Ship Zone [Spoilers] Shamy: Season 10

[shamyyellow]

2 hours ago, Gbb said:

In walks beautiful, intelligent Ramona Nowitski, who he clearly enjoys spending time with. Who, as it turns out, would be very happy to pursue a romantic relationship with Dr. Cooper... One touch of her lips and no one ever has to wonder if Sheldon is with Amy by default. Those lips aren't Amy's. I only want hers. And I don't want to wait one more minute.

Exactly.

I think it's genius that they brought in another female scientist who is not just beautiful and smart, but attentive to Sheldon in a way Amy usually is. We know from S2 and this episode that Ramona is willing and capable of teaching Sheldon new skills, cooking for him, being attentive to him, etc. Not only that, but she came during a time when Sheldon was missing Amy and craving all of those things most... which leads us to the fact that Sheldon really seemed to enjoy Ramona's company and friendship. To me, that is what makes this episode so profound. On paper, Ramona replaces Amy is a new and shiny way that should be more than enough for a man as scientific and clinical as Sheldon. So what does Amy have that Ramona doesn't? His heart.

It's really that simple.

[Soopysue]

I think Steve Molaro would like to respond to that theory:
“I’m really happy with how it turned out. I love that he walks out of his office and just gets into a cab … Then the simplicity of her opening that door was so sweet and honest.”
"We took great pains to make sure that Sheldon was sincerely oblivioous and innocent, and I’d like to say, it was on purpose in that another innocent character, say, SpongeBob, was something he was attracted to on a plane. I’m not going to take credit for that, but while I’m thinking about it, I’m going, "Well, sure, of course he likes SpongeBob," whose entire character is based on innocence."
"It was important to us that Sheldon just honestly consider her as a friend, so after that kiss, there’s a moment where you can see Jim sort of process, and I think he’s thinking, "Oh! Well, all right, everybody was right. Penny was right. This is not OK. What is my next move? Excuse me a moment." [laughs] He gets on a plane, so I don’t know if my heart could’ve handled Sheldon actually being tempted."

Sorry to quote you again@gbb ! But I was wondering which Molaro interview this is from if you can remember ? Is there any more of it ? Thanks so much for sharing !
Now to catch up on everyone's chat !!....this may take a while lol


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Oh wow I caught up and I can feel the love oooozing from this forum - I love it so much ........you've all covered the things I adored but@gbb &@koops you guys are on fire this afternoon !


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Hmmmm I posted & it disappeared so apologies if you get this twice !!!
The love for Shamy is ooozing from the forum today I love it !!!! @koops &@gbb I can't like your posts enough this afternoon !


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[April]

8 minutes ago, Anita said:

-he is able to recognize that other scientist male can be a threat, so why he can't see it here after penny points it out to him?

Probably the same reason he can use irony but has a hard time recognising it. Sure, he knows that he doesn't like if another guy is making a pass at Amy, but he has a hard time recognising it when that actually happens to him. The idea that Ramona is after him when he's in a relationship with Amy is just so absurd to him that he's giving her the benefit of the doubt. But obviously by the next day Penny's words have made enough impact that he's confronting Ramona and he's realising Penny was right.

8 minutes ago, Anita said:

- he didn' notice ramona is a woman? He, himself said amy awakened the sexual criature in him and noticed the pretty girls

Seeing how the episode played out I'm gonna say he probably didn't literally not know or not notice Ramona is a woman (after all he already pointed it out to Amy before they went swimming, not to mention, obviously, the S2 episode) but that may have been a way to express that he wouldn't think differently of her if she were a man. Gender doesn't matter to him here.

8 minutes ago, Anita said:

-he is able to see leonard calling amy at night is inapropiate and not that ramona being in their apartament at the same hour is too? And why amy didn' tell him it is?

Different time zones. It's a couple hours later where Amy is.

8 minutes ago, Anita said:

and in another note.

Ramona bought the toblerone in a duty free, in an aiport I guess, so she landed on Caltech with pursuing sheldon in her mind.

why penny got mad because Leonard did not describe ramona's looks to her, she did know her physically.

Penny got mad that she didn't get details like "Ramona touched him" and "Sheldon didn't use disinfectant!"

As an aside:

The gang's reaction to this just strikes me as so outdated. Like they didn't get the memo that Sheldon isn't freaking out about these things anymore. The show hasn't done these kinds of jokes in ages and even shown Sheldon being relatively comfortable with physical touch (obviously mostly from Amy but there've been other instances as well) which is a strong contrast to early seasons when he would freak out about everything. This also gels pretty well with Amy's ketchup bottle comment cause it has been such a long journey for them where physical contact of all sorts has been such a struggle. But now Sheldon has mostly gotten over it to the point where it doesn't play much of a role anymore.

[wowbagger]

Right, just finished watching, and here are my Very Important Thoughts.

Okay, I was, to put it mildly, unimpressed by the premise of this episode. I thought the Ramona, now with Bunny Boiler! action proposal trigger was dumb, low-key sexist and tooth-grindingly hackneyed. I didn't like that the show treated Sheldon as property to be guarded, or a child to be protected. I didn't like Amy's 'I GAVE YOU ONE JOB!' line. And I , like @mirs1, disliked that the Shamy proposal would carry the whiff of assault/exploitation/whatever.

And.....I haven't changed my mind about any of those things. 

But goddammit if the writing and acting didn't sell the shit out of it. Incidentally, is it me or has the cast been given wheatgrass shots and cleansing retreats this season? Even when the writing flounders, their energy and chemistry has tended to bring the gags home. In a way that I don't think was happening with the limp back halves of seasons past.

I mean, even when I'm wincing at Amy's ketchup bottle line, or the gag about Sheldon running out into traffic, I can't hold back the guilty giggle. Because Rauch, Bialik and Cuoco are killing it. I don't know how Bialik manages to have chemistry with the rest of the cast on Skype, but I am very, very grateful. So yes, even as I roll my eyes at the idea that the gang is supposed to keep Sheldon on some sort of leash, I melted at Penny's exhausted 'Don't look at me like that, I tried' to the PAmy portrait. I am a whore for PAmy. What can I say.

And even when I think 'Jesus, guys, calm the fuck down' at the gang's overreaction at Sheldon and Ramona's lunch, their furious yelping kaffeeklatsches are delivered with such charm and conviction that I am 'awww'ing as I am laughing. By the way, I am with @koops when she wonders whether the writers were pulling shippers' legs with those sequences - affectionately, of course. 'OH MY GOD HE MADE HER LAUGH!' 'OH MY GOD SHE TOUCHED HIS HAND WHAT COULD IT MEEEEEEEAAAAAANNNNNN?'

And then the gang has dinner. And look, I knew I would be charmed by the gang's attempts to keep Sheldon and Ramona separate, but I didn't know just how much. Rauch spreading her legs as she wriggles between Sheldon and Ramona so that she can drive a bigger wedge between them than her tiny body would otherwise allow? The gang's tense, watchful body language throughout? And then quite possibly the funniest scene the show has pulled off in a long, long while? Sheldon walking Ramona down, Penny's manic 'WE'LL ALL GO!'* and then the gang's oh-so-subtle wriggling between Sheldon and Ramona, one by one? Not since Sheldon played basketball with Bawwy have I laughed quite so much. This is the show's forte - fresh and glorious physical comedy - and oh my God did it deliver. 

I don't know, maybe the answer is simple. Yes, the gang was overreacting and behaving like paranoid - and possessive - mother hens. But it so obviously came from a place of love. And I melt when the gang is clearly affectionate and supportive.

And - as someone who's given Leonard plenty of shit this season - can I just say I found his Toblerone obsession utterly charming? 

Even Raj's romantic sadsackery was imbued with freshness and life. I cackled at the self-awareness of his 'I haven't played the race card yet'.

And I loved that the writers managed to put a little bit of a spin on Sheldon's 'amusing factoids' by having him incorporate internet-listicle terminology like 'the answer will shock you!' in his skype-chat with Amy. 'New Jersey's state bird or murder rate? Both are shocking.'

And look, others have talked about the grammar flirting, so all I can say is this: Sheldon knoweth not how else to admonish but vigorously. Fifty Shades of Grey, eat your heart out.

*I would follow Penny into battle, just FYI.

[April]

13 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

And look, others have talked about the grammar flirting, so all I can say is this: Sheldon knoweth not how else to admonish but vigorously. Fifty Shades of Grey, eat your heart out.

Just look at her face:

She is so into his god damn grammar lectures. I love it!! hahahha

[spidergirl]

I love Mayim 's reference of kligon and stormtrooper costumes  in a shamy wedding, lol!

Shamy wedding, these two words are quite strong but more closer to be real than ever!

 

https://www.yahoo.com/tv/big-bang-theory-postmortem-mayim-bialik-shamys-season-finale-shocker-141411056.html

Edited May 12, 2017 by spidergirl

[koops]

I think what I love about this episode, upon rewatch, is that it's showing us how Sheldon has changed while at the same time he is still Sheldon. With Ramona, he's his usual, oblivious, clueless, uninterested Sheldon from years past. He barely notices her "attributes" and even if he does it's from a very "matter-of-fact" point of view. This is the Sheldon from S2-3 that some parts of the fandom (who has probably quit by now, who knows - and who cares) kept complaining was gone and had been ruined. He's not gone. He's never been gone. He's just put 10 years of human life experience and interaction under his belt, has fallen in love, and has merged his old persona with all these experiences. Of course, this will mean nothing to people who want to dig their heels and insist the show has jumped the shark because the characters haven't remained static caricatures of themselves, but whatever. I think this episode greatly mixed the old and the new.

As for the germophobia and the gang not noticing... well, I think they probably don't pay attention all that much and also I don't think they're as privy as to what goes on behind closed doors in the Cooper-Fowler residence, at least until last week. But it's another thing that makes sense to me. I know some might want Sheldon to only be ok with Amy touching him, but that's not how getting over a phobia works. Amy was the catalyst that made him begin to overcome it, but it's not something that was ever specific to one person. Phobias are serious, general obstacles. And I hope I'm never going to see people (not Shamy fans of course) complain because Sheldon (mostly) got over it, because that's like being upset that someone got over depression. If you enjoy watching someone be in distress because "it's funny", then you're a bully. The show has always found the way to find the humor in the difficulties, but ultimately it's a good thing that Sheldon is probably a lot more relaxed and happy in his every day life because of managing his phobias. And it's nice to watch him be more relaxed as a character too, because you know how much he had to work for it and it's payoff as a viewer. 

[spidergirl]

34 minutes ago, wowbagger said:

And I loved that the writers managed to put a little bit of a spin on Sheldon's 'amusing factoids' by having him incorporate internet-listicle terminology like 'the answer will shock you!' in his skype-chat with Amy. 'New Jersey's state bird or murder rate? Both are shocking.'

And look, others have talked about the grammar flirting, so all I can say is this: Sheldon knoweth not how else to admonish but vigorously. Fifty Shades of Grey, eat your heart out.

*I would follow Penny into battle, just FYI.

Just look at Sheldon as he said this:

Fifty shades of Cooper , Amy's  book in her nightstand, lol!

Edited May 12, 2017 by spidergirl

[koops]

17 minutes ago, April said:

Just look at her face:

She is so into his god damn grammar lectures. I love it!! hahahha

What I adored about it is that there wasn't a double meaning in the sense of Amy trying to get to sex and Sheldon not getting it. The double meaning was that to them this IS literally like sex talk. She loves it! Man. I would say "get married", but that's beyond the point now, isn't it.

[Anita]

5 minutes ago, April said:

Probably the same reason he can use irony but has a hard time recognising it. Sure, he knows that he doesn't like if another guy is making a pass at Amy, but he has a hard time recognising it when that actually happens to him. The idea that Ramona is after him when he's in a relationship with Amy is just so absurd to him that he's giving her the benefit of the doubt. But obviously by the next day Penny's words have made enough impact that he's confronting Ramona and he's realising Penny was right.

I disagree in one thing, he can be oblivious at ramona's advances, he can see just friendship where there is something more so until the talk with penny I'm more or less fine, but the absolute not understanding the situation that he express when penny explains it to him is a little too much.

You are totally oblivious to a situation or you aren't, if  you know that a man can try to get in the way of a relationship you have to know a woman can too, It would seem less forced to me if he had say to penny, I understand what you are saying but I don't think that  it is what is happening here, we are just friends, and the next day he confronts ramona to ensure that is not really what is happening.

I don't know if I'm expressing right what I meant. If the idea of ramona hitting on him is absurd because he is in a relationship with amy , the idea of any person hitting on someone in a relationship is absurd, he is trusting in the honor code of a third person he barely knows.

[djsurrey]

51 minutes ago, Anita said:

I disagree in one thing, he can be oblivious at ramona's advances, he can see just friendship where there is something more so until the talk with penny I'm more or less fine, but the absolute not understanding the situation that he express when penny explains it to him is a little too much.

You are totally oblivious to a situation or you aren't, if  you know that a man can try to get in the way of a relationship you have to know a woman can too, It would seem less forced to me if he had say to penny, I understand what you are saying but I don't think that  it is what is happening here, we are just friends, and the next day he confronts ramona to ensure that is not really what is happening.

I don't know if I'm expressing right what I meant. If the idea of ramona hitting on him is absurd because he is in a relationship with amy , the idea of any person hitting on someone in a relationship is absurd, he is trusting in the honor code of a third person he barely knows.

I thought it was all really silly but there are connections that make it all look very clever. See 

Turns out that Riki Lindhome (who plays Ramona) also did the voice of the popsicle twins in the Spongebob movie (pointed out by #vonmar). The scene from the animated movie:

Quote

He then hears the Popsicle Twins greeting him. He turns around to see them. They ask him to play with him. Plankton gets scared. They say, "Hurry." He gets even more scared. They then say, "Before we melt." He gets even more scared. The Popsicle Twins start laughing as they melt which causes Plankton to run away from them.

The addition of Sheldon watching Spongbob on the plane makes the inclusion of Riki Lindhome look really inspired. So subtle.

"It's too sweet in here!"  

Edited May 12, 2017 by djsurrey

[April]

23 minutes ago, Anita said:

It would seem less forced to me if he had say to penny, I understand what you are saying but I don't think that  it is what is happening here, we are just friends, and the next day he confronts ramona to ensure that is not really what is happening.

That is pretty much how I see what's happening though. He doesn't believe it in the moment cause he thinks they are just friendly colleagues. But he clearly gave Penny's warning enough consideration overnight so that the next day he's confronting Ramona and when it turns out Penny was right he acts accordingly.

[koops]

26 minutes ago, Anita said:

I disagree in one thing, he can be oblivious at ramona's advances, he can see just friendship where there is something more so until the talk with penny I'm more or less fine, but the absolute not understanding the situation that he express when penny explains it to him is a little too much.

You are totally oblivious to a situation or you aren't, if  you know that a man can try to get in the way of a relationship you have to know a woman can too, It would seem less forced to me if he had say to penny, I understand what you are saying but I don't think that  it is what is happening here, we are just friends, and the next day he confronts ramona to ensure that is not really what is happening.

I don't know if I'm expressing right what I meant. If the idea of ramona hitting on him is absurd because he is in a relationship with amy , the idea of any person hitting on someone in a relationship is absurd, he is trusting in the honor code of a third person he barely knows.

I'm confused. Isn't the bold part exactly what happened? Sheldon didn't agree with Penny's assessment of the situation, he confronted Ramona about if immediately, and then found out Penny was right? 

On another note... I didn't pay much attention at first, but after re-watching those scenes a bunch of times I noticed that Ramona does look very upset in the end there. As in, she's being rejected openly and she knows it. I mean, not that I feel sorry for the b***, but it was interesting to me that they didn't have her smirk or be smug or be unaffected by it. That it's a rejection, and there's no question about it. 

[Gbb]

3 hours ago, Soopysue said:

Sorry to quote you again@gbb ! But I was wondering which Molaro interview this is from if you can remember ? Is there any more of it ? Thanks so much for sharing !
Now to catch up on everyone's chat !!....this may take a while lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh wow I caught up and I can feel the love oooozing from this forum - I love it so much ........you've all covered the things I adored but@gbb &@koops you guys are on fire this afternoon !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hmmmm I posted & it disappeared so apologies if you get this twice !!!
The love for Shamy is ooozing from the forum today I love it !!!! @koops &@gbb I can't like your posts enough this afternoon !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Here you go: https://www.tvinsider.com/190019/tbbt-the-big-bang-theory-season-finale-shocker-sheldon-amy-shamy/

And thanks!

Edited May 12, 2017 by Gbb

[Die Zimtzicke]

2 hours ago, djsurrey said:

The addition of Sheldon watching Spongbob on the plane makes the inclusion of Riki Lindhome look really inspired. So subtle.

Spongebob was a part of one of the most important days of Sheldon's life...the day he and Amy went to the aquarium together after they had broken up. It was part of the game they played there.

[joyceraye]

1 hour ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

Spongebob was a part of one of the most important days of Sheldon's life...the day he and Amy went to the aquarium together after they had broken up. It was part of the game they played there.

And after he told Amy while she was driving he didn't want her to be his girlfriend again, he wanted just to be friends   .........  while she was breaking her heart, he was talking about Spongebob.

[djsurrey]

57 minutes ago, joyceraye said:

And after he told Amy while she was driving he didn't want her to be his girlfriend again, he wanted just to be friends   .........  while she was breaking her heart, he was talking about Spongebob.

Which episode?

[vonmar]

6 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

Which episode?

"The Platonic Permutation" (9x9)  Thanksgiving episode.

[djsurrey]

3 hours ago, vonmar said:

"The Platonic Permutation" (9x9)  Thanksgiving episode.

Oh, I see in the tag.

Quote

Amy: Hi, Sheldon. I’m just driving home from my mother’s.

Sheldon: Did you have a nice time?

Amy: I did. Um, listen, I really enjoyed spending this morning with you.

Sheldon: Well, I can’t take all the credit. It was pretty funny when that one anchovy started going the wrong way.

Amy: It was. Uh, listen, I, I was thinking that, um, maybe I’m ready to be your girlfriend again.

Sheldon: Oh. I thought we were just friends.

Amy: We are. But I was hoping, maybe…

Sheldon: Amy, I excel at many things, but getting over you wasn’t one of them. I think I need to just be your friend.

Amy: Okay. I understand.

Sheldon: Good. Oh, I watched a video of the hagfish producing mucus, so I’m gonna change my answer and eat SpongeBob.

Amy: Okay. Sure.

 

Edited May 13, 2017 by djsurrey

[Soopysue]

Here you go: https://www.tvinsider.com/190019/tbbt-the-big-bang-theory-season-finale-shocker-sheldon-amy-shamy/
And thanks!

Thanks so much ! [emoji8]


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[veejay]

10 hours ago, wowbagger said:

Right, just finished watching, and here are my Very Important Thoughts.

......//......

*I would follow Penny into battle, just FYI.

Regardless of my good upbringing and in the name of Penny I would like to give you a big smack of a kiss for this wonderful posting.
Excuse my bold behavior.

[Soopysue]

I'm confused. Isn't the bold part exactly what happened? Sheldon didn't agree with Penny's assessment of the situation, he confronted Ramona about if immediately, and then found out Penny was right? 
On another note... I didn't pay much attention at first, but after re-watching those scenes a bunch of times I noticed that Ramona does look very upset in the end there. As in, she's being rejected openly and she knows it. I mean, not that I feel sorry for the b***, but it was interesting to me that they didn't have her smirk or be smug or be unaffected by it. That it's a rejection, and there's no question about it. 

Yes her expression is very much of someone who was rejected ( skanky bi*ch) - thank God !!!!
Also I noticed that in Sheldon leaving he turns and walks away from bi*ch around the desk the other way - not a big deal but I loved they didn't have him go past her, but rather turn , ignore & flee without so much as looking at her !
God do I hate her !!!! Ugh !


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[spidergirl]

1 hour ago, veejay said:

Regardless of my good upbringing and in the name of Penny I would like to give you a big smack of a kiss for this wonderful posting.
Excuse my bold behavior.

I have always loved the determined side of Penny about things. And she is a shammy shipper since always too. Cant get over of Penny power in this scene! Amy has to know how her bestie did her best about protecting shamy. And so did Bernie.I sense a great girls talk moment somewhere in s11  

[koops]

I hadn't read the entirety of Steve's interviews so this snippet escaped me:

Quote

"I see Sheldon as an innocent bystander [...], and intentionally. I don't know what he's going to do. But if asked the question, he answers it. He's not one to hide or deceive information, ever."

Not that there was any doubt in my mind before, but it's nice to get official confirmation that the writers' minds are on our same wavelength. There's not going to be any stupid drama, with Sheldon trying to hide things from Amy and no question that he was anything but innocent in all this. I think that also partly answers the doubt some might have regarding whether Sheldon proposed out of guilt. He's innocent in what happened, and wouldn't hide it if asked... if he felt guilty in any way, he wouldn't act the way he's acting. I mean, I do think there might be a bit of guilt in him at the fact that he didn't realize sooner what was going on, but that's not something he would propose for. Plus, he's had that idea in his head for 2+ years now. He's had time to think about it.

It's tiresome to see reporters constantly asking if Sheldon is "ready", like he's some sort of dumb idiot who doesn't know what he wants. When has Sheldon ever made a step he wasn't 100% sure of? If anything, he's the opposite. He delays and delays and delays in order to make sure he's certain. And whenever he had reservations about something, he made it clear from the start and worked through them (like he did this season when he agreed to trying living together). I keep going back to Spoiler Alert, but back then it was Amy who was handling the whole situation in an immature way where her desire to live with her boyfriend trumped the reality that it's not the same as getting a roommate (she was all ready to move into Leonard's bedroom with her own bed), that there's a level of intimacy that goes far beyond that and she just wasn't getting it, while Sheldon did. He is more aware of the importance of certain commitments than most give him credit for.

[wowbagger]

yes, the 'commitment phobic' remark always puzzles me about Sheldon, the Man of Many Contracts. Sheldon takes commitments extremely seriously. More than most. That is precisely why he is so wary of taking on new ones. Amy is the opposite. She's impulsive. She hurtles onto new things without thinking them through and is happy to abandon them the instant she has doubts. Look at the moving in episode. One bad night and Amy wanted to call the whole cohabitation experiment off and had to be manipulated into continuing #forscience.