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Chit Chat: Season 11


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7 minutes ago, mirs1 said:

Jim Parsons is pitching something Iike that, ahahah!

More seriousIy, though, the canceIIation Ieft a huge hoIe in ABC schedule, so maybe they'II arrange something Iike that; anyway, I think writing her off and continuing with the show it might be equally controversiaI, and not very profitable;  I guess they'II take some time to see if that's a viable solution

I’d think it’s dead - too much identification with Ms Barr, plus the politics mixed in. Eponymous shows are challenging. Taggart survived the death of  the character Taggert, but Mark MacManus actually died. That’s a lot to ask of a currently alive actor if you want to replicate the success.  I know the show must go on but surely there are limits. 

But this from Mr Parsons was a hoot. Well played.

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10 minutes ago, JE7 said:

Sorry but no you don't have free speech in Germany at least not a Americans define it. I live in the American South we are not proud of the klu klux klan but we can't be imprisoned for talking about them, displaying their sigils or collecting their paraphernalia. In your country you had the Nazis and can go to prison for those things. If you can be imprisoned for saying something that's not free speach.

The "fire" exception is because it could cause a panic that would cause physical injury to others this instance dosent meet that criteria 

No one is imprisoning Ms Barr. She was operating in a commercial environment and her behaviour was too costly - and perhaps distasteful - for the organisation paying for the show. It’s capitalism what got her, not snowflakes. She can go wild on Twitter now, without consequence. Let’s see how that pans out. There may be a  paying market for what she says. What are the chances.

Edited by Nogravitasatall
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14 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

Apparently one can be imprisoned for lying to the FBI.

 

14 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

Apparently one can be imprisoned for lying to the FBI.

Yes and that's a wonderful trap you say you arrived at a place at 5  the cctv shows it was 5: 03 you just lied to the FBI and can be prosecuted....

Unless of course you "cooperate" 

12 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

What are the chances.

Quite good actually

Edited by JE7

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4 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

Apparently one can be imprisoned for lying to the FBI.

Yes, and that’s under a law passed by the duly elected representatives. That’s not limiting one’s freedom of speech I’d think, just one’s freedom of lying. You can say anything you want that’s not a lie.

Dont think we have an equivalent, though some of the anti-terror provisions are draconian. So we probably do.

9 minutes ago, JE7 said:

Quite good actually

Slightly horrified that I can suspect that this might be true.  :) 

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21 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

No one is imprisoning Ms Barr. She was operating in a commercial environment and her behaviour was too costly - and perhaps distasteful - for the organisation paying for the show. It’s capitalism what got her, not snowflakes. She can go wild on Twitter now, without consequence. Let’s see how that pans out. There may be a  paying market for what she says. What are the chances.

The show is (was) popular and profitable, we will never know if it would have hurt the network because they cancelled it which WILL hurt them from lost revenue among other ways.

We don't know what the monatery damage might have been (capitalism) because they made a political decision before that happened. It may have hurt them it may not we will never know

Edited by JE7

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54 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

That’s not limiting one’s freedom of speech I’d think, just one’s freedom of lying. You can say anything you want that’s not a lie.

Dont think we have an equivalent, though some of the anti-terror provisions are draconian. So we probably do.

That is not really true. You can't conspire to have someone commit a crime. Extortion is a crime.  I imagine there must be restrictions on uttering threats. There are always limits.

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26 minutes ago, JE7 said:

The show is (was) popular and profitable, we will never know if it would have hurt the network because they cancelled it which WILL hurt them from lost revenue among other ways.

We don't know what the monatery damage might have been (capitalism) because they made a political decision before that happened. It may have hurt them it may not we will never know

Well if it’s principle then that’s something. Principles over profits. I read some of her stuff and it was just offensive in many dimensions.  But they legitimately decided not to proceed with their commercial arrangement. Overall it must have been that it didn’t make sense to them to remain associated with her.

Brands have value.  Disney is behind ABC - and they value their brand and they maintain standards. Try not smiling as Disneyland front of house cast and see how you go. Lots of reasons not to give the weight of ABC and Disney to a repulsive loon on Twitter. Which is what she now may be reduced to. A rich loon, but loon.

Sad for the little people but weigh up the harm and it might well be that the public sphere is better off with loons remaining invalidated and not enabled. The network claimed responsibility for its content. Nobody was silenced politically, as I see it. She just lost one platform, but she still has Twitter, if she wants to go off. Twitter don’t care about their content, apparently. She wasn’t shushed there. But she has been held to account IRL.

Happy to let this go now. I’m not even watching that show (never got on board) and we have our own racists *sigh*.

Cheers.

 

 

10 minutes ago, djsurrey said:

That is not really true. You can't conspire to have someone commit a crime. Extortion is a crime.  I imagine there must be restrictions on uttering threats. There are always limits.

I meant to the FBI in the course of interrogative discourse. Yes there are limits. The limits of speech are a legal rabbit hole. I’m not a legal ferret but I think, in terms of interrogations, get a lawyer or stay silent are safe rules. And don’t ever say or write anything in public that you wouldn’t want your mum to hear, is a pretty safe rule too.

 

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2 hours ago, JE7 said:

Sorry but no you don't have free speech in Germany at least not a Americans define it. I live in the American South we are not proud of the klu klux klan but we can't be imprisoned for talking about them, displaying their sigils or collecting their paraphernalia. In your country you had the Nazis and can go to prison for those things. If you can be imprisoned just for saying something that's not free speach.

Actually, you can speak about the Nazis, I and other people do it all the time and it depends on context, like historical . What you can't do is display Nazi paraphernalia in public. You can hang up Nazi flags inside your home, use Hitler bedsheets or draw thousands of tiny swastikas onto your wallpaper and nobody will be arrested for that (see our first article of constitution).

And while you may think it strange but the German government, no matter what party runs it, takes our past seriously. Because quite frankly, the Ku Klux Klan is a bunch of amateurs compared to what the Nazis did. If the Klan had herded black people into gas chambers (or meat grinders or whatever) to kill them by the hundreds of thousands or millions and maybe started a (new civil) war about the issue, I think we wouldn't see Klan rallies today, at least not in public. Then again, some americans (way too many in my humble view) tend to be ignorant when it comes to their own country's past.

Edited by son-goku5
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I was never a fan of the original show and haven't watched the new one at all.

I am just saying that while an employer does indeed have the right to fire someone over speech that "Harm" done to the brand is a two edged sword. Some people would have been unhappy with them and stopped watching 5here network if the show continued, some are mad at them for cancelling it and will stop watching their network.

They simply had to chose which viewers they wanted to piss off and they chose the ones who don't agree with them politically.

And no I will never again go to a Disney park or watch one of their shows. Their PC crusade has ruined the Muppets and star wars already I won't encourage them to do more with any financial support

14 minutes ago, son-goku5 said:

Actually, you can speak about the Nazis, I and other people do it all the time and it depends on context, like historical . What you can't do is display Nazi paraphernalia in public. You can hang up Nazi flags inside your home, use Hitler bedsheets or draw thousands of tiny swastikas onto your wallpaper and nobody will be arrested for that (see our first article of constitution).

And while you may think it strange but the German government, no matter what party runs it, takes our past seriously. Because quite frankly, the Ku Klux Klan is a bunch of amateurs compared to what the Nazis did. If the Klan had herded black people into gas chambers (or meat grinders or whatever) to kill them by the hundreds of thousands or millions and maybe started a (new civil) war about the issue, I think we wouldn't see Klan rallies today, at least not in public. Then again, some americans (way too many in my humble view) tend to be ignorant when it comes to their own country's past.

None of us can hide the bad acts in our history  after all "those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it" 

While I like and respect our European members I would not want to live under your governments, but then again I don't have much respect for my own either

Edited by JE7
Those who would trade liberty for security deserve neither - Benjamin Franklin

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9 minutes ago, son-goku5 said:

Actually, you can speak about the Nazis, I and other people do it all the time and it depends on context, like historical . What you can't do is display Nazi paraphernalia in public. You can hang up Nazi flags inside your home, use Hitler bedsheets or draw thousands of tiny swastikas onto your wallpaper and nobody will be arrested for that (see our first article of constitution).

And while you may think it strange but the German government, no matter what party runs it, takes our past seriously. Because quite frankly, the Ku Klux Klan is a bunch of amateurs compared to what the Nazis did. If the Klan had herded black people into gas chambers (or meat grinders or whatever) to kill them by the hundreds of thousands or millions and maybe started a (new civil) war about the issue, I think we wouldn't see Klan rallies today, at least not in public. Then again, some americans (way too many in my humble view) tend to be ignorant when it comes to their own country's past.

They also started publishing 'Mein Kampf' again in Germany last year for the first time in 70 years. It was an annotated edition with academic notes accompanying it that were critical of the book.

I know they put restrictions on some video games in Germany that involved/featured Nazis, for example the Wolfenstein games were heavily censored.

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2 hours ago, JE7 said:

The show is (was) popular and profitable, we will never know if it would have hurt the network because they cancelled it which WILL hurt them from lost revenue among other ways.

We don't know what the monatery damage might have been (capitalism) because they made a political decision before that happened. It may have hurt them it may not we will never know

Because of Ms Barr’s history, I’m betting there was an insurance policy in place to protect the production company against the results of her doing something similar to what brought about the cancellation...

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36 minutes ago, Jonny said:

I know they put restrictions on some video games in Germany that involved/featured Nazis, for example the Wolfenstein games were heavily censored.

Yes, because of the display of Nazi symbols. Usually, you have to import the US or UK versions if oyu want to play it.

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25 minutes ago, hokie3457 said:

Because of Ms Barr’s history, I’m betting there was an insurance policy in place to protect the production company against the results of her doing something similar to what brought about the cancellation...

I wondered about this. Premium would have been stratospheric.

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26 minutes ago, hokie3457 said:

Because of Ms Barr’s history, I’m betting there was an insurance policy in place to protect the production company against the results of her doing something similar to what brought about the cancellation...

The production company maybe but the network is doubtful since they only buy the show not own or produce it

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6 hours ago, Chrismo said:

Thes reason they don’t have jobs is Disney. The reason they had jobs was because  of Roseanne 

If they were concerned about morality the show never would have been on the air.

It seems Sara has a career because of Roseanne

That's true, but then so does Johnny Galecki, John Goodman, Laurie Metcalf and others. Are they being attacked for not standing up to Roseanne?

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9 minutes ago, chucky said:

That's true, but then so does Johnny Galecki, John Goodman, Laurie Metcalf and others. Are they being attacked for not standing up to Roseanne?

Sara GiIbert was a producer in the revivaI (as Roseanne Barr was) and among the ones who had the idea for it; she has been attacked mainIy in this capacity, according to some fans (I kinda agree, TBH) she knew Roseanne's views and behaviours beforehand and shouId have expected this outcome. Anyway, in the comments I've read to Sara's tweets about the situation aIso the other actors are caIIed out for not standing up to Roseanne, Iess vehementIy than Sara for sure, but they are caIIed out

Edited by mirs1
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I read that Roseanne has now doubled down on her remarks and also said something about how she's sorry for those people working behind the cameras.

To that, I only have to say one thing: If Ms Barr was really concerned about the other people working on the show, she had only one thing to do. NOT SAY THESE THINGS. But apparently, she was unable to control herself and just had to be publicly racist

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2 minutes ago, mirs1 said:

Sara GiIbert was a producer in the revivaI (as Roseanne Barr was) and among the ones who had the idea for it; she has been attacked mainIy in this capacity, according to some fans (I kinda agree, TBH) she knew Roseanne's views and behaviours beforehand and shouId have expected this outcome. Anyway, in the comments I've read to Sara's tweets about the situation aIso the other actors are caIIed out for not standing up to Roseanne, Iess vehementIy than Sara for sure, but they are caIIed out

I respect your opinion, but really, I've moved on and don't really care 1 iota about Roseanne. She's really not worth wasting any more of my time. I'm only responding to that I am moving on from this topic. You do make some interesting points,

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33 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

I'm not really seeing the point of cancelling the show since the season was already over. Seems like a hasty decision

Because now there won't be a second season. Meaning, the actors on the show have time for other projects (if they have some lined up)

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2 minutes ago, son-goku5 said:

Because now there won't be a second season. Meaning, the actors on the show have time for other projects (if they have some lined up)

I think the decision effects the crew more than the actors.

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They already ordered a second season so there might have been the need to make a quick decision before they start going into production. They've already struggled with negative publicity recently because of Roseanne Barr (like urging viewers to give the show a chance and separate it from her online antics) so I guess this last one was the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back and they took the opportunity to get out of this mess while they still can.

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14 hours ago, joyceraye said:

doubt most people in the world would have heard of the bloke she was poking fun at 

The really offensive ones were about Chelsea Clinton and Valerie Jarrett, Hillary Clinton's daughter and Obama's press secretary. This was a series of offensive tweets.

17 hours ago, BigBangEnthusiast said:

Me too. Poor Sara has received a lot of backlash on Twitter

Sara spoke up against it right away. So hopefully that dies down quickly.

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