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Tensor

[Spoilers] Discussion: Season 10

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For a character that we know has been involved in the meth scene for years, that actor as Penny's brother is the most ridiculous casting ever, and makes light of a huge meth epidemic that's killing off hundreds of thousands in the US. There are currently towns here where drug related deaths are outnumbering deaths by old age and natural causes. And the look of many meth chemists and users is quite distinct, with the notorious "meth mouth", meth scabs, emaciated bodies, and dead eyes the usual giveaways to a meth user.

I know that Penny's brother was more of a chemist, so perhaps he was not using so much, but there was a time he had run away from rehab. He's been in jail. And the danger and sheer toxicity of the chemicals used in meth leave their mark too. Having Mr. Golden Haired, innocent looking boy with all his big white horse teeth show up as a longtime, hardcore member of the meth drug scene is just ridiculous, to the point it's offensive towards a very real issue that's crippling America's heartland. Meth has because the #1 problem facing middle America, and is certainly becoming a major problem here in Seattle, where I live, as well. Casting that actor in the role is just a joke, and one in poor taste considering what meth is and what meth does. 


Maybe he has cleaned up his act and Susan made sure he dressed up not to embarrass the family. Lol but you are right Meth is also a big problem in the UK too and is taken by all classes of people and a big problem these days. They come in all package, dealer or dealer/ user or just users but it's still a growning problem worldwide.

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They said he cooks meth. He doesn't have to look like a hobo in order to cook meth. Also it's a comedy.

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They said he cooks meth. He doesn't have to look like a hobo in order to cook meth. Also it's a comedy.


True. But aleast make it look believable. Comedy or drama, TPTB are still selling the character that we have heard of but not seen. Now we have, as an audience we have a mind set of what we think he might look like. He is not.

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1 minute ago, Tonstar17 said:


True. But aleast make it look believable. Comedy or drama, TPTB are still selling the character that we have heard of but not seen. Now we have, as an audience we have a mind set of what we think he might look like. He is not.

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Isn't that the point....have you create an image in your head and then throw something completely different at you?

Isn't that how you get people to talk even more about your 10 year old show?

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I know the brother doesn't look like the stereotypical meth cooker BUT hasn't TBBT strove to break down the stereotypes of nerds to some extent?  (and I stress the "some extent"). 

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27 minutes ago, vonmar said:
 

I'll be streaming the fuck out of it so no worries there ayer.

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Isn't that the point....have you create an image in your head and then throw something completely different at you?

Isn't that how you get people to talk even more about your 10 year old show?


Yes, it floates but in my head the drugs don't work.

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7 hours ago, Tensor said:

Moving Sheldon over to 4B shouldn't have come as some surprise.  It's actually a very sneaky move on the part of the writers and TPTB.  If they decide it isn't working they move Sheldon back to 4A, Amy back to her apartment, and you return to having all three of them back in 4A.   If Lenny had moved over there, it's tougher to justify them moving Lenny back into 4A, to return to the status quo,  even if Amy moved out of Leonard's room.  

I must say I completely understand the skepticism here.    By disguising this as a Shamy experiment, TPTB have written themselves a way back into the Lenny/Sheldon co-dependency living scenario, if they so choose.   

I believe Sheldon truly gets the fact that Lenny should be living alone as a married couple, but has been willing to overlook this to satisfy his selfish desire/need not to be alone.   This is Sheldon's MO.  

However, I feel that if Amy had agreed to be his roommate after the dissolution of the Shelnard Roommate Agreement, Lenny would in fact be on their own in 4B.  While it is true Sheldon always insisted he would be living with Leonard, this was before he became serious about considering a future with Amy.   Never once has he hinted that he and Amy would be living under the same roof with Lenny. 

There were several ways Amy's sudden need to find somewhere else to temporarily live could have gone:

  • Living with Sheldon, staying in Leonard's old room per Penny's suggestion.  
  • If Sheldon wanted to experiment with sharing a bed, he could have Amy sharing his room with him while having Lenny remain in 4A.
  • He could have suggested Amy stay in 4B, while he remains in 4A with Lenny. 
  • She could stay with Howardette in Stuart's old room.
  • Staying with her mother.

None of these scenarios played out.   Sheldon deliberately chose to excavate himself from the comfort of his apartment/room to put himself in unfamiliar territory with Amy, creating a separation from Lenny.   I get that it is unnerving that Sheldon is the one who seems to have control of the situation by making himself the center of attention, calling all the shots, deciding when he's ready to move out rather that Lenny getting the guts to move themselves out on their own or kick him to the curb.    Is it an ideal situation?   By any means, no.   However, Lenny made their decisions and chose to lie in the bed created for themselves.   Yes, it is flawed.   However, just as Sheldon needs to learn compassion and independence, Lenny need to learn how to not enable bad behavior by giving into Sheldon's whims and being okay with their decision to do so in spite of Sheldon's reactions to it.

However, as far as I am concerned, this also makes Lenny's light as a couple shine.   They believe so strongly in their union and ability to weather any storm that they can joke about their relationship and are willing to sacrifice some of their independence and comfort for the sake of providing homeostasis to a dear friend, who is broken.   Like it or not, Lenny care and worry about Sheldon.   It is easier for them to give into Sheldon and find a little bit of relief in knowing he will be okay than fighting him and having their guilt over abandoning him eat them alive.

This is why I think it is so significant that Sheldon is choosing this experiment in 4B of his own initiative.    Lenny finally have the opportunity for independence without feeling guilty for breaking Sheldon to get it.   Sheldon is making himself Amy's problem.    The ring is still out there.   Amy wants to marry Sheldon.    I just cannot see TPTB going through this experiment without the goal being to set up a permanent Shamy union and eliminating the Sheldon/Lenny living situation.

It would be quite interesting if the 5-week experiment goes by only to find that Shamy and Lenny have gotten used to the new LAs.  Shamy decide to keep things as they are and slowly convert 4B into their home while Lenny remain in 4A.

However, if the writers pull a dirty hat trick, and things permanently go back to status-quo on the LA, I will gladly eat crow and accept your "I told you so" with a great deal of embarrassment on my end.

Edited by jenafan
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You be suprise how many dealers are uperclass/middle class. The working class are always stereotyped and blamed even though they are not the Mr Big.

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16 minutes ago, jenafan said:

Lenny finally have the opportunity for independence without feeling guilty for breaking Sheldon to get it.   Sheldon is making himself Amy's problem.    The ring is still out there.   Amy wants to marry Sheldon.    I just cannot see TPTB going through this experiment without the goal being to set up a permanent Shamy union and eliminating the Sheldon/Lenny living situation.

I can see it as a way to find an excuse to keep the status quo.

  • Lenny perhaps require the intrusive pesky Sheldon to help avoid noticing flaws in each other.
  • Sounds like roles could reverse between Amy and Sheldon. I can't imagine sharing an apartment with him. I really can't imagine someone sharing a bed with him.

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2 hours ago, BigBang15 said:

Just an FYI, The Big Bang Theory is a sitcom. It's not a documentary or even a drama (though it does create drama on this board :)).

Everybody is aware that the show is a sitcom.  Please refrain from pointing that out, it sounds condescending.  

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50 minutes ago, jenafan said:
I must say I completely understand the skepticism here.    By disguising this as a Shamy experiment, TPTB have written themselves a way back into the Lenny/Sheldon co-dependency living scenario, if they so choose.   

I believe Sheldon truly gets the fact that Lenny should be living alone as a married couple, but has been willing to overlook this to satisfy his selfish desire/need not to be alone.   This is Sheldon's MO.  

However, I feel that if Amy had agreed to be his roommate after the dissolution of the Shelnard Roommate Agreement, Lenny would in fact be on their own in 4B.  While it is true Sheldon always insisted he would be living with Leonard, this was before he became serious about considering a future with Amy.   Never once has he hinted that he and Amy would be living under the same roof with Lenny. 

There were several ways Amy's sudden need to find somewhere else to temporarily live could have gone:
 
  • Living with Sheldon, staying in Leonard's old room per Penny's suggestion.  
  • If Sheldon wanted to experiment with sharing a bed, he could have Amy sharing his room with him while having Lenny remain in 4A.
  • He could have suggested Amy stay in 4B, while he remains in 4A with Lenny. 
  • She could stay with Howardette in Stuart's old room.
  • Staying with her mother.
None of these scenarios played out.   Sheldon deliberately chose to excavate himself from the comfort of his apartment/room to put himself in unfamiliar territory with Amy, creating a separation from Lenny.   I get that it is unnerving that Sheldon is the one who seems to have control of the situation by making himself the center of attention, calling all the shots, deciding when he's ready to move out rather that Lenny getting the guts to move themselves out on their own or kick him to the curb.    Is it an ideal situation?   By any means, no.   However, Lenny made their decisions and chose to lie in the bed created for themselves.   Yes, it is flawed.   However, just as Sheldon needs to learn compassion and independence, Lenny need to learn how to not enable bad behavior by giving into Sheldon's whims and being okay with their decision to do so in spite of Sheldon's reactions to it.

However, as far as I am concerned, this also makes Lenny's light as a couple shine.   They believe so strongly in their union and ability to weather any storm that they can joke about their relationship and are willing to sacrifice some of their independence and comfort for the sake of providing homeostasis to a dear friend, who is broken.   Like it or not, Lenny care and worry about Sheldon.   It is easier for them to give into Sheldon and find a little bit of relief in knowing he will be okay than fighting him and having their guilt over abandoning him eat them alive.

This is why I think it is so significant that Sheldon is choosing this experiment in 4B of his own initiative.    Lenny finally have the opportunity for independence without feeling guilty for breaking Sheldon to get it.   Sheldon is making himself Amy's problem.    The ring is still out there.   Amy wants to marry Sheldon.    I just cannot see TPTB going through this experiment without the goal being to set up a permanent Shamy union and eliminating the Sheldon/Lenny living situation.

It would be quite interesting if the 5-week experiment goes by only to find that Shamy and Lenny have gotten used to the new LAs.  Shamy decide to keep things as they are and slowly convert 4B into their home while Lenny remain in 4A.

However, if the writers pull a dirty hat trick, and things permanently go back to status-quo on the LA, I will gladly eat crow and accept your "I told you so" with a great deal of embarrassment on my end.
 


 $. They make the rules. Lenny would have been off years ago if it was up to them. Everything we see now is from Sheldon point of view and what he wants. Everyone is the yes man to Sheldon and what he wants. $, and no one can shit until Sheldon say so. $. It's the Sheldon show. $.  The show doesn't make sense anymore. Ensemble show I seem to remember. Not anymore. it's just a one man show now.
And I know what ppls are thinking hate the show don't watch it. I love Lenny and that's what keeps me invested but my love for the show is
rapidly receding.

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Edited by Tensor
Comments about other poster removed.
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49 minutes ago, jenafan said:

I must say I completely understand the skepticism here.    By disguising this as a Shamy experiment, TPTB have written themselves a way back into the Lenny/Sheldon co-dependency living scenario, if they so choose.   

I believe Sheldon truly gets the fact that Lenny should be living alone as a married couple, but has been willing to overlook this to satisfy his selfish desire/need not to be alone.   This is Sheldon's MO.  

However, I feel that if Amy had agreed to be his roommate after the dissolution of the Shelnard Roommate Agreement, Lenny would in fact be on their own in 4B.  While it is true Sheldon always insisted he would be living with Leonard, this was before he became serious about considering a future with Amy.   Never once has he hinted that he and Amy would be living under the same roof with Lenny. 

There were several ways Amy's sudden need to find somewhere else to temporarily live could have gone:

  • Living with Sheldon, staying in Leonard's old room per Penny's suggestion.  
  • If Sheldon wanted to experiment with sharing a bed, he could have Amy sharing his room with him while having Lenny remain in 4A.
  • He could have suggested Amy stay in 4B, while he remains in 4A with Lenny. 
  • She could stay with Howardette in Stuart's old room.
  • Staying with her mother.

None of these scenarios played out.   Sheldon deliberately chose to excavate himself from the comfort of his apartment/room to put himself in unfamiliar territory with Amy, creating a separation from Lenny.   I get that it is unnerving that Sheldon is the one who seems to have control of the situation by making himself the center of attention, calling all the shots, deciding when he's ready to move out rather that Lenny getting the guts to move themselves out on their own or kick him to the curb.    Is it an ideal situation?   By any means, no.   However, Lenny made their decisions and chose to lie in the bed created for themselves.   Yes, it is flawed.   However, just as Sheldon needs to learn compassion and independence, Lenny need to learn how to not enable bad behavior by giving into Sheldon's whims and being okay with their decision to do so in spite of Sheldon's reactions to it.

However, as far as I am concerned, this also makes Lenny's light as a couple shine.   They believe so strongly in their union and ability to weather any storm that they can joke about their relationship and are willing to sacrifice some of their independence and comfort for the sake of providing homeostasis to a dear friend, who is broken.   Like it or not, Lenny care and worry about Sheldon.   It is easier for them to give into Sheldon and find a little bit of relief in knowing he will be okay than fighting him and having their guilt over abandoning him eat them alive.

This is why I think it is so significant that Sheldon is choosing this experiment in 4B of his own initiative.    Lenny finally have the opportunity for independence without feeling guilty for breaking Sheldon to get it.   Sheldon is making himself Amy's problem.    The ring is still out there.   Amy wants to marry Sheldon.    I just cannot see TPTB going through this experiment without the goal being to set up a permanent Shamy union and eliminating the Sheldon/Lenny living situation.

It would be quite interesting if the 5-week experiment goes by only to find that Shamy and Lenny have gotten used to the new LAs.  Shamy decide to keep things as they are and slowly convert 4B into their home while Lenny remain in 4A.

However, if the writers pull a dirty hat trick, and things permanently go back to status-quo on the LA, I will gladly eat crow and accept your "I told you so" with a great deal of embarrassment on my end.

I like your analysis and I really hope the actual situation is like this. But I think maybe you're interpreting things based on the results here. What I mean is since we already know the experiment actually takes place in 4B, we sure can come up with reasons why 4B is a better choice for character development and storytelling while maybe the writers didn't really think that much.

It's like in 921 when Lenny were having arguments over picking Sheldon's side, some members on the forum said this must be the writers suggesting Penny having problems to step into the adult world, that she's using Sheldon as an excuse to avoid moving out, etc, etc. Then three episodes later, Penny was happily planning her wedding redo. It turned out she had no problem living her adult/married life after all.

I guess as always, we'll have to wait and see. But on the subject of why the writers chose 4B for Shamy's experiment, I agree with @Tensor . I think it's simply because this way it'll be easier to explain in case in the future they decide to go back to the old LA.

Edited by camelliayao
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TBH he looks no different to Jesse from Breaking Bad. IF that is a gauge, to what someone should look like as a drug dealer, I am not getting it. So I Don't think it is bad casting. Unless their is criteria for what a drug dealer should look like. And I Don't think it is about Charcter Growth at all, when it comes to changing the DNA. TPTB are just inconsistent with it. They say they don't want Lenny to move out in fear of changing the DNA of the show. But they have had no problem changing other parts to the show. SO I Don't think character growth is really the point here. In any case I don't see how this is bad casting for Penny's brother. based on what? How is a former drug dealer susposed to look like? Boy this show cannot do anything right can it hahah. Deserves more credit tbh. 

Edited by 3ku11

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1 hour ago, jenafan said:

 

This is why I think it is so significant that Sheldon is choosing this experiment in 4B of his own initiative.    Lenny finally have the opportunity for independence without feeling guilty for breaking Sheldon to get it.   Sheldon is making himself Amy's problem.    The ring is still out there.   Amy wants to marry Sheldon.    I just cannot see TPTB going through this experiment without the goal being to set up a permanent Shamy union and eliminating the Sheldon/Lenny living situation.

It would be quite interesting if the 5-week experiment goes by only to find that Shamy and Lenny have gotten used to the new LAs.  Shamy decide to keep things as they are and slowly convert 4B into their home while Lenny remain in 4A.

However, if the writers pull a dirty hat trick, and things permanently go back to status-quo on the LA, I will gladly eat crow and accept your "I told you so" with a great deal of embarrassment on my end.

Shamy living together from episode 4 this season on will not happen. All Amy would be is the 4th wheel. Amy does want to marry Sheldon but the show IMO is history if they have 3 married couples. The only time you will see Shamy married is in the series finale.

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1 hour ago, Tensor said:

Everybody is aware that the show is a sitcom.  Please refrain from pointing that out, it sounds condescending.  

Well, some people seem to think otherwise. I thought at that point it was necessary to point that out or the conversation may have turned into something worse. People seem to forget it's a sitcom. It's not the rule of life or the end of the world. Wil Wheaton said it best, paraphrasing, "when you wake up in the morning, if the episode is the funniest you ever saw or a total piece of crap, your life isn't going to change".  It wasn't meant to belittle anyone, just as a reminder. I'll leave it at that.

Edited by BigBang15

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9 hours ago, Tonstar17 said:


He looks more of a nerd than a drug dealer. I guess TPTB didn't want to stereotype.

I think they should have used Aaron Paul from "Breaking Bad" just to throw the audience a curve ball.

7 hours ago, Carm6773 said:

IMHO, it's just bad casting

I agree with you even if the casting wasn't as atrocious as the actress they picked for "Meemaw".

Edited by Carlos
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2 hours ago, BigBang15 said:

Well, some people seem to think otherwise.

  If people want to to post about the show in a serious manner, they are allowed to.  If they want to be negative about things, they are allowed to, within certain threads.  What isn't allowed is commentary on other posters posts, or telling other posters how they should post.  You may want to check our rules thread. 

2 hours ago, BigBang15 said:

I thought at that point it was necessary to point that out or the conversation may have turned into something worse. People seem to forget it's a sitcom. 

 It's not your place to point that out.    If you think there is a problem with a post, or the direction a thread is taking, you should report it, and let the staff take care of it.  Not comment on it yourself.  Just for your information, there was nothing wrong with the thread or the posts.

 

2 hours ago, BigBang15 said:

It's not the rule of life or the end of the world. Wil Wheaton said it best, paraphrasing, "when you wake up in the morning, if the episode is the funniest you ever saw or a total piece of crap, your life isn't going to change".  

 Neither is anyone's life going to change, if someone wants to post a serious type post, even though it's well known it's a sitcom.

 

2 hours ago, BigBang15 said:

 It wasn't meant to belittle anyone, just as a reminder. I'll leave it at that.

 It may not have been meant that way, but as I said, it was both condescending and not your job.

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4 hours ago, Chrismo said:

Shamy living together from episode 4 this season on will not happen. All Amy would be is the 4th wheel. Amy does want to marry Sheldon but the show IMO is history if they have 3 married couples. The only time you will see Shamy married is in the series finale.

I think it well happen. I Think they are testing the waters, and if they get a favorable response it well stick. I doubt Amy would want to go back to normal, after living with Sheldon, she has wanted for intimacy for years. And I bet Sheldon well like it more he thought he would, just like with coitus. And prob complain that Lenny are not doing what Amy did!! :sarcastichand:. I think people need to start giving Amy more credit. This ain't Three's company anymore, Amy is very important to the narrative now. IT reminds me of Breaking Bad, Mike was not meant to be an important cog in the begginning. But he was crucial by the end. I see Amy in the same way. I have always had a soft spot for Amy, ever since "Put it on me, put it one me!!". So I hope it sticks. Amy is still a supporting character. But I don't see them living together chaning the DNA that much, seeing they love to throw that around. 4A well still be the main seating area regardless. I do agree if Shamy get married it well be series final though. 

ETA: Air date over here for BBT season ten, is in two days! IT airs 8:30 pm this Wednesday, hot off the sateilite. 

Edited by 3ku11
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8 hours ago, Lionne said:

For a character that we know has been involved in the meth scene for years, that actor as Penny's brother is the most ridiculous casting ever, and makes light of a huge meth epidemic that's killing off hundreds of thousands in the US. There are currently towns here where drug related deaths are outnumbering deaths by old age and natural causes. And the look of many meth chemists and users is quite distinct, with the notorious "meth mouth", meth scabs, emaciated bodies, and dead eyes the usual giveaways to a meth user.

I know that Penny's brother was more of a chemist, so perhaps he was not using so much, but there was a time he had run away from rehab. He's been in jail. And the danger and sheer toxicity of the chemicals used in meth leave their mark too. Having Mr. Golden Haired, innocent looking boy with all his big white horse teeth show up as a longtime, hardcore member of the meth drug scene is just ridiculous, to the point it's offensive towards a very real issue that's crippling America's heartland. Meth has because the #1 problem facing middle America, and is certainly becoming a major problem here in Seattle, where I live, as well. Casting that actor in the role is just a joke, and one in poor taste considering what meth is and what meth does. 

On the one hand, I can see why they did it. I guess it unites two stereotypes about Middle America that are sort of at odds with each other: sunny, can-do,-buttoned-up optimism and meth-usage/dealing? I can see this being a fairly successful Saturday Night Live sketch: 'Tim McGee, Meth Intern' or something like that. Or even a character on Thirty Rock (unsurprising, since Thirty Rock is filled with SNL alumni, right?). So in that sense, an idea for a sketch character is probably about right for an episode already packed with guest stars - you can just wheel out Jack McBrayer, have him say something about how Mister Heisenberg has been noticin' the long hours he puts in at work and how he's due to become Regional Manager any day now, have someone else ask what it is he does, and get horrified when they find out. That sort of thing.

On the other: I am....uncomfortable.....with this show flirting with anything that edgy. In my opinion, the show works best when it is fundamentally good-spirited and sincere. I'm not saying that you can't or shouldn't get comedy out of a fresh-faced meth dealer. I'm saying that I'm a little worried about this show attempting to do so.

Edited by wowbagger
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