Jump to content

[Spoilers] Season 12 Dark Lenny Thread


Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Tensor said:

Yeah, but, he was willing, wanting to donate for Zack and Melissa, evidently thinking he would be involved as the father.  It was only after it was pointed out he wouldn’t be involved as the father, that he decided not to donate.  This is a strong indication he really wants to be a father. 

They really screwed up with this one(well they screwed the whole thing up, but I’m being specific here).  As fast and unrealistic they depicted Leonard’s aquiencence to not having kids, it was an ending.  We knew Leonard was  ok with not having kids.  Now, we find out he’s not happy about it, (and to top it off, Penny feels bad about disappointing her dad and Leonard)and one way or another someone in their marriage isn’t going to be happy over something rather large.   Penny having to change her mind, or Leonard not having kids. 

Agreed  They have really backed themselves into a corner with this Lenny scenario.  No matter what they come up with it is going to offend someone.  They absolutely have to create a plausible reason for Penny not wanting kids and also a legitimate reason if she would change her mind. What a lousy way to end a great show.  Think this will have alot of criticism and repercussions for quite awhile if they do not end it satisfactorily for everyone.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 2.7k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

I can actually live with the one off cheating bullshit more than the long running stupidity of the “he wore her down” line which yet again rears its ugly head in the next episode. As unrealistic and

It was about a year ago at this time and I just finished watching 11.24. The Shamy wedding. It was wonderful and marvelous. A really amazing television wedding. It was then that I told myself yes. The

The comparison between the Fowlers and Lenny was over the top and so was the shoe horned set up line from Bernadette. Not that I share everyone’s disgust for the accusation of them having nothing in c

Posted Images

10 minutes ago, Mario D. said:

...Think this will have alot of criticism and repercussions for quite awhile if they do not end it satisfactorily for everyone.

This seems to have actually been noticed elsewhere as well.

Big Bang Theory Is Using Penny & Leonard To Distract From The Weaker Stories

Screenrant.com

"Granted that The Big Bang Theory stagnated Penny and Leonard's married life and the show is making up for it with this baby drama, it's quite frustrating that other characters - mostly Raj and the Wolowitzs barely get any major focus in the final season."

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Tensor said:

Yeah, but, he was willing, wanting to donate for Zack and Melissa, evidently thinking he would be involved as the father.  It was only after it was pointed out he wouldn’t be involved as the father, that he decided not to donate.  This is a strong indication he really wants to be a father. 

They really screwed up with this one(well they screwed the whole thing up, but I’m being specific here).  As fast and unrealistic they depicted Leonard’s aquiencence to not having kids, it was an ending.  We knew Leonard was  ok with not having kids.  Now, we find out he’s not happy about it, (and to top it off, Penny feels bad about disappointing her dad and Leonard)and one way or another someone in their marriage isn’t going to be happy over something rather large.   Penny having to change her mind, or Leonard not having kids. 

Writers, if they got their heads out their butts we might get a nice episode! If Lenny wasn't going to have kids, then why bring it up? It's bad enough with Penny saying no kids, then they throw in the Zack crap. That's just angst on top of angst which is ridiculous for a comedy!

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, chucky said:

Writers, if they got their heads out their butts we might get a nice episode! If Lenny wasn't going to have kids, then why bring it up? It's bad enough with Penny saying no kids, then they throw in the Zack crap. That's just angst on top of angst which is ridiculous for a comedy!

Penny will probably have an unplanned pregnancy and she will turn around and say she was just scared, but she knows they can do it together… blah blah blah. Then Leonard will say their baby will be smart and beautiful as a throwback to the first episode…

n_405.gif.2bda0ded86673dd204c38a2500f309de.gif

...the end. Bang! 🙄

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, chucky said:

Writers, if they got their heads out their butts we might get a nice episode! If Lenny wasn't going to have kids, then why bring it up? It's bad enough with Penny saying no kids, then they throw in the Zack crap. That's just angst on top of angst which is ridiculous for a comedy!

I totally agrees  with you, if there are no plans for Lenny babies, why does the writers bring this Zack donation crap story up.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, veejay said:

Penny will probably have an unplanned pregnancy and she will turn around and say she was just scared, but she knows they can do it together… blah blah blah. Then Leonard will say their baby will be smart and beautiful as a throwback to the first episode…

n_405.gif.2bda0ded86673dd204c38a2500f309de.gif

...the end. Bang! 🙄

Probably since the surprise pregnancy worked twice for Howardette! Hopefully they ill come up with something new and original!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, veejay said:

Penny will probably have an unplanned pregnancy and she will turn around and say she was just scared, but she knows they can do it together… blah blah blah. Then Leonard will say their baby will be smart and beautiful as a throwback to the first episode…

n_405.gif.2bda0ded86673dd204c38a2500f309de.gif

...the end. Bang! 🙄

This is one scenario that can be considered. However, she still has to explain why she did not want kids.

1 hour ago, veejay said:

This seems to have actually been noticed elsewhere as well.

Big Bang Theory Is Using Penny & Leonard To Distract From The Weaker Stories

Screenrant.com

"Granted that The Big Bang Theory stagnated Penny and Leonard's married life and the show is making up for it with this baby drama, it's quite frustrating that other characters - mostly Raj and the Wolowitzs barely get any major focus in the final season."

Didn't know much about screenrant.com but upon reading their articles they have proven to give the most insightful and clear understanding of the show and episodes.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Mario D. said:

This is one scenario that can be considered. However, she still has to explain why she did not want kids.

With big explanations the writers were not pretty bustling the last years. At least not with Lenny. I'd rather be quiet now.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, veejay said:

Penny will probably have an unplanned pregnancy and she will turn around and say she was just scared, but she knows they can do it together… blah blah blah. Then Leonard will say their baby will be smart and beautiful as a throwback to the first episode…

n_405.gif.2bda0ded86673dd204c38a2500f309de.gif

...the end. Bang! 🙄

That's an optomistic scenario. Not good, optimistic compared to what may actually be, which is no kids. The writers like this idea, you can see it in their interviews. No kids is a very likely scenario, and we will be left to imagine Leonard's misery at watching his friends, including SHELDON COOPER, raise their children, while Penny will live with guilt for her decision (again, she should definitely not have kids out of guilt but she will live with guilt). On the show they will probably have Leonard say he is as happy as can be as long as he has her, cue the Awwws. Another possibility is they make Leonard suddenly not want kids, which as I said will just not be believable to me. 

Anyway, I do not think they will sure have them have children. I don't think this is a trick to keep people on edge and then they'll change it. I don't think they'll respond to fans' reactions. I think the higher chances are for no kids. They like this idea. They think they're sending an important message, which in a sense they are but they chose the wrong characters, they sacrificed their characters and their story for this.

  • Like 3
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the reason the writers are keeping tight lipped on what is Penny's issue with kids is because they want to keep the arc open and can change their minds later. I'm 65% sure on the writers sticking with the no Lenny kids tho. They will drag it to the last episode before they reveal why Penny doesn't want kids.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Tonstar17 said:

I think the reason the writers are keeping tight lipped on what is Penny's issue with kids is because they want to keep the arc open and can change their minds later. I'm 65% sure on the writers sticking with the no Lenny kids tho. They will drag it to the last episode before they reveal why Penny doesn't want kids.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk
 

If they give a reason then they give rise to hope and fans pushing to solve it, so not giving one makes perfect sense if they don't plan to change the no kids decision.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If they give a reason then they give rise to hope and fans pushing to solve it, so not giving one makes perfect sense if they don't plan to change the no kids decision.
True, but if they give a reason why Penny doesn't want kids, for example because it's a life time commitment and it's not for her, then I dont think the fans will push for her to change her mind. They will just accept it, as long as Leonard is on board with it which tptb have to power to make happen.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Tonstar17 said:

True, but if they give a reason why Penny doesn't want kids, for example because it's a life time commitment and it's not for her, then I dont think the fans will push for her to change her mind. They will just accept it, as long as Leonard is on board with it which tptb have to power to make happen.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk
 

For me it's too late for Leonard to come to terms with it. It would not be believable to me. They should have started working on it earlier in the season.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m probably VERY optimistic, but I think it will end well for Lenny. If the writers said anything other than ‘no kids desicion is great’ in the interviews, fans would immediately draw to the obvious conclusion with Penny changing her mind etc. etc. IMO, they just want to keep it on edge till the very last episode, so the fans would speculate (and we do :) )

Zack’s storyline didn’t solve anything, IMO. Leonard and Penny are in the same place now as they were after 12x03. Yes, the ending in 12x15 was way more sweet and all, but Leonard was still using ‘if’ when talking to Wyatt (‘IF Penny and I don’t want kids, it’s between us’), so he probably still hopes, idk

Agree with @veejay Penny would probably say she was just scared of such responsibility and stuff. Again I know it’s too optimistic, but I think it’s the last (and the cruelest 😝) ‘will they or won’t they’ for Lenny. 

 

 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

I think the only way they can get away with no kids is if she can’t. JMO if Penny’s excuse is she’s  scared it’s time for her to put on the big girl pants.

IMO, but the decision to have kids is much more terrifying than admitting you love someone or agreeing to marry someone (and Penny was really afraid of both those things). So, it's okay to be scared and to have doubts. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, smartandbeautiful said:

I’m probably VERY optimistic, but I think it will end well for Lenny. If the writers said anything other than ‘no kids desicion is great’ in the interviews, fans would immediately draw to the obvious conclusion with Penny changing her mind etc. etc. IMO, they just want to keep it on edge till the very last episode, so the fans would speculate (and we do :) )

Zack’s storyline didn’t solve anything, IMO. Leonard and Penny are in the same place now as they were after 12x03. Yes, the ending in 12x15 was way more sweet and all, but Leonard was still using ‘if’ when talking to Wyatt (‘IF Penny and I don’t want kids, it’s between us’), so he probably still hopes, idk

Agree with @veejay Penny would probably say she was just scared of such responsibility and stuff. Again I know it’s too optimistic, but I think it’s the last (and the cruelest 😝) ‘will they or won’t they’ for Lenny. 

 

 

 

I keep having thoughts that Penny sees a therapist to talk about the reasons why she doesn't want to have children. Maybe one reason is she's afraid she'll get fat, not be able to lose the weight and fears Leonard won't find her attractive any more. Much of her identity is tied into her beauty and sexiness.  Maybe she knows someone who had terrible postpartum depression. Maybe she's afraid she won't be a good mother because she's too or not enough (fill in the blank). She also speaks of how guilty she feels about disappointing the 2 most important people in her life. 

Of course she should talk to her husband about these things, but wants someone to bounce things off first and knows she has to then have a discussion with Leonard. It'd be great if she saw the shrink she was trying to sell drugs to. Loved her. She helped Leonard so much!

Probably far fetched, but it could bring credibility to her coming around, facing her fears, and changing (or not changing) her mind. At least we, and Leonard, would know what's up with her.

  • Like 7
  • Penny Thumbs Up 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, smartandbeautiful said:

IMO, but the decision to have kids is much more terrifying than admitting you love someone or agreeing to marry someone (and Penny was really afraid of both those things). So, it's okay to be scared and to have doubts. 

The ending of the Zack storyline bothered me. It ended with a phone call. To me it should of been Penny stepping up admitting she had a problem with all this. Not the usual Leonard backing down. Just as someone who mentioned earlier on one of the forums on how Leonard is still afraid of Penny leaving him.  (His discussion with Stuart about Denise). To me it should of been unless you want kids I’m donating.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Chrismo said:

The ending of the Zack storyline bothered me. It ended with a phone call. To me it should of been Penny stepping up admitting she had a problem with all this. Not the usual Leonard backing down. Just as someone who mentioned earlier on one of the forums on how Leonard is still afraid of Penny leaving him.  (His discussion with Stuart about Denise). To me it should of been unless you want kids I’m donating.

I agree and disagree at the same time 😂 on the one hand, I kinda liked Leonard supporting his wife as always. but on the other, if the donation would make him less heartbroken than no kids at all, he should've done that... idk, they raised a pretty complicated topic and IMO didn't handle it well

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For me, a large part of my interest, and investment, in the L/P relationship was the “magical” and enduring nature of the connection between two disparate personalities.  They had obstacle after obstacle to surmount and a live-in naysayer to wrangle and they still managed to find comfort in each other and common purpose. Intrinsically, at their cores, they were compatible, regardless of the differences in the external dressings. They wanted to be together because, apparently, they were fundamentally content  and satisfied with each other.

Now it seems, for no good commercial, comedic or dramatic purpose, they are fundamentally in disagreement about one of the most singular decisions a couple can make - to nurture a new person.

This decision is life changing. One must make a sacrifice to meet the needs of the other. Living a good life is not  about reproduction- we are not running short on humans - but this is not at all similar to an argument about liking Buffy. Any way this goes, if the characters mean what they have said, someone is in for a lifetime of regret. What a way to finish a love story. 

Or the creatives smother on the candy sprinkles - and hope we don’t notice the problem with the filling.

We’ll see.

 

Edit: I can’t fathom the creative intent here. It’s just a bummer of a plot. Why not simply not have this story?

Edited by Nogravitasatall
  • Like 6
  • Thanks 1
  • Penny Thumbs Up 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I agree and disagree at the same time [emoji23] on the one hand, I kinda liked Leonard supporting his wife as always. but on the other, if the donation would make him less heartbroken than no kids at all, he should've done that... idk, they raised a pretty complicated topic and IMO didn't handle it well
I like that Leonard is supportive of Penny on this and many other occasions, but the thing is, will Penny be that supportive if the shoe was on the other foot. Not so sure from past performance from Penny not supporting Leonard.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Tonstar17 said:

I like that Leonard is supportive of Penny on this and many other occasions, but the thing is, will Penny be that supportive if the shoe was on the other foot. Not so sure from past performance from Penny not supporting Leonard.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk
 

Yes, I've been wondering about that too! Would be more interesting if they turned that topic around, so Penny could show how much she cherish her husband. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, I've been wondering about that too! Would be more interesting if they turned that topic around, so Penny could show how much she cherish her husband. 
Now that, I would love to see. But hey, we will only be grooming ourselves for more disappointment from tptb. [emoji2]

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Nogravitasatall said:

For me, a large part of my interest, and investment, in the L/P relationship was the “magical” and enduring nature of the connection between two disparate personalities.  They had obstacle after obstacle to surmount and a live-in naysayer to wrangle and they still managed to find comfort in each other and common purpose. Intrinsically, at their cores, they were compatible, regardless of the differences in the external dressings. They wanted to be together because, apparently, they were fundamentally content  and satisfied with each other.

Now it seems, for no good commercial, comedic or dramatic purpose, they are fundamentally in disagreement about one of the most singular decisions a couple can make - to nurture a new person.

This decision is life changing. One or the other must make a sacrifice to meet the needs of the other. Living a good life is not  about reproduction- we are not running short on humans - but this is not at all similar to an argument about liking Buffy. Any way this goes, if the characters mean what they have said, someone is in for a lifetime of regret. What a way to finish a love story. 

Or the creatives smother on the candy sprinkles - and hope we don’t notice the problem with the filling.

We’ll see.

 

 

Boy, this topic has been beaten nine ways from sunday. And maybe that is what tptb had in mind. Keep this scenario going until they can come up with a plausible alternative. To be sure Penny and Leonard's romance has been a rocky road and yes they have met every obstacle to be in a happy place together. But having or not having children is a large mountain to climb if there are disparate views which should have been discussed earlier in their relationship.  I have always felt there is some underlying reason for Penny not wanting children and for me it is the total committment to have a family for whatever reason she fears. I guess we will have to wait and see how this plays out in the next episodes.

  • Like 3
  • Penny Thumbs Up 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.