[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

[3ku11]

Sheldons not a bigger jerk then Leonard lol? I think Cannon says other wise. 

[vonmar]

3 minutes ago, Tensor said:

That skull thinks Sheldon is a bigger jerk than Leonard?  

That's an opinion, not a fact.  I was told that there were facts involved.

[Tensor]

It's a fact, that in skull's opinion, Sheldon is a Jerk.  

It's also a fact, that in your opinion: Poor Saint Leonard.  So sweet, so kind, he never takes potshots at anyone...never mocks Sheldon or anyone else, but still gets so much abuse heaped upon him.  It's so unfair.

[3ku11]

I was just simply saying through out the course of the series. In cannon Sheldon has consistently been a jerk to everyone around him. While Leonard at times takes shots at Sheldon. It is usally to no direct effect. Sheldon even takes indirect shots at Leonard when he is not even in the conversation, or the same room. Probably could list a 100 times where Sheldon was a jerk to Leonard. Then Leonard. The show clearly these days have degenerated Leonard from the central focal point of the show. Where he was at least appreciated. To the whipping boy of the series. So yes he is the Alan Harper of TBBT now. 

[djsurrey]

46 minutes ago, 3ku11 said:

Then Leonard. The show clearly these days have degenerated Leonard from the central focal point of the show. Where he was at least appreciated. To the whipping boy of the series.

If the series has a whipping boy it would be Stuart.

Leonard has a central role still. So does Penny. Just not so much as a couple.

 

[April]

8 hours ago, djsurrey said:

Overall your right in that Leonard is nice. When he says something about Sheldon it is out of utter frustration because Sheldon is so extremely frustrating.

Nah, he's also doing it for shits and giggles. There are many situations where these digs come unprovoked.

[hokie3457]

8 hours ago, Nogravitasatall said:

It may sound as if people are whining but Saint Leonard got his halo knocked off good and proper. He genuinely almost sank his marriage. That's not trivial.  

Even though Leonard may mock, it is never to any real effect. Does Sheldon heed him? Not likely. He sometimes makes sotte voce  asides pointing out the underlying ridiculousness of Sheldon's positions. Does it stop anything ridiculous happening? No. Leonard's comments never affect the outcome and Leonard's actions rarely affect the outcome. Leonard's role often is to mitigate that harm from Sheldon's actions.

He's like the straight Costello to Sheldon's Abbott. He has to roll with the punches and not land any of his own, or only some light touches. Penny gets to punch back to some degree. It's never fair on the fall-guy. But if you like Leonard then yes, it is unfair. Because it's not equal treatment. Hey ho  

 

 

 

edit: but its meant to be funny. Still I liked it better when Sheldon "had his back" against Kurt. Haven't seen that kind of thing for a while.  

Yikes. For the most part, Leonard's barbs are said in sarcasm, teasing, kiddidng and cutting up. On the obverse, Sheldon believes and is serious about everything he says. He believes Leonard is extremely inferior and should give up his  career and become a (history?) teacher. He believes that Princeton is a second rate university (he even alluded to its standards falling because Leonard graduated there.) he believes Penny is of easy virtue because of her past even though she has remained true to Leonard all the time they've been together. He believes Howard is in a worthless discipline. He even believes the same about Amy. He constantly derides geologists ( and now Bert) and so many other sciences that aren't his. He is arrogant, mean dismissive if others and is a verbal bully(I'll admit that all the characters have this last trait). The thing is, that is how the character is written and what many like about him. He is a giant baby and pain in the a**.  If I were in a group of friends that included Dr Coooer, I would avoid him like the plague. I know he has his good points, but they do not (for me) come close to making up for his a**holeness. 

Rant. Done.

[Jonny]

There are no saints on this show, they can all be nasty pieces of work and yes of course that includes Sheldon.

As we are talking about Leonard @hokie3457 not this season, for whatever reason a lot of Leonard's barbs didn't have that sarcasm or that patented cheesy grin. They were said with a straight face, a noticeable in my view change this season by the writers. You see if they are laughing after they have said them I know it's just a bit of snark or a barb with no major feeling behind them. When it's a straight face I naturally think they mean it. Medication for example, there was no laugh and no grin.

Look at earlier seasons when Leonard made a gag about Sheldon or anyone and the rest of the guys laughed as did Leonard as he was proud of them. I hope they can find that again in Season 11, it's delivery that is bugging me more than anything.

[hokie3457]

1 hour ago, Jonny said:

There are no saints on this show, they can all be nasty pieces of work and yes of course that includes Sheldon.

As we are talking about Leonard @hokie3457 not this season, for whatever reason a lot of Leonard's barbs didn't have that sarcasm or that patented cheesy grin. They were said with a straight face, a noticeable in my view change this season by the writers. You see if they are laughing after they have said them I know it's just a bit of snark or a barb with no major feeling behind them. When it's a straight face I naturally think they mean it. Medication for example, there was no laugh and no grin.

Look at earlier seasons when Leonard made a gag about Sheldon or anyone and the rest of the guys laughed as did Leonard as he was proud of them. I hope they can find that again in Season 11, it's delivery that is bugging me more than anything.

You are right @jonny. Many of Leonard's barbs have a bit more sting to them, I grant you that. Also I did say that all the characters can be a bit bullly-ish. However, I maintain that the others sre different from Sheldon as he isn't teasing. He sincerely believes what he says. Each barb he delivers are his opinion. That us my opinion.

Edited May 15, 2017 by hokie3457

[Capt. Hilts]

7 hours ago, Tensor said:

That skull thinks Sheldon is a bigger jerk than Leonard?  

That's Skull's opinion.

Which is fine, but not a fact.

[Nogravitasatall]

 

8 hours ago, hokie3457 said:

Yikes. For the most part, Leonard's barbs are said in sarcasm, teasing, kiddidng and cutting up. On the obverse, Sheldon believes and is serious about everything he says. He believes Leonard is extremely inferior and should give up his  career and become a (history?) teacher. He believes that Princeton is a second rate university (he even alluded to its standards falling because Leonard graduated there.) he believes Penny is of easy virtue because of her past even though she has remained true to Leonard all the time they've been together. He believes Howard is in a worthless discipline. He even believes the same about Amy. He constantly derides geologists ( and now Bert) and so many other sciences that aren't his. He is arrogant, mean dismissive if others and is a verbal bully(I'll admit that all the characters have this last trait). The thing is, that is how the character is written and what many like about him. He is a giant baby and pain in the a**.  If I were in a group of friends that included Dr Coooer, I would avoid him like the plague. I know he has his good points, but they do not (for me) come close to making up for his a**holeness. 

Rant. Done.

Yeah, but he's usually humoured. Hehe.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Tensor
Removed quoted comment that is now hidden

[Carlos]

9 hours ago, vonmar said:

That's an opinion, not a fact.  I was told that there were facts involved.

Yes, you were told that by me. What I was referring to were all the times that Sheldon was a jerk to Leonard, and all the times that Leonard was a jerk to Sheldon, and how if you compare both, you will see, from facts (canon) , not opinion, how much more of a jerk Sheldon has been to Leonard than vice versa.

[serena_1995]

14 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

Penny asked for sex. Leonard provided. That's Lunar Excitation.

Penny was also completely drunk and judgement impaired. Imo Leonard should have refused her and not gone further with her.

[Chrismo]

3 hours ago, serena_1995 said:

Penny was also completely drunk and judgement impaired. Imo Leonard should have refused her and not gone further with her.

That may be true but Penny wasn't complaining about what happened afterwards .

[Tensor]

2 hours ago, Capt. Hilts said:

That's Skull's opinion.

Which is fine, but not a fact.

Skull's opinion is, Sheldon is a jerk.  It's a fact, skull's opinion is Sheldon is a jerk. 

[Capt. Hilts]

4 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Skull's opinion is, Sheldon is a jerk.  It's a fact, skull's opinion is Sheldon is a jerk. 

True dat.

[5Mississippis]

4 hours ago, SRAM said:

Really,, let's talk about a so called best friend who forces the other to sign a roommate agreement.  Sheldon first made him sign it to be his roommate, then when Priya found a way out for Leonard, Sheldon blackmailed him buy threatening to expose them which would breakup their relationship (yea some friend), then when Leonard finally broke it Sheldon tried to trick him by cutting off power to the building.  And then if you want to talk about "love of their live" why does Sheldon constantly treat Amy like a doormat until she actually has to stand her ground with him sometimes, that is what actually caused their breakup, Sheldon treating her as a doormat and her finally having enough of it.  

Leonard is a Saint, anyone who has put up with Sheldon for so long deserves sainthood.

Sheldon also surprised Leonard and Penny by letting a homeless guy live in his old room. 

[April]

3 hours ago, 5Mississippis said:

Sheldon also surprised Leonard and Penny by letting a homeless guy live in his old room.

After Leonard pulled a literal dick move on the apartment flag!

(lol sorry, couldn't resist)

[hokie3457]

3 hours ago, 5Mississippis said:

Sheldon also surprised Leonard and Penny by letting a homeless guy live in his old room. 

Not to mention potentially dangerous. No identification beyond a receipt from a blood bank, etc.....

[serena_1995]

So you agree, that having sex with a drunk, judgement impaired woman, while being totally sober  was not a "nice" move by Leonard ?

And btw, Sheldon did not cheat on Amy. 

[5Mississippis]

1 hour ago, SRAM said:

Really,, let's talk about a so called best friend who forces the other to sign a roommate agreement.  Sheldon first made him sign it to be his roommate, then when Priya found a way out for Leonard, Sheldon blackmailed him buy threatening to expose them which would breakup their relationship (yea some friend), then when Leonard finally broke it Sheldon tried to trick him by cutting off power to the building.  And then if you want to talk about "love of their live" why does Sheldon constantly treat Amy like a doormat until she actually has to stand her ground with him sometimes, that is what actually caused their breakup, Sheldon treating her as a doormat and her finally having enough of it.  

Leonard is a Saint, anyone who has put up with Sheldon for so long deserves sainthood.

Sheldon also let Aquaman record away, capturing any intimate activities between Leonard and Penny, without informing them they were being recorded for god knows how long.

When they became aware, Leonard, standing behind the kitchen island (naturally), looked distressed and sighed heavily, just looked down at the table. Just a frustrated sigh?! Sheldon got away easy for that one. If that were me, Sheldon would have gotten punched right in the face. 

[Swedish Chef]

9 hours ago, djsurrey said:

Leonard has a central role still. So does Penny. Just not so much as a couple.

 

Then there is no point in having them married. 

[Tensor]

 Thread unlocked.  Let's not go back to that particular discussion.   

[Swedish Chef]

I'm a little curious about the Shamy proposal, why did the writers make the plot with Ramona just so Sheldon could propose in the finale.  I'm absolutely no expert on Shamy's relationship, but hasn't there been episode better suited than the season finale for the proposal.

I'm also wants to point out that I have no problem with Shamy being engaged(I know Amy hasn't said yes yet, but I really don't see her saying no) because Shamy , just like Lenny or Howardette has every right to be a married couple in this show.  

[April]

38 minutes ago, Lagernisse said:

I'm a little curious about the Shamy proposal, why did the writers make the plot with Ramona just so Sheldon could propose in the finale.  I'm absolutely no expert on Shamy's relationship, but hasn't there been episode better suited than the season finale for the proposal.

I'm also wants to point out that I have no problem with Shamy being engaged(I know Amy hasn't said yes yet, but I really don't see her saying no) because Shamy , just like Lenny or Howardette has every right to be a married couple in this show.  

I've said this before but I think the way they did it 1) the proposal was enough of a surprise* and 2) the episode had enough tension with Ramona going after Sheldon** that people might wonder how that proposal will work out. Sure, the general assumption is that Amy will say yes but I've also seen some people thinking she'll say no and the most popular variation across both camps is that there'll be a talk of some sorts where Amy has questions and Sheldon has to explain the situation.

*Surprise in that they could have easily made the kiss the cliffhanger but then the episode just kept going with that montage of Sheldon noping out of there and travelling straight to Amy.

**Not that Sheldon was actually tempted as even Molaro confirms, but Ramona clearly didn't take "no" for an answer so the tension comes from the gang's worry about how far she'll go.

Edited May 15, 2017 by April