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[Spoilers] Season 11 Discussion Thread

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I only have one wish for season 11 (actually two wishes: more Lenny screen time would be nice, but that's not gonna happen) that the writers tries to make the show funny again. The LOL moments in season 10 was few and far between ,especially in the second half of the season. There were way too many filler episodes in my opinion in the previous season. 

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15 hours ago, spidergirl said:

 Mayim is one person who perform Amy. It can not be seen imo as both were real.

And for last Tv couples with good chemestry  are only these who have an intense erotic spark and the others could not be even loved? It is really good most of people in this world could be love and have offspring and many of them are not beautiful in an overall sense or take care for erotic stuff as one of their priorities. Love expresses in many ways as erotic stuff and even these people we like less have the right of be happy.

I think the problem is that chemistry (or sexual chemistry) between 2 actors in a couple is also a subjective thing. Personally I think that Lenny have that in spades, and believe that Shamy don't, but that is just me. Whenever I see Shamy get physical it doesn't do anything for me even if I do care about their overall story. I mean, I'd rather see less of it, and have a little bit more balance in the show, but I'm not holding my breath on that one, the current state of affairs being what it is.

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2 minutes ago, April said:

And a lot of people find that interaction rather cute and sweet precisely because it is changing and you can see him getting more comfortable with Amy. And vice versa as well cause Amy is also pretty awkward and stiff at times in her own way. Watching these two slowly figuring this whole thing out is part of the appeal for their fans. If that's not your thing then obviously that's not the couple for you. But again, different people like different things. Nothing wrong with that.

(I mean seriously, if I want to watch perfectly sexy and flawlessly choreographed sex(y) scenes I just rewatch Sense8. That's really not what I'm in for with TBBT. LOL)

Amen to that, expecially for the Sense8 part, lol! Can't still believe they cancelled that awesome show! Thanks goodness we'll get at least a proper ending!

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27 minutes ago, bfm said:

The thing is, Shamy's physical affection is awkward/stiff on purpose. Sheldon is not comfortable with physical touch and so, like most of his hugs (it's better now with Amy), his kisses and caresses are kind of stiff. It's a character thing, it's not because of the actors.

Indeed. I love it when Sheldon goes all serious and formal when he's feeling affectionate and Amy doesn't tell him to loosen up. His 'Hello' is so sweet ! 

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2 hours ago, Carlos said:

I think the problem is that chemistry (or sexual chemistry) between 2 actors in a couple is also a subjective thing. Personally I think that Lenny have that in spades, and believe that Shamy don't, but that is just me. Whenever I see Shamy get physical it doesn't do anything for me even if I do care about their overall story. I mean, I'd rather see less of it, and have a little bit more balance in the show, but I'm not holding my breath on that one, the current state of affairs being what it is.

What we are more into or not about ships is really a subjective matter, every personal taste is subjective, not a universal thing. People enjoy someone or something about same matter and many other more could feel in same way.  It is cool but it doesnt make it as something everyone should follow.

There are few things on the show I could care less but as I know it pleases many viewers, who sometimes are not much into about what  I care more about. It is fair enough and doesnt hurt anyone. There is space for everyone's tastes.

Edited by spidergirl
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1 hour ago, bfm said:

The thing is, Shamy's physical affection is awkward/stiff on purpose. Sheldon is not comfortable with physical touch and so, like most of his hugs (it's better now with Amy), his kisses and caresses are kind of stiff. It's a character thing, it's not because of the actors.

Emily had the line

Quote

Emily: Uh, usually on first dates, I talk about music and stuff, but I was promised weird, so let's do this.

which sums up relationships on TBBT. I'm expecting weird.

 

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On 7/26/2017 at 9:31 AM, JohnPhD said:

In contrast, there has never been the slightest chemistry between JP and MB. MB was brought in to play Amy as an obnoxious woman with no sex-appeal obsessed with a man indifferent to sex, whose belief that Sheldon was her "boyfriend" was a joke. She played this role perfectly well. She has utterly failed to convert Amy into a woman that Sheldon could actually love and want to have sex with. Perhaps the character transformation was too drastic and nobody could have done it. Anyway, MB couldn't. Sheldon's declarations of love have been completely unbelievable because no-one could love Amy. The lack of any erotic spark between them makes the spectacle of their getting physical even to the extent of a kiss quite creepy to watch

I think they have great chemistry personally. To each his own, or her own as the case may be. Mayim and Amy as played by Mayim is wonderful to me.

On 7/26/2017 at 11:40 AM, JohnPhD said:

Most couple's physical relationships are not watched by anyone else. There is no need to show a couple getting -physical in a TV show unless it's enjoyable to watch, as Penny and Leonard are.

I'm happy for the people who like it but I don't think it's enjoyable at all, I don't like them as a couple, and I'm glad they don't do it much physicality anymore. But again, to each his own. There's a storyline for everyone.

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On 7/27/2017 at 5:11 AM, spidergirl said:

Sheldon and Amy are enjoyable to watch  in bed together. That's  why they are shown there many times . For their fans there is the need of seeing them there and show staff make it real.

I'll  rather see Lenny in bed together then Shamy tbh. I have never had any interest in Shamy. And if they wrote out Amy I would not miss her tbh. I mean you see more Shamy pillow talk then Lenny these days. Which I don't like. Lenny were the mainstream, hero and heroine of the series. And I liked Shamy better when they were this weird alternative couple. Before they had sex (Yes I said sex not coitus). But some where along the line they change that. And relegated Johnny and Kaley to a supporting role. And look if your invested in Shamy great.

I'm just not invested in them. I just miss the balance, and the friendship dynamics this show once had. Till they'd entered some kinda relationship vortex. Personally take Amy out of the picture. From a comedy stand point. Things improve. And this is not me bashing Amy. I think she's super interesting at times. I just don't get Shamys appeal. It's not really a relationship when its all on one persons terms Sheldon. I just think Sheldon would be a lot better, heck the show would benefit more from Sheldon being single. Not that I expect, that to happen at this stage of the series's. 

This series quality clearly has degressed over the past three-four seasons. It has gotten very predictable. With a two year extension. It concerns me how much the quality can decline. You would expect first 5 tapings of Season 11. To be Shamy centric. So for fans of other aspects. Like other characters, the original comedy, science e.t.c. Well Season 11 offer them much? I don't know. I just don't know. 

Edited by 3ku11
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12 hours ago, April said:

...../

And that leads me to the core problem t: Lenny itself, specifically that the writers don't have the creative drive for them that they have for the other two couples. That is the thing that needs fixing  - not with writing out some other character that will only drive attention away from the very thing that needs fixing! It's like when last year everyone was suggesting "Sheldon needs to move out - once he's out everything will finally be better for Lenny!!" Guess what, Sheldon moved out but the writers concentrated on Sheldon's new experiences instead of making Lenny better.  The only ones who can fix that are the writers by concentrating on Lenny. The easiest way to do this is let Shamy live happily in homeostasis in the background and become the couple at the kitchen island. Wishing bad things on them will only backfire massively if your goal is more attention for Lenny.

A good and reasonable post, April. I think the last paragraph also reflects nearly my impression of the serial.
Without the former creativity of the dialogues, the stories and the jokes with every characters, this series ultimately becomes the pure Sheldon-Show. :scratchhead:
I will certainly not watch the following two years with that premise and I really don't know why I should have to subject myself to that.

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@April   I agree with each of your points, thank you.

o_00408.gif.ef15b471ed2096dd3cdc0f72d110d851.gif

Just for fun: at the sight of Leonard in this little jif, I do imagine at least one of the writers.  :shy:

Edited by veejay
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On 7/18/2017 at 3:54 PM, Carlos said:

I disagree (with Goldie Hawn's character and by extension , you). Penny is the same age as Kaley which sort of proves the point that actresses Penny's age can actually not only make it , but make it big.

Yeah, but Kaley made it big 10 years ago (with BBT). If Kaley/Penny were starting now (10 years older), their chances of getting the type of roles they would want (hot, young girl) are gone.

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12 hours ago, April said:

To be perfectly honest and a bit blunt here but:

I'll never understand the quick-fixes a lot of you guys are coming up with. The show is out of balance, nobody is denying that. But many of the suggestions I've read during my time here simply won't fix that. Quite the opposite actually, they will only make things worse for you. You're shooting yourself in the foot if you want the show to doctor around with some peripheral symptoms that don't address the core problem.

Like, framing Amy as the scapegoat that ruined everything and if you take her out What will happen is: 1) At least half a season if not more will be dedicated to Sheldon dealing with the pain of losing her forever. Look at the breakup arc and how it dealt with that. If you think that Sheldon will go back to being "robotic" or whatever then this alone made it clear that's never ever gonna happen again. 2) You won't automatically get more Lenny stories out of it. Season 9a wasn't the big Lenny era where they suddenly got a ton of amazing stories, now was it? They were relegated to the kitchen area being witnesses and occasionally commenting on Sheldon's life and taking care of him to the point of putting their married life on hold for a year. I don't remember any of you being particularly happy about that.

"But wait," I hear you say, "that was just because Amy was not really gone! What we really want is to let things go back to where it was before S4!!" Okay, pushing aside the fact that Amy won't be completely gone because contracts and such, let's entertain this idea. Let's say Sheldon has a short mourning period and then somehow magically transforms into his former self again what would happen? Looking at the S1-3 stories you'll get: 1) Sheldon third-wheeling Lenny like crazy cause he has no one else. He'll be nosing around their business all the time and I'm sure you'll looooove that. 2) You'll get Penny and Sheldon spending a ton of time together cause S2/3 were just full of that and if you want that again it means endless episodes with Shenny. 3) If you're lucky you'll also get Sheldon spending more time with Leonard and the boys. Again, what you won't get is automatically better and more Lenny stories cause the most important part back then was their will-they-won't-they courtship phase which obviously isn't an option now that they're married.

And that leads me to the core problem: Lenny itself, specifically that the writers don't have the creative drive for them that they have for the other two couples. That is the thing that needs fixing  - not with writing out some other character that will only drive attention away from the very thing that needs fixing! It's like when last year everyone was suggesting "Sheldon needs to move out - once he's out everything will finally be better for Lenny!!" Guess what, Sheldon moved out but the writers concentrated on Sheldon's new experiences instead of making Lenny better.  The only ones who can fix that are the writers by concentrating on Lenny. The easiest way to do this is let Shamy live happily in homeostasis in the background and become the couple at the kitchen island. Wishing bad things on them will only backfire massively if your goal is more attention for Lenny.

Have to say this was an outstanding analysis of the LENNY situation. Totally agree with yr comments.  Some people may not agree with me but this is why JG was hesitant to resign his contract renewal.  Think he wanted better storylines for Penny and Leonard.  Let us hope he was convinced and there will be better stories for LENNY fans to enjoy.

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12 hours ago, April said:

To be perfectly honest and a bit blunt here but:

I'll never understand the quick-fixes a lot of you guys are coming up with. The show is out of balance, nobody is denying that. But many of the suggestions I've read during my time here simply won't fix that. Quite the opposite actually, they will only make things worse for you. You're shooting yourself in the foot if you want the show to doctor around with some peripheral symptoms that don't address the core problem.

Like, framing Amy as the scapegoat that ruined everything and if you take her out What will happen is: 1) At least half a season if not more will be dedicated to Sheldon dealing with the pain of losing her forever. Look at the breakup arc and how it dealt with that. If you think that Sheldon will go back to being "robotic" or whatever then this alone made it clear that's never ever gonna happen again. 2) You won't automatically get more Lenny stories out of it. Season 9a wasn't the big Lenny era where they suddenly got a ton of amazing stories, now was it? They were relegated to the kitchen area being witnesses and occasionally commenting on Sheldon's life and taking care of him to the point of putting their married life on hold for a year. I don't remember any of you being particularly happy about that.

"But wait," I hear you say, "that was just because Amy was not really gone! What we really want is to let things go back to where it was before S4!!" Okay, pushing aside the fact that Amy won't be completely gone because contracts and such, let's entertain this idea. Let's say Sheldon has a short mourning period and then somehow magically transforms into his former self again what would happen? Looking at the S1-3 stories you'll get: 1) Sheldon third-wheeling Lenny like crazy cause he has no one else. He'll be nosing around their business all the time and I'm sure you'll looooove that. 2) You'll get Penny and Sheldon spending a ton of time together cause S2/3 were just full of that and if you want that again it means endless episodes with Shenny. 3) If you're lucky you'll also get Sheldon spending more time with Leonard and the boys. Again, what you won't get is automatically better and more Lenny stories cause the most important part back then was their will-they-won't-they courtship phase which obviously isn't an option now that they're married.

And that leads me to the core problem: Lenny itself, specifically that the writers don't have the creative drive for them that they have for the other two couples. That is the thing that needs fixing  - not with writing out some other character that will only drive attention away from the very thing that needs fixing! It's like when last year everyone was suggesting "Sheldon needs to move out - once he's out everything will finally be better for Lenny!!" Guess what, Sheldon moved out but the writers concentrated on Sheldon's new experiences instead of making Lenny better.  The only ones who can fix that are the writers by concentrating on Lenny. The easiest way to do this is let Shamy live happily in homeostasis in the background and become the couple at the kitchen island. Wishing bad things on them will only backfire massively if your goal is more attention for Lenny.

The current situation is that Shamy scenes are hogging the screentime. A pre-requisite for fixing Lenny is screentime to do it in, so Shamy have to be moved aside. Letting them live happily in the background sounds reasonable, but I don't think the programme makers can be trusted to keep them there. That's why I believe Amy should go - to be safe. And Sheldon could go back to his first love - his own mind.

I certainly don't believe that wonderful Lenny will automatically expand into the space vacated by Shamy, and I don't think anyone else said so. You are quite right that the writing of L & P needs fixing. I would guess they need to change some of the writing team and maybe the showrunner, but I don't claim to know how brilliant Lenny writing is to be achieved. But they had it for many seasons (still a majority of past seasons) so it can be done. And really they only need to give KC half a chance to show what she can do.

Personally I wouldn't mind Sheldon third-wheeling Lenny if it was done well. Lots of sitcom households are eccentric in some way, so why not the Hofstatders and their Sheldon? Plus Sheldon could provide conflict and problems for L&P to confront - we can't have them just being lovey-dovey all the time.

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14 hours ago, 3ku11 said:

I'll  rather see Lenny in bed together then Shamy tbh. I have never had any interest in Shamy. And if they wrote out Amy I would not miss her tbh. I mean you see more Shamy pillow talk then Lenny these days. Which I don't like. Lenny were the mainstream, hero and heroine of the series. And I liked Shamy better when they were this weird alternative couple. Before they had sex (Yes I said sex not coitus). But some where along the line they change that. And relegated Johnny and Kaley to a supporting role. And look if your invested in Shamy great.

I'm just not invested in them. I just miss the balance, and the friendship dynamics this show once had. Till they'd entered some kinda relationship vortex. Personally take Amy out of the picture. From a comedy stand point. Things improve. And this is not me bashing Amy. I think she's super interesting at times. I just don't get Shamys appeal. It's not really a relationship when its all on one persons terms Sheldon. I just think Sheldon would be a lot better, heck the show would benefit more from Sheldon being single. Not that I expect, that to happen at this stage of the series's. 

This series quality clearly has degressed over the past three-four seasons. It has gotten very predictable. With a two year extension. It concerns me how much the quality can decline. You would expect first 5 tapings of Season 11. To be Shamy centric. So for fans of other aspects. Like other characters, the original comedy, science e.t.c. Well Season 11 offer them much? I don't know. I just don't know. 

I won't write a long reply because we have talked about this before, as it is resumes to personal preferences. I would sugest you, if I may, reading the @April s most recent posts in this thread as she  analysed about show' s plots  that really summ up imo so well the divergency of opinions among the fans about the different couples and characters' s plots as well.

 

Edited by spidergirl
A few sentences were improved.
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5 hours ago, April said:

And that leads me to the core problem that you like to ignore: Lenny itself, specifically that the writers don't have the creative drive for them that they have for the other two couples. That is the thing that needs fixing and you need to start with Leonard and Penny themselves - not with writing out some other character that will only drive attention away from the very thing that needs fixing! It's like when last year everyone was suggesting "Sheldon needs to move out - once he's out everything will finally be better for Lenny!!" Guess what, Sheldon moved out but the writers concentrated on Sheldon's new experiences instead of making Lenny better. So you can blame Sheldon and Amy and whoever all you want but it won't fix your Lenny issue at all. The only ones who can fix that are the writers by concentrating on Lenny. The easiest way to do this is let Shamy live happily in homeostasis in the background and become the couple at the kitchen island. Wishing bad things on them will only backfire massively if your goal is more attention for Lenny.

This is the best comment I've read on here in weeks and I thank you for it. Very well thought out and logical. And I totally agree.

If I'm not happy with a character though, I can't blame the characters, because they are all doing the scripts the writers give them to the best of their ability. I wish I knew why the writers didn't care about certain things they used to care about, but I have no clue. I just strongly suspect they are not going to suddenly make Sheldon or Amy miserable when they've got fans who love Sheldon with Amy, which they do, and Young Sheldon to promote.

3 hours ago, April said:

Raj's story is a god damn train wreck although with a bit of potential for some good developments. In both cases of Lenny and Raj the writers need to sit down and hammer out some stories that play to the strengths of the characters and give them some much needed focus.

And I totally agree with this. I used to like Raj. I am starting to dislike him very much. If anyone could go and not be missed, it's the Raj character. There hasn't been any point to him for ages.

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30 minutes ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

 

Sorry, quoted you in error

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Just a little reminiscence for me...

n_122.gif.a31e9cee3b60977e431122c7dfe69f99.gif

...collectors edition...

n_116.gif.177451e2066bb2026028febf0f19785c.gif

...after rewatching a few episodes.

Happy Weekend!  :shy:

Edited by veejay
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7 hours ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

This is the best comment I've read on here in weeks and I thank you for it. Very well thought out and logical. And I totally agree.

If I'm not happy with a character though, I can't blame the characters, because they are all doing the scripts the writers give them to the best of their ability. I wish I knew why the writers didn't care about certain things they used to care about, but I have no clue. I just strongly suspect they are not going to suddenly make Sheldon or Amy miserable when they've got fans who love Sheldon with Amy, which they do, and Young Sheldon to promote.

Thank you!

And yes, you really need to take the writers' attitude and what they did in those 10 years into account. Expecting them to write out a character that then somehow will fix another couple is not how it's gonna work. The writers both love Sheldon and Amy as characters and the two together. They've invested a lot in the couple and they are a big hit with the audience.  They are proud of the work they've done and the character development that came out of it as a result. Shamy are here to stay for the rest of the show.

I do think though there's a way to make Lenny more interesting again and for that I would have loved to hear something from SDCC. But sadly there wasn't really anything. Even when Johnny was asked if there's anything he wanted he was just like (paraphrasing here) "I trust the writers and I don't have any wishes, I'm happy the way it is!" which... oh well. There's a spark missing for Lenny when even the actors are going "yeah whatever". I dearly hope the writers can find that spark again and turn the ship around but we'll have to wait and see...

Quote

And I totally agree with this. I used to like Raj. I am starting to dislike him very much. If anyone could go and not be missed, it's the Raj character. There hasn't been any point to him for ages.

Now that the ridiculous dating two girls thing is over he's become more bearable to me so I'd be willing to give him another chance. But like with Lenny the writers really need to find a creative spark that makes him more interesting.

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14 hours ago, luminous said:

So, Kaley is in Australia right now?

But apparently she'll be back in California on Sunday, if I understand her latest IG postings regarding this pawworks event " Whiskers of Oz Brunch" correctly.

Oz: It's a colloquial term for Australia. :shy:

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Really cool that Kaley is in Australia, and I think this could have something to do with  her event on Sunday

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