episodes 1209 'The Citation Negation' (November 15)

[Tripper]

The Citation Negation - Season 12, Episode 9 
Airs Thursday, November 15 at 8/7c on CBS.

Sheldon and Amy are devastated after learning from a Russian paper that Super Asymmetry has already been discovered and disproven. Also, ultra-competitive Bernadette asks Stuart's girlfriend, Denise, to teach her how to beat Howard in a popular videogame.

[veejay]

Seriously, can you believe this guy? 😟

[chucky]

3 hours ago, veejay said:

Seriously, can you believe this guy? 😟

Yep, Mary should have gotten that second opinion! 😊

[veejay]

Big screen's required! Girl power under control?

Source

[Tripper]

Rate the episode in our poll

[Kev0821]

Mayim's recap of the episode:

https://groknation.com/culture/citation-negation-mayim-bialik-recap/

[eirwinrommel]

Wouldn't it be funny if the Russian who wrote the paper disproving Asymmetry was the ex-physists/janator from Sheldon's Physics Bowl team (Season 1 Episode 13). 

Third Floor Janitor: The answer is minus eight by alpha.

Sheldon: Hang on, hang on a second, that’s not our answer. What are you doing?

Third Floor Janitor: Answering question. Winning physics bowl.

Sheldon: How do you know anything about physics?

Third Floor Janitor: Here I am janitor, in former Soviet Union I am physicist. Leningrad Politechnica. Go Polar Bears.

Edited November 16, 2018 by eirwinrommel

[Kev0821]

3 hours ago, Kev0821 said:

Mayim's recap of the episode:

https://groknation.com/culture/citation-negation-mayim-bialik-recap/

I love how Mayim mentioned her eating cereal on the couch as a depressed Amy. She was snacking on it between takes. It was really cute! ❤️

[joyceraye]

2 hours ago, eirwinrommel said:

Wouldn't it be funny if the Russian who wrote the paper disproving Asymmetry was the ex-physists/janator from Sheldon's Physics Bowl team (Season 1 Episode 13). 

Third Floor Janitor: The answer is minus eight by alpha.

Sheldon: Hang on, hang on a second, that’s not our answer. What are you doing?

Third Floor Janitor: Answering question. Winning physics bowl.

Sheldon: How do you know anything about physics?

Third Floor Janitor: Here I am janitor, in former Soviet Union I am physicist. Leningrad Politechnica. Go Polar Bears.

Yes ! I thought that when I read Kev's taping report. I've been wondering whether he'll turn up again in this last season.

Edited November 16, 2018 by joyceraye

[Chrismo]

The show can’t get any worse than this. Can it?

[SRAM]

There were some funny parts tonight but the whole dynamics of the show seem off to me this season.  

[djsurrey]

Seems like I have seen an episode like this before. At least something too much like it.

Series 07 Episode 10 – The Discovery Dissipation

[KripkeRules]

The Bernie plot is a lighthearted one, and I'm very glad to see Denise again.

But the Shamy plot, sigh, I'm very sad to see TPTB killed Super Asymmetry like this. 

This is the 9th episode, so based on that "assumption" some of us came up with earlier this season, this episode was written after they knew this would be the final season...  After watching this one, I have to say I lost my hope on the rest of the final season to end with a "big bang".

I hope I'm wrong, of course. 

[veejay]

1 hour ago, Chrismo said:

The show can’t get any worse than this. Can it?

Exactly!

[veejay]

The Big Bang Theory Season 12, Episode 9 Recap: Amy and Sheldon's Project Falls Apart

Glamour

..."I'm not sure what Leonard gets out of this, but he already has Penny, so what more does the guy need in life?"...

Come on, really? WTF

..."This has been their baby for the better part of a year. Of course they'll find their footing again, but they have to process their disappointment first."

No, this isn't about the writers, is it? And whose disappointment does she mean?
Mine for sure!

[3ku11]

53 minutes ago, veejay said:

The Big Bang Theory Season 12, Episode 9 Recap: Amy and Sheldon's Project Falls Apart

Glamour

..."I'm not sure what Leonard gets out of this, but he already has Penny, so what more does the guy need in life?"...

Come on, really? WTF

..."This has been their baby for the better part of a year. Of course they'll find their footing again, but they have to process their disappointment first."

No, this isn't about the writers, is it? And whose disappointment does she mean?
Mine for sure!

[chucky]

6 hours ago, Chrismo said:

The show can’t get any worse than this. Can it?

I don't know, we'll have to see a few more episodes. I'm beginning to wonder, Are the "YS" cast visit suppose to help "YS" or "TBBT?

[HeWolf]

From the poll it appears that this one won't be joining the 'favorites' list of a lot of TBBT fans. I didn't find it to be horrible, though I am disappointed in the Shamy story arc. The rest of it, I thought, wasn't bad. The Bernadette plot was amusing. I liked how Denise turned the tables on her with the tough competitor act. All of the parts with Leonard, Howard, and Raj were good and produced some laughs.

The killing off of Shamy's super asymmetry idea seemed overly simplistic. One obscure paper from 40 years ago would not be sufficient to disprove their theory. While it is conceivable for Sheldon to react like a big baby over a contrary professional opinion, it is less believable from Amy. Just feel this was poorly conceived, written, and played out.

Once again, it appears that the producers of the show, and their writers, will not allow these characters any sort of success. As usual, they have pulled the rug out from under them when it appears they're about to actually triumph in some endeavor. Why? Apparently, this time it was so we could see Sheldon throw an infantile hissy fit. Way to break new ground and lead us viewers into uncharted territory. Oh, wait! 

[veejay]

50 minutes ago, HeWolf said:

From the poll it appears that this one won't be joining the 'favorites' list of a lot of TBBT fans. I didn't find it to be horrible, though I am disappointed in the Shamy story arc. The rest of it, I thought, wasn't bad. The Bernadette plot was amusing. I liked how Denise turned the tables on her with the tough competitor act. All of the parts with Leonard, Howard, and Raj were good and produced some laughs.

The killing off of Shamy's super asymmetry idea seemed overly simplistic. One obscure paper from 40 years ago would not be sufficient to disprove their theory. While it is conceivable for Sheldon to react like a big baby over a contrary professional opinion, it is less believable from Amy. Just feel this was poorly conceived, written, and played out.

Once again, it appears that the producers of the show, and their writers, will not allow these characters any sort of success. As usual, they have pulled the rug out from under them when it appears they're about to actually triumph in some endeavor. Why? Apparently, this time it was so we could see Sheldon throw an infantile hissy fit. Way to break new ground and lead us viewers into uncharted territory. Oh, wait! 

Well said!

[JE7]

Personally I am glad to see this plotline end in the last season there are more important things to do than continue to pound on us about Sheldons supposed superiority 

[bfm]

This was...boring. Really, boring. I had some smiles and maybe two small chuckles.

I'll stat with the Bernadette plot because it didn't annoyed me, like the other plot. It was very IC, and I like it that they now have a female who is well versed in things like comic books, SW, ST, and gaming in Denise. But that's most of the good things I have to say about this. I was expecting to enjoy it much more but the whole thing felt underwhelming. I feel like they could've done more with it. I also feel like they could've gotten more out of Melissa. They could've played more with her helplessness when playing, and more with super-competitive Bernadette. It just felt like snippets from beginnings of scenes that would escalate as they progress. Very underwhelming.

 

The Super Asymmetry paper plot. UGH. UGH UGH UGH. This was utterly ridiculous. I'm willing to forgive things like Amy jumping from different areas of research again and again and the ambiguous nature of the positions of the guys and Amy (and also Sheldon choosing a font, IRL they would probably have a journal they want to send the paper to in mind and they'd style their paper according to their instructions), but SERIOUSLY, the whole premise made NO SENSE.

1. Why the heck would Leonard and Raj agree to do some busywork for a paper they are no part of?! THAT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE. This is work he authors should do, they may "not feel like it" but it's their work and no one would agree to do it for them, unless they're getting something in return (pay, favor, whatever). And it turns out you don't really have to be in academia to figure that out, I don't think Radloff is in academia and she figured that out easily.]

2. No one would have to go to a library today in order to write up a list of references. There are papers available online from so many years back and from so many countries. Maybe, maybe, there exist the rare paper that is somehow only available at the Caltech library, but there wouldn't be a bunch of them. IRL, Shamy would have used a software for that, they exist (yes, they, multiple) or use the help of Google Scholar (with the little corrections one has to make, as in he case of papers with many writers where it cuts some of the names off). 

3. Leonard and Raj wouldn't have to read the papers if they were only writing up a list of references. That makes no sense.

4. How come Raj figured out the Russian paper was worth a look, based on what he read on the paper that cited it, and Shamy didn't? All of these papers should've ben papers they've read so they did see it. Now, sometimes one just searches for a paper to support a certain claim, so they won't read the whole paper, but if the paper mentioned a former paper regarding super-assymmetry I would expect them to notice that. Turns out Shamy are sloppy scientists 

I know, I know, "it's just a sitcom". I know, I know, many of those who watch it do not know how these things really work. But is it really too much to expect that the writers make a little bit of an effort to check if their plots are not ridiculously improbable? And to come up with something that makes more sense? They have a physicist as a consultant and an actress with a Phd (who I guess doesn't want to go against the writers and is okay with things being this slated for the sake of the show), all the had to do is ask and then think of something that fits better with reality (e.g., Shamy knowing about the Russian paper for some time and trying to get their hands on it and in this episode finally getting it). Keep in mind, this comes just after Leonard being asked to assign a grant because for some reason it was the job of the president of the university and he didn't want to do it. 

I know it may seem like it, but I'm not mad. I have other things in TBBT to be mad about, so don't worry about that... I just find it so silly and ridiculous.

 

The few moments I liked were Leonard's reaction to Sheldon's "test" - great acting by Johnny; Amy's responses about the things they were wrong about; Penny trying to bat-cheer them up. There were 2-3 Bernadette moments I found amusing, but I can't remember them.

Also, I am not a Sheldon hater, I generally like Sheldon throughout the show, but lately not so much, and here he did not make me laugh, he mostly annoyed me. Something feels so off with him. 

 

P.S: Is Penny now working for Denise's family's funeral home? What's with all that black lately?

[veejay]

@bfm   Very good observation of what happened. I could recognize you in this scene while reading.

[Zephon75]

Well i hate to repeat myself but this was another disappointing episode in a disappointing season. the Shamy plot felt like a rehash of a previous plot from a earlier seaon. The Bernadette plot was lighthearted but fell short of what it could of been , and the last scene where a bored Penny is playing against Bernadette just felt off. I will say this though for some reason when Amy said to Leonard "Why not , you don't you think other women find him attractive?"and Leonard replied "no". For some reason that made me chuckle which is a surprise as that hasn't happened in a while with this show.

Alos this sort reminded me of when the guys had there gyroscope project taken off them, Sheldon along with Howard(but not Leonard for some reason). Where  both sad about losing that project , this felt just like that one and just like that one Leonard had to try and cheer Sheldon up.

Just read the Glamour review and this part stood out:

She's right. Shamy needs time to grieve. This has been their baby for the better part of a year. Of course they'll find their footing again, but they have to process their disappointment first. And no offense to Super-Asymmetry, but that's the storyline I want to watch.

First it hasn't been the best part of a year it'ss been about six months, Why do the shamy need time to grieve over the loss of there Super-Asymmetry project. I don't remember Leonard been given any time or chance to grieve over losing the gyroscope project.

Edited November 16, 2018 by Zephon75

[chucky]

48 minutes ago, Zephon75 said:

for some reason when Amy said to Leonard "Why not , you don't you think other women find him attractive?"and Leonard replied "no". For some reason that made me chuckle which is a surprise as that hasn't happened in a while with this show.

Totally agree! Penny has worries about Leonard leaving her and Leonard worries of Penny leaving him. They're valid worries. Amy should not be having any worries what so ever. She is the only woman chasing after Sheldon, well, except for Ramona. That was creepy. Not Howard creepy, but creepy just the same!

[Jonny]

30 minutes ago, chucky said:

Totally agree! Penny has worries about Leonard leaving her and Leonard worries of Penny leaving him. They're valid worries. Amy should not be having any worries what so ever. She is the only woman chasing after Sheldon, well, except for Ramona. That was creepy. Not Howard creepy, but creepy just the same!

It was a gag, I had no problem with it whatsoever and certainly nothing to take seriously.  Even a Season 12 curmudgeon like myself put my pitchfork and my Steve Holland Voodoo doll down and laughed at that gag lol.

Edited November 16, 2018 by Jonny