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[Spoilers] Shamy: Season 11


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29 minutes ago, Gbb said:

@April, thanks so much for bringing this up. It's actually something I've been thinking about for a couple of seasons now. And the show itself dealt with it some back in 1 or 2 (whenever Dennis Kim came to campus). It's very difficult for a child prodigy to stay ahead of everyone for his whole career. At some point, he or she begins to level off. It's impossible to stay the smartest one in the room your entire life. But life and work experience and maturity can actually turn you into a better scientist than you were when you were a wunderkind.  And thanks in large measure to the ways Amy in particular and the gang in general have helped teach him how to move past his ego and consider what others have to offer, he's well on his way to being a much better scientist than he was before.

This is  a very interisting point as Sheldon is reaching a point in his professional life that he could have done better for his background as genial child but as every science worker he may experiment tough issues for he to get the sucess he was willing to have since the beginning of his career as physicist. I think it is very meaningful as Sheldon is getting aware of his limitations about some stuff as any scientist is not perfect as he is also a human being with his limitations as everyone else. I really like writers are bringing these kind of issues to the table as follow up of Sheldon's personal growth as he had involved more personally and socially and now he is aware his will is important but many things in work world dont depend only from his mind.

I wonder if this could be a story arc for next seasons  as boys have been accomplishing many things personally like their close relationships ( romantically included) and their careers could be navigating into new "waters" or taking more risks in their present jobs. For a show about nerds and geeks lives from last ten years, I think it would be realistic and give some deep to what they could accomplish in their lives for future.

It is true that as happier a person is , it gets easier to focus in these things that could have been postponed for some reason or focus on those which need more work or some important decisions need to be made.  I think our tbbt boys and girls are able to be sucessfull as they work in all those pending issues , personally  or professionally, they may have. I think it would make great storyplots for next weeks.

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Reminder: This thread only allows positive discussion about Shamy. If you don't dig the Shamy:  

Time flies when we have fun, it is a universal truth. On 24 th Aug 2016 I made my first post in this forum and it has been a joy to share all my fan love for shamy and for tbbt with you all. Thank you

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1 hour ago, Gbb said:

It's very difficult for a child prodigy to stay ahead of everyone for his whole career. At some point, he or she begins to level off. It's impossible to stay the smartest one in the room your entire life.

Especially when that room is an environment like Caltech where you're not the only genius.

1 hour ago, Gbb said:

But life and work experience and maturity can actually turn you into a better scientist than you were when you were a wunderkind.  And thanks in large measure to the ways Amy in particular and the gang in general have helped teach him how to move past his ego and consider what others have to offer, he's well on his way to being a much better scientist than he was before.

My thoughts exactly!

I also think that we can see that in Amy herself. Like with so many other character developments they let her go through that first and then later do something similar with Sheldon. She's had her professional setbacks as well like when she was removed from the monkey study but we've seen her become more and more mature and she's apparently popular with her colleagues and helpful when it comes to cooperative projects. She's also diligent and hard-working as a scientist and I have no doubt that her current success is well earned. I would hope that the writers make Sheldon follow her example and have some success due to that. <3

37 minutes ago, spidergirl said:

I wonder if this could be a story arc for next seasons  as boys have been accomplishing many things personally like their close relationships ( romantically included) and their careers could be navigating into new "waters" or taking more risks in their present jobs. For a show about nerds and geeks lives from last ten years, I think it would be realistic and give some deep to what they could accomplish in their lives for future.

I would like that very much as well. I mean, everyone is going through the typical couples check lists like marriage, kids, etc. when it comes to future story speculations and we're approaching the end of the list for almost all the couples by now so it's time to find some focus in some non-relationship goals. I guess in a way that would bring the show full circle if towards the end the characters are all set up with some good career prospects for the future.

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3 hours ago, Gbb said:

It's very difficult for a child prodigy to stay ahead of everyone for his whole career. At some point, he or she begins to level off. It's impossible to stay the smartest one in the room your entire life.

Teachers hear this a lot from parents who think their special little snowflake should be the smartest kid in the class. They will say, "But he was reading when he was two!" and you kind of have to answer, "Yeah, but now everyone is." I totally agree that Sheldon can't rest on his laurels much longer and the work he's doing with Amy may be exactly what he needs.

2 hours ago, April said:

Especially when that room is an environment like Caltech where you're not the only genius

This is one of the reasons I liked the Cooper-Kripke Inversion so much. It addressed this a bit. I didn't like how Sheldon used Amy to get out of it but it may prove to be foreshadowing. Sheldon will be more successful with Amy than on his own.

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On 8/23/2017 at 6:49 AM, April said:

Alright then we got some spoilers for 11x02 (paraphrased below in italic) in the DT and nothing really for Shamy as a couple, but rather individually:

- Leonard gives a depressing interview about physics being dead or something and his negativity is dragging the guys down as well. For Sheldon it's surely nothing new. He's had a crisis with his subject of study already so it'll be interesting how he deals with it. It certainly doesn't help that they have lost the gyroscope project not too long ago. But I really hope his project with Amy can bring him back on track or that this will lead to a new project for the guys altogether.

- Amy meanwhile is off with Bernie discussing their success and how to hide it from their men (to not rub it in while they are down, I presume???) and they end up being competitive over who's more successful (lol) and we'll find out Amy gets a new lab and new funds at Caltech! YAY!! Way to go, Amy!! <3 I love that her stay at Princeton got Amy more prestige at work and isn't brushed under the rug. The idea of keeping it secret from Sheldon sounds a bit like 10x23 and I'm not sure we'll get a resolution here. Though after 11x01 the perfect resolution would of course be that Amy tells him and Sheldon takes it in stride and is happy for her. We'll see.

- Amy's ring is apparently a huge eye catcher! LMAO

Do you know if anyone confirmed the ring is in fact the same Meemaw one? Ive heard it being an eye-catcher and I think large, but I do t recall the Meemaw ring anything extraordinary (IMO).

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27 minutes ago, 2L344 said:

Do you know if anyone confirmed the ring is in fact the same Meemaw one? Ive heard it being an eye-catcher and I think large, but I do t recall the Meemaw ring anything extraordinary (IMO).

I don't recall anyone confirming that it is the same ring or a different one  Here's Memaw's ring....from The Commitment Determination....best view I could find.

 

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7 hours ago, 2L344 said:

Do you know if anyone confirmed the ring is in fact the same Meemaw one? Ive heard it being an eye-catcher and I think large, but I do t recall the Meemaw ring anything extraordinary (IMO).

I doubt anybody got a close up of the ring from where the audience sits during taping. As said, it could just be the studio lights that make it so sparkly and it might not necessarily look like that in the episode.

Unless we hear something different I would assume in the story it's supposed to be the heirloom ring.

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14 hours ago, April said:

 

Sheldon learns bit by bit how to deal with his overbearing ego and I think in a way this may make him a more successful scientist in the end. For one he'll be able to better cooperate with colleagues in his or related fields. 

as a Hollywood analogy, that can happen to many child actors too, like what happened to Sheldon(being a child prodigy and not being able to keep up as an adult).

BTW, I think the loss of the Gyroscopic project had nothing to do with Sheldon or Leonard or Howard's ego at all.  I have found Sheldon to be a bit annoying/unlikable lately(for a variety of reasons I am not going to go into), but I didn't think Sheldon was particularly unpleasant in the Gyroscope project plot at all. He even agreed to donate part of his earnings to Howard's child. In the big picture,  it was a team effort.

There were digs from Sheldon towards others, but there were an equal number of unprovoked digs from Leonard and Howard towards him.So it is unfair to single out Sheldon as the only one who needs learning and growing, the only one who is undeserving of any success and competence,  while others are perfect as they are. He did his part, but he also let Howard and Leonard do their own thing.  It was a bit weird that it was taken away from them...and now Howard is having another baby and Sheldon is engaged, but they both feel somewhat unfulfilled professionally.  It was hard work after all, and their work (so far that we know ) wasn't even acknowledged, or recognized. were they even paid ? On top of that, them losing interest in physics ...its like kicking a limp injured puppy IMO. We don't have enough info so far about what actually happens in 11.02 and how it ends, so it could be a one-off thing, but it would be a good idea to follow it up.  

Off topic, but Sheldon and Penny have faced the most set backs than any other character IMO.  Its not even close. Raj hasn't had a work plot in ages either.  It doesn't have to be a Nobel at all(and it won't be), but I would like to see Sheldon (and Raj and Penny  too) have something positive or at least something fulfilling  in their career....that doesn't end in frustration. 

18 hours ago, April said:

They did a bit with that with the guys' project but ultimately fell back on the old "Sheldon is annoying, let's find a way to get rid of him" idea. Sheldon working together with someone who actually likes his company could actually still hold some story opportunities here.

Ramona likes Sheldon and is in the same field as Sheldon. But given the way they ended things with her involvement with Shamy, I wouldn't trust them to bring her back or do something with her that involves her professionally with Sheldon. Dave is also another character who liked Sheldon(and Leonard) .  The project with Amy is something with the most potential. But TBH, personal animosity should be set aside to hire the best person for a job, so I don't have an issue with characters working with people they don't like, as long as they don't harp on the differences too much.

16 hours ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

That is true. I have longed for some more of the rarer pairings. I like Amy and Bernie together.

Yes that will be funny. While it is silly to hide success from your male partners(really is there any reason to hide ?), I hope they focus more on the A/B competitive part. 

Edited by serena_1995
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2 minutes ago, serena_1995 said:

So it is unfair to single out Sheldon as ... the only one who is undeserving of even the tiniest of success and competence,  while others are perfect as they are.  

Out of curiosity, when did anyone suggest that??

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Just now, Gbb said:

Out of curiosity, when did anyone suggest that??

LOL Right? Didn't we just write a ton of posts about how Sheldon could become a more competent and successful scientist?? How do you end up with the complete opposite meaning of what the text says?

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23 minutes ago, April said:

LOL Right? Didn't we just write a ton of posts about how Sheldon could become a more competent and successful scientist?? How do you end up with the complete opposite meaning of what the text says?

I'm merely pointing out that I think the loss of the Gyroscope project had nothing to do with Sheldon's ego or his  other unlikable attributes, which was mentioned in some of the posts. And while we don't have enough info, it doesn't look like what happens in 11.02 is either. There was a lot of focus in posts on how other characters have taught Sheldon to improve himself, but thats not relevent to what is happening now.

Edited by serena_1995
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39 minutes ago, serena_1995 said:

I'm merely pointing out that I think the loss of the Gyroscope project had nothing to do with Sheldon's ego or his  other unlikable attributes, which was mentioned in some of the posts. And while we don't have enough info, it doesn't look like what happens in 11.02 is either. There was a lot of focus in posts on how other characters have taught Sheldon to improve himself, but thats not relevent to what is happening now.

Nobody suggested that it was Sheldon's fault they lost the gyroscope project because of his behaviour. Heck, I even named the project as one of the examples where they showed Sheldon actually getting better at cooperation.

The issue is that the show itself often falls back to the "haw haw Sheldon is annoying" jokes combined with the others making snipes at him for no reason which, if you remember the discussions from last season, I'm not a big fan of. Sheldon has been a sweetheart most of the time last season. Sure, occasionally he fucks up but even those fuck ups aren't nearly as bad as some of the shit he pulled years earlier and unlike back then he actually cares now and tries to make up for it. I see a tangible improvement in his behaviour but still the show and by extension the characters treat him as if he's still the same careless ass he was 10 years ago. It's frustrating.

Now, the whole reason the ego part comes into this discussion is because of the Shamy story in 10x23, 11x01 and even 11x02 where it's all about Amy having some success and Sheldon needs to deal with that while also being in a bit of a slump himself. It's all about his ego here and he needs to step aside a bit and leave the spot light to Amy where she deserves it. It can't just always be about how Amy supports him, sometimes he has to support Amy as well and I loved that cause I think that just shows how much he's grown up by now. Personally, I don't see it as him deserving no success or whatever. Instead it's a challenge for the character to overcome which in the end is what drives a story.

Edited by April
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1 hour ago, April said:

Now, the whole reason the ego part comes into this discussion is because of the Shamy story in 10x23, 11x01 and even 11x02 where it's all about Amy having some success and Sheldon needs to deal with that while also being in a bit of a slump himself. It's all about his ego here and he needs to step aside a bit and leave the spot light to Amy where she deserves it. It can't just always be about how Amy supports him, sometimes he has to support Amy as well and I loved that cause I think that just shows how much he's grown up by now. Personally, I don't see it as him deserving no success or whatever. Instead it's a challenge for the character to overcome which in the end is what drives a story.

Ymmv but Imo, Sheldon was never a complete "careless ass". Thats not how Jim Parsons played him imo. He always cared and thats why became a beloved character early on. I think there are examples of him being likable in older years and many of him being an ass in later seasons. Its not so much then vs now,  but about the plot for me i guess. Also, I never said the bold part. And i dont see how Sheldon was in any way egoistic in 10.23. He was supportive of Amy from the get go. But that doesnt change what hapenned to him in his professional life  was kinda shitty and he had a complete right to be upset about it too. Personally, unless a character is fulfilled in their career , i cant feel happy for them and their  (fictional life). So it shouldnt have to be one or another. It can be something  rewarding for Sheldon and other characters at the same time. Its a bit ghoulish(and unromantic) for me, to have one character repeatedly have a near-breakdown and always see it as positive.

Edited by serena_1995
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40 minutes ago, serena_1995 said:

Ymmv but Imo, Sheldon was never a complete "careless ass". Thats not how Jim Parsons played him imo. He always cared and thats why became a beloved character early on. I think there are examples of him being likable in older years and many of him being an ass in later seasons. Its not so much then vs now,  but about the plot for me i guess.

Sure, it's not a 100% black and white which is also why I think the idea that some people have of him in early seasons as "robot Sheldon" is complete rubbish. But there's still a tangible difference with his approach, which is my point. In the past he cared sometimes but he didn't like to admit it or he tried to suppress his emotions somehow or tried to weasel his way out of it some other way. Today he openly cares and isn't afraid to show a more vulnerable side and he's quick to apologise and make up for his mistakes. Again, not saying he's flawless today but he has improved a lot.

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Also, I never said the bold part.

I never said you said the bold part. What is it with you misunderstanding posts today?

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And i dont see how Sheldon was in any way egoistic in 10.23. He was supportive of Amy from the get go.

Nobody said he was egoistic. He has a big ego but that doesn't mean I accused him of acting on it specifically in 10x23. He tried to be supportive from the get go and I loved that. But he still was too upset at that point and overreacted (thinking Amy would totally leave him and such) so he needed Leonard to give him a push into the right direction. Nothing wrong with that. His reaction is understandable given the circumstances. But he needed to get over his ego in the sense that he needed to put his personal needs aside and let Amy go with his full support.

And again, there's a bigger issue with his ego in 11x01 where he kinda sorta ruins the dinner with Amy's colleagues because he only wants to talk about himself while they were praising Amy's accomplishments. The conflict is explicitly about how he needs to take a step back and let her enjoy the spot light for a bit.

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But that doesnt change what hapenned to him in his professional life  was kinda shitty and he had a complete right to be upset about it too. Personally, unless a character is fulfilled in their career , i cant feel happy for them and their  (fictional life). So it shouldnt have to be one or another. It can be something  rewarding for Sheldon and other characters at the same time. Its a bit ghoulish(and unromantic) for me, to have one character repeatedly have a near-breakdown and always see it as positive, when i think all characters have their flaws to different extents.  

First of all: This is a comedy and somehow something will always go wrong. So when everything is going ridiculously smoothly in his private life chances are something will go haywire at work. That's just Writing 101: conflict equals story.

Secondly: If your complaint lies with the show putting an overemphasis on Sheldon while ignoring the other characters then sure, I'm all with you here. I'd love if the other characters and their flaws would get similar attention and plotlines dedicated to them overcoming their own challenges. But this is not the thread to discuss that. If you haven't noticed this is the Shamy thread and it's all about Sheldon and Amy here. ;)

Edited by April
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45 minutes ago, April said:

First of all: This is a comedy and somehow something will always go wrong. So when everything is going ridiculously smoothly in his private life chances are something will go haywire at work. That's just Writing 101: conflict equals story.

Yeah, conflict does drive the work vs relationship story, but it can sometimes be constructive too.  Like how they have handled Amy as a character. While 10.24 was a challenge for Shamy,  both relationship and work are going great for Amy now and they can still derive comedy from that. So they can do the same for Sheldon too.  Maybe not right now given the circumstances , but maybe sometime later.

 On the other extreme, the writers  have made long running jokes of Penny making bad dating choices and also failing at work - acting,  waitressing, college and the misery of her current job...so i can see the point in things going hay wire at both work and private life and getting comedy from that too. But I agree, i wont go further than that, since that would be a topic for another thread. 

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1 minute ago, serena_1995 said:

Yeah, conflict does drive the work vs relationship story, but it can sometimes be constructive too.  Like how they have handled Amy as a character. While 10.24 was a challenge for Shamy,  both relationship and work are going great for Amy now and they can still derive comedy from that. So they can do the same for Sheldon too.  Maybe not right now given the circumstances , but maybe sometime later.

And Sheldon reaching that point where both private and personal life will be rewarding was exactly what I was talking about earlier. :)

As said, they went with a lot of development for Amy early on and much quicker but in some broad strokes you can see what they'll do with Sheldon later cause in the end they're cut from the same cloth, as the writers like to say. Amy was condescending and rude early on and we saw her being kicked from projects cause she wasn't conducting herself properly with the test subjects. As she matured it got better and we saw her being liked by colleagues and cooperating on projects with them and now getting to go to Princeton where they apparently love her and it gets her further success at Caltech. Sure, her arc here didn't get the same screen time as Sheldon's issues do (and to be fair nobody gets the screen time Sheldon does so that's a bit of a moot point) but I think overall they make for a coherent development of her character and I think Sheldon could follow those footsteps - especially with her as a partner both in life and professionally at this side.

1 minute ago, serena_1995 said:

 On the other extreme, the writers  have made long running jokes of Penny making bad dating choices and also failing at work - acting,  waitressing, college and the misery of her current job...so i can see the point in things going hay wire at both work and private life and getting comedy from that too. But I agree, i wont go further than that, since that would be a topic for another thread. 

Indeed. I think there's no limit on what can go wrong but rather on what can go right. If too much is going right it can get boring easily or so writing wisdom tells us.

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48 minutes ago, April said:

Now that we know Amy is getting a new lab and everything I have another thing for my wish list:

Sheldon visits her in the new lab for lunch! Pretty please, writers?? :wub:

(I always loved them eating lunch in Amy's lab, be it at UCLA or now Caltech.)

Yeah that would be great to see. Or maybe they could be working on their project together and they have a lunch break in the lab :)

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2 hours ago, BlackWhiteRose said:

So happy Shamy are engaged! *awwwwwwww* I just love them so much together :wub:

me too:icon_razz:

i wonder if they will get married in season 11 or 12, it will likely be a long engagement. At least longer than I want:icon_biggrin:

 

1 hour ago, April said:

Now that we know Amy is getting a new lab and everything I have another thing for my wish list:

Sheldon visits her in the new lab for lunch! Pretty please, writers?? :wub:

(I always loved them eating lunch in Amy's lab, be it at UCLA or now Caltech.)

 

51 minutes ago, Jonny said:

Yeah that would be great to see. Or maybe they could be working on their project together and they have a lunch break in the lab :)

I loved all the lab episodes, yes more please

 

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4 hours ago, mirs1 said:

I hope to see more shamy working together at their project this season! My wish list for s. 11 includes that and sheldon meeting amy's parents on screen...btw, isn't that wonderful that now we know for a fact they are both in the picture in some form?

For the rest, I'm not overly interested in wedding preparations and stuff, but a couple of mentions here and there would be nice. As for the wedding, no idea when it will take place. The other couples were engaged at least a season. Since shamy are already living together and we got plenty of plots last season about them adjusting to ''married'' life, it doesn't really make a difference to me if that happens in s. 11 or 12, but I must admit i'm curious about how it will turn out and what kinds of sheneganigs are waiting for us!

Yes it is! Now I just want to see it lol

You know my thoughts already on the wedding planning stuff in that I want to see some of it, especially with two people as quirky as these two lol. It will be interesting to see when the writers actually start having them talking about it, I am sure they have an episode perhaps in mind when they want them to be married by it's just getting there.

With the time jump it makes sense to me that it is this season that it happens rather than Season 12 and like you said they have been living together for a while now so I don't see the point in really dragging it out.

Edited by Jonny
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