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[Spoilers] Season 11 Discussion Thread

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Just now, joyceraye said:

If someone moves an item from one shelf to another in the store, is that theft ? I can see Sheldon doing that.

The equivalent of this would be Sheldon moving the bitcoins to a different file, on Leonard computer.    By moving it to the flash drive, Sheldon moved it "out of the store" so to speak.    

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12 minutes ago, Tensor said:

If someone takes something from a store, and then returns it, nobody took anything from anyone, but it's still prosecutable as theft.   Sheldon moved something from where someone else had put it, didn't tell them about it, until he felt it was the right time.  It's still a crime in the US.  The separate question on whether the DA would press charges on it, is another argument.  

Yes they did ! They removed it from the rightful owner's possession to theirs. That's what taking means. If they returned it they could argue they were borrowing it, but that is not permitted without consent.The only time the bitcoins file left Leonard's possession was when he gave the laptop to Penny and she gave it to Zack.

Edited by joyceraye

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Just now, joyceraye said:

Yes they did ! They removed it from the rightful owner's possession to theirs. That's what taking means. If they returned it they could argue they were borrowing it, but that is not permitted without consent.

 And that is exactly what Sheldon did.  He took it off of Leonard's computer, (Leonard is the rightful owner) and didn't return it to him (by letting him know where it was). If Leonard doesn't know where it is, it's not in his possession.  If Leonard had known it was on his flash drive, don't you think he would have put it back where it had been?  Sheldon eventually returned it, by telling him where it was (although, again, by that time,  it wasn't in Leonard's possession).  

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3 minutes ago, Jonny said:

It was a prank gone wrong and a dick move, but nothing illegal or criminal. That's how I see it.

Exactly how I see it as well.  

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5 minutes ago, Jonny said:

It was a prank gone wrong and a dick move, but nothing illegal or criminal. That's how I see it.

This is the way I see it as well,Sheldon did something wrong(again)against his friends, but it is not criminal and I think that Sheldon has done things on the show that are more serious than this. 

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8 minutes ago, Jonny said:

It was a prank gone wrong and a dick move, but nothing illegal or criminal. That's how I see it.

I think somebody should do it in real life, call the police, and then there'll be a test case. Whatever the judge and jury decide will be the precedent and we'll all know.

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18 minutes ago, joyceraye said:

The only time the bitcoins file left Leonard's possession was when he gave the laptop to Penny and she gave it to Zack.

The bitcoins file wasn't on the laptop, when Leonard gave the laptop to Penny, so they didn't leave Leonard's possession, until he lost the flash drive.

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16 minutes ago, Tensor said:

If Leonard doesn't know where it is, it's not in his possession.  

If I found a £20 note, belonging to my wife, laying on the floor, and put it in her pocket, but forget to tell her, unless/until she discovers it, it's not in her possession?

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14 minutes ago, chucky said:

I don't know why this argument continues. One side says he guilty of theft and the other side is defending Shelly. It's obvious none of you will admit they are wrong. Shelly boy is guilty as sin, but the Shelly boy lovers will argue to the death that their fair-haired boy did nothing wrong. Enough is enough, just agree to disagree and move on.

Remember the line about the dishes in Disney's Snow White and the Seven Dwarves ? ' They're not stole, they're hid in the cupboard.' 

It's nothing to do with who likes Sheldon or not. Leonard should have copied all his files to his new lappie and formatted the hard drive on his old one before giving it to Penny. Or better still, remove the hard drive to an external drive case and put a new one in for her. it's what I do.

7 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

The bitcoins file wasn't on the laptop, when Leonard gave the laptop to Penny, so they didn't leave Leonard's possession, until he lost the flash drive.

Of course. Silly me. They'd already been transferred.

4 minutes ago, JE7 said:

I swear to god Sheldon could shot Amy in the head on camera and some would say it wasent a crime. 

Of course it's a crime to possess a gun unless it's in a locked cabinet - oops - wrong country.

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1 minute ago, Lagernisse said:

I could be wrong but isn't this situation with the bitcoins a little bit like when Sheldon's WoW-account was hacked. 

I'd say very much so.

The police weren't interested in pursuing his WoW account hacking, and I doubt they'd be willing to pursue the bitcoin case either.

Besides which, the Statue of Limitation expired 4 years ago.

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6 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

If I found a £20 note, belonging to my wife, laying on the floor, and put it in her pocket, but forget to tell her, unless/until she discovers it, it's not in her possession?

Did you take it from her originally?  

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19 minutes ago, Stephen Hawking said:

The bitcoins file wasn't on the laptop, when Leonard gave the laptop to Penny, so they didn't leave Leonard's possession, until he lost the flash drive.

Actually, they did.  At some point, Sheldon transferred the files from the computer, into the flash drive, which was in Sheldon's possession, before he gave it back to Leonard.  

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6 minutes ago, Tensor said:

Did you take it from her originally?  

No, but I returned it to her, without informing her, which, according to your point, means it's not in her possession, because she doesn't know it's there.

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Just now, Stephen Hawking said:

No, but I returned it to her, without informing her, which, according to your point, means it's not in her possession, because she doesn't know it's there.

You're forgetting part of the point was Sheldon taking it from Leonard.  This doesn't apply here.  

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Look, 

Sheldon took it off of Leonard's computer without telling him (whether this is considered as another crime of hacking, would depend on if the computer was locked or if Leonard had made Sheldon aware of his passwords.  As close as they were, I don't see it as hacking.)

He put it on the flash drive that was not, at that time, in Leonard's possession, it was in Sheldon's possession.   That is the technical definition of theft.   This could fall under the crime of theft by trick (not providing Leonard with relevant information, i.e. he didn't tell Leonard he moved it) which has two other elements:

  1. You kept the property for a period of time (even a very brief period); AND
  2. The property owner didn't intend to transfer ownership of the property to you.

Whether or not it was given back to him doesn't matter.  Two things here.  First, the "Statute of Limitation, in California theft cases, starts when the crime is discovered, not just when it happens.  As this particular act was just discovered, the Statute of Limitations starts now.  And B,  someone involved with a "prank gone wrong" can be held criminally liable. (and yes, I know I said first, and B)

Now, all that is spelled out in the California Penal Code.  So, by definition, it is theft.  However, there is another part involved here, whether or not the victim requests the pressing of charges against the person committing the crime, and whether or not the DA thinks it's worth it to prosecute the crime.  

In this particular case, Leonard didn't appear to press charges, and I would find it highly unlikely that a DA would prosecute this particular case.  So, while theft was committed, I don't see it being prosecuted.  

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What hasn't been talked about is that when sheldon downloaded the file he became responsible for their safe keeping. When he gave it back without telling leonard it meant sheldon was still responsible for their safe keeping not leonard

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

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16 minutes ago, Tensor said:

However, there is another part involved here, whether or not the victim requests the pressing of charges against the person committing the crime, and whether or not the DA thinks it's worth it to prosecute the crime.

Sheldon wanted a prosecution, when his WoW account was hacked, but the police weren't willing to conduct and investigation, let along prosecute.

I doubt they'd be willing to support a prosecution in this case either.

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This whole discussion reminds me on that serious issue.

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Btw. the scientific explorations will be continued... :icon_cheesygrin:

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Oh, I agree, but the whole discussion was whether a crime was committed. The answer, to that,  is yes.  The prosecution of said crime is another discussion, and my thinking is, no it won’t be prosecuted. 

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1 hour ago, JE7 said:

I swear to god Sheldon could shoot Amy in the head on camera and some would say it wasent a crime. 

I'd say human life is worth much more than Bitcoin was "worth" in 2010.

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12 minutes ago, Mislav said:

I'd say human life is worth much more than Bitcoin was "worth" in 2010.

I spent time in the military and law enforcement and i can tell you on the street life is cheap to worthless i have seen men killed over a 12 pack of beer 

 

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12 minutes ago, JE7 said:

I spent time in the military and law enforcement and i can tell you on the street life is cheap to worthless i have seen men killed over a 12 pack of beer 

 

Then it's a good thing that none of the characters on this show don't live a street life.

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Just now, Mislav said:

Then it's a good thing that none of the characters on this show don't live a street life.

Penny nearly did. :icon_biggrin: 

From The Financial Permeability:-

Penny: Okay. Well, thank you. Oh, God, no, I can’t. Sheldon honey, I don’t want things to be weird between us.

Sheldon: Won’t it also be weird if I have to say hello to you every morning on my way to work and you’re living in a refrigerator box and washing your hair with rain water?

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