to make Leonard look bad. And they intended to make Sheldon look like his words "An innocent bystander"

 

Anyway just curious. When do they start shooting S11? Anyone know. I know last year it was September I Think. 

The cast comes back in early August.  The writers come back mid-summer to prep.

[legacy99]

The cast comes back in early August.  The writers come back mid-summer to prep.

Thank you

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

[joyceraye]

2 hours ago, jenafan said:

Your scenario is just as reasonable. 

I just thought Sheldon might want to stay in NJ with Amy for the summer, and perhaps she may want him to.   I never stated his job wasn't as important as Amy's or that Amy should return to Pasadena.  It is something different, that is all.

With Sheldon's work being theoretical, rather than experimental like Leonard's, he might be able to do some of it from Princeton. The spartan-looking place Amy's in could do with a whiteboard to brighten it up a bit.

[3ku11]

Looking at the polls for the episodes. Interesting how the number of votes, and the ratings reflected the declining quality in the second half. The highest rated episodes. Were 10.01 and 10.04. The Lenny Wedding and When Sheldon moved Out. 47 and 32 votes respectively, rated Excellent. My Fav episodes from this season was 10.04 Cohabatation Experimentation and Holiday Summnation. 

[Gbb]

5 hours ago, Lagernisse said:

Sheldon kissing Ramona is just another way for the writers to tell us how much greater Shamy is compared to Lenny. Sheldon will tell Amy right away  about the kiss, Leonard doesn't speak for two years, just great. 

I don't think it has anything to do with Shamy being better than Lenny or Sheldon being greater that Leonard. It has to do with who these two men are as people and their personality types. Sheldon rarely ever lies, but it's not because he's a better person. He's blunt to the point of rudeness even if it makes him or someone else look bad.  He's just not wired to lie when the truth is sitting right there. Leonard, on the other hand, is both insecure and very concerned about others' feelings, so if the truth is going to get him in trouble or hurt someone, he's apt to tell a white lie (or a bold one) or keep his mouth shut. 

To me, it's a simple question of "how is Sheldon likely to respond in this instance?" not "how can we make Sheldon look better than Leonard?"

[Carlos]

3 hours ago, vonmar said:

Revenge?  No. I can't imagine that Leonard in my wildest dreams. Not in a million years, that's what separates Leonard from Sheldon. Awareness, compassion. That is not going to happen.

I said as much on my post, did I not?

[3ku11]

2 minutes ago, Gbb said:

I don't think it has anything to do with Shamy being better than Lenny or Sheldon being greater that Leonard. It has to do with who these two men are as people and their personality types. Sheldon rarely ever lies, but it's not because he's a better person. He's blunt to the point of rudeness even if it makes him or someone else look bad.  He's just not wired to lie when the truth is sitting right there. Leonard, on the other hand, is both insecure and very concerned about others' feelings, so if the truth is going to get him in trouble or hurt someone, he's apt to tell a white lie (or a bold one) or keep his mouth shut. 

To me, it's a simple question of "how is Sheldon likely to respond in this instance?" not "how can we make Sheldon look better than Leonard?"

Look this whole thing for Lenny Fans. Is fueled by Moloros comments. Essentially implying well plain out saying. Leonard cheated, and Sheldon diddn't. Leonards act was offscreen. But information we got. They both participated in a kiss with another woman. So its only fair. Leonard and Sheldon get the same treatment. If that is neither cheated. Fine. But the transparency clears. 

[No Regrets]

13 minutes ago, Gbb said:

I don't think it has anything to do with Shamy being better than Lenny or Sheldon being greater that Leonard. It has to do with who these two men are as people and their personality types. Sheldon rarely ever lies, but it's not because he's a better person. He's blunt to the point of rudeness even if it makes him or someone else look bad.  He's just not wired to lie when the truth is sitting right there. Leonard, on the other hand, is both insecure and very concerned about others' feelings, so if the truth is going to get him in trouble or hurt someone, he's apt to tell a white lie (or a bold one) or keep his mouth shut. 

To me, it's a simple question of "how is Sheldon likely to respond in this instance?" not "how can we make Sheldon look better than Leonard?"

What you're saying makes sense until I start thinking about how Leonard as a character is so often looked down upon by the writers for whatever reason. He's not fit enough, he's not successful enough, he's not attractive enough, he was lucky to land Penny (they'll even let Leonard imply that himself over and over), he's not a good enough husband, he's not a good enough son, he's not as popular at work and so on and so on. Even if they're not deliberately trying to make Sheldon look better, Leonard will always come off as inferior because that's how they make almost every character see him. And that's what bothers me so, so much. Leonard is a good guy and he doesn't deserve that as a character. 

[Swedish Chef]

2 hours ago, Gbb said:

I don't think it has anything to do with Shamy being better than Lenny or Sheldon being greater that Leonard. It has to do with who these two men are as people and their personality types. Sheldon rarely ever lies, but it's not because he's a better person. He's blunt to the point of rudeness even if it makes him or someone else look bad.  He's just not wired to lie when the truth is sitting right there. Leonard, on the other hand, is both insecure and very concerned about others' feelings, so if the truth is going to get him in trouble or hurt someone, he's apt to tell a white lie (or a bold one) or keep his mouth shut. 

To me, it's a simple question of "how is Sheldon likely to respond in this instance?" not "how can we make Sheldon look better than Leonard?"

Of course the writers wants Sheldon to be better than Leonard. 

Just a few things on my mind :

Sheldon didn't cheat, Leonard did.

Sheldon is better in love making than Leonard.

Sheldon is in a better relationship than Leonard.

Sheldon has more friends than Leonard. 

[3ku11]

Well yeah they established alot of points this season. The writers transparently suggesting. NO slamming it in your face Sheldon is supieor in every single way. Bernadettes Birth. Sheldon is a pro in the bedroom. Season 8 the stupid relationship test. Sheldon bragging he and Amy have a better relationship based on some number. Amy sure diddn't see it that way lol. Sheldon has more friends at Cal-Tech. Even though Leonard went on a expedition with Stephan Hawking. So I fail to see how the show all season were not trying to make a point in how Sheldon is better then Leonard in every single way. It is glaringly obvious.

The Season of Sheldon eating Leonard 

Edited May 14, 2017 by 3ku11

[veejay]

I’ve come across on this interesting article, which is a bit extended and seriously concerned with the current status of our beloved comedy. I think the expressed opinion here is plausible and not far-fetched or biased at all, despite the headline (IMHO).

http://www.fame10.com/entertainment/7-reasons-why-we-are-ready-for-the-big-bang-theory-to-end/?streamview=all

Possibly a small stimulus for an upcoming summer hiatus discussion.

Edited May 14, 2017 by veejay

[shamyyellow]

15 minutes ago, 3ku11 said:

Looking at the polls for the episodes. Interesting how the number of votes, and the ratings reflected the declining quality in the second half. The highest rated episodes. Were 10.01 and 10.04. The Lenny Wedding and When Sheldon moved Out. 47 and 32 votes respectively, rated Excellent. My Fav episodes from this season was 10.04 Cohabatation Experimentation and Holiday Summnation. 

I feel like every season declines in the middle whereas the beginning and the end are almost always better. It makes sense that halfway through, they aren't starting a storyline or summing anything up so it gets a little iffy... but that's just my own personal opinion about quality, not ratings.

I know this was a conversation a few weeks back, but there are so many reasons why ratings drop, especially since the way people watch television is constantly changing. It's not just people switching cable for iTunes, Amazon, and Netflix, it's the habits we are forming because of that. TBBT in general is increasingly hard to watch week by week in a world of streaming full seasons of hour long episodes. Personally, I can never tell if I like a season or not until I watch it all back to back. That makes me wonder how many people opt for that instead of week to week. Just a few years ago, it wasn't so easy to do it any other way. Now, if I'm not obsessed with a show, I'll just wait and watch it all at once after the season finale airs.

Another huge reason ratings may or may not be what they used to is the lack of promotion. This year, there were zero visits to the set by the usual entertainment shows. They didn't hold any special events, they didn't do any panels, and there was little to no excitement coming from them to us. We saw promotion work rather nicely in S9 between the hype over Shamy coitus and the 200th episode. The only promotion this season got was from their official YouTube channel a day before and a few hours after the finale aired. Keep in mind that their channel has a total of 400K subscribers, which is a great example of how bad numbers aren't exact cut and dry. How does a show with 20M viewers have such a weak online following? There are a lot of answers but none of them have to do with the overall popularity of the show. However, the number of people that promo reached explains why it did nothing for them.

With the last 3 seasons, we have seen ratings slip in March/April/May. I don't know why exactly, but they do. I truly believe the reasons I stated have at least something to do with it, but even the overall age of the show will have some impact over time. We live in the day and age of new everything all the time and what isn't placed right in front of our faces isn't always recognized or remembered.

And I will admit that Lenny's constant fighting and bickering has definitely turned me off, so I can't really blame anyone else who hasn't enjoyed it much either. That isn't to blame Lenny for the decline, but to say the show was more cohesive when that wasn't the case. The people on this forum who are the least happy and threaten to quit watching the show are Lennies, so it makes sense their downfall is at least partly to blame for ratings going down. 

[shamyyellow]

2 hours ago, No Regrets said:

What you're saying makes sense until I start thinking about how Leonard as a character is so often looked down upon by the writers for whatever reason. He's not fit enough, he's not successful enough, he's not attractive enough, he was lucky to land Penny (they'll even let Leonard imply that himself over and over), he's not a good enough husband, he's not a good enough son, he's not as popular at work and so on and so on. Even if they're not deliberately trying to make Sheldon look better, Leonard will always come off as inferior because that's how they make almost every character see him. And that's what bothers me so, so much. Leonard is a good guy and he doesn't deserve that as a character. 

Is it possible that you and other's might be missing the disses about Sheldon while focusing on all the negativity thrown at Leonard? 

The first words Leonard spoke in the finale were a diss about Sheldon and what a pain in the ass he's been since Amy left. The guys talked about him being stupid because he likes going to the train store and is particular about the medicine he buys. He's stupid and annoying because he likes to look at ladders. When he left to another table with Ramona, Howard said he was "lured away by a stranger with a candy bar." When they realized who Ramona was, Howard said she was around "before Sheldon hit puberty and grew man parts." He made Ramona laugh so according to Leonard, there had to be something wrong. In the next scene, Bernie almost gagged at the thought of Sheldon's "sexual appetite". In the scene after that, Sheldon retells a joke from Raj about wanting to hang himself while they were out together. In the next scene, the girls insinuated that he was too stupid to know better than to run out into traffic. Later in the episode, Raj says an attractive women would never be interested in Sheldon. The list goes on and on...

I'm not taking away from the fact that the writers can do better with Lenny, but this particular complaint seems like selective hearing to me. Every character on this show is ridiculed for the sake of comedy and it's often at the expense of continuity or the well being of relationships. They called Amy unattractive about 17 times in the finale to build Ramona up. They called Sheldon stupid about the same amount to strength his naivety. They had Penny yell at Leonard so he would call Amy because then Sheldon could emphasize that naivety even more by seeing the problem with that, but not Ramona. 

I guess I just see that Sheldon/Shamy fans let it go while Leonard/Lenny fans don't because they're unhappy with the storylines and lack of progress they've been given. And no, I'm not saying that's unreasonable. I guess I'm just pointing out that the problem always comes back to Lenny being mistreated. Shamy is in a good place, so those jokes at his/their expense don't really bother us. If the writers would just fix Lenny and give their fans something more/better to focus on, this probably wouldn't even be a discussion.

[mirs1]

1 hour ago, shamyyellow said:

I feel like every season declines in the middle whereas the beginning and the end are almost always better. It makes sense that halfway through, they aren't starting a storyline or summing anything up so it gets a little iffy... but that's just my own personal opinion about quality, not ratings.

I know this was a conversation a few weeks back, but there are so many reasons why ratings drop, especially since the way people watch television is constantly changing. It's not just people switching cable for iTunes, Amazon, and Netflix, it's the habits we are forming because of that. TBBT in general is increasingly hard to watch week by week in a world of streaming full seasons of hour long episodes. Personally, I can never tell if I like a season or not until I watch it all back to back. That makes me wonder how many people opt for that instead of week to week. Just a few years ago, it wasn't so easy to do it any other way. Now, if I'm not obsessed with a show, I'll just wait and watch it all at once after the season finale airs.

Another huge reason ratings may or may not be what they used to is the lack of promotion. This year, there were zero visits to the set by the usual entertainment shows. They didn't hold any special events, they didn't do any panels, and there was little to no excitement coming from them to us. We saw promotion work rather nicely in S9 between the hype over Shamy coitus and the 200th episode. The only promotion this season got was from their official YouTube channel a day before and a few hours after the finale aired. Keep in mind that their channel has a total of 400K subscribers, which is a great example of how bad numbers aren't exact cut and dry. How does a show with 20M viewers have such a weak online following? There are a lot of answers but none of them have to do with the overall popularity of the show. However, the number of people that promo reached explains why it did nothing for them.

With the last 3 seasons, we have seen ratings slip in March/April/May. I don't know why exactly, but they do. I truly believe the reasons I stated have at least something to do with it, but even the overall age of the show will have some impact over time. We live in the day and age of new everything all the time and what isn't placed right in front of our faces isn't always recognized or remembered.

And I will admit that Lenny's constant fighting and bickering has definitely turned me off, so I can't really blame anyone else who hasn't enjoyed it much either. That isn't to blame Lenny for the decline, but to say the show was more cohesive when that wasn't the case. The people on this forum who are the least happy and threaten to quit watching the show are Lennies, so it makes sense their downfall is at least partly to blame for ratings going down. 

I completely agree...the lack of promotion in the show is astonishing! I have no idea if that might be a reason for the ratings drop, but for sure it's not very respectful towards the hard core fans! The persons in charge simply think they don't need to try anymore because of the show's popularity. S. 9 was well covered with the press because the S. 8 finale was such a train wreck that in the first part of the seasons Molaro had many interviews about it, then Shamy coitus, the Paley fest panel, the 200th episode did the rest. S. 10 coverage was a desert compared to that...it looked like TBBT fell under the radar, there have been very few interviews and articles about the show; part of this probably had to do with negotiations, but even after the main cast signed, things didn't improve that much. The cast hasn't had a proper photo-shoot since S. 7 and they continue to recycle for their advertisings or the DVD\Blue Ray covers some old pics modified with some improbable photoshop work, frankly I've seen fans doing a much better job than that. And, let's not even talk about the DVD\Blue Ray extras...In S. 9 extras they have used some footage they shot in S. 8!!!!

The public media of the show are even worse, IMO. I'm not sure they have a Media Manager, because there is such little coordination. There are very few BTS pics or interactions with the actors. As a person who doesn't live in the USA, I for sure hate that most of the material is geo-locked, I clearly understand why and I wouldn't mind so much if, from time to time, there was indeed some footage I could watch, or if some members of the cast  had a take over of their social media...As it is, it's much more interesting to follow the actors'  or Alex Ayers's social media, rather than the Official TBBT ones. 

Edited May 14, 2017 by mirs1

[jenafan]

I watched episode 9.2 tonight.   All throughout the episode, Leonard and the others referred to the kiss with Mandy as a drunken make out.  Bernie even felt guilty for not telling Penny she has known all along.  Even without the interview, it seems obvious Leonard's situation was different from Sheldon's.

What Leonard did was as an accident due to the influence of alcohol.  He participated in a kiss, something he would not have done sober.  Penny considered it cheating and was even shocked Leonard would ever do such a thing to her and then cover it over the two years.   While we didn't see the events happen on screen, the dialogue regarding the matter and Leonard's guilty conscience in trying make the situation right is enough to know he felt and was partially responsible for what happened.

Sheldon deserves some flack for spending so much time alone with another woman with Amy away, creating the perfect opportunity for temptation to set in or for Ramona to make an advance toward him.   Was he wrong?  No, but his actions were not wise.  Is it wrong for someone to go walk alone in a park?  No, but one takes risks in doing so.  Whether Sheldon believed his behavior was inappropriate or not does not negate the fact that while he called Leonard out for asking about Ramona's boyfriend status and calling Amy during the night, that he himself was exhibiting the very behavior he was condemning.  I cringed, not about the swimming, but because Sheldon accepted Ramona's self invite to his home with Amy not there.  Had Amy not Skyped, who knows what shenanigans Ramona would have pulled.  Furthermore, even if Sheldon rejected her, where is his defense?  She could claim anything with his word against hers.  

The man is obviously clueless.  Sheldon does it again by allowing Ramona to come into the office with the door shut behind her and telling her he enjoys spending time with her while she is obviously trying to woo him over with a homemade office picnic.  Sheldon, for the life of him, cannot read what is going on behind her actions.  So, he point blank asks.  To state his situation was the same as Leonard's by claiming he participated in Ramona's forced thrust in his face because he didn't push her away would not hold up if the evidence were presented for a case to indicate cheating.  Let's be realistic here.  Sheldon was taken advantage of.  Ramona didn't like the reasons Sheldon was providing for why a romantic relationship was not possible, and she thought she could tempt him by kissing him.  He clearly was not moved by it.  He was paralyzed with shock and stepped away from the situation.

Life is not fair.  People make mistakes.  Others are in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Some are hard luck cases while others seem to always get the benefit of the doubt and always come out ahead.  

I don't think Sheldon is written to make Leonard look bad.  It is simply two different people with different lives and personalities.  Sheldon insults Leonard.  Leonard tries to build Sheldon up.   Leonard is the good guy who gets all the bad breaks but manages to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ it off and move on.  Sheldon is the naive sometimes jerk who has everyone wrapped around his finger and seems to always come up on top despite his behavior.  The Shelnard friendship dynamic works for them.  It is part of what the show is about.   

It is understandable that storys get repeated with different characters.  All couples go through their version of courtship, break ups, make ups, time apart, mistakes, major life decisions, etc.  The show would be awfully boring if every scenario ended with the same outcome.  

I don't understand the Lenny and Shamy comparisons trying to justify the claim one is written in a way to achieve a specific perception of another.  The couples are different. The way they deal with their individual relationships according to their personalities and what they know about their mates if different.  Leonard deals with and responds to situations opposite from the way Sheldon does.  

Leonard was labeled a cheater, so Sheldon should be, too, because it makes Leonard look bad if he isn't?  Really?   That ship sailed a long time ago when Penny forgave him.  Why can't we?  

It is not supposed to be a tit-for-tat.  It never was.

Edited May 14, 2017 by jenafan

[Swedish Chef]

14 minutes ago, jenafan said:

 The show would be awfully boring if every scenario ended with the same outcome.  

Doesn't Sheldon always wins over Leonard ?

[3ku11]

2 hours ago, shamyyellow said:

I feel like every season declines in the middle whereas the beginning and the end are almost always better. It makes sense that halfway through, they aren't starting a storyline or summing anything up so it gets a little iffy... but that's just my own personal opinion about quality, not ratings.

I know this was a conversation a few weeks back, but there are so many reasons why ratings drop, especially since the way people watch television is constantly changing. It's not just people switching cable for iTunes, Amazon, and Netflix, it's the habits we are forming because of that. TBBT in general is increasingly hard to watch week by week in a world of streaming full seasons of hour long episodes. Personally, I can never tell if I like a season or not until I watch it all back to back. That makes me wonder how many people opt for that instead of week to week. Just a few years ago, it wasn't so easy to do it any other way. Now, if I'm not obsessed with a show, I'll just wait and watch it all at once after the season finale airs.

Another huge reason ratings may or may not be what they used to is the lack of promotion. This year, there were zero visits to the set by the usual entertainment shows. They didn't hold any special events, they didn't do any panels, and there was little to no excitement coming from them to us. We saw promotion work rather nicely in S9 between the hype over Shamy coitus and the 200th episode. The only promotion this season got was from their official YouTube channel a day before and a few hours after the finale aired. Keep in mind that their channel has a total of 400K subscribers, which is a great example of how bad numbers aren't exact cut and dry. How does a show with 20M viewers have such a weak online following? There are a lot of answers but none of them have to do with the overall popularity of the show. However, the number of people that promo reached explains why it did nothing for them.

With the last 3 seasons, we have seen ratings slip in March/April/May. I don't know why exactly, but they do. I truly believe the reasons I stated have at least something to do with it, but even the overall age of the show will have some impact over time. We live in the day and age of new everything all the time and what isn't placed right in front of our faces isn't always recognized or remembered.

And I will admit that Lenny's constant fighting and bickering has definitely turned me off, so I can't really blame anyone else who hasn't enjoyed it much either. That isn't to blame Lenny for the decline, but to say the show was more cohesive when that wasn't the case. The people on this forum who are the least happy and threaten to quit watching the show are Lennies, so it makes sense their downfall is at least partly to blame for ratings going down. 

No I would say the continued focus on Shamy, has caused Ratings to go down hill more then anything. Lenny have barley fought the last 5 to the finalie. 

45 minutes ago, jenafan said:

I watched episode 9.2 tonight.   All throughout the episode, Leonard and the others referred to the kiss with Mandy as a drunken make out.  Bernie even felt guilty for not telling Penny she has known all along.  Even without the interview, it seems obvious Leonard's situation was different from Sheldon's.

What Leonard did was as an accident due to the influence of alcohol.  He participated in a kiss, something he would not have done sober.  Penny considered it cheating and was even shocked Leonard would ever do such a thing to her and then cover it over the two years.   While we didn't see the events happen on screen, the dialogue regarding the matter and Leonard's guilty conscience in trying make the situation right is enough to know he felt and was partially responsible for what happened.

Sheldon deserves some flack for spending so much time alone with another woman with Amy away, creating the perfect opportunity for temptation to set in or for Ramona to make an advance toward him.   Was he wrong?  No, but his actions were not wise.  Is it wrong for someone to go walk alone in a park?  No, but one takes risks in doing so.  Whether Sheldon believed his behavior was inappropriate or not does not negate the fact that while he called Leonard out for asking about Ramona's boyfriend status and calling Amy during the night, that he himself was exhibiting the very behavior he was condemning.  I cringed, not about the swimming, but because Sheldon accepted Ramona's self invite to his home with Amy not there.  Had Amy not Skyped, who knows what shenanigans Ramona would have pulled.  Furthermore, even if Sheldon rejected her, where is his defense?  She could claim anything with his word against hers.  

The man is obviously clueless.  Sheldon does it again by allowing Ramona to come into the office with the door shut behind her and telling her he enjoys spending time with her while she is obviously trying to woo him over with a homemade office picnic.  Sheldon, for the life of him, cannot read what is going on behind her actions.  So, he point blank asks.  To state his situation was the same as Leonard's by claiming he participated in Ramona's forced thrust in his face because he didn't push her away would not hold up if the evidence were presented for a case to indicate cheating.  Let's be realistic here.  Sheldon was taken advantage of.  Ramona didn't like the reasons Sheldon was providing for why a romantic relationship was not possible, and she thought she could tempt him by kissing him.  He clearly was not moved by it.  He was paralyzed with shock and stepped away from the situation.

Life is not fair.  People make mistakes.  Others are in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Some are hard luck cases while others seem to always get the benefit of the doubt and always come out ahead.  

I don't think Sheldon is written to make Leonard look bad.  It is simply two different people with different lives and personalities.  Sheldon insults Leonard.  Leonard tries to build Sheldon up.   Leonard is the good guy who gets all the bad breaks but manages to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ it off and move on.  Sheldon is the naive sometimes jerk who has everyone wrapped around his finger and seems to always come up on top despite his behavior.  The Shelnard friendship dynamic works for them.  It is part of what the show is about.   

It is understandable that storys get repeated with different characters.  All couples go through their version of courtship, break ups, make ups, time apart, mistakes, major life decisions, etc.  The show would be awfully boring if every scenario ended with the same outcome.  

I don't understand the Lenny and Shamy comparisons trying to justify the claim one is written in a way to achieve a specific perception of another.  The couples are different. The way they deal with their individual relationships according to their personalities and what they know about their mates if different.  Leonard deals with and responds to situations opposite from the way Sheldon does.  

Leonard was labeled a cheater, so Sheldon should be, too, because it makes Leonard look bad if he isn't?  Really?   That ship sailed a long time ago when Penny forgave him.  Why can't we?  

It is not supposed to be a tit-for-tat.  It never was.

I don't think it is about a fan reaction to Sheldon being deemed a cheater because Leonard is. But the consistency in which Sheldon is percieved to be supeior. And Leonard is inferior in every single way. Sheldon "cheating" does not change every week they degrade Leonard. This is just another seperate example of it. They are not mutually exclusive. 

[jenafan]

34 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

Doesn't Sheldon always wins over Leonard ?

If one insists on comparing, then it does seem so.    

However, that does not mean Sheldon is written for the purpose of making Leonard look bad or Leonard is written badly to make Sheldon look good.  

The writers have simply chosen to write character traits in Leonard and Sheldon they wish to exploit that have nothing to do with one or the other but create a form of sibling rivalry between the Sheldon haters, the Sheldon apologists, and those in the middle of the argument who just want peace and to enjoy the show as it is written and as a whole.

JMHO. Obviously, I can't think for the writers.  

Edited May 14, 2017 by jenafan