episodes 1110 - The Confidence Erosion (December 7)

[MTBigBangTheoryFan]

1 hour ago, joyceraye said:

I've never heard of a time when the grooms did little or nothing.  They might, just as Sheldon did after all his traumas, have felt like it.   The first wedding I attended in which I knew what was going on was in 1959. I read up about it in old books published from late Victorian times to the 1920s. Publishers of etiquette books used to make a fortune from bridegrooms. Traditionally the groom  makes sure his best man knows the names of the bridesmaids and chief bridesmaid so he can toast them.  He makes sure the best man has got the ring. He chooses the best man. The groom books  the cars  or other transport and organises the honeymoon, the destination of which is traditionally kept secret. He supplies the bride's parents with details of the friends and relations on his side who are to be invited. He arranges the suits for the best man and any supporters or groomsmen. He pays the marriage licence or certificate fee and also the choir and organist if it's in church. He orders the buttonholes. He buys presents for the bridesmaids. All this was still pretty much the case when I was last a bridesmaid in the early 1980s. I don't know if this fits with the idea of how great-grandparents and grandparents did things. That couple have just had their first grandchild. 

There's no rule that says any of the above have to be complied with. There has always needed to be some co-operation between the two sides with regard to guests, hymns,choice of best man, catering etc. The last few weddings I've attended have been of couples from 'ethic minorities' and they've all had at least two weddings. 

8

What you describe sounds very much like a Victoria/Edwardian Wedding among the English Royals and Aristocrats. I didn't mean didn't do anything at all (They had the best Man to choose if had any pick out and had to make sure the Ring made it safely) but the fact of the matter is 60+ Years ago and more when it came to American Weddings (The non-famous and wealthy)  the Women Family did the majority of the Wedding Planning. The Groom did do a few things that were expected of him (Find best man, Keep track of the ring, etc,.) but other than that they did not do a lot and left most (probably about 90-95%) of the wedding planning up to the Bride and her Parents. The Bride APrents planned most of the wedding and paid for the whole thing. 

It was the Baby Boomer Generation who decided that Men needed to take a bigger part in planning their Wedding.  When they started Marrying in the 1960 and 1970s Men started doing a lot more in planning the wedding, there started being a lot more cooperation and Equal help.  Men started to help a lot more then Groom had in the past. BOTH the Groom and Bride Parents started paying for their fair share and for half the wedding. half the wedding. It was no longer one-sided but there are still weddings today where the Bride parents pay for the whole thing and lots of them. 

 

[joyceraye]

3 hours ago, spidergirl said:

Interesting post. I enjoyed getting to know all that info. However I am glad things are simpler nowdays. Well at least if I got married, everything would be simple and minimal

Weddings can be very simple. The parents of one of my godsons got married in a registrar's office, which some people wrongly call a 'registry office' . (Like the clerk's department  where Sheldon and Amy got their licence but then didn't have the wedding. ) The families and friends of both of them were there. We all went back to their flat while they went to McDonald's or somewhere for a drink and a snack. Her mother had made a big pot of stew. His grandmother had made a cake. His mother took photographs. Her cousins brought guitars and sang to us. We had speeches when the newlyweds joined us. It was the  least costly wedding I've ever been to and we all had a great time. It made Howardette's and Lenny's look lavish. There's no need to spend a fortune on costumes and dancing. 

[Tonstar17]

Weddings can be very simple. The parents of one of my godsons got married in a registrar's office, which some people wrongly call a 'registry office' . (Like the clerk's department  where Sheldon and Amy got their licence but then didn't have the wedding. ) The families and friends of both of them were there. We all went back to their flat while they went to McDonald's or somewhere for a drink and a snack. Her mother had made a big pot of stew. His grandmother had made a cake. His mother took photographs. Her cousins brought guitars and sang to us. We had speeches when the newlyweds joined us. It was the  least costly wedding I've ever been to and we all had a great time. It made Howardette's and Lenny's look lavish. There's no need to spend a fortune on costumes and dancing. 

Now that's sounds like my dream wedding if I ever decide to put pen to paper.

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[Die Zimtzicke]

On 12/12/2017 at 8:06 AM, bfm said:

How do you know most women think of that? I think that's just a stereotype. 

Okay, most women I have known. Is that better?

On 12/12/2017 at 1:43 AM, djsurrey said:

I found it amusing which is all I expect from a sitcom.

Me, too. Thank you. It's a sitcom. It doesn't affect the fate of the nation.

[KripkeRules]

This one was great and funny. Loved Raj's storyline, Shamy's city hall scene was nice, too.

[JohnPhD]

What a boring episode. Why on earth does Amy and Sheldon's utterly predictable wedding planning have to take place onscreen? It would be just as interesting seeing them do their tax returns. In general we see far too much of Amy's life and far too little of Penny's. I foolishly got hopeful for a moment that they were going to get A & S's wedding out of the way at City Hall there and then and have done with it, but of course not. It was really rather sad to see the great JP making that mawkish speech to Amy, which arbitrarily falsified the past: S didn't "think he'd never find anyone he wanted to marry", he wasn't interested in a relationship and was happy by himself. He didn't "find" Amy, she latched on to him and wore him down season by season.

As for the other storyline, what's the point of Raj if he's not the butt of Howard's jokes. Howard has done everything for Raj who actually gives him very little - if Raj is so ungrateful and sensitive that he can't take a bit of teasing, to hell with him. Howard's the one with the family and the life - why should he care. I just hope they don't show Bernadette letting Raj in their house while he's not speaking to Howard. Or skyping with him.

[Sah]

On 12/10/2017 at 7:25 PM, vonmar said:

Interesting, my husband was way more involved than that short list.

Luckily mine as well. Mine was very interested in everything but the flowers, that was solely up to me. 

I thought it was a wonderful episode. I loved Amy and Sheldon in this one. Sheldon's speech to Amy was really sweet, I liked seeing the way they were dividing up wedding decisions. I loved Raj in this episode as well. Nice to see him stand up for himself. I hope we get to see more of the lady he had a coffee date with. Funny, Sheldon always gets shit for saying things to people but honestly they are all mean to eachother. 

[KripkeRules]

6 hours ago, JohnPhD said:

What a boring episode. Why on earth does Amy and Sheldon's utterly predictable wedding planning have to take place onscreen? It would be just as interesting seeing them do their tax returns. In general we see far too much of Amy's life and far too little of Penny's. I foolishly got hopeful for a moment that they were going to get A & S's wedding out of the way at City Hall there and then and have done with it, but of course not. It was really rather sad to see the great JP making that mawkish speech to Amy, which arbitrarily falsified the past: S didn't "think he'd never find anyone he wanted to marry", he wasn't interested in a relationship and was happy by himself. He didn't "find" Amy, she latched on to him and wore him down season by season.

As for the other storyline, what's the point of Raj if he's not the butt of Howard's jokes. Howard has done everything for Raj who actually gives him very little - if Raj is so ungrateful and sensitive that he can't take a bit of teasing, to hell with him. Howard's the one with the family and the life - why should he care. I just hope they don't show Bernadette letting Raj in their house while he's not speaking to Howard. Or skyping with him.

Are you talking about Leonard wore Penny down? Yeah, the show already told us so. No need to repeat it, mate.

[JohnPhD]

5 hours ago, KripkeRules said:

Are you talking about Leonard wore Penny down? Yeah, the show already told us so. No need to repeat it, mate.

No I'm pointing out that whereas it's often said falsely that Leonard wore Penny down, which is not the case at all, Amy in fact wore Sheldon down, both in the sense of getting him to finally accept an emotional and sexual relationship that he didn't want for many seasons, and also in the sense of diminishing him. And it's never said that Amy wore Sheldon down altho' it would be true.

[Die Zimtzicke]

7 hours ago, KripkeRules said:

He didn't "find" Amy, she latched on to him and wore him down season by season.

After the coffee shop meeting he never had to speak to her or see her again. But he did. So something about her intrigued him. When they opened the next season he was really enjoying her friendship. The lol he put in while he was texting her was cute. Unlike Sheldon to my mind, but it showed that he and Amy had become friends. She could send him little jokes and he was getting them.

[JohnPhD]

1 hour ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

After the coffee shop meeting he never had to speak to her or see her again. But he did. So something about her intrigued him. When they opened the next season he was really enjoying her friendship. The lol he put in while he was texting her was cute. Unlike Sheldon to my mind, but it showed that he and Amy had become friends. She could send him little jokes and he was getting them.

Yes, Sheldon appreciated Amy as a friend, he didn't often come across anyone compatible with himself. But he was not looking for "someone he might want to marry" and that was not on his mind when he became friends with Amy. S just wanted a meeting of minds; A, after The Alien Parasite Hypothesis episode, was desperate for a sexual relationship.

I didn't much care for the way Sheldon's friends assumed that because he had a friend who was a girl she must be his girlfriend. And I thought Penny was a bad friend to Sheldon in relentlessly pushing him to have sex with Amy.

[joyceraye]

1 hour ago, JohnPhD said:

Yes, Sheldon appreciated Amy as a friend, he didn't often come across anyone compatible with himself. But he was not looking for "someone he might want to marry" and that was not on his mind when he became friends with Amy. S just wanted a meeting of minds; A, after The Alien Parasite Hypothesis episode, was desperate for a sexual relationship.

I didn't much care for the way Sheldon's friends assumed that because he had a friend who was a girl she must be his girlfriend. And I thought Penny was a bad friend to Sheldon in relentlessly pushing him to have sex with Amy.

But at that stage Amy didn't want a sexual relationship with Sheldon. However, she did want brains as well as physicality in a lover.  Zack lost all his sexual attractiveness to her when she realised he was dim. in the tag she caught hold of Sheldon's hand as an experiment. She felt nothing then. At the time I liked that. I wanted them to be good friends. They both needed  friends who appreciated and liked their mind. There were no signs either of them wanted more from each other until Sheldon gave Leonard the 'Not for you' rabbit punch. She had to be drunk in order to kiss him. When Sheldon got jealous over Amy's dating Stuart and asked her to be his girlfriend I was disappointed. I'm glad for Sheldon that it did morph into love because if Amy had met and married another man he might have lost that friendship.

[Capt. Hilts]

4 hours ago, Die Zimtzicke said:

After the coffee shop meeting he never had to speak to her or see her again. But he did. So something about her intrigued him. When they opened the next season he was really enjoying her friendship. The lol he put in while he was texting her was cute. Unlike Sheldon to my mind, but it showed that he and Amy had become friends. She could send him little jokes and he was getting them.

AND he has personal space and habit issues associated with people on the autism spectrum.

3 hours ago, JohnPhD said:

Yes, Sheldon appreciated Amy as a friend, he didn't often come across anyone compatible with himself. But he was not looking for "someone he might want to marry" and that was not on his mind when he became friends with Amy. S just wanted a meeting of minds; A, after The Alien Parasite Hypothesis episode, was desperate for a sexual relationship.

I didn't much care for the way Sheldon's friends assumed that because he had a friend who was a girl she must be his girlfriend. And I thought Penny was a bad friend to Sheldon in relentlessly pushing him to have sex with Amy.

Interesting comments, Jphd

[Die Zimtzicke]

4 hours ago, Capt. Hilts said:

AND he has personal space and habit issues associated with people on the autism spectrum.

As the mother of a 30 year old son with Asperger's I totally agree.

[Shelldon]

We're never finding out where that coffee date went, are we?

Still, change is in the air, or should I say hair? Spunky Raj is getting a career advancement, hopefully we'll spend a lot of time at this new setting in the future. Howard is not the comedian he thinks he is and I somewhat can buy that some of Raj's womanizer traits were picked up from Howard. 

My one worry is that they are only fleshing Raj out until Bernadette's actress comes back from her leave.

Penny treating Leonard nicer felt like them addressing other fan complaints and the Shamy plot felt like the writers trying to tell us to be patient about the wedding.